VaporGenie
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Egzoset
Banned
Salutations Satyrday,
About "candle" vs "jet" flames, learning curves vs combustion, etc... After 3 months i can conclude i've made progress in 2 areas: 1) my PVC articulated extension makes a significant operating difference; 2) a shield obstructing the focal point will effectively delay "Hot-Spot" formation and hence combustion ultimately.
It seems to me that eye-contact with the front puck and the flame helps a great deal while having a decent refillable butane lighter proves to be quite appreciable as well. I favour "candle"/"jet" compatibility but i'd most probably want to switch instantly should my "2-Stones" wooden pipe be able to handle that... At the moment a pair of 3 mm thick "Ceramic Filters" is coupled to a pair of shielding spacers, combustion has become a much lesser concern but i still need improvement on airflow restriction - but at least i think this solution has real potential. Well, that would be nice already if resellers kept "foamy rocks" in stock besides the VG pipe so lets not be over-optimistic over this one!...
Anyway, i'm also conducting parallel tests using an "Easy Mod" as my reference. The PVC extension remains prefered as i don't like how hot a genuine VG duck-lips mouthpiece can get... It's refered to as being "easy" because this other modification was done externally, via the sphere's bowl-side access hole: an aluminium "defocussing" shield can be conveniently added to deflect radiating heat while a screen keeps this section clean (it's still possible to leave some free space if i want):
Though i'm afraid that's no definite Combustion Fix just yet - but there's hope!
...
Alternately my "2-Pucks" approach appears to lead to a suitably-balanced deal but it's going to prove tight on space. If i'm right thickness must go down to nearly 1 tenth of an inch for each puck since my aluminium sheet seems close to AWG #19 and i'm assuming the use of assymetric spacers with legs on 1 side only (twice the thickness for the middle shield). An untouched genuine puck is about 7.5 mm thick, in comparison this structure should fit nicely with ~0.6 mm to spare (1 pair of pucks seperated by 1 spacer, the other being located in the externally-accessible bowl-side part of my sphere).
So far i notice my ABV gets darker and yet it looks more even, which i view as an indication that deeper extraction effectively occured (and i see no scorching under normal conditions). There are 2 heating methods, as usual or "Red-Hot"... Getting some better airflow is all that's left to be done i believe. Combustion is no major concern by the time a bowl gets spent in any case.
Also, having recourse to the extension tubing allowed me to "climb the curve" at my own pace so i can now operate a genuine Classic wooden VG pipe if i must.
About "candle" vs "jet" flames, learning curves vs combustion, etc... After 3 months i can conclude i've made progress in 2 areas: 1) my PVC articulated extension makes a significant operating difference; 2) a shield obstructing the focal point will effectively delay "Hot-Spot" formation and hence combustion ultimately.
It seems to me that eye-contact with the front puck and the flame helps a great deal while having a decent refillable butane lighter proves to be quite appreciable as well. I favour "candle"/"jet" compatibility but i'd most probably want to switch instantly should my "2-Stones" wooden pipe be able to handle that... At the moment a pair of 3 mm thick "Ceramic Filters" is coupled to a pair of shielding spacers, combustion has become a much lesser concern but i still need improvement on airflow restriction - but at least i think this solution has real potential. Well, that would be nice already if resellers kept "foamy rocks" in stock besides the VG pipe so lets not be over-optimistic over this one!...
Anyway, i'm also conducting parallel tests using an "Easy Mod" as my reference. The PVC extension remains prefered as i don't like how hot a genuine VG duck-lips mouthpiece can get... It's refered to as being "easy" because this other modification was done externally, via the sphere's bowl-side access hole: an aluminium "defocussing" shield can be conveniently added to deflect radiating heat while a screen keeps this section clean (it's still possible to leave some free space if i want):
Though i'm afraid that's no definite Combustion Fix just yet - but there's hope!
N.B.:
That "Shielding Spacer" left a dark image on my ABV, i need to make more room between it and its corresponding screen as fairly intense heat emanates from there...
...
Alternately my "2-Pucks" approach appears to lead to a suitably-balanced deal but it's going to prove tight on space. If i'm right thickness must go down to nearly 1 tenth of an inch for each puck since my aluminium sheet seems close to AWG #19 and i'm assuming the use of assymetric spacers with legs on 1 side only (twice the thickness for the middle shield). An untouched genuine puck is about 7.5 mm thick, in comparison this structure should fit nicely with ~0.6 mm to spare (1 pair of pucks seperated by 1 spacer, the other being located in the externally-accessible bowl-side part of my sphere).
So far i notice my ABV gets darker and yet it looks more even, which i view as an indication that deeper extraction effectively occured (and i see no scorching under normal conditions). There are 2 heating methods, as usual or "Red-Hot"... Getting some better airflow is all that's left to be done i believe. Combustion is no major concern by the time a bowl gets spent in any case.
Also, having recourse to the extension tubing allowed me to "climb the curve" at my own pace so i can now operate a genuine Classic wooden VG pipe if i must.
Egzoset
Banned
Salutations everyone,
Here's something about what i consider to be my 5th 2-Stones Modded VG pipe. It's all based on a pair of tripod-shaped aluminium components similar to those illustrated below:
Ideally there should be only 1 single model (with short legs) so it fits both situations better.
I've made my front "foamy rock" 5 mm thick while a 2 mm refurbished one fits the bowl-side aperture (at the base of my sphere). That second "puck" got eroded after all my testing so it seemed appropriate to wrap it in a screen sleeve to prevent excessive movement.
It's hard to get the front "Ceramic Filter" red-hot while it sits on a shielding spacer acting like some heat-sink, effectively transfering excess heat before that piece starts radiating too much i suppose. A typical session will last between 5 to 10 seconds using my Xikar Resource, through quite a wide range of experiences i must add!! 1 Shield per stone is what i'll need from now on to consider any VG tweeking complete; i figure starting from there it's going to be like learning playing a flute - but much easier and convenient with some time/effort and luck.
I've tried a "3-Stones" configuration and felt i was definitely better with 2: 1 works but my preference goes to the middle solution so far.
Complete pipe extraction finally appears to be an option for me and i can begin to trust my sensations at last! Spent herb comes out darker and yet more even. Potential butane-related reactions are a thing of the past, i just hope aluminium is safe in my application!...
Finally, hot Spots are being delayed as expected. Combustion remains possible (if/when wanted!) but very unlikely during normal use. Well, at least airflow must have improved since i actually failed to notice.
Also, lets mention the HerbalAire black ballon mouthpiece and/or the Arizer Solo glass stem can be real handy as insertion tools i found out...
N.B.:
I no longer have an "Easy Mod" reference as its 7.5 mm puck got filed down (to 5) in my present experiment...
Here's something about what i consider to be my 5th 2-Stones Modded VG pipe. It's all based on a pair of tripod-shaped aluminium components similar to those illustrated below:
Ideally there should be only 1 single model (with short legs) so it fits both situations better.
I've made my front "foamy rock" 5 mm thick while a 2 mm refurbished one fits the bowl-side aperture (at the base of my sphere). That second "puck" got eroded after all my testing so it seemed appropriate to wrap it in a screen sleeve to prevent excessive movement.
It's hard to get the front "Ceramic Filter" red-hot while it sits on a shielding spacer acting like some heat-sink, effectively transfering excess heat before that piece starts radiating too much i suppose. A typical session will last between 5 to 10 seconds using my Xikar Resource, through quite a wide range of experiences i must add!! 1 Shield per stone is what i'll need from now on to consider any VG tweeking complete; i figure starting from there it's going to be like learning playing a flute - but much easier and convenient with some time/effort and luck.
I've tried a "3-Stones" configuration and felt i was definitely better with 2: 1 works but my preference goes to the middle solution so far.
Complete pipe extraction finally appears to be an option for me and i can begin to trust my sensations at last! Spent herb comes out darker and yet more even. Potential butane-related reactions are a thing of the past, i just hope aluminium is safe in my application!...
Finally, hot Spots are being delayed as expected. Combustion remains possible (if/when wanted!) but very unlikely during normal use. Well, at least airflow must have improved since i actually failed to notice.
Also, lets mention the HerbalAire black ballon mouthpiece and/or the Arizer Solo glass stem can be real handy as insertion tools i found out...
N.B.:
I no longer have an "Easy Mod" reference as its 7.5 mm puck got filed down (to 5) in my present experiment...
CheeseSandwich
Well-Known Member
So I gave my Dad a VG coil for father's day and he absolutely loves it. I've been trying to convert the old bugger forever and the coil finally did it.
Vitolo
Vaporist
Good job, converting another combuster!
CheeseSandwich
Well-Known Member
Thanks Vitolo, been working on him for a while.
SSVUN~YAH
You Must Unlearn, What You Have Learned...
http://www.pipesdaddy.com/Junior-Cyclone-Glass-Water-Pipe-Black-p/wp-0163-0001.htm
Got this piece in the other day, much sturdier than I was fearing after getting sent the wrong cyclone pipe. It's not the greatest to use with my solo, not bad though just not on par with the bubblers ime. With the VG coil it's awesome, perfect size to fill it up and get about 3-4 great milked rips per bowl. I didn't like how the coil gunked up my downstems on my bubs but this is a great solution. I got an 18mm keck clip fastened to the 6 slit 14mm downstem perc and the 18mm female GonG joint of the pipe. This prevents accidentally pulling the stem out and reduces "play" between the connections. Now when the stem gets nasty I can take it out and clean as well as not worry about a downstem while cleaning the whole pipe. Incredible how inexpensive this sweet lil piece is, hmmn 1 coil and this pipe still cheaper than my solo. I'm not ready to say the coil has overtaken the solo, but it's now giving it a better run for it's money!
Got this piece in the other day, much sturdier than I was fearing after getting sent the wrong cyclone pipe. It's not the greatest to use with my solo, not bad though just not on par with the bubblers ime. With the VG coil it's awesome, perfect size to fill it up and get about 3-4 great milked rips per bowl. I didn't like how the coil gunked up my downstems on my bubs but this is a great solution. I got an 18mm keck clip fastened to the 6 slit 14mm downstem perc and the 18mm female GonG joint of the pipe. This prevents accidentally pulling the stem out and reduces "play" between the connections. Now when the stem gets nasty I can take it out and clean as well as not worry about a downstem while cleaning the whole pipe. Incredible how inexpensive this sweet lil piece is, hmmn 1 coil and this pipe still cheaper than my solo. I'm not ready to say the coil has overtaken the solo, but it's now giving it a better run for it's money!
shredhead
Specialist
I love that I can take my stone out of my VG and make a glass VG so easily! The first time I tried it a month ago I combusted. But today I changed my technique a bit and I am getting amazing results! Gotta be very careful with this set up but it's giving the biggest and smoothest hits out of any vape. I can't believe the smoothness. I'm hitting it very hard tho with light dips of the torch lighter usually a 10 second inhale with two 2 -3 second bursts of torch. Gunna get some bigger screens for my adapter and hit some kief later 
Edit!!!!!!
Lovin these tastey smooth hits!
Double edit!
This set up has me higher then any vape I have, and without adding any more herb. It's like I'm hitting the cloud the way the effects are. This is the best and cheapest route anyone can go for getting a portable and at home bong set up. I'm really amazed at the efficiency of this mod as well. I get many hit, all very big and thick, out of very little (0.1). I haven't coughed once either.........
Edit!!!!!!
Lovin these tastey smooth hits!
Double edit!
This set up has me higher then any vape I have, and without adding any more herb. It's like I'm hitting the cloud the way the effects are. This is the best and cheapest route anyone can go for getting a portable and at home bong set up. I'm really amazed at the efficiency of this mod as well. I get many hit, all very big and thick, out of very little (0.1). I haven't coughed once either.........
shredhead
Specialist
Ok so second day with this set up and I gotta say it is THE best high, up there with the cloud for sure. No combustion issues at all. I can see myself strictly using this, just for the convenience factor. It's nice not having anything plugged in or worrying about batteries. Also it could be a great vape for on my amp during jams. Nice quick BIG hits. I can't believe more people don't do this, it's unbelievable and so cost effective. Even the last hits of the bowl taste good. It's all because of all that fresh air thats comin in, man I'm impressed. This has changed my vape game big time.
Edit:
Also have this dope 14mm j hook that's perfect for this set up.
Edit:
Also have this dope 14mm j hook that's perfect for this set up.
SSVUN~YAH
You Must Unlearn, What You Have Learned...
Amen brother, knowledge is power! I dropped some knowledge at my LHS today. I want a setup like yours and will have it before the year ends. I use the coil and have the same experiences as you are describing, although I'm confident that your all glass path would add more glorious flavor to this already great experience! VG glass Sherlock with ryot axe pack on my wishlist...
shredhead
Specialist
Oh man it is so flavorful! And super compact! I have only had vapor genie products in the past so I can't say for other lighter based vapes, but I feel the taste is comparable with the underdog, but you can also just hit it real light and get super tastey light hits that still get you insanely medicated. I highly recommend it. If you like the glass pipe I would say just buy the glass VG, but I like the durability of the wood pipes. So great they changed their design! Thank you VG!
Meghan
Well-Known Member
I've never used a VG before but am keen to pick one up. I like the idea of having a vape that can't die on me! I combusted mainly with a handheld glass pipe for 14 years, so the whole concept of pipe and lighter is a familar and nostalgic one for me. I went to the VaporGenie website and was stunned by all the options. And...now I'm totally lost. I've done some reading and I've heard great things about the coil (although it sounds like it's not good unless you're using water filtration?) and the glass Sherlock style, but I'm wondering what the popular consensus is. I'm fairly confident that I will be able to pick up the proper technique with a little practice, so I'm not too worried about getting the absolute easiest model. My biggest concerns are taste and that it will get me nice and medicated. I don't normally vape through water, so I'd like something that doesn't require it.
Honestly, the glass Sherlock style looks bad-ass but I'm worried about the fragility and size. Is there a smaller, stealthier option that tastes just as good?
I'm sorry if you VG fans are always answering similar questions...I know it's all up to personal preference in the end, but I'd love to know what everyone here likes the best.
I don't normally vape through water, so I'd like something that doesn't require it.Honestly, the glass Sherlock style looks bad-ass but I'm worried about the fragility and size. Is there a smaller, stealthier option that tastes just as good?
I'm sorry if you VG fans are always answering similar questions...I know it's all up to personal preference in the end, but I'd love to know what everyone here likes the best.
CheeseSandwich
Well-Known Member
is it possible to buy replacement ceramic stones for the VG coil?
Egzoset
Banned
Salutations CheeseSandwich,
I vaguely recall reading on their web site that replacements are only available through purchasing the pipe itself: mention you want this particular item when you buy. ...but i could be mistaking, in which case please let me know as i'll need a few of those, eventually! My late "3-Stones" experiment accelerated erosion as a result of frequent manipulations, i must confess.
I vaguely recall reading on their web site that replacements are only available through purchasing the pipe itself: mention you want this particular item when you buy. ...but i could be mistaking, in which case please let me know as i'll need a few of those, eventually! My late "3-Stones" experiment accelerated erosion as a result of frequent manipulations, i must confess.
It's a tedious process there's forms you have to fill out and such on the VG website.
I've never used a VG before but am keen to pick one up. I like the idea of having a vape that can't die on me! I combusted mainly with a handheld glass pipe for 14 years, so the whole concept of pipe and lighter is a familar and nostalgic one for me. I went to the VaporGenie website and was stunned by all the options. And...now I'm totally lost. I've done some reading and I've heard great things about the coil (although it sounds like it's not good unless you're using water filtration?) and the glass Sherlock style, but I'm wondering what the popular consensus is. I'm fairly confident that I will be able to pick up the proper technique with a little practice, so I'm not too worried about getting the absolute easiest model. My biggest concerns are taste and that it will get me nice and medicated.
Honestly, the glass Sherlock style looks bad-ass but I'm worried about the fragility and size. Is there a smaller, stealthier option that tastes just as good?
I'm sorry if you VG fans are always answering similar questions...I know it's all up to personal preference in the end, but I'd love to know what everyone here likes the best.
Don't quote me here but I believe the new bronze Sherlock is smaller in size than the glass, as far as medicating all VG's do the job very well, there's not really a huge difference between them other than ease of use. The wood will have a taste to it just like any standard wood pipe but after some usage the wood taste disappears. Now, some complain that you "taste gas" HOWEVER, I find this to be bullshit and an error in technique. I used a zippo with my glass Sherlock and had no flavor taint at all. DO NOT flick your bic over the stone and immediately begin sucking, simply take the extra 5 seconds to flick the bic away from the VG, and let it burn for a few seconds before starting your hit.
SD_haze
Well-Known Member
As long as you've bought a vaporgenie before, then you should qualify for $10 replacement stones.
Egzoset
Banned
Salutations Pcpvapors,
Salutations SD_haze,
Please allow me to confirm this statement with a touch of nuance! I'm operating my "modded" Classic VG using a flexible PVC extension almost exclusively, because of the eye-contact feature this provides. It's not clear to me if i can even recall "tasting" butane during my first few initiation days, before i actually thought of an extension...
Anyway, the point is i can now claim having adequate control over the flame, in order to avoid contact with it. That probably explains why i haven't "tasted" butane since March (e.g. the month i started using a VaporGenie Classic pipe).
Now, by this i don't mean butane burning is perfect. In fact, since no machine exists in the real universe that corresponds to such simplistic description, euh... Well, if the butane lighter ain't perfect don't expect perfect burning neither! Plus, there's 30 ppm of (undefined) "impurities" in my Xikar Purofine can that i'm prepared to deal with (mine are 300 ml/30 ppm, not 400 ml/15 ppm, by the way!) - judging from the bizarre reactions i experienced (which prompted me to search for a way to limit exposure) and the final outcome (i got my own solutions finally).
{Euh...}
Here's how it works: 3 to 5 second heating/inhalation suffices, the rest is from storage. It may not seem like it but to me this represents a crucial improvement, in that short period some energy appears to be stored in the structure but i believe the trade-off will be accelerated "erosion" - hence my interest in getting replacements, eventually. Total time (from lighting to end of inhalation) only ranges around 4 to 7 seconds, typically.
If this will verify then that's good news, the bad news is that won't help me: i wish it could come from the reseller i deal with, in person...
Salutations SD_haze,
Please allow me to confirm this statement with a touch of nuance! I'm operating my "modded" Classic VG using a flexible PVC extension almost exclusively, because of the eye-contact feature this provides. It's not clear to me if i can even recall "tasting" butane during my first few initiation days, before i actually thought of an extension...
Anyway, the point is i can now claim having adequate control over the flame, in order to avoid contact with it. That probably explains why i haven't "tasted" butane since March (e.g. the month i started using a VaporGenie Classic pipe).
Now, by this i don't mean butane burning is perfect. In fact, since no machine exists in the real universe that corresponds to such simplistic description, euh... Well, if the butane lighter ain't perfect don't expect perfect burning neither! Plus, there's 30 ppm of (undefined) "impurities" in my Xikar Purofine can that i'm prepared to deal with (mine are 300 ml/30 ppm, not 400 ml/15 ppm, by the way!) - judging from the bizarre reactions i experienced (which prompted me to search for a way to limit exposure) and the final outcome (i got my own solutions finally).
{Euh...}
Here's how it works: 3 to 5 second heating/inhalation suffices, the rest is from storage. It may not seem like it but to me this represents a crucial improvement, in that short period some energy appears to be stored in the structure but i believe the trade-off will be accelerated "erosion" - hence my interest in getting replacements, eventually. Total time (from lighting to end of inhalation) only ranges around 4 to 7 seconds, typically.
If this will verify then that's good news, the bad news is that won't help me: i wish it could come from the reseller i deal with, in person...
Egzoset
Banned
Euh...
I was curious about the HI for this exact purpose - once (local reseller didn't carry the glass part!). Anyway, what about a halogen lamp?... Just find one which gets hot enough, if that's possible at all. Google says 250 ~ 260 °C while i suspect much more would be needed unless you've got the lungs to inhale until the "Ceramic Filter" has heated up. At least halogen means GLASS (e.g. "clean"), i guess. Right?
Well, as for soldering irons, eutectic solder melts around 183 °C if i'm not mistaking. This may seem fine when one simply intends to heat the surrounding air up to this temperature, or so, but the flame required for a VaporGenie application can be safely assumed to be much hotter, something like more than twice what you're suggesting... and i'm thinking of the "yellow"/"candle" type here.
You'd have to remove the "puck" or make it thinner, 2~ mm being about the lowest practical limit (light still passes thru at 3mm so i'd suggest you try 4 mm). Of course, once reduced down to this thickness it's not possible to return to a genuine VG design. Euh... By the way, when i wrote i got reactions it must be specified that my 2nd version layout triggered the event. While i had access to one i tried to compare the original VG pipe to my "2-Stones"approach, after i gave it some time the "puck" was sized-down to test other configurations.
I was curious about the HI for this exact purpose - once (local reseller didn't carry the glass part!). Anyway, what about a halogen lamp?... Just find one which gets hot enough, if that's possible at all. Google says 250 ~ 260 °C while i suspect much more would be needed unless you've got the lungs to inhale until the "Ceramic Filter" has heated up. At least halogen means GLASS (e.g. "clean"), i guess. Right?
Well, as for soldering irons, eutectic solder melts around 183 °C if i'm not mistaking. This may seem fine when one simply intends to heat the surrounding air up to this temperature, or so, but the flame required for a VaporGenie application can be safely assumed to be much hotter, something like more than twice what you're suggesting... and i'm thinking of the "yellow"/"candle" type here.
You'd have to remove the "puck" or make it thinner, 2~ mm being about the lowest practical limit (light still passes thru at 3mm so i'd suggest you try 4 mm). Of course, once reduced down to this thickness it's not possible to return to a genuine VG design. Euh... By the way, when i wrote i got reactions it must be specified that my 2nd version layout triggered the event. While i had access to one i tried to compare the original VG pipe to my "2-Stones"approach, after i gave it some time the "puck" was sized-down to test other configurations.
Euh...
I was curious about the HI for this exact purpose - once (local reseller didn't carry the glass part!). Anyway, what about a halogen lamp?... Just find one which gets hot enough, if that's possible at all. Goggle says 250 ~ 260 °C while i suspect much more would be needed unless you've got the lungs to inhale until the "Ceramic Filter" has heated up. At least halogen means GLASS (e.g. "clean"), i guess. Right?
Well, as for soldering irons, eutectic solder melts around 183 °C if i'm not mistaking. This may seem fine when one simply intends to heat the surrounding air up to this temperature, or so, but the flame required for a VaporGenie application can be safely assumed to be much hotter, something like more than twice what you're suggesting... and i'm thinking of the "yellow"/"candle" type here.
I've been looking at the HI and vape attachment because of my love for heady dry glass, maybe just another reason to pick it up....
Egzoset
Banned
Hummm...
I hate dryness and that's one reason why i'm still using the VaporGenie, as a matter of fact. The matter of side-effects isn't a priority to me anymore, since this is supposed to be a "Plan-B" which doubles as an almost ideal "sampler" anyway... Anything not butane won't offer the self-moisturizing feature, in any case, and this implies having to match the vaporizer with a water accessory, unless dryness is no concern.
Sorry but there's not much to add as i've expressed my views in multiple past posts already, i imagine someone would have written all about it a long time ago it this could have worked.
I hate dryness and that's one reason why i'm still using the VaporGenie, as a matter of fact. The matter of side-effects isn't a priority to me anymore, since this is supposed to be a "Plan-B" which doubles as an almost ideal "sampler" anyway... Anything not butane won't offer the self-moisturizing feature, in any case, and this implies having to match the vaporizer with a water accessory, unless dryness is no concern.
Sorry but there's not much to add as i've expressed my views in multiple past posts already, i imagine someone would have written all about it a long time ago it this could have worked.
Meghan
Well-Known Member
Thanks for the feedback. After doing some more reading, I decided to pick up the Bronze Sherlock VG from the classifieds. I have a feeling this was money well spent...
OF
Well-Known Member
I think you're confusing heat and temperature.
All halogen lamps get plenty hot. Like over 5000 real degrees. Plenty hot for our uses, managed right? All the temperature a man could want.
http://hypertextbook.com/facts/2003/ElaineDevora.shtml
Likewise, common solder (melting at about 370 degrees F) is typically heated with a 700F soldering iron. The laws of Thermodynamics demand that the source be higher in temperature....or did when I went to school.
To heat the herb, heat has to flow from a higher temperature source. Just like in your home oven where the heating element has to be hotter than the box to bring the temperature up. A welding torch has to be hotter than molten steel or it won't melt steel. Heat flows from hot to cold, it's in the rules. That flow is what changes temperatures.
IMO you really do need to follow the conventional rules here if it's going to make sense. Stating with heat (in calories or BTUs say) and temperature (in degrees F or C) being two different things (but related by Laws). Something like horsepower and car speed?
OF