Discontinued Pandora Kit from Purple-Days
- Thread starter Purple-Days
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- discontinued diy log
shantytown007
Well-Known Member
I just pulled the trigger on the Walnut... though if this goes well, I'm gonna collect them all. Wife's so gonna kill me, but I'll die happy.HighSti said:
minnesnowta
Vaporist/Glass Head
Oooooo good to see you have some bodies with the logo already done up. And I'm glad I chose walnut. Looks good. All of them do actually. Can't wait to see it in person
HighSti
Vaporist-Secularist
Yes I did pull the trigger on the alder and I think I will enjoy every bit of it. Yes the PD may be something to be jealous of but I must say that your mz is pretty nice as well aero. Tom, from what I've seen, the elk leather changes color quite significantly from a gray to a tan after the buzz butter is applied.. Can you confim this?
fail
Well-Known Member
Shot some images of my recently built American Cherry Pandora kit.
I used propolis(in alcohol) as an undercoat to the Buzz-Butter. Propolis gives the red color you see on the images.
Video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S-QACnC47DA
One thing does concern me about the solder of the resistor which is used as the heating element. When I ordered the kit I wasn't aware that the resistor is the actual heating element. I guess that it is OK to use the resistor as the heating element (unless it cracks open for some reason and releases some toxic stuff). What does worry me is the solder that is a part of the heating element. The solder is probably not toxic when in solid state, but what about when heated up? The heating element (together with the solder) gets to 180+-, which is very close to solder melting point (200+-). I wonder what stuff gets released from the solder when it gets close to the melting point.
I looked for solder on Wiki, but wasn't able to draw any conclusions. I think that if I had to build the Pandora kit again, I would try to somehow "tie" the wires instead of using solder.
I used propolis(in alcohol) as an undercoat to the Buzz-Butter. Propolis gives the red color you see on the images.
Video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S-QACnC47DA
One thing does concern me about the solder of the resistor which is used as the heating element. When I ordered the kit I wasn't aware that the resistor is the actual heating element. I guess that it is OK to use the resistor as the heating element (unless it cracks open for some reason and releases some toxic stuff). What does worry me is the solder that is a part of the heating element. The solder is probably not toxic when in solid state, but what about when heated up? The heating element (together with the solder) gets to 180+-, which is very close to solder melting point (200+-). I wonder what stuff gets released from the solder when it gets close to the melting point.
I looked for solder on Wiki, but wasn't able to draw any conclusions. I think that if I had to build the Pandora kit again, I would try to somehow "tie" the wires instead of using solder.
DevoTheStrange
Ia! Ia! Vapor Fthagn!
As far as I know the soldering is not an issue for melting and giving off fumes. Lead Free Solder usually has a melting point of 210C or above (5-20C higher than leaded solder)... the PD only reaches 190C. That is a pretty big difference in regards to temp.
When you tie the wires they still pose a risk of coming apart and causing a short making the unit not work. the solder is required to insure that there is a good flow of electricity through to the resister. If you just tie them off, normal bouncing around and the likes can cause the wiring to come loose, thus killing your PD, and will have to be repaired as soon as the wires lose connection.
When you tie the wires they still pose a risk of coming apart and causing a short making the unit not work. the solder is required to insure that there is a good flow of electricity through to the resister. If you just tie them off, normal bouncing around and the likes can cause the wiring to come loose, thus killing your PD, and will have to be repaired as soon as the wires lose connection.
DevoTheStrange
Ia! Ia! Vapor Fthagn!
getting soft and melting are huge differences. When you are looking at melting points.. a few degrees is a big difference. and for all we know it could be one of the solders that has a higher melting point...I am sure Tom would know the data on that.
some lead frees melting point gets up too 220-230 area
the solder is required to maintain the flow of electricity.
some lead frees melting point gets up too 220-230 area
the solder is required to maintain the flow of electricity.
Purple-Days
Well-Known Member
This is the solder used by us since Day #1. Sn 96.5% Ag 3.5% nothing but Tin and Silver. We have been about material safety since day #1.
That's the reason we started making our own vapes. BTW I'm not sure what you mean by 'getting soft'... solder is soft to start with, very pliable. 
Tin Melting Point: 505.08 K (231.93 C, 449.47 F) not 220C and Silver Melting Point: 1234.93 K (961.78 C, 1763.2 F) not 220C. and at 96.5% Tin...
Fail, are you waiting to put the retaining clip in for some reason? I otherwise, nice video and nice unit.
As far as the resistor it is a ceramic, just like your coffee mug. And again, we have always been about material safety, so all electronic components have been RoHS compliant since Day #1. The only thing that's gonna break one is pyshical force and since it is secured inside a stainless steel sleeve you would need to remove it to break it. At that point it is like broken china, just broke, not toxic.
This isn't something new for us. 
Yes, the new wood bodies are turned and lasered but need bored.
The Elk Leather is tan, whatever that means... color is hard to pin down, and even harder to capture on digital images without a lot of expensive pro tools. The color will deepen with Buzz-Butter and go very dark with oil.
Alder is going to get scarce at this rate. I only ordered enough to see how it turned, which it did very well. Should have gotten more and we will when we order more wood.
fail
Well-Known Member
Purple-Days,
I am sure that you use the safest components. The thing is that I am kind of paranoid about this stuff. My concern was not the purity of the solder and not about the contaminants which can be present in small amounts even in the best solders. I am just trying to speculate about how the solder behaves in terms of safety when being close to its melting point.
About the retaining clip, I don't have yet the tool to insert the pin. They didn't have it in the shop.
I am sure that you use the safest components. The thing is that I am kind of paranoid about this stuff. My concern was not the purity of the solder and not about the contaminants which can be present in small amounts even in the best solders. I am just trying to speculate about how the solder behaves in terms of safety when being close to its melting point.
About the retaining clip, I don't have yet the tool to insert the pin. They didn't have it in the shop.
Purple-Days
Well-Known Member
I figured it was something like that. Watch turning the unit upside down till you get that clip in place.
Yes, material safety is so very important to us. It has been since Day #1. Like I have said I make these for us first, we breathe through them every day.
Yes, material safety is so very important to us. It has been since Day #1. Like I have said I make these for us first, we breathe through them every day.
fail
Well-Known Member
Actually I have some feedback on this and it is also related to the previous discussion. It looks like that I should not worry about turning the unit upside down, because the heat exchanger became bound to the resistor after two days of usage. When I first assembled the unit and before the initial power up, I could slide up and down the heat exchanger over the resistor. Now, after few days of usage, it looks like that the heat exchanger got fused to the resistor and I can't move it at all. I tried hard to move it, but it is bound like a concrete,Purple-Days said:
Don't want to cause a flood of posts by the forum users telling me that I must put on the clip and assure everyone that I will do it ASAP!
Purple-Days
Well-Known Member
Believe me or not. That's why there is no warranty and the build is entirely your responsibility. You may decide you 'know better' at any moment of the build. Your responsibility. 
I can only provide, the best instruction, that I know works.
The resistor is in no way 'fused' in place and you are not right about this. I have re-built a few and there is absolutely no way that you have heated the solder (and the entire thermal mass, not to mention getting the solder to stick properly without a flux to stainless) to anywhere near melting point and it is not bonded. PLease see the post above that corrects you temperature guesses for melting points.
Since I suggest the resistor should be friction fitted, and assuming you did that right, you are suspending the thermal mass by those wires and you will find out... Also: The 1" top washer is in a 1" hole. The Kiln dried wood may shrink slightly in the beginning, but that washer - to wood wall - friction will loosen with time and the clip is vital. You will turn it over one day and see the heat exchanger on the floor. And then you will look back at these instructions and understand why all PDs have a retaining clip. Good Luck and please understand why I am explaining it this way. I want you to succeed, not look down at something that fell apart.
That's why there is no warranty and the build is entirely your responsibility. You may decide you 'know better' at any moment of the build. Your responsibility. I can only provide, the best instruction, that I know works. The resistor is in no way 'fused' in place and you are not right about this.
I have re-built a few and there is absolutely no way that you have heated the solder (and the entire thermal mass, not to mention getting the solder to stick properly without a flux to stainless) to anywhere near melting point and it is not bonded. PLease see the post above that corrects you temperature guesses for melting points.Since I suggest the resistor should be friction fitted, and assuming you did that right, you are suspending the thermal mass by those wires and you will find out... Also: The 1" top washer is in a 1" hole. The Kiln dried wood may shrink slightly in the beginning, but that washer - to wood wall - friction will loosen with time and the clip is vital. You will turn it over one day and see the heat exchanger on the floor. And then you will look back at these instructions and understand why all PDs have a retaining clip. Good Luck and please understand why I am explaining it this way. I want you to succeed, not look down at something that fell apart.
fail
Well-Known Member
Purple-Days,
I think that you are not correct about the melting point temps of your solder. If you look in Wiki for your solder, you will find the exact melting point Sn96.5Ag3.5 is 221 Celsius.
I can easily hit 221 when I use a crappy Chinese power supply:
Apparently this power supply outputs much higher voltage than its 12Volt rating. When I first operated it at 12V, the weed got fully combusted and only the ashes were left. Now I operate it at 9V.
9V operate the PD at lower temp than the standard PD, but surprisingly this low temp gives a different and special high. The high is very relaxing and differs from the standard PD temps effect.
I like this low temp high and think that I will stick to it.
I think that you are not correct about the melting point temps of your solder. If you look in Wiki for your solder, you will find the exact melting point Sn96.5Ag3.5 is 221 Celsius.
I can easily hit 221 when I use a crappy Chinese power supply:
Apparently this power supply outputs much higher voltage than its 12Volt rating. When I first operated it at 12V, the weed got fully combusted and only the ashes were left. Now I operate it at 9V.
9V operate the PD at lower temp than the standard PD, but surprisingly this low temp gives a different and special high. The high is very relaxing and differs from the standard PD temps effect.
I like this low temp high and think that I will stick to it.
minnesnowta
Vaporist/Glass Head
Well a pd on a standard 12v wall wart never gets that hot so your "crappy chineese" power supply would be to blame. Like stated before the temp of a NORMAL pd is around 190 which is well below the 220 point which you found.
You really think that the solder can go bad when Tom has had the same pd plugged in for years??? Tom researches his shit. He knows what he's talking about and if it wasn't safe it wouldn't be in there. If you think you can do better I'm sure you can try for yourself. Just stop trying to prove him wrong. It won't happen...
You really think that the solder can go bad when Tom has had the same pd plugged in for years??? Tom researches his shit. He knows what he's talking about and if it wasn't safe it wouldn't be in there. If you think you can do better I'm sure you can try for yourself. Just stop trying to prove him wrong. It won't happen...
lwien
Well-Known Member
I've had mine running 24/7 for over a year. No problems with the solder at all. I will say, though, that the PD is running warmer now than when I first got it. It may have to do with the wood curing process, but I've never had to resort to koozies or 13.5v adapters like many of the competing vape users tend to do.
Purple-Days
Well-Known Member
Yes, that's better, not a guess or range of temps. As you can see this solder actually has a higher melting point than the most common Lead Free solder used.
Hundreds and hundreds of PDs are in use with 12Volt supplies. Hooking a "crappy Chinese power supply" that is not supplying the correct voltage? "Apparently this power supply outputs much higher voltage than its 12Volt rating." Yes, it appears you are right, much higher...
Not sure why you say, the rest... "The high is very relaxing and differs from the standard PD temps effect." Since you were using a higher voltage and not getting standard results.
Seems you want to take your own path, that's OK.
This is a great example to others. We give specs and recommendations and instructions. If you don't follow them, you can expect your results to be atypical.
Hundreds and hundreds of PDs are in use with 12Volt supplies. Hooking a "crappy Chinese power supply" that is not supplying the correct voltage? "Apparently this power supply outputs much higher voltage than its 12Volt rating." Yes, it appears you are right, much higher...
Not sure why you say, the rest... "The high is very relaxing and differs from the standard PD temps effect." Since you were using a higher voltage and not getting standard results.
Seems you want to take your own path, that's OK.
This is a great example to others. We give specs and recommendations and instructions. If you don't follow them, you can expect your results to be atypical.