Discontinued ThermoVape Evolution

[OF]

I use an lv evo on the Persei and can go through about 3 loosely packed bowls until the battery is half drained, if I pushed it I'm sure I could get 5 good bowls out of the 1600mah 18650 but it would be really low by the end of it...

But still this is much, much better than my mflb. I use to carry that with 4 batteries and a charger at all times... With the evolution, I just keep it in my persei box until I feel like having a good ole herb sesh. The performance of the evo compared to the mflb is tremendous, the mflb has a max vape output that is about half of what I would like to take. With the evo I let it heat up 10s, draw really slow until I'm happy with the vape (10-20s more), then just draw like crazy. You can get back to back clouds without thinking, or you can turn it off for a couple seconds, enjoy your previous hit for a while, pre-heat for 5s or so and just keep on vaping.

The efficiency is definitely there, it's just up to you whether you want a few huge clouds or a bunch of small hits.

Excellent post, Joe. Funny, I woke up this morning thinking about that very thing, trying the Evolution my new Persei. I guess in the back of my mind (yeah, I know...) it should do fine, that's not really the point....

Thanks for the report of smooth sailing later today.

I think you've summed it up very well. Heat the core up HOT, then pull some hot air into the bowl to heat it, then and only then take the fat hit of your dreams. Guys tend to rush it and not let it heat enough first, or accept the heating air as vapor hits or fall back on their MFLB skills and slow the draw down for higher temperatures and more vapor when exactly the opposite is called for. Honk on it.

The idea is when you get to that point of wanting to get power into the load to produce vapor you use stored energy, not energy as it's produced. Done right there's more heat 'on tap' for immediate use than you need for the hit (or TV would have scaled things differently).

Thanks again, great post, I hope folks read it.

OF

 

[t-dub]

Heat the core up HOT, then pull some hot air into the bowl to heat it, then and only then take the fat hit of your dreams. Guys tend to rush it and not let it heat enough first, or accept the heating air as vapor hits or fall back on their MFLB skills and slow the draw down for higher temperatures and more vapor when exactly the opposite is called for. Honk on it.

The idea is when you get to that point of wanting to get power into the load to produce vapor you use stored energy, not energy as it's produced. Done right there's more heat 'on tap' for immediate use than you need for the hit (or TV would have scaled things differently)

Thanks OF. This helps bring focus to my understanding of the thermodynamics of this device. I'm thinking I need one

 

[OF]

Thanks OF. This helps bring focus to my understanding of the thermodynamics of this device. I'm thinking I need one

Hey, you're quite welcome. 'Setting the record straight, one vapist at a time'?

A guy could do less useful things with his time......

Thanks for the post.

OF

 

[jambandphan03]

Hey jam, what piece of your arsenal are you using to drive the LV Evo?
I know you did not get that saber yet, just curious....Thanks.

I ended up getting the Evo-LV KIT from TV. None of my current mods were up to the challenge, they all have 3amp switches... or not a strong enough battery to drive it.

I just checked the tracking on my Sabor Mini, and it's made it to Portland, but not yet to Eugene, so it will most likely be Monday, unless I am pleasantly surprised this afternoon. The pattern has been a day (not counting sunday) after it makes it to Portland, sometimes 2, I will get my packages. I have a feeling that using the mini will work just fine w/ the passthrough, but not so much with the 16340 battery, unless the lil'chuck I tried with that battery had some other issue with conducting the power, but I doubt it. More likely the battery is just not powerful enough to get past one round.

I have been using the "510" extended adapter that I put together from 2 other 510 compatible adapters (510-901+901-510) to make a heat spacer, it seems to help. I took it off for a session and noticed that my battery chamber got hot faster, and it took a little longer to get up to vape temp, so I put it back. I have about 3/4" more distance between the body and the bowl.

 

[havealight101]

There are a whole host of 3000 mAh 18650 cells out there of different chemistries out there, it's clearly possible as I see it to double what we're getting from the present 1600 mAh one.

Yup, know it. Doesn't mean the shit is any better the next day...or the one after. Opening the discussion was unintentional it seems, Tim was being honest explaining what happened as far as he did. I'll be honest, I don't any more than you. Something is being worked on. I assume they tried for 'double duty' on some prototype by testing the new vape on the prototype supply. Assume, I don't know, but it seems reasonable. That supply is a separate project, it may or may not work out. What happens, for instance, if it works great for 50 cycles and by then it's capacity is down to what the 17670 gives us now? Or the unit it's driving is found to have problems?

The horse is not dead, it's just not ours to beat yet. If the question is 'can you get 50 hits?', the answer is no. And nobody is saying there is, no matter how many times the same question is asked. Or how it's worded.

Can we please be done with it until TV is ready to tell us something further?

OF

There are a whole host of 3000 mAh 18650 cells out there of different chemistries out there, it's clearly possible as I see it to double what we're getting from the present 1600 mAh one.

Yup, know it. Doesn't mean the shit is any better the next day...or the one after. Opening the discussion was unintentional it seems, Tim was being honest explaining what happened as far as he did. I'll be honest, I don't any more than you. Something is being worked on. I assume they tried for 'double duty' on some prototype by testing the new vape on the prototype supply. Assume, I don't know, but it seems reasonable. That supply is a separate project, it may or may not work out. What happens, for instance, if it works great for 50 cycles and by then it's capacity is down to what the 17670 gives us now? Or the unit it's driving is found to have problems?

The horse is not dead, it's just not ours to beat yet. If the question is 'can you get 50 hits?', the answer is no. And nobody is saying there is, no matter how many times the same question is asked. Or how it's worded.

Can we please be done with it until TV is ready to tell us something further?

OF

Yes we'll be done, and the horse is pretty battered. I apologize, I guess I'm more so speaking from "launchday"(i may have been the first order) remorse, I guess it happens a lot 'round here in FCLand. So I guess its my fault for pulling the trigger to quick? Since launch day, the true specs and stats have come out(thanks Tim for answering/testing when we ask), but the launch day stats is purely why I purchased this(i don't like lots of batts). That's where I'm coming from.. I have never questioned vapor production or quality.
Now no more... I lay down my sword.

Nice post Joe

 

[jambandphan03]

With the evo I let it heat up 10s, draw really slow until I'm happy with the vape (10-20s more), then just draw like crazy. You can get back to back clouds without thinking, or you can turn it off for a couple seconds, enjoy your previous hit for a while, pre-heat for 5s or so and just keep on vaping.

The efficiency is definitely there, it's just up to you whether you want a few huge clouds or a bunch of small hits.

I said about the same thing a few pages back, only I give it about a 15 sec heat up. Glad it's working for you on the Persei! I use the touch test to see how hot it's getting rather than counting the seconds now. Once the base of the bowl is too hot to leave my fingers on there, I know it's getting close and I'll start to gently hit it.

 

[JoeKickass]

I said about the same thing a few pages back. Glad it's working for you on the Persei!

Yeah your post helped me hone my technique, thanks!

On a different note, I wanted to see if the evo was over-driving my persei since it has a 5 amp limit and we had thought the evolution might draw more than that. With a full battery (4.22 volts) I measured a current of only 4.1 amps.

So, good that it's not damaging the persei but why so low I wonder? Maybe the 20 watt spec is at full battery voltage? 20 watts / 4.2 volts (full charge) = 4.76 amps... throw in some circuit resistance and I think my measured 4.1 amps is probably pretty accurate. And from there it should only decrease as the battery voltage drops, so the evo is really a sub 20 watt device?

Still happy with performance, so this just means it's more efficient than we thought!

 

[jambandphan03]

I am sorry I don't recall who's idea this was, but somebody mentioned watching your heat coil fire up, before loading it, to see just how long it takes just to get up to full power. I did this with mine, and it didn't have a strong glow until about 7 seconds. Add a few more seconds for the chamber to get heated up to temp with a load in there, 15 sec is probably about the minimum time it should take to start getting hot enough for vapor. I did notice however, that once the coil is hot, and you release the button for a second or two then fire it back up, the time is much shorter to watch it come to full glow, maybe 3-5 seconds, unless you let it cool too long. So it is a great idea to see how your core performs as a first step of using this device. Sorry I don't feel like combing back into old posts to find it...

 

[OF]

Yes we'll be done, and the horse is pretty battered. I apologize, I guess I'm more so speaking from "launchday"(i may have been the first order) remorse, I guess it happens a lot 'round here in FCLand. So I guess its my fault for pulling the trigger to quick? Since launch day, the true specs and stats have come out(thanks Tim for answering/testing when we ask), but the launch day stats is purely why I purchased this(i don't like lots of batts). That's where I'm coming from.. I have never questioned vapor production or quality.
Now no more... I lay down my sword.

Nice post Joe

Hey, cool, no apology necessary. I think it's a bummer to be disappointed and unfortunately you were set up by accident. Doesn't change the point it doesn't meet your specs of course, hopefully you'll find it useful. Worst case you'll need a second battery as I see it? That should make your fifty hits.

And soon, I think this will become obsolete. Or at least no longer state of the art. As is the nature of such things. Neat part is, given a little herb and electricity it should continue to serve well in it's intended role.

Be fun to see what comes out next, won't it?

Thanks for the kind words.

Yeah your post helped me hone my technique, thanks!

On a different note, I wanted to see if the evo was over-driving my persei since it has a 5 amp limit and we had thought the evolution might draw more than that. With a full battery (4.22 volts) I measured a current of only 4.1 amps.

So, good that it's not damaging the persei but why so low I wonder? Maybe the 20 watt spec is at full battery voltage? 20 watts / 4.2 volts (full charge) = 4.76 amps... throw in some circuit resistance and I think my measured 4.1 amps is probably pretty accurate. And from there it should only decrease as the battery voltage drops, so the evo is really a sub 20 watt device?

Who was it that said the experimenter is always a part of the experiment? Heisenberg I think? Anyway, I suspect if you'd also been reading voltage at the device you'd see it wasn't what you thought either. Your current meter and it's leads have probably upset things downward with more resistance. The only truly accurate way to rate the device is to force a given current in the normal range through it and measure the voltage at the device. Resistance and power are calculated from this, typically. This is the process Tim describes. So, yes, in that case I think it's a little hotter when put together?

OF

 

[JoeKickass]

Who was it that said the experimenter is always a part of the experiment? Heisenberg I think? Anyway, I suspect if you'd also been reading voltage at the device you'd see it wasn't what you thought either. Your current meter and it's leads have probably upset things downward with more resistance. The only truly accurate way to rate the device is to force a given current in the normal range through it and measure the voltage at the device. Resistance and power are calculated from this, typically. This is the process Tim describes. So, yes, in that case I think it's a little hotter when put together?

OF

Well I think I verified the flaw you found with my multimeter! I measured the resistance of the ammeter setting with another multimeter and found a significant amount of resistance:

About 0.3-0.4 ohm to be exact... and unfortunately I can't think of a way measure voltage at the output so I think we'll have to be content with theoretical numbers...

(My idea was to assume the resistance stays relatively constant and just measure voltage at the device)

 

[Stu]

Who was it that said the experimenter is always a part of the experiment? Heisenberg I think?

 

[OF]

Damn, Stu, sometimes I like you more than is good for either of us I bet! Thanks so much, you made my day bit time.

I used to be a Union Steward, and while I wasn't 'that guy', I sure worked with him......

OF (AKA 'Carbon Base')

 

[jambandphan03]

Well, this is no good, my charger just stopped working. The lights went out completely, I tried unplugging it, plugging it back in, at both ends of the wire, switched the switches on the sides, nada...dead. bummer. I guess I'll be contacting TV... on the plus side, my extra Evo-LV heat core just went off with the mailman, so it's on the way to being swapped for the 6v. Time to fire up the solo...


**just figured out I have a single batt universal charger that I got from madvapes a while back that just barely fits the 17670 batt and seems to be working. I use it for my AW 16340 batts. That ought to keep things rolling for now.

 

[2clicker]

Well, this is no good, my charger just stopped working. The lights went out completely, I tried unplugging it, plugging it back in, at both ends of the wire, switched the switches on the sides, nada...dead. bummer. I guess I'll be contacting TV... on the plus side, my extra Evo-LV heat core just went off with the mailman, so it's on the way to being swapped for the 6v. Time to fire up the solo...


**just figured out I have a single batt universal charger that I got from madvapes a while back that just barely fits the 17670 batt and seems to be working. I use it for my AW 16340 batts. That ought to keep things rolling for now.

didnt you get that XTAR charger or whatever it was...? shouldnt that charge your 17670s?

 

[jambandphan03]

I ordered it, a couple of days ago, but it won't be here for a few more days. It is supposed to work with the 17670, I won't know for sure until it gets here. I'm just glad my single batt charger seems to be working.

 

[2clicker]

i got my orings in the mail today. thanks TV!

havent had a chance to try the Evo with it on there yet. i will be checking it out here soon while i watch my Blues slap the LA Kings around a little bit...

 

[jambandphan03]

A little tip about the O ring, slowly twist as you push down on your cap, so it doesn't just roll the O ring down.

also just found out the Sabor Mini should work with the AW IMR 18350 700mah battery which is supposed to be a bit heftier than the 16340, so I have a couple of those heading my way in the next few days to see if they will have enough juice to power the Evo-LV on the Mini. I like the TV battery set up, but it would be cool if it works with the Mini since there seem to be a limited number of mods that will make the cut.

 

[darkrom]

Joe can you post a pic of your setup? I'm new to these who ecig style everything really besides the T1. I have just recently started following Persei stuff thanks to the herb cart. I'm curious to see what that looks like. I get 1 bowl per set of batteries on my T1, definitely not 2. 3-5 bowls sounds amazing to me.

 

[JoeKickass]

Joe can you post a pic of your setup? I'm new to these who ecig style everything really besides the T1. I have just recently started following Persei stuff thanks to the herb cart. I'm curious to see what that looks like. I get 1 bowl per set of batteries on my T1, definitely not 2. 3-5 bowls sounds amazing to me.

Sure I'll post the pic (in the persei thread) in a little bit. Do you have the lv or the regular evo? The regular version would have to use the same batteries even in the Persei, I think...

 

[darkrom]

I have the T1. I'm just curious about that setup. 3+ bowls sounds pretty awesome to me. What do you use to get the 3-5?

 

[JoeKickass]

I have the T1. I'm just curious about that setup. 3+ bowls sounds pretty awesome to me. What do you use to get the 3-5?

Oh ok and the t1 is 6v normaly right? I believe that trades a bit of runtime for faster heat up...

I have the lv evo and use a 3.7v 18650:

So I think you might be able to replicate my number of bowls with a lv evo and a 17670 in your current t1

 

[darkrom]

That is one awesome setup. I am jealous for sure. 3-5 bowls per battery WOW is all I can think haha.

 

[Mflbparox]

Oh ok and the t1 is 6v normaly right? I believe that trades a bit of runtime for faster heat up...

I have the lv evo and use a 3.7v 18650:

So I think you might be able to replicate my number of bowls with a lv evo and a 17670 in your current t1

haha im doing the same exact setup brb ill let you know the results

 

[Dj Bass]

Hey Joe. Having issues with my thermovape universal adapter I think. Is that the one you use, or the one from THCScientific? The thermovape one can't be screwed all the way down for me on the Persei, wondering if another adapter is the fix.

 

[JoeKickass]

Hey Joe. Having issues with my thermovape universal adapter I think. Is that the one you use, or the one from THCScientific? The thermovape one can't be screwed all the way down for me on the Persei, wondering if another adapter is the fix.

Yup I can take another pic if you want but mine can only be screwed on half way or less...

Would really love a shorter adapter, anyone find a perfect fit for the persei and other m601 to 510 connectors?