Hex-Nail (HN-01) - RIP

J

JigMelon

Well-Known Member
Well it's been another week so I feel like I should give everyone an update. I have not touched this at all in the last 10 days. I have spoken with new management (whether this is new management of the company or just new owners of the software is something which has not been shared with me) several times via phone and email and have told them all of my security concerns, I've disclosed everything I've done so far in testing, I've told them about the licensing issues and the potential legal issues which exist with the products that have already been released, and I've even told them what they need to do to fix the security issues and to prevent legal trouble. I have shared with them very valuable information to the success of their endeavor (and I did so here via PMs with Ava in the past, as well), without asking for any form of compensation, and have nothing to show for it. The new management mentioned their interest to get me under an NDA, and they even mentioned that they needed to serve someone a C&D in the past for researching a product of theirs. They have had plenty of opportunities to provide such documents (digitally, at least) and have failed to do so. They wanted to schedule a phone meeting with me, new management, and their software engineer, and they rescheduled the meeting several times before ultimately canceling the meeting 10 days ago. I have not heard from them since. I fear that they have been met with legal obligations.

Although I am not under an NDA, there is some information I have excluded from this post and the last one for the sake of my own legal protection.

HexNail never showed any form of licensing of their proprietary software, and I see no evidence of it on the device's environment, either. Until they disclose otherwise, it is technically legal to distribute the full environment, including the compiled hexnaild software, for free. As I said in the past, any future licensing could possibly be applicable to prior events, so I would still hold off on doing so until more information is known.

I'm trying to help everyone, including manufacturers, but we're all in quicksand until they cooperate.

If it comes down to it, I will continue on my ambition to make an update to share with yall, but if this happens you will be responsible for acquiring the hexnaild software and any other unlicensed components yourself. I will not participate with distribution of the proprietary software in any way until it is licensed properly.

New management: If you're reading this, shoot me an email.
 
PoopMachine

PoopMachine

Well-Known Member
JigMelon said:
@ensabbahnur The topic has come up, but I don't feel comfortable sharing the contents of this specific discussion at this time. Sorry :/ I know y'all understand, though, and I appreciate it. Can't hurt to reach out and ask them yourself!
Click to expand...

Ill take care of that for you.

"soon!!!"

BTW, thanks for your work on this. Be nice if some community project could come out of this somehow.
 
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J

JigMelon

Well-Known Member
PoopMachine said:
BTW, thanks for your work on this. Be nice if some community project could come out of this somehow.
Click to expand...

Assuming they are unable to license the old products and re-release with the necessary information for GPL compliance, it's inevitable.

Not that I don't think they have the capability to do so; I just think they may not be able to do so legally since the company has been liquidated. Idk enough about those laws though. Also, even if they could, it probably wouldn't be worth their time or other resources unless they were already facing legal obligations in regard to licensing and distribution.
 
GOD710

GOD710

Member
JigMelon said:
Well it's been another week so I feel like I should give everyone an update. I have not touched this at all in the last 10 days. I have spoken with new management (whether this is new management of the company or just new owners of the software is something which has not been shared with me) several times via phone and email and have told them all of my security concerns, I've disclosed everything I've done so far in testing, I've told them about the licensing issues and the potential legal issues which exist with the products that have already been released, and I've even told them what they need to do to fix the security issues and to prevent legal trouble. I have shared with them very valuable information to the success of their endeavor (and I did so here via PMs with Ava in the past, as well), without asking for any form of compensation, and have nothing to show for it. The new management mentioned their interest to get me under an NDA, and they even mentioned that they needed to serve someone a C&D in the past for researching a product of theirs. They have had plenty of opportunities to provide such documents (digitally, at least) and have failed to do so. They wanted to schedule a phone meeting with me, new management, and their software engineer, and they rescheduled the meeting several times before ultimately canceling the meeting 10 days ago. I have not heard from them since. I fear that they have been met with legal obligations.

Although I am not under an NDA, there is some information I have excluded from this post and the last one for the sake of my own legal protection.

HexNail never showed any form of licensing of their proprietary software, and I see no evidence of it on the device's environment, either. Until they disclose otherwise, it is technically legal to distribute the full environment, including the compiled hexnaild software, for free. As I said in the past, any future licensing could possibly be applicable to prior events, so I would still hold off on doing so until more information is known.

I'm trying to help everyone, including manufacturers, but we're all in quicksand until they cooperate.

If it comes down to it, I will continue on my ambition to make an update to share with yall, but if this happens you will be responsible for acquiring the hexnaild software and any other unlicensed components yourself. I will not participate with distribution of the proprietary software in any way until it is licensed properly.

New management: If you're reading this, shoot me an email.
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Dude just take over then and rebrand and licence it may seem a bad thing to do as u have helped them from the strat but your never going to get anything for it. Be our robin hood and just sort this peice of equipment out.

I just wanna have bluetooth or a external display now u know the software plugging that into a raspberry pi and sorting the rest would be easy for you, yet we are all here waiting on the gone ava.

It may seem bad to them and yoursellf but theres about 40+ of us that will happily back you and the new brand.

Heck you could even team up with other pepole starting new enails like freenail or disordly conduction.
 
PoopMachine

PoopMachine

Well-Known Member
GOD710 said:
Dude just take over then and rebrand and licence it may seem a bad thing to do as u have helped them from the strat but your never going to get anything for it. Be our robin hood and just sort this peice of equipment out.

I just wanna have bluetooth or a external display now u know the software plugging that into a raspberry pi and sorting the rest would be easy for you, yet we are all here waiting on the gone ava.

It may seem bad to them and yoursellf but theres about 40+ of us that will happily back you and the new brand.

Heck you could even team up with other pepole starting new enails like freenail or disordly conduction.
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+1

if this can become a community driven project that someone can DIY themselves, I could see this being a great thing with ginormous potential.

What are the changes that the proprietary stuff can be tossed and something open source replacing it?
 
Hogni

Hogni

Honi soit qui mal y pense
@GOD710 I believe waiting for Ava here is like waiting for Godot. Do you really think to see Ava here again after all what happened and - what for? She can't program. She can't - or won't - professionally assemble the devices.
All that we saw is she can dab as hell.
 
J

JigMelon

Well-Known Member
@GOD710 I definitely will not be commercializing their product in any way. Legal issues aside, I'm not going to steal someone else's work without going through the proper channels just out of principal.

@PoopMachine Developing new software to replace hexnaild absolutely CAN be done, but that's something I won't be able to do personally. I would love to, I just don't have the software engineering experience. The linux environment and the servers within are what I am experienced with. I definitely think we could get a community project going with a simple DIY build, a tutorial, and an SD card image without hexnaild. Whether a hexnaild replacement is made or users are expected to acquire that elsewhere is something that any participants will be able to discuss. Assuming it would truly be developed in an open way, there's no reason both paths can't be pursued.

Regarding helping them from the start, I definitely did not help them in any way officially; I just offered some suggestions. The suggestions I offered to Ava previously were without knowledge of the environment, as at the time I had not yet explored my SD card, also out of principal. The more specific information regarding legal issues, security issues, etc were made to the new management after I had explored. I do not feel that anybody owes me anything, and I did not mean to imply that with my post (but I see how the post could come off that way). What I meant to imply is that I've offered to help out without compensation in the past and recently, and have not been given the opportunity to do so.

Like I said, if they don't pick this product back up, a community project is inevitable. IMO the only thing worth buying in this field is the new MaxVapor once it's released, but that will be for people who are willing to spend the money on a professionally made (and supported) product. The community project would ideally result in a DIY product that people could make for less than $100. The perfect High5/Auber killer.

There's no reason someone couldn't base a product on the community project, but they would need to go through the appropriate hoops regarding licensing and disclosure to do so legally, assuming the community project would still be based on GPL-licensed software.

What I/we/anyone CAN do, however, is assemble everything without the SD card, and sell that unit. A pre-built or printed enclosure along with an SBC (single board computer) that already has the other components soldered in place is absolutely something that could be legally sold, as long as they aren't also distributing software. They would also need to avoid advertising it as being used with the proprietary software. Idk if that's a route I will go down personally, just due to lack of time and investment money, but I'm sure there are several users here that would consider doing so. It wouldn't surprise me to see that from some of the mod vendors around here, which would be awesome!

For now, my goals are to make a DIY unit and tutorial that would allow people to make their own unit assuming they could get their hands on a working SD card image. Copying software (for personal, non-commercial use) you already own is legal, at least in the US.

Once I've made a second unit and will then have a fallback unit, I'll start working on implementing bluetooth and/or a screen to the existing unit. Both of those things can be implemented without modifying hexnaild in any way, so this could be worked on openly, too.

I know everyone is really excited about AP mode, bluetooth, anything that increases functionality, but I really think it is in everyone's best interest to hold off on such dev work until more information is known. Doing something for free that benefits everyone doesn't mean you're free of legal repercussions, and until we know what was actually acquired by the new management, we will not know what legal repercussions are applicable. I don't want anyone here to get burned more than they have been already.
 
scalescliffs

scalescliffs

cashed
The attention to legality and respecting the rights of those who acted in bad faith is admirable but confusing.

There’s no license attributed to any of this - I bought a product and I would defy a potential claim to prove negligence on my part regarding the fair use and repair of the product. Where is the license agreement binding any of this, the patents, the enforceable copyrights?

Furthermore, who would bring claim that cannot instantly be met by counterclaims for theft and fraud?
 
ItWasaGoodDre

ItWasaGoodDre

Active Member
scalescliffs said:
The attention to legality and respecting the rights of those who acted in bad faith is admirable but confusing.

There’s no license attributed to any of this - I bought a product and I would defy a potential claim to prove negligence on my part regarding the fair use and repair of the product. Where is the license agreement binding any of this, the patents, the enforceable copyrights?

Furthermore, who would bring claim that cannot instantly be met by counterclaims for theft and fraud?
Click to expand...

Exactly what I was thinking. I respect the approach, but don't understand the reasoning behind it given that there is no licensing/copyright of any sort and the previous & current owner have not done a single thing to honor their word or satisfy the legal claims against them.
 
J

JigMelon

Well-Known Member
I don't disagree with yall, and if you look into the ramifications of products based on GPL software you'll see that we are entitled to some things. Whether or not that holds depends on if the product was bought by the new company or just the software, I believe. If someone else is more knowledgeable on this please jump in.

Also, for people who want to go deeper, there's nothing stopping you. Do what you gotta do. I just meant that I don't feel comfortable doing so myself currently.

I'm still open to helping them out if it means that current owners will get an official update, and I would prefer to maintain a good relationship with them until the fate of that is determined.
 
GOD710

GOD710

Member
Hogni said:
@GOD710 I believe waiting for Ava here is like waiting for Godot. Do you really think to see Ava here again after all what happened and - what for? She can't program. She can't - or won't - professionally assemble the devices.
All that we saw is she can dab as hell.
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Haha i meant it in a sarcastic way as we all know she will never return now :/

Im pretty sure this is all chat and all our hexnails will just become a old story now. Im pretty much considering getting a @FreeNail he seems much more customer focus and knows what he is doing.

@JigMelon I can see exactly where you are coming from but nothing will happen in the future on this forum is all that is left.
 
Monsoon

Monsoon

Well-Known Member
GOD710 said:
Haha i meant it in a sarcastic way as we all know she will never return now :/
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I noticed that some time after shit hit the fan and Hex-Nail went poof, Ava's FC profile went private so she came in here long enough to at least do that. I guess she's either gone for good or forever lurking now. Not much she can say now to fix anything but it would have been nice to dump some info here to help current owners since the warranties are now useless.

GOD710 said:
Im pretty sure this is all chat and all our hexnails will just become a old story now. Im pretty much considering getting a @FreeNail he seems much more customer focus and knows what he is doing.
Click to expand...
Don't get a freenail, it's overpriced and gimmicky for what it does. If you want something comparable to a Hex-Nail, the MaxVapor is a contender right now and half the price of the freenail.
 
Justpassedu

Justpassedu

Well-Known Member
I have on more question , apologies for the double post. What is the link to mirror the Hn-01's on a second screen again and does it still work and if so how do I go about it ? Ty


* Edit - Found it , can anyone confirm this still works :

to get to the web interface you need to do the following

1: Link the Hex Nail to your network (This is in the Hex nail settings and you will want to note the IP it assigns)

2: remember the assigned IP from the above and on either a mobile device or your computer, open a web page

3: Enter in the following and replace the IP with your Hex nail assigned IP address
"http://192.168.1.96:8888" (Replace IP with your Hex Nail IP)
4: it might take a few refreshes, but it will eventually load the Hex Nail interface in the webpage
A few things to keep in mind. Chrome seems to be the best overall browser for this, but have not tried any others. So if you run into issues, maybe try a different browser.
 
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YabbaDABBAdo

YabbaDABBAdo

Well-Known Member
Justpassedu said:
I have on more question , apologies for the double post. What is the link to mirror the Hn-01's on a second screen again and does it still work and if so how do I go about it ? Ty


* Edit - Found it , can anyone confirm this still works :

to get to the web interface you need to do the following

1: Link the Hex Nail to your network (This is in the Hex nail settings and you will want to note the IP it assigns)

2: remember the assigned IP from the above and on either a mobile device or your computer, open a web page

3: Enter in the following and replace the IP with your Hex nail assigned IP address
"http://192.168.1.96:8888" (Replace IP with your Hex Nail IP)
4: it might take a few refreshes, but it will eventually load the Hex Nail interface in the webpage
A few things to keep in mind. Chrome seems to be the best overall browser for this, but have not tried any others. So if you run into issues, maybe try a different browser.
Click to expand...

I can confirm that it works… And I know from other people who use theirs only through the web app since some of the screens have died but I use Safari and have no issues connecting
 
S

Square4Life

Well-Known Member
Since my Hexnail is currently a paperweight and I'm getting rid of NV controller...

What makes something like the Hexnail a 'better' controller (if it was working) than something like the Auber RDK300? Reason for asking, I recently got a banger and coil from @710Coils and paired it with a Auber RDK300 since that coil can't fit the NV controller. I've honestly been in love with it. Super easy to turn off/on, temp control seems to be on point, easy to adjust temp, etc.

That being said, I'm replacing my NV parts and want to get an additional controller (was hoping the HExnail would be working by now) so I can run the banger and FP at the same time. Just to clarify as well, I'm selling my NV controller and coil so that both coils can be interchanged if needed on the controllers. Just want it all compatible.

Should I get a more 'advanced' controller than the RDK-300 or just another RDK-300? I'm just trying to understand how much of a difference a more advanced controller really makes. I'm done with having the flashiest, I just want it to function and function well.
 
Justpassedu

Justpassedu

Well-Known Member
alittledabwilldoya' said:
How many HN-01's out there that are working properly?

One here.


PS @Justpassedu thank you for the tutorial.
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Mine is perfect ( Hn-01), very little use as well on it. Just sold it actually to someone that can currently get more use out of it than me. @Square4Life they are both basically just heating a coil and regulating the temps but the Hex-Nail takes it beyond that with many fine adjustments that can be made to suite your needs and modes that just take it to whole other level , plus pre-tunes for specific nails that take all the guess work out of finding those optimal settings. I'd do a little reading through the forums to see what it can do but with the Auber you get no options except temp control and that is basically it. Here is the manual to show you many of the options : https://drive.google.com/open?id=1e6H-TYqZhGGpDWJ-x0fwpPSKewNiNWxr
 
Justpassedu,
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