dotLeaf

[blackstone]

Blows my mind that they still have these chambers available for retail.

Some people have zero faith in medical (or any other) certification for vaporizers because it may not prevent every problem getting out, but in this case, in the certification they would have already had to demonstrate that they took every step possible to avoid risks, they would be forced to clearly explain any potential risk to every user and how to avoid it, or to cease sales of the product if an avoidable risk continues to exist.
Without it they can almost do what they like.
Maybe the crazing/cracking plastic is not a big risk but the oven insert temperature randomly running away outside all parameters like that, yuk. God knows what you inhale then.
I hope this doesn't go like Discreet Vape/Lily Rucky/Puffit 2 etc for you guys..... where they apologize and give out endless replacements for a year, never properly fix the fault, then fold.

 

[maremaresing]

@blackstone Me too, but nothing I've seen from the company so far indicates that at all. You may have missed this from the last page.

In regards to still shipping out Ultem ovens, I agree that that needs to stop until the final rendition of the oven is done. That's just setting customers up for a bad experience, and wasting their own money on unnecessary shipping, wasting manpower on unnecessary customer service issues, etc. I would do things differently like most of you, but it's not up to me, so I'm just along for the ride while they get things figured out.

Personally, I have had an all around pleasant experience so far with DotLeaf and DotMod in general, and while I see that they have some issues that they need to get worked out, I will continue to follow their progress and support them. I've seen enough companies go through this to know that it will either make or break them, but I can most assuredly say that if all we do is complain and raise a fuss...they wont waste their time on us. Customer service will start to go downhill, they will blow off customer service issues, you'll get bigger and bigger gaps in communication, the free replacement stuff will stop, etc etc. Things can get much worse...just look at some of these other vape manufacturers out there who are struggling now that they've been run into the dirt. I won't name names for this threads sake, but I'm sure they are easy enough to figure out. We have a part to play in all this too, and we can just as easily fail them as they can us. As consumers, lets help build them up rather than trash talk these companies that don't immediately and instantly cater to our every whim. We should be above all this. IMO, I think DotLeaf is responding very quickly to overcoming issues and unforeseen problems that they have come up against, and they are doing AMA's to remain transparent. These are all things we have verbally stated that we wanted from the other companies that are failing us on a regular basis, so when a company actually steps up to make things right, lets try and be good consumers, and give a little faith.
Again, I don't work for them, I don't get paid in any way by them, and I paid full price to them to get my Dotleaf. I was also one of the ones to help get a discount established, which was graciously extended beyond the 10 people it was supposed to help to cater to all of you as well. I just like the product and enjoy helping the community. I have no skin in this game other than the $170 that I invested with my order.

Many of us have an awesome vape to use now. Today. That works flawlessly every time with performance of a heavy hitter desktop. I would be crushed if they decided to stop working with the vape community on this product. The dotleaf is so far ahead of the game in performance and size and quality and price that I want it to really shake up the industry.

Vape design evolution has followed a steady path with steady features and kinda been homogenizing. Plus I hate the rubbery coating lots of vapes get nowadays. Everything is so proprietary and non replaceable. Even removeable ovens is a Hot New Thing that dotleaf naturally did because that's what they've been doing on the ecig scene for years. Same with removeable 18650. Same with standardized mouthpieces.

And the thing is so tiny. It's smaller than some vapes that use 18350. I'd like to see it next to the PAX or miqro for comparison. The AIS is chunkier for sure.

 

[Severmore]

At least @Severmore managed to successfully end up with one of the black ovens! How's it been treating you?

To be honest, I haven't tried it yet...the chatter about the PBT has me a bit worried, so I thought I'd wait until the specs are posted by dotLeaf, or at least until other user reports.

I was anticipating that all of you with herb tanks in the mail would be receiving the black ones, but it looks like there are much fewer of them out there than I thought. Based on @VGOODIEZ post a bit back, I'd like to think that dotLeaf is currently scrambling to get these new ones produced at scale, packaged for sale, and sent out to retailers as replacements. It is unclear to me if the new tanks will have an updated lid, or if they will stick with the current ultem version.

Speaking of issues, while my replacement dotLeaf works very well, one of my new "older-style" tanks started cracking by the second load, and I watch em grow with subsequent uses. Definitely a bummer.

I too want this device to succeed; it's pretty awesome. The fact that they're taking strides to right the ship is definitely a good thing. For me, dotLeaf's customer service has been great, and I will continue to support them until otherwise. Although, I'm sure we'd all appreciate a bit more transparency, as it's clear that the current tanks are merely a stopgap...to perhaps cannabliss?

I may be firing up that black tank sooner than I'd planned...for the team

 

[maremaresing]

PBT is an odd choice, but they did confirm that it's good for the temperatures that it receives. They answered 230C so that's that.

The "older style" tanks you have- were those the black oring or the white? Seems like the black oring ones had more problems than the white.

 

[Severmore]

PBT is an odd choice, but they did confirm that it's good for the temperatures that it receives. They answered 230C so that's that.

The "older style" tanks you have- were those the black oring or the white? Seems like the black oring ones had more problems than the white.

I've had both...white o-ring utlem tanks ("sharp" lid) originally sent to me by a third party retailer with my initial dotLeaf (#03xx) order in mid-December. Then dotLeaf sent me a replacement unit (#16xx) with the black o-ring ultem tanks ("smooth" lid) which arrived a few days ago. Both tank versions cracked at the base on the first day...though remained functional (at least until my original dotLeaf stopped recognizing the tanks). I was planning to ride my current ultem tanks until performance decreases.

Regarding the reddit AMA, they stated 230F...which is a bit different. Could be an honest mistake? Regardless, PBT seems more temperature sensitive than ultem, hence my hesitation.

https://www.reddit.com/r/vaporents/comments/kwptbm/_/gj5vbcp

 

[blackstone]

@blackstone Me too, but nothing I've seen from the company so far indicates that at all. You may have missed this from the last page.



Many of us have an awesome vape to use now. Today. That works flawlessly every time

That was the same with Discreetvape, and there were great aspects to the Puffit 2.
But 6 ovens, lots of patience and politeness, and one year after I bought one, they were just gone. So I do hope this doesn't go that way.

As to the rated temperature of the new oven casing, so far I've seen numbers from 140F to 220f to 230c, so I don’t know. I thought this vape goes to 240C?

At least they will communicate with you. I had an open line of communication until I complained, now I'm ghosted. I'm in the same boat with my unit. It heats until combustion and is currently completely unusable to me. I purchased before the discount code was posted. I paid $190USD + $40CAD import. That's $283 CAD I'm personally out of pocket within a week of purchase and I'm left with a company that seems completely unable or unwilling to try and help me out.. Not sure what to do as I've been fortunate enough never experienced these issues before.

I'll give it a few week's time while I drift off with some tasty Bowlés. How long does one have to request a PP or CC chargeback?

Ow, that's Crafty+ kinda money.

 

[SixStringToker]

I sent a 4th email to dotMod support. I'm not expecting much based on my personal history with the company so far, but we shall see. I'd like to think that I'm civil and even helpful in my emails and I try to provide as much data as I can:

One other data point in regard to my combusting dotLeaf ovens is that, when they were functional, I'd pack them quite tightly in order to increase the draw resistance and give a better mouth-to-lung experience. Perhaps that causes heat buildup beyond what you've seen in your testing?

These cracks go entirely through the oven body; I can catch the edges of them with my fingernails and actually see in close-up photos where the cracked material is even shifted. In one case, I can actually see thru one of the cracks into the oven interior. This would mean that these ovens are not able to seal since the gaskets do no good when air can just come in thru the walls. Surely that's going to impact performance.

Can I expect to receive replacement ovens to replace the bad ovens that you sent to replace my bad ovens? Or am I on my own?

Thank you for your time & please respond.

My posts to this thread have not all been complaints and I believe that I've gone pretty easy on the company, all things considered. If I run into problems with a device or manufacturer, I'm going to share my experience.

 

[maremaresing]

Sorry I clearly misread what they may have mistyped. I read it as 230C. While the oven gets up to 245C, the outer casing doesn't get nearly that hot.

@SixStringToker I don't think you are out of line at all. Your experience is pretty extreme so far. Hope they sort you out ASAP.

 

[SixStringToker]

Regarding the reddit AMA, they stated 230F...which is a bit different. Could be an honest mistake?

Yea, I think that's just a typo on their part. The melting point of PBT is 433°F.

 

[Abysmal Vapor]

Yea, I think that's just a typo on their part. The melting point of PBT is 433°F.

I am still waiting to hear what grade it is ,you can find a lot of data online,but it is guessing game ,cause it even varies from manufacturer to another. .Also that might be a melting temp,but it also has operation temp limits stated much lower,i am guessing that is a temperature where the material starts to degrade structurally . I thought their point was that the parts that come in contact with the plastic doesnt get hotter than 230F.
-----------------

In the end ultem cracking might be related also to poor contact,causing it to heatup at places it shouldnt get hot. In other words ultem cracking and combustion might have the same source.

 

[SixStringToker]

I received a relatively quick reply to the latest email to customer support (quoted earlier). Unfortunately, the first level of tech support is not actually very familiar with the device, so my email has been forwarded to a "colleague who is more well-versed on the dotLeaf and chambers" and I should expect a reply next week.

I also forgot the Customer Support rule... only respond to the very first question / statement in an email. So my question about replacements for my replacements did not get an answer.

::sigh::

 

[darco]

That’s very strange, it sounds almost like they sent you one of the original chambers, with the bit that tears at the o-ring.

Yeah that’s what it looks like to me too. In my perspective based on the issues I faced and how it got resolved for me, I think the smoothening out of the lid could have caused it to be a bit too short, causing the contact to not be made with the terminals at the bottom. An improper connection could cause the software go crazy with its resistance based temperature calculations and overheat. So I’m guessing the replacement oven with the older design presses down hard enough for the contact to be proper (for my device).

I’ll put the vape through A few more bowls and report back on reliability.

 

[darco]

In the end ultem cracking might be related also to poor contact,causing it to heatup at places it shouldnt get hot. In other words ultem cracking and combustion might have the same source.

I agree with this. I feel it’s the absence of a real temperature sensor / thermostat and having to deal with temp control in software using resistance variation is where the issue lies.

I think a bunch of these issues could be sidelined if Dotleaf explores an on demand mode with a chamber to go with it, in the lines of the Splinter or Stempods. As on demand devices are quite usable without sophisticated temperature control, since users can let go of the button soon as they feel the vape is getting hotter than ideal.

 

[darco]

Not sure if this has been mentioned here before but the ArGo screens that comes with the device fit absolutely perfectly into the DotLeaf bowl at the bottom. I have been using my new chamber with the ArGo screen and it seems to be helping as I don’t see any particulates in the chamber yet.

 

[Sn4Pz]

Blows my mind that they still have these chambers available for retail. In their AMA they stated "some" users had issues with cracking. Some

Or that they only had two issues of defective heaters during their "extensive" test phase...

hahaha ooook

 

[darco]

Or that they only had two issues of defective heaters during their "extensive" test phase...

hahaha ooook

IMO it is quite likely that the heaters started cracking more after they shaved off the top of the lid (which was done post release to fix the o-ring tearing issue). Hence the reports of the original chambers working better / not cracking. This would mean that they genuinely did not face a lot of cracking in their tests. Also, it would be stupid for any company to release a product if it always cracks in their tests. I’m sure they did not account for all the extra money they are now having to spend shipping replacements.

I think the company is being as transparent and communicative as a small company can be. Though I have had a rough experience with the device, I don’t feel cheated in any way.

By saying all this I don’t mean to dismiss and further upset the people who have had a bad experience or lack of support so far. New products have teething problems and like many others have said here - there seems to be a lot of potential in this device, especially considering its modular design. Let’s show some community support back to the company and work towards a better device together.

 

[TedK]

Uhhg. I was really hoping for something good to happen today; freakin' anything at this point. I just got home and noticed a package from DotMod. It's my replacement ovens! Except... they're the same ultem ovens as the original three. I am not thrilled.

'Not even going to bother trying them.

Same here just received a new oven, only to find it's the exact same faulty oven.
Whose cock do you have to suck to get a working product??? You'd expect early adopters to be treated with a little more respect than this.

CRACKING OVENS ARE UNACCEPTABLE (don't tell me its just cosmetic)
This should have been resolved during testing, but they quite clearly rushed this product out. Did they even do any testing themselves?? Na just let the pleb customers do that.
Absolute joke!

 

[maremaresing]

As promised earlier, I took some pictures of my original oven after cleaning. I wish I'd taken photos beforehand, but it had a good bit of leaf dust in the heat fins, and the rim where the lid attaches was sticky with reclaim. The ceramic inside of the oven was perfectly clean, of course, because it's pretty much self cleaning.

Bear in mind, I used this same exact oven near daily in hard use since I got it. Low temps, high temps, refills, anything I posted here was with this oven. To clean, I just swished it around 70% iso a bunch, then ran it under the faucet to rinse out. Let it dry and it's good as new.

The bottom has some cracks that I really suspect I did myself. After hearing about the oring risk, I REALLY forced it to compress the bottom spring when removing and inserting. This put a lot of pressure on the bottom contact, and these are likely stress fractures. Who knows. They showed up in a week or two, and haven't gotten any worse.

This is what I'd judge as "cosmetic", not whatever ya'll are experiencing.

As a final comment, I'm really happy the company is quick on it's feet with rushing in updated components. I'm sure they never expected a complete overhaul of their core components right out of the gate. That said, I'm a little sad that the Ultem is going away. Being able to see through the oven is so neat.

 

[Deecee]

I got a black oven today, done 2 sessions at lvl 2 so far. Flavor is very different from convection vaping on my stempod si, also feels like air doesnt travel through flower well. Looking forward to many more bowls to figure how to best vape this device.

 

[TedK]

Same here just received a new oven, only to find it's the exact same faulty oven.
Whose cock do you have to suck to get a working product??? You'd expect early adopters to be treated with a little more respect than this.

CRACKING OVENS ARE UNACCEPTABLE (don't tell me its just cosmetic)
This should have been resolved during testing, but they quite clearly rushed this product out. Did they even do any testing themselves?? Na just let the pleb customers do that.
Absolute joke!

Just attempted to use this second oven, and somehow it's worse than the first one. This one heats up continuously until combustion. No vibration, no indication it had reached the correct temp.
It also cracked more than the first one, this all on first use with a fresh battery. (not user error)

 

[maremaresing]

@TedK Welcome to FC!!! Thanks for giving the little dotleaf a chance. Definitely seems like those 2nd gen ovens have Problems. If you clean it out and run it on lower temps, does it work ok? Maybe the second gen had a different resistance and now temp4 is BAD but temp2 is very okay?

I'm now putting my 2nd gen oven through it's paces, after my first gen oven did so well over the last month. Eager for others to put their obsidian ovens through the paces. This is the neat thing about FC; we are on the cusp of vape technology.

 

[staircase slight of hand]

And just one week into use the dreaded white triple-blink has rendered mine useless. Seems that the revised lid just isn’t tall enough to engage the contact on the bottom (pushing down on the oven when turning on makes it work, but as soon as I release it the triple-blink happens again).

This was a nice device for the brief period that it worked, but I’m not really happy about the fact that they have a “no refunds whatsoever” policy for something that should have been released with some serious beta-test-release disclaimers.

 

[buckhakeesah]

I got a black oven today, done 2 sessions at lvl 2 so far. Flavor is very different from convection vaping on my stempod si, also feels like air doesnt travel through flower well. Looking forward to many more bowls to figure how to best vape this device.

Don't treat it like a convection vape. Let the heat build up and then pull more slowly than you would with a convection one. That helped me build up satisfying hits with it. The potential for big, flavorful rips and even AVB sessions is possible. I am still on original equipment. No cracks. Combustion was due to my personal error I feel. There's some hope.

 

[Arawfish]

Just want to update the thread on the status of my device, after talking with CS and reading over the AMA I decided to request a black oven, so hopefully I get one and not another oven I already have.
In the meantime though I decided to try my cracked and combusting ovens again, and I seem to be without issue of any kind. It has stopped going into the forever heating mode and seems to be working normally now... not sure what’s the deal is but I have a working vape again so I guess I can’t complain?

 

[Severmore]

Well...had my first combustion experience last night. Tank was cool prior to inserting and contacts were clean. Small cracks ran all the way up the side of the ultem chamber a la @SixStringToker Not good.

After begrudgingly cleaning the dotLeaf, I tried the new black oven. Two cycles at level 4 with a cool down in between. Other then one or two instances of the dreaded triple white light flash, it seemed to work well. No cracks, yet.