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Vaporization temperature dependent selection of effects

Discussion in 'Vaporization Discussion' started by tdavie, Feb 2, 2010.

  1. Egzoset

    Egzoset 1SipAToke Vaporist (v3.0)

    Messages:
    2,686
    Location:
    Shawinigan/Qc, Canada
    Perhaps we'd also need a tablod that would look something like this:

    400F (204C) Easy Vape
    415F (213C) Volcano, Zephyr Ion, MiniVap,
    455F (235C) Aromed 4.0, Evolutions v7, Noble/Top Vapor VP600, BC Vaporizer
    Ingjr and darkrom like this.
  2. midnight rider

    midnight rider Well-Known Member

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    wanted to send a big thanks out to tom and all who blazed the trail before him with compiling all this tremendously useful info and making this thread. :cool:
    all these different temps/effects combos make one thing crystal clear, for serious vaping you need at least one variable temp vape in your arsenal :2c:
  3. lwien

    lwien Well-Known Member

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    10,743
    Location:
    Arcadia, California

    No I don't. ;)
  4. VaporNation

    VaporNation Vaporizer Superstore Retailer

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    Location:
    Los Angeles, California
    Wow...I'm seeing some pretty extreme vaporizing temps. Personally, I think something around 350F and 380F is perfect. Otherwise, if you raise the heat above 400F, it just feels like your smoking. Then what's the point of vaporizing?
  5. degrassmann

    degrassmann Active Member

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    4
    Well to get the specific medical properties you want.

    I like that last chart. For me I like anywhere from 170-200 C.
  6. TwztedElegance

    TwztedElegance Boom Shankar

    Messages:
    166
    Location:
    India/Canada
    There may not be a point to you personally, but someone else may prefer higher temperatures to help ease the transition from smoking to vaporizing. To each his own, use this knowledge to pick whatever is your ideal range. I personally start low and end bowls at a high temperature to extract as much as possible
  7. midnight rider

    midnight rider Well-Known Member

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    35
    you don't own a variable temp vape lwien?
  8. lwien

    lwien Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    10,743
    Location:
    Arcadia, California
    Not anymore. Look in my sig.
  9. Tricky

    Tricky Active Member

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    5
    Hello Everyone.. I just got my Ariser Extreme Q, the one with the remote.. What's the best temperature to use? Thanks.
  10. Elluzion

    Elluzion Vapeosaurus Rex

    Messages:
    947
    Location:
    California
    Seems like 190c and 230c are the 2 optimal ranges for lower (more psychoactive) and higher (more body high)
  11. Papoose

    Papoose Well-Known Member

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    8
    Location:
    Saskatchewan
    I find the best effects at 180 degrees.
  12. willieR

    willieR Well-Known Member

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    968
    I wouldn't mind seeing this table along side the various bad things and their volatilization temperatures. For example at a certain temp Benzene is released, and so is a specific cannabinoid. You might not want to go there knowig you're also getting the Benzese, whatever.

    A table that showed the toxin release temps would be helpful for making decisions.
  13. andrewburgess

    andrewburgess Well-Known Member

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    24
    i'm pretty sure benzene is a combustion byproduct. it doesn't exist in unburned pot so can't be released.
  14. willieR

    willieR Well-Known Member

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    968
    Benzene starts being released at 200. Well below combustion
  15. willieR

    willieR Well-Known Member

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    968
    I'm more concerned now than ever before to have an awareness to stay under the 200C (392F) speed limit. I'll get most of the goodness I'm looking for and very little of the badness.

    I'm not one to look at ABV, and I don't care about missing some cannabinoids if it means I also have to ingest toxins. What the hell is the point?
  16. pakalolo

    pakalolo RoboMod v3.17 (ticking) Staff Member

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    Location:
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    Every attributed reference I've seen about benzene release at 200 C comes from a single NORML study done in 2001. I would appreciate it if you or someone could provide any supporting reference. Of particular interest would be what quantities are released, since Gieringer simply states, "Significant amounts of benzene began to appear at temperatures of 200 C. (392 F)..."

    I have a problem with that, since as andrewburgess pointed out, benzene doesn't exist in cannabis and if produced must be formed from the heating process. The references I can find all state that benzene is a by-product of combustion. I have found nothing (except Gieringer) that refers to benzene forming from simple heating at any temperature (never mind 200 C) as opposed to combustion. The fact that I can find no other supporting evidence bothers me.

    Having said that, we are exposed to traces of benzene all the time. I know I've probably had more than my share from four decades of smoking weed, for example, but consider this: there have been multiple studies that have confirmed that smoking marijuana does not increase cancer risk even in heavy weed smokers. We know that benzene does form during combustion (along with other carcinogens). It seems logical to me that if the benzene from combustion doesn't increase my risk, then it is highly unlikely that the benzene from vaporizing above 200 C (assuming there really is some) does.

    If you feel that your risk is increased enough to be concerned, then it's obvious what you should do: get a temperature-controlled vaporizer. You are correct that you can't easily limit the LB to stay below 200 C.
  17. willieR

    willieR Well-Known Member

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    968
    I did, in fact, get that statistic from that NORML study. What you say makes perfect sense. I see now what Andrewburgess was saying. I would love to know more about this. Not just Benzene, as that is simply a commonly used example, but I'd also like to know about other harmful materials that could be released pre-combustion. I have no interest in compounds formed or released as a result of combustion, since I'm not vaping nearly that high in temp.

    Perhaps I should start a new thread, as this isn't the original thread theme?
  18. willieR

    willieR Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    968
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vaporizer_(cannabis)

    Here they detail some studies that are openly contradicting the 2001 NORML study. This article points to several studies that all concluded no harmful substances were produced during vaporization. Very interesting indeed. There are references to these studies, and I think I'll take a look at them.

    Pakalolo thank you very much for pointing this out. It looks like I had this all wrong, which is excellent news!
  19. treecityrnd

    treecityrnd Active Member

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    515
    Thank you! I've been following this thread for a long time now and doing my own research. Can't wait to report back with data...
  20. pakalolo

    pakalolo RoboMod v3.17 (ticking) Staff Member

    Messages:
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    Location:
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    I feel obliged to point out that I was chatting with someone who is knowledgeable about this sort of thing and he told me that it is plausible that benzene forms during heating. That doesn't mean it does in this case, and I still want to find some reliable source that supports or discredits this finding.
  21. evelgrill

    evelgrill Active Member

    Messages:
    1
    nice topic! :D

    I would say its plausable too, when toasting or baking bread that goes brown from "heating", acrylamide forms which is a carcinogen, at temperatures starting around 200c.

    in "cooking" the temperature that separates boiling from frying is 200c, you cant fry a steak below 200c, hehe ;)

    sry bout my eurotrash english skills :)
  22. VWFringe

    VWFringe Naruto Fan

    Messages:
    935
    Location:
    South Orange County, CA
    i take whip hits, and I'm a fan of the higher temps effects, they help me keep my sessions short

    understanding the different temps really matches my experience, of getting the stone I want (haze) after the first hit, and after it's really hot for a long time
    --
    didn't I see something about mitigating benzene by exhaling the first part of the hit? i do this rapid three or four puffs until i see cloud before i start on the first and second hits - i do it to save on lung capacity mostly but thought i was getting rid of the benzene also.
  23. MrNorml

    MrNorml Well-Known Member

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    308
    So, could one say this?

    Iolite 374F (190C) then, produces:

    140 284 1xE, 1xAE, 1xAD
    150 302 2xE, 1xAE, 2xAD
    160 320 3xE, 2xAE, 3xAD, 1xAN
    170 338 4xE, 3xAE, 4xAD 2xAN 1xAX, 1xAS, 2xAI
    180 356 4xE, 3xAE, 4xAD 2xAN 1xAX, 1xAS, 2xAI
    185 365 5xE, 3xAE, 5xAD 3xAN 2xAX, 2xAS, 2xAI
    190 374 5xE, 3xAE, 4xAD 2xAN 2xAX, 3xAS, 2xAI

    so one could look for a product that produces the temps they want for the effects they want? (And make butter out of the remains for the remaining effects.)
  24. meduser#420

    meduser#420 Touch it, Feel it.

    So starting with this thought; If your sample being say .3g and 10% moisture content was put in a 355f stream of air. Would it still be 355f after 0% moisture content is reached?

    a lot of times when I use just a fixed setting it seems Im getting basically everything out. I realize draw speed changes the heat aswell, but with a fan style it would be a little more consistent. Am I getting everything at a fixed setting... hmmm...
  25. djonkoman

    djonkoman Well-Known Member

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    1,611
    well pfcourse the other stuff alsi vaporizes at that lower temp, just less rapidly as at a higher temp(water also already evaporates at roomtemp, just not as much as when aproaching the boilingpoint)

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