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The Herbalizer

Discussion in 'Plug-in Vaporizers' started by nopartofme, Apr 7, 2013.

  1. b0

    b0 Vapor powered

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    Subscribing to this. I don't like whip/bag vapes, but want to see the nerd side of this vape :science:
    nopartofme likes this.
  2. Hippie Dickie

    Hippie Dickie The Herbal Cube Manufacturer

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    yes, i believe so, but only after the 3 to 6 minute warmup/heat saturation ... so 3 secs to that performance is significant.

    with that 3 sec speed to toke, it sounds more like the sublimator -- at first i thought it was just another ViVape.
    b0 likes this.
  3. OO

    OO Technical Skeptical

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    Yeah, but can it play Cool Spot?
    If it's a portable, it may be revolutionary.

    There are at least two plug ins I can think of that fit the bill otherwise, though one only gives the option of going to 400*F.
    I don't think that is what was meant, because that was nowhere in the post that lwien quoted.


    I myself am confused, how will this vape allow one to remove what one doesn't want? Must be pretty darn advanced to achieve this.
    natural farmer and SD_haze like this.
  4. SD_haze

    SD_haze MMJ Vaporist

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    Ah ha you're right. It was in the original post he quoted but not the section he snipped.

    This perplexes me greatly, too.
  5. VaPeD&CoNfUsEd

    VaPeD&CoNfUsEd JoDa Glassworks Glass Blower

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    From what I'm gathering, that's the heat up time. That's y I'm so interested.
  6. Hippie Dickie

    Hippie Dickie The Herbal Cube Manufacturer

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    Detachable, 8 foot power cord

    300 watts would seriously dent a battery, or the unit would be quite heavy.
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  7. OO

    OO Technical Skeptical

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    With that combined with temp range consistency, I think it is pretty awesome, IF it delivers.

    But a few things are left to be desired, like compatibility to water devices, and portability. But if those are quick fixes, and all the other claims are true, they may do well.
    Until capacitor technology catches up to battery technology that is. ;)

    Since it isn't portable, then revolutionary I don't agree.
    CentiZen likes this.
  8. Slightly Medicated

    Slightly Medicated (SliM) Iron Lungs

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    Very interesting looking device, I am very impressed with the video the company produced. Really shows they care about that aspect of marketing and such. I found it to be very impressive. I do not think this thin is portable at all.

    I saw this a few months ago when I was surfing the net. It peaked my interest then. I thought it was much smaller at the time... think palm of your hand. From the video I saw one of the measurements to be about 8.6 inches in diameter. So I suspect it is a little over 8 inches wide in that clamshell design.

    It looks like a nice package to move from place to place. I could easily see using this device for my very medical patients. Other devices can be quite intimidating at times. If you are not used to a water pipe... it can kind of seem like allot to take in in the beginning. I think the whip/bag option is still the most approachable for the average user.
    ataxian likes this.
  9. VaPeD&CoNfUsEd

    VaPeD&CoNfUsEd JoDa Glassworks Glass Blower

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    Well whips are pretty easy to retro fit to just about any water piece. And for portability: while it isn't a portable unit it does house the whip and power cable. So those 2 things would make it pretty easy to get around I suppose. Even easier than bagging up say an ssv!
  10. OO

    OO Technical Skeptical

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    Or an HA for that matter.
  11. RUDE BOY

    RUDE BOY Space is the Place

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    I'm not big on cords and plugs but I could see this sitting next to my I-Home on the back patio.
    JoshyBalls likes this.
  12. vtac

    vtac vapor junkie Staff Member

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    I was surprised to not see any mention of this vape in the last year or so. Sure didn't take long for you guys to figure out it was the mystery vape, though.

    I had the chance to spend some time with the creators and a pre-production unit last month. To be honest I was skeptical after reading the bios on their website. Seeing "NASA engineers", "contributed to the design of the Trident II suborbital ballistic rocket guidance system" and "A key designer on the Stealth Bomber radar system" had my bullshit detector on high alert.

    Turned out to be legit though. At one point we were talking about that type of stuff and the CEO Josh opens his closet and pulls out a big box labeled "Satellite Parts" to show me some of the chips he worked on. Check out a pic of his desk.
    [​IMG]

    It was actually pretty surreal to talk to someone so intensely passionate about vaporizing who also had that level of technical understanding. At one point he apologized to me for going on so much about vaporizers - first time for everything, hah.

    So, really good vibes from the people involved, but I'm sure you're all interested in the vape. Again, I was skeptical and ready to be underwhelmed. A whip and bag vape, big deal right? Well the unit I tried was pre-production and had a 3D printed body, but it was sexy. Very sleek, and the fit and finish was immaculate. Looks aren't everything, but it was clear that a great deal of thought was put into the design. I'm sure many people will pleased to hear that it's being designed and built in the USA. They actually moved their office to be across the street from the engineering firm that's helping them with the design.

    There's a lot of unexpected technology in this vape like an accelorometer, and light sensor, but if I had to pick one thing that stood out to me it would easily be the temperature control. The idea of digital temperature control in a vape is great because it gives you precise control. Seems simple enough. Unfortunately it's really fucking hard to do properly. By that I mean the display giving an accurate reading of the temperature the herb is being exposed to, and the software accurately adjusting the heater to maintain the desired temperature, especially during use when the user alters it by drawing air.

    That level of accuracy is somewhat of a holy grail in vaporizing. Take a look through the Bud Toaster thread for an idea of why. I don't need to name names because it doesn't exist in any of the mass market vapes. When I figured that out it sort of turned me off "digital vapes" because it felt like the purpose was being defeated. After all, preset temperature models like log vapes work fine, as do models that use an analog dial to adjust temperature.

    I guess one could say that the current vape offerings are a little rough in that regard. It was never a deal breaker if they still produce vapor, but it seems to be something that people often don't appreciate. There's often some confusion when people are talking about a new vape and assume that the temperature setting on their unit will result in the same experience on all units. That variance is just something that we've learned to work around.

    That's a lot of talk about temperature. Why? I think I have a pretty good feel for vaporizing in general, and I've tried a lot of the vapes on the market. I knew all of this temperature stuff before trying the Herbalizer. But I didn't know what it would be like to actually have perfect temperature control. It's good. Really good. It's said that you can't truly know something until you've experienced yourself, and that definitely was the case for me here.

    The Herbalizer uses a purpose built halogen bulb as its heat source. This is important because it can get hot quickly. 0 to 1000F in a few seconds. Multiple thermocouples are polled by the software which puts the puzzle together. Watching the slick little visualization on the LCD while the unit adjusted itself after the temperature setting was changed was peculiarly satisfying. Knowing that I could accurately vape at any temperature I wanted felt fresh and liberating. It was neat watching the bulb kick on briefly to compensate for the drop in temp after the bowl was removed. The only thing that wasn't near instant was going from a high temperature to a low temperature. Still faster than any digital vape I've used before, and it went a lot quicker by removing the magnetic bowl and turning the fan on for a few seconds.

    This is a graph made with a 16-input USB thermocouple data logger showing real time measurement of the critical components staying cool, and most importantly the hot airflow. Most of the the technical stuff is beyond me, but the top two waveforms are what we want. Flatline. Yes, they killed it.
    [​IMG]

    Having the laser-like temperature control opens up some exciting possibilities, such as boiling off compounds at 350F using the fan assist and then vaping only the higher boilers, isolating precisely the desired compounds and effects. It could be done before, but not with this level of precision and repeatability. More than any vape I've used before it felt like I was using a scientific instrument or medical device. Or maybe a Star Trek prop. Vapor production from the unit was excellent. Extremely consistent, dense and flavorful. Though we had access to a multitude of other vaporizers we didn't do any comparisons. I sort of regret that now, but it didn't seem necessary at the time. I really need to get a Herbie for more testing.

    On another note we vaped a massive variety of herbs - yes, legal herbs - essential oils and even berries. Bags were filled, whips were hit, and we even brewed some vapor tea with the fan assist feature. I was surprised at how enjoyable the experience was, and felt a tinge of sadness that I had abandoned the idea of enjoying more of what nature has given us all these years. One of my favorites was steam distilled cinnamon essential oil in a mix of other things I can't remember; wonderfully sweet. I had a bit of a tickle in my throat and tightness in the chest after the plane ride there, and it was incredible how effective vaping some eucalyptus with peppermint was at relieving it. The experience really opened my eyes to the potential in natural medicine through vaporizing.

    tl;dr: The most accurate vaporizer I have ever used. I WANT!

    Will try to answer questions to the best of my ability.

    Oh yeah they made some videos:

  13. OO

    OO Technical Skeptical

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    Nice write up.

    Something to keep in mind is that the boiling points of specific compounds vary depending on the starting material, and will vary somewhat. However, the fine point of selection is appealing. Being able to pick a degree Fahrenheit and being at that temp is interesting. What is the uncertainty of the measurement?

    I still don't see how you can exclude what you don't want if it's a mid-boiler and you want all the compounds simultaneously.
  14. RUDE BOY

    RUDE BOY Space is the Place

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    Thanx Much for the info vtac , what would you compare the size herbalizer with ?

    keeping my quetions simple.
  15. OO

    OO Technical Skeptical

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    I'm slightly offended by some of the statements made in the videos.
    I think honesty is the best policy, and while the statements are not dishonest, they certainly give the impression of avoiding the truth.

    I'm out.
  16. Enchantre

    Enchantre A short, pithy statement

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    Watched the video...

    Okay, the researcher that developed the Stealth Bomber.... LOL!! That's too, too wonderful.

    Cuz, it is a stealth device. I love it! :rofl:
  17. RUDE BOY

    RUDE BOY Space is the Place

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    Going through the pictures on face book it looks like it'll run on a 12 volt supply. if so I'll be watching it much closer . videos of it in action will be cool !
  18. VaPeD&CoNfUsEd

    VaPeD&CoNfUsEd JoDa Glassworks Glass Blower

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    Great write up vtac. I especially liked when you said you felt like you were using medical equipment. That's one of the most appealing aspects of it for me. Precise medication control.
  19. Mynameismud

    Mynameismud But call me Alowishus Devadander Abercrombie.

    I think they should start working on another (portable) vaporizer and call it the stealth bomber.

    Anyway im extremely interesteed
    Enchantre likes this.
  20. vtac

    vtac vapor junkie Staff Member

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    Yes it is a plug in vaporizer. Beyond that I'm not 100% on any of this so please keep that in mind. Size is a bit smaller than a football I'd say, but with the flatter oval shape. Weight was maybe a few pounds. The bowl is an interesting 2 piece design that screws together and is magnetically held in place when inserted into the unit. Didn't measure the capacity but I think it was around the diameter of a quarter and the same in height. IIRC it's stainless steel surrounded by high temp engineering plastic. The interior heat chamber is anodized aluminum. It's not the most expensive vaporizer ever but there will be some sticker shock. I don't think it's unreasonable given the amount of technology and engineering that went to it. I'll let them announce it at launch.

    I would have preferred that they touted their strengths without mentioning other vaporizers (indirectly) in their videos as well. I'll cut the guy a bit of slack since he worked on the stealth bomber radar system.
  21. 1_gr8_underdog

    1_gr8_underdog Trapped in the Astral Planes

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    I seen a video of a guy(josh I think) on the beach with it hooked to a car battery blowing a bag but now I can't seem to find it :shrug: Perhaps it was all just a dream:tup:
  22. OO

    OO Technical Skeptical

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    No slack cut here.

    My standards don't tolerate comments like "other vapes don't work". Because they do work.

    It doesn't matter how smart you are, someone is always smarter.

    Like Tesla.
  23. Yoshi

    Yoshi Woah

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    I read on their site that it's +- 5˚F
    OO likes this.
  24. pakalolo

    pakalolo RoboMod v3.17 (ticking) Staff Member

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    I'm still trying to figure out why the name "Herbalizer" is so familiar to me, yet I'm sure I never saw this thing before.

    While I agree that precise temperature control can help a lot in extracting what you want, I think this point gets a little too much emphasis in general and not just in Herbalizer marketing.

    As many of you know, when a discussion of vapourizing by temperature comes up I am always quick to point out that producing vapour is not a binary process. Any component—doesn't matter which one—starts to vapourize long before you reach its theoretical boiling point, and as OO points out, boiling points vary somewhat anyway. The components exist in a matrix, not as individual compounds, so the boiling points listed in the popular charts (even if accurate) don't really reflect the compound that is being vapourized.

    Precise temperature control can't give you just a specific component. You can use a temperature that provides a component in its highest ratio, but that's it. You can't suppress components with lower boiling points and you can't avoid getting some proportion of compounds with higher boiling points.
  25. nopartofme

    nopartofme Well-Known Member

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    I had the same feeling. For me it was because it sounds a lot like Herborizer… :shrug:
    EveryDayAmnesiac likes this.

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