Discontinued Zion vaporizer

DocGonzo

DocGonzo

Well-Known Member
I agree with ZC. Their capability is their biggest selling point, so these vapes should almost sell themselves once people get a chance to try them. Do whatever it takes to get them in the hands of the most popular vape reviewers on Youtube and the blog scene and I bet you'll get a significant boost to sales.
 
nondarb

nondarb

.
pakalolo said:
I find this a bit amusing. FC is a much smaller pool than a lot of members think. Because we don't allow company-bashing and reddit does, the malcontents cluster there, but they are the same few posters bitching over and over.
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I think you're missing his point. The damage is done, it's not the same posters (many of the most vocal ended up hopping aboard in the end!) but rather others repeating some of the earlier rumblings.

RBT as a whole could really stand to mend some fences within the community, sure maybe folks are being hypersensitive but other companies have really stepped up the service aspect driving the industry to new standards.

r/vaporents is even smaller
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Not so sure about that.... They sure do seem to get more unique visitors and new users, FC's alexa ranking has dropped quite a bit compared to last year. If the subs not bigger yet it will be very shortly should nothing change.

To be clear, i'm not bashing this site or RBT's products (I enjoy my milaana and recommend it fairly often!) but emphasizing that @cwheezy has a point. Excited to see some progress being made on the Zion nonetheless, I agree with others sentiments concerning getting out some review units to the bigger name guys improving sales.
 
pakalolo

pakalolo

Toolbag v1.1 (candidate)
Staff member
nondarb said:
I think you're missing his point. The damage is done, it's not the same posters (many of the most vocal ended up hopping aboard in the end!) but rather others repeating some of the earlier rumblings.

RBT as a whole could really stand to mend some fences within the community, sure maybe folks are being hypersensitive but other companies have really stepped up the service aspect driving the industry to new standards.



Not so sure about that.... They sure do seem to get more unique visitors and new users, FC's alexa ranking has dropped quite a bit compared to last year. If the subs not bigger yet it will be very shortly should nothing change.

To be clear, i'm not bashing this site or RBT's products (I enjoy my milaana and recommend it fairly often!) but emphasizing that @cwheezy has a point. Excited to see some progress being made on the Zion nonetheless, I agree with others sentiments concerning getting out some review units to the bigger name guys improving sales.
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We'll have to hold differing opinions then. r/vaporents barely shows up when you search for "Zion vaporizer". I got his point loud and clear, but I think you're missing mine. The influence of both FC and r/vaporents is insignificant. The vast majority of vapourizer users (let alone potential users) neither know nor care about either of them.
 
little maggie

little maggie

Well-Known Member
As far as I can see, no one is owed an apology nor is there any repair that needs to happen. Engineers don't necessarily have the best social skills- that's not their strength. RBT has developed some great products. The problem is that he has not found someone to provide the customer service part of his business.

As one of the 3 who had to return their zion, I'm looking forward to the first shipment whenever it is ready.
 
hweezi

hweezi

formally cwheezy
Word of mouth gets around quick, and it doesn't take much research to find the information that may deter you from buying a $400 dollar vape, and if I'm spending that cash I know I myself will do some research before throwing it down. I don't see why anyone else wouldn't, it's literally an investment. So where else do you do that research.

Unless RBT is after the impulse buyers which I highly doubt, there may be a speed bump slowing things down.

pakalolo said:
We'll have to hold differing opinions then. r/vaporents barely shows up when you search for "Zion vaporizer"
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Well maybe if there were any out there maybe people would actually be talking about it. Now if I search "Milaana Vaporiser" you get a post called "the first unbiased RBT Milaana vaporizer review." That's gonna make me want to look around more, and that's on the first page of search results.

Idk, could mean fuck all but it's something to think about.
 
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T

TheRobbo

Well-Known Member
cwheezy said:
Word of mouth gets around quick, and it doesn't take much research to find the information that may deter you from buying a $400 dollar vape, and if I'm spending that cash I know I myself will do some research before throwing it down. I don't see why anyone else wouldn't, it's literally an investment. So where else do you do that research.

Unless RBT is after the impulse buyers which I highly doubt, there may be a speed bump slowing things down.



Well maybe if there were any out there maybe people would actually be talking about it. Now if I search "Milaana Vaporiser" you get a post called "the first unbiased RBT Milaana vaporizer review." That's gonna make me want to look around more, and that's on the first page of search results.

Idk, could mean fuck all but it's something to think about.
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That sub is a perfect example of why I stopped reading r/vaporents and in fact most things on redit... too many cock heads using half the story to suit their agenda. I mean seriously using someone else's post on a different forum to explain why a product is shit? How about buy one and fucking test it yourself or shut up!
And whats with the line saying Scrim was the only customer not afilliated with RBT? Dont get me started :freak:
I understand scrim didn't like the vape and that is fine but he only had it for like 3 days...If I based my opinion on 3 days usage I would have probably been disappointed too, the amount my technique has changed and results have improved over the months I've had Mil it's almost like a different vape now!
Ok rant over
Robbo out
 
Shit Snacks

Shit Snacks

Milaana. Lana. LANA. LANAAAA! (TM2/TP80/BAK/FW9)
TheRobbo said:
That sub is a perfect example of why I stopped reading r/vaporents and in fact most things on redit... too many cock heads using half the story to suit their agenda. I mean seriously using someone else's post on a different forum to explain why a product is shit? How about buy one and fucking test it yourself or shut up!
And whats with the line saying Scrim was the only customer not afilliated with RBT? Dont get me started :freak:
I understand scrim didn't like the vape and that is fine but he only had it for like 3 days...If I based my opinion on 3 days usage I would have probably been disappointed too, the amount my technique has changed and results have improved over the months I've had Mil it's almost like a different vape now!
Ok rant over
Robbo out
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Totally, and a bit off topic, but the dude who had posted that on Reddit, did eventually buy Milaana and loves it, now he has two :ko::tup:
 
HellsWindStaff

HellsWindStaff

Dharma Initiate
pakalolo said:
We'll have to hold differing opinions then. r/vaporents barely shows up when you search for "Zion vaporizer". I got his point loud and clear, but I think you're missing mine. The influence of both FC and r/vaporents is insignificant. The vast majority of vapourizer users (let alone potential users) neither know nor care about either of them.
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Your points are objectively wrong in a few areas:

- People who use vaporizers, from my experience, are more saavy then the average weed consumer. Vast majority of people I know, you are totally right, they have no idea about FC or Vaporents. And those same users are the ones who will go buy Grenco pens at the store, because they are uninformed. Why would they buy the Milaana/Zion if they have no idea bout it?

- The Milaana is not available in really any headshops, so those same local users who did no research, aren't going to even encounter a Milaana.

So, the place you are going to find about the Milaana, is these two resources. You won't even KNOW to google "Milaana Vaporizer" unless you went to one of those locations, of which there are numerous griping users in the archives of them both... These two locations are important for users to get info about vaporizers.

That's not to say the griping is continuous. I don't see anyone really bitching about RBT. I was a firm proponent of not giving money for Milaana's/Zions and I have even recommended them to people looking for quick thick on demand portable convection. People aren't shouting at the rooftops not to buy these.

Regarding users, this site has 25,523 registered users. Vaporents has 53,432............. so FC is an even smaller userbase than vaporents.

Hell, I just googled "Cannabis Vaporizers" and /r/Vaporents comes up before FC.....and it's still on the 2nd page. The websites on the first page, no mention of the Milaana or many other vapes.

So, if I even managed to suss out the name, Milaana Vaporizer or Zion vaporizer without going to these sites, and I google "Zion Vaporizer" You have two RBT store links, PV link, the link to this thread with other mentions of the Zion on FC underneath, 4 videos from the same user, and TWO /r/vaporents posts.....next page, a post on Grasscity from the same user again who had the videos, and then a bunch about Zion Illinios Vape shops. If /r/vaporents barely shows up, then I am curious as to what FC is doing in this Google search? Is it even more barely showing up? Does it count that it shows up more because when you hit "Show more from FC" it shows you a link to page 200, page 201, page 202, etc?

You google Milaana Vaporizer you have "First Unbiased Milaana Review" from reddit and you have FC and you have the retailers. And 3 videos but this time only 2 are from IAK2 lol.

So, I agree that while both sites are a relatively unknown blip on the spectrum of weed users, the idea that FC is somehow a bigger blip than /r/vaporents is objectively false, and the idea that users would find out about the Milaana or Zion from other resources is also objectively false. Since they'd never even hear about it or know where to look.

if you asked your non vaping friends to name vaporizers, there is a reason the volcano and the pax are still considered creme de la creme. Initially innovative and above the water mark. Which gave them word of mouth/media play. Too many people won't do the research to discover new vapes and you aren't havin Doug benson fire up a Milaana or having Donnie Glover rave about his underdog to show the tech to masses.
 
HD Springer

HD Springer

Well-Known Member
HellsWindStaff said:
Your points are objectively wrong in a few areas:

- People who use vaporizers, from my experience, are more saavy then the average weed consumer. Vast majority of people I know, you are totally right, they have no idea about FC or Vaporents. And those same users are the ones who will go buy Grenco pens at the store, because they are uninformed. Why would they buy the Milaana/Zion if they have no idea bout it?

- The Milaana is not available in really any headshops, so those same local users who did no research, aren't going to even encounter a Milaana.

So, the place you are going to find about the Milaana, is these two resources. You won't even KNOW to google "Milaana Vaporizer" unless you went to one of those locations, of which there are numerous griping users in the archives of them both... These two locations are important for users to get info about vaporizers.

That's not to say the griping is continuous. I don't see anyone really bitching about RBT. I was a firm proponent of not giving money for Milaana's/Zions and I have even recommended them to people looking for quick thick on demand portable convection. People aren't shouting at the rooftops not to buy these.

Regarding users, this site has 25,523 registered users. Vaporents has 53,432............. so FC is an even smaller userbase than vaporents.

Hell, I just googled "Cannabis Vaporizers" and /r/Vaporents comes up before FC.....and it's still on the 2nd page. The websites on the first page, no mention of the Milaana or many other vapes.

So, if I even managed to suss out the name, Milaana Vaporizer or Zion vaporizer without going to these sites, and I google "Zion Vaporizer" You have two RBT store links, PV link, the link to this thread with other mentions of the Zion on FC underneath, 4 videos from the same user, and TWO /r/vaporents posts.....next page, a post on Grasscity from the same user again who had the videos, and then a bunch about Zion Illinios Vape shops. If /r/vaporents barely shows up, then I am curious as to what FC is doing in this Google search? Is it even more barely showing up? Does it count that it shows up more because when you hit "Show more from FC" it shows you a link to page 200, page 201, page 202, etc?

You google Milaana Vaporizer you have "First Unbiased Milaana Review" from reddit and you have FC and you have the retailers. And 3 videos but this time only 2 are from IAK2 lol.

So, I agree that while both sites are a relatively unknown blip on the spectrum of weed users, the idea that FC is somehow a bigger blip than /r/vaporents is objectively false, and the idea that users would find out about the Milaana or Zion from other resources is also objectively false. Since they'd never even hear about it or know where to look.

if you asked your non vaping friends to name vaporizers, there is a reason the volcano and the pax are still considered creme de la creme. Initially innovative and above the water mark. Which gave them word of mouth/media play. Too many people won't do the research to discover new vapes and you aren't havin Doug benson fire up a Milaana or having Donnie Glover rave about his underdog to show the tech to masses.
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Another book on why hws hates Ryan. When it's all said and done do you like the performance of any Rbt product. If not why the consistant 10 paragraph statements on why Rbt is a bad person.

Why are we in a pissing match over who's got bigger balls. FC or vaporents. Who cares about all that shit.
 
HellsWindStaff

HellsWindStaff

Dharma Initiate
HD Springer said:
Another book on why hws hates Ryan. When it's all said and done do you like the performance of any Rbt product. If not why the consistant 10 paragraph statements on why Rbt is a bad person.

Why are we in a pissing match over who's got bigger balls. FC or vaporents. Who cares about all that shit.
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Idk? I didn't bring it up? But if you guys are going too, might as well get your facts straight eh?

Don't think you know what the word consistent means. But this is also a guy who gets stressed over 10 paragraphs, so not all surprising. I've not said a negative word in months. The opposite of consistent. What are facts when you simply misconstrue them?

I've recommended it to people. I've said the performance seems swell. Just cause I'm not stuffed on his cock doesn't negate my compliments to it. Should it? I'll be sure to leave it off the list when people ask then.

Thanks for reminding me why I avoid this thread. You (guys) who fervently (that means enthusiastically and passionately Springer) defend anything that isn't glowing praise for it speaks more about you than me & my innocuous comment simply stating that the influence of vaporents and FC shouldn't be understated, since average folk will NEVER hear about the Milaana or Zion or many other vapes without researching in those locations.

Uhhh ohhhhh getting dangerously close to 5 paragraphs :uhoh:
 
HD Springer

HD Springer

Well-Known Member
This is how I see it. I like to use the Milaana and the Zion. The Milaana is my DD. I hope this company survives the rocky start it's had. Does that make me on Ryan's dick or cock I guess. Never really thought of it that way.


1 of the main reasons satisfied customers like myself feel a need to respond to "any" negative comments might be because other people have gone above and beyond the call of duty to lobby against Rbt products being offered with certain reputable vendors. On that other (r)sight a while back. It's a crazy market/world we live in.
 
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pakalolo

pakalolo

Toolbag v1.1 (candidate)
Staff member
First, this thread (or any other) is not the place to discuss another member's posting style or subject. If you comment on another member, the only place on FC where negative comments are appropriate is the Negative Feedback thread for Classifieds.

Second, @HellsWindStaff: I can cherry-pick Google searches to win my point too, but I won't take the trouble. I'll concede that r/vaporents must be a bigger influence than FC after all, because that's not the issue. You agree with me on the real point here: most people who use vapourizers for cannabis (and nearly all weed users) don't know or care about these two sites.
 
hweezi

hweezi

formally cwheezy
We're talking about this because nothings been done, we're a year past the original shipping date (OCT 2015 remember?) with what progress? So to say there's nothing to repair with the community is not true.

Not even a time frame, so I'm fucking glad I opted out for a Mi instead, cause I've not got much hope for the Zion. With that said I really want him to prove me wrong.

Though if RBT wants to let me buy my Zion pre-order ( and any others that had backed out ) for the price I had originally paid while my interest free loan was used for a year, I'd call that mending something. Or hell a gracious discount for previous pre-orderers. No ones asking for handouts.

But to say nothing can be done is a farce.

If you value other things that isn't just profit.
 
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HellsWindStaff

HellsWindStaff

Dharma Initiate
pakalolo said:
r/vaporents barely shows up when you search for "Zion vaporizer".
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It's not that you won't take the trouble, it's that they outright don't exist. Sorry, I took the time to actually fact check what's said in this thread. Between the above and saying FC is bigger, some poor schmuck coming to learn who doesn't check will be leaving with all sorts of false notions....always good to do your homework

I guess I must reiterate, I disagree that most vaporizer users aren't doing their due diligence and researching on their own and thus they do have an idea about this site and/or reddit. Which is why it's important for a company to have a good reputation in those places. Because the average daily toker, I do agree here, will never hear of this place or vaporents and consequentially will never hear of the Milaana or the Zion or the Supreme etc. The Zion or Milaana isn't appealing to the average daily toker. Its appealing to niche vaporizer enthusiast market.

@cwheezy careful with that interest free loan talk. The same people who will chide you and say you don't get it are the same people who say the founder of the Evoke should be in jail for taking users hard earned money with nothing to show & assume that he is taking vacations and eating fancy dinners with that $$....Funny how cloth doesn't cut both ways ya know? Gawd what are those users nerve :lol: :eyeroll: But I agree I hope to see it in the light of day myself.

here's a list of things I think have been good:

- new cs user guy is a cool dude and seems helpful
- Ryan has been more transparent
- Ryan has lost the "woe is me" attitude
- Milaanas are shipping out with little to no issues
- Milaana users by and large really dig the device and very very few complaints. (Why I've recommended it to people and thinking of pulling trigger)
- awesome vapor quality!!

Hope that clears up misconceptions. Thinking about buying one. Guess the praise needs to be explicit.

What came first? The "angry" people without vapes or the ones who did get them but spread false information and insulted detractors as being "whiny, childish, etc"? So maybe Springer, the r crowd wouldn't tell reputable vendors to fuck off from this product if they weren't told to fuck off? Like I said earlier tho, no one is shouting this. Like at all... Ed and Randy are big boys who run successful big boy businesses; you give too much credit to the detractors for not having piu/Ed stock it/work with him. But I am flattered you think my and others opinion weighs so high on their minds.

So enjoy the Milaanas, maybe I'll be joining you soon after a SBj/cfv, good luck to Zion, good luck to Madcap and Mephisto and Maggie on getting theirs back. And good luck RBT!
 
HD Springer

HD Springer

Well-Known Member
Again. Thanks for book.

Nice apples to oranges comparisons. You sure have a very interesting argument.
 
HD Springer,
VegNVape

VegNVape

Increase the Peace
Company Rep
cwheezy said:
Well there's been nothing but crickets in here anyways
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:hmm:

. . . . Jiminy?
latest


:peace:​
 
Z

ZC

Well-Known Member
Honestly I think most vape users just walk into their local headshop and ask the bozo behind the counter which one they recommend.

I'm still caught up on one number. 250 Mi's out in the wild. That's just not enough. Like some basic arithmetic here and I'm wondering how RBT can pay for or justify a loan for paying a customer service rep and another company to produce Mi's.
 
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pakalolo

pakalolo

Toolbag v1.1 (candidate)
Staff member
HellsWindStaff said:
It's not that you won't take the trouble, it's that they outright don't exist. Sorry, I took the time to actually fact check what's said in this thread. Between the above and saying FC is bigger, some poor schmuck coming to learn who doesn't check will be leaving with all sorts of false notions....always good to do your homework
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I already conceded that you win and you still have to :horse:

Both Pax and Magic-Flight have sold into the millions of units, and probably S&B is well up there too. There is no way those people did any amount of online research because the traffic doesn't come anywhere close to supporting the theory. Sure, these sites influence the people who do some research. My point remains, almost none of them do. That means that for RBT to sell appreciable volume, they either have to secure a deal with a large distributor or established manufacturer who is willing to push their products, or they have to engage in a huge expensive marketing campaign. This is true for all of the small startups.
 
HellsWindStaff

HellsWindStaff

Dharma Initiate
HD Springer said:
Again. Thanks for book.

Nice apples to oranges comparisons. You sure have a very interesting argument.
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What's your point? Is there one? Are you going to continually bitch about length of posts?

Shows your "point" (what is it???) is weak as fuck too. complaining about post length *yawn* lol like is this guy serious? Brings nothing to table....

its ok Springer. "

How can they continue this bullshit of a show. At least with the grasshopper they were giving info. Albeit false info but at least they would communicate over time. These crooks won't even acknowledge that they took people's hard earned $.


Oops I forgot about that 1 picture where the "team" was out dinning on backers funds. Let's not forget that pic.
"

Lmao. You're hypocritical as fuck. Things have gotten better with Ryan tho similar stuff was said no? I was dying of laughter when I saw you post that. The interest free loan is totally cool! Progress takes time! Patience is a virtue! It's not lying, He just predicted wrong! :lol: :lol: :lol: this is up there in funny posts. I stand with Neeraj lol.......he's just an innovator innovating and it takes time away from innovation when you respond to your backers. :lol: he's an engineer not a cs guy Springer, get with the program! Apples to oranges??? They are both fruit. And I see a guy who does the exact same thing there, who then complains and defended those same points here :lol:

@pakalolo thank you for clarifying. Implying I'm "cherry picking points" lowers that points value IMO. Which is only reason I reiterated but gracias for clarifying I wholeheartedly agree that is what would have to be done and apologies for being dense and beating the horse in that regard.

Enjoy the products hope this sees light of day must wrap up approaching game of thrones level post length
 
HellsWindStaff,
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Shit Snacks

Shit Snacks

Milaana. Lana. LANA. LANAAAA! (TM2/TP80/BAK/FW9)
tumblr_nyzchdeszd1qanwe4o1_r1_500.gif


I actually had something else in mind at first but this works pretty well lol Nothing against either of you HDS and HWS, but you both may not have been your best selves, going back and forth here now, probably best to just chill, move on, live and let live? :peace::cheers::spliff:

Anyway, getting back on topic a bit (yeah yeah no such thing here as I've said) I have been taking my Zion batteries much lower than I used to now just rotating two pairs. The chip in Ziggy cuts off around 3v (can't remember if production was to be there or 3.3v... or what Zenon is, probably should test) and you can get so many sessions at various voltages it's ridiculous. I was getting used to single batteries again with Milaana and appreciating the simple convenience it offers, but it has been pretty damn nice to have regulation and super long life with two... Ah it is good to be back with the original phenomenon, reminds me why we first fell in love 15 months ago, hopefully some day soon more people will be able to experience this beautiful creation as I have :luv:

68c3585120ade14b6376159756cf82ba.jpg


Really any excuse to post Looney Tunes :D
 
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grokit

grokit

well-worn member
I found fc after I bought my pax v.1, my first portable. I hated it and had to figure out why. To the pax's credit I've had issues with almost all of the battery-powered portables I've tried. I had previous desktop vaping success with my ssv, which was after a couple other unsuccessful forays with lesser vapes. One of them was hopeless, but I have to admit that user error contributed to my dissatisfaction with the other one. If I had come to fc earlier I might have kept that other desktop, as I would have learned how to use it right. But back to battery-operated portables, the milaana is the best of them all even if it's basically a one-hitter; that's what I need 90% of the time is a quick portable hit and the milaana always delivers the goods. It sounds like the zion is in a whole 'nother league so I'm really looking forward to it (hurryup!).

Sorry for the rambling journey but at least I kinda brought it home :spliff:
 
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