Discontinued The Persei Vaporizer for herbs and concentrates.

[Caligula]

Any word on the 1701s? Trying to be as patient as possible, but im going bald from this hair-tearing time-lapse.

This.

 

[Silver420Surfer]

I would love to drop the Herc on this sucker.i'd feel like a caracter out of one of my pc games i play, wielding his futuristic vape of terror. Don't know or care if it'd work, and certainly not advertising another company. Just wanted to share something I found quite artisinal looking with this group, who are aware other mods exist, yet sill appreciate the Persei greatly.

G--say the word and I remove the link ASAP. No disrespect to you sir at all.

 

[OF]

Unfortunately no battery that I know of can monitor temps without having a sensor inside the cartridge.

I'm sure that statement is true, you don't know of such a system, or you'd likely tell us so.

However, you actually do know one of a sort, bit I don't think you recognize it. A while back we were discussing this very point as a feature of the SR71 heater, right? The resistance changes with temperature?

Put another way, if SR71 current reduces when it's hot, if I can measure the exact current I know how hot.

The battery And the cartridge MUST be used together. The Dabbler cartridge does have sensor inside the cartridge and in the battery.

Exactly so. Matching the temperature vrs resistance 'curve' to the measured resistance at any point will tell you the temperature to some accuracy. Or at least you can do that. I can think of a couple of ways that might be done 'on the fly', can't you?

That means, of course, a match. "Any old cart" won't work.

As long as it's at least possible I'm not going to call the man a liar until I have some evidence he's not telling it straight.

If 'self regulation' is possible in SR71, I suggest the same technology could deliver 'smart regulation'?

OF

 

[THC SCIENTIFIC]

I'm sure that statement is true, you don't know of such a system, or you'd likely tell us so.

However, you actually do know one of a sort, bit I don't think you recognize it. A while back we were discussing this very point as a feature of the SR71 heater, right? The resistance changes with temperature?

Put another way, if SR71 current reduces when it's hot, if I can measure the exact current I know how hot.



Exactly so. Matching the temperature vrs resistance 'curve' to the measured resistance at any point will tell you the temperature to some accuracy. Or at least you can do that. I can think of a couple of ways that might be done 'on the fly', can't you?

That means, of course, a match. "Any old cart" won't work.

As long as it's at least possible I'm not going to call the man a liar until I have some evidence he's not telling it straight.

If 'self regulation' is possible in SR71, I suggest the same technology could deliver 'smart regulation'?

OF

Temp control implies no matter what cart I put on it it's going to be the same temp. If that is the case then there shouldn't be any need for the statement
"our cartridges only work with our devices".

like I stated the cart and battery is matched for final output no controlling is needed.

As for the Herc self regulation then please show me any wire heater that works the same.

Only way is to take a 1.5 ohm cart and put it on the unit and compare it to the original and if the 1.5 cart gets hotter then no temp control exists.

What your saying is that the device has a built in variable watt system like the kick in witch it limits the watts to 6 no matter what cartridge. If that's the case they would not need the "our cart only works with our device" statement again.


If you think the ego batteries have that capability I have land on the moon I want to sell ya.

 

[OF]

Temp control implies no matter what cart I put on it it's going to be the same temp.


like I stated the cart and battery is matched for final output no controlling is needed.

I disagree. Temperature control means the temperature is controlled. If the heat load goes up, more power is used to produce more heat to bring the load back to the right temperature. Likewise, if it gets too hot, heat energy is throttled back, much like your home thermostat controls the temperature of your living room.

I also disagree with the second statement for the same basic reason. Temperature control means you compensate for changes, matching as you suggest only works right at one set of conditions. In the house analogy opening a window or a colder night calls for more power. It's a dynamic thing, not static. Control, not formula. The difference between open loop and closed loop.

As for the Herc self regulation then please show me any wire heater that works the same.

What your saying is that the device has a built in variable watt system like the kick in witch it limits the watts to 6 no matter what cartridge. If that's the case they would not need the "our cart only works with our device" statement again.

I think I've done so a couple of times, soldering irons come to mind as an example. It's well established thing, heaters are built around the idea. If I'm not mistaken the very heaters you're using in SR71 are used in other products?

No, that's not what I'm saying. I'm saying if you can accurately measure the change in resistance you can calculate the temperature rise. This too is well established. In serious power electromagnets as used on big accelerators, Electron Microscopes and other gear I've worked on over the years this is common practice to measure the coil temperatures. They're water cooled almost always due to the power levels and being precision magnets they're current (not voltage) controlled. By measuring the exact voltage on the coil (and knowing the exact current) you can calculate the resistance and from it the temperature rise since copper resistance has roughly .393% per degree C rise over the range.

I'm saying such a scheme could be used. I don't know for sure that's happening, but I believe it's possible if you want to do it bad enough. And then, yes, potentially you'd need to use the matching type cart heater......can you put any old 1.5 ohm heater in SR71 and have it work the same? Same reason.

Only way is to take a 1.5 ohm cart and put it on the unit and compare it to the original and if the 1.5 cart gets hotter then no temp control exists.

If you think the ego batteries have that capability I have land on the moon I want to sell ya.

I don't agree with this part, either. Take 3 different makes or 1.5 Ohm carts at random. Only one will be the hottest. Put the other way, I can build a 1.5 Ohm cart that doesn't get very warm at all (if the losses are high enough). The proof is to test the regulation. Change the heat load (hit it a lot) and see if the heat drops off (or detect it compensating). If it's a true pass through you should also be able to measure an increase in current as it tries to bump the temperature back up. In vapes like Solo this is easy to show. Hit it a lot (or just blow into the empty cup) and the duty cycle (percent of on time) for the heater goes up (to hold the same temperature in the face of the increased heat load). All you need to observe it is lungs and a stopwatch app on your Iphone......

I never said 'any old Ego supply will work', in fact quite the opposite. A very special supply, one I'm not sure even exists, would be needed. I'm sorry if I somehow left you with that impression.....I've no need for lunar real estate right now.....but I can offer you an excellent deal on a used bay bridge we just replaced.....cash and carry.......

Regards,

OF

 

[Silver420Surfer]

I just want to find a good mobile vape pen that I don't have to screw with to make it work or buy an endless supply of carts. Thought the TET Rev Dart/AVA were it for me, but after accumulating 3, I realized I either had wonky ones, or they just weren't for me. Too many lung busters followed or preceeded with little to no hits. For me it was too hit or miss with the Rev Darts, but I was really happy when they worked. Then I got a VB Dabbler, and realized how good my Rev Darts did not taste. The VB Dabbler was WAY superior in taste, and comparable in hit size/quality, plus no "ghost" hits like I expeienced with the Dart. Loved everything about TET, made in US, excellent warranty, good peeps. Just wasn't right for me. Got excited for the Cera, till I saw the size/shape(which is important to me, I realize doesn't matter for everyone). Used my friends many times(when it was available, he too had to use TETs warranty more than he would of liked), and just not digging it, at all. Maybe I am shying away due to the "similarities" of the same type of ceramic or darn close to the Revolutions.

So back to Dabbler for daily mobile needs(I don't always vape flowers, but when I do, I always use the Vapexhale Cloud), and frequent dabs on the nail at home. So my Dabbler battery dies and I need something NOW, not 2 days or whatever, NOW. So after kind of dissecting my Dabbler battery, I noticed nothing out of the ordinary for my non-engineering eyes and decided to go against the recommendation of VB, and use a 650 e-go I had. It worked the same as I can tell as the original Dabbler battery, and still is after 1 1/2 or 2 months daily heavy use. Picked up a spare 650 batt from local e cig shop and saved over $35+ from the oem battery. Kinda started looking around the internets for other "replacement" parts for my pen. Started finding MANY identical/ or very very similar parts. Carts with same coils, titanium coils,(no Dr Dab is not 1st with Ti coils sorry), e-go cones, type 4 mouthpieces, batteries,etc. Seeing all these companies popping up selling these eerily similar devices at varying markups, I came to the same conclusion THC Scientific just said earlier, most of the claims felt like b.s. to me. So, I do mostly like the performance/taste/hit quality of the 710/Vapor Dab/Dabbler/Micro Vaped/Dr Dabber-type pens, but with a ton of that stuff appearing to eminate from Schenzen(lets say I trust the Chinese very little, when it comes to my health, especially when you see the CHEAP prices on these eerily similar products that are being marketed over here.), I decided to checkout another homegrown company Delta9 Uptech. Which from reading OF posts, I believe also gets parts from China. (Really?!) So I thought I would look into the Persei, since it seems like the only other decent choice for mobile concentrate(shatters/crumbles/waxes/honeycombs).
So, there is my story, and why I am now here in this thread. Seeking all the knowledge I can, EXCEPT wattage, and voltage, and ohms and amps and jiggawatts. OF/G --start another power thread or something. Let's get back to the how good of a job it does or doesn't in real life,with concentrates(or flowers for those who like it for that) not Rain Man numbers/theory. Just my .
Learn me on all these different "rods";white, blue, plaid?? I didn't see them on the website.
Whew, no more triple strength Cookies and Cream bhang bars for me, I posted way too much and forgot to go sleep.

Hope this helps explain my vape qwest.I sure used enough words.

 

[THC SCIENTIFIC]

OF voltage is constant on most of these ego batteries, only a select few do a complete voltage (basically what ever the battery voltage is).


Your points are correct and I'm not saying your wrong. I'm saying no ego battery has this capability. I guarantee it so much that I'm willing to bet on it.

To say that voltage gets bumped up or drops because if wire resistance requires circuitry that just won't fit in that housing. The ego battery just simply provides voltage.

Now I can bet you also that the constant voltage of the battery coupled with the atomizer is what is being regarded as controlled.



Here do this test if it detects temps.

If it detects temperatures then running it dry would mean that it will just simply shut down the current so as the atomizer does t over hear.


If it glows you owe me steak dinner.


Silver420surfer you can talk about anything on our threads if your comparing or not. In fact we are so sure of our products we till always help you get the right one. Even if means going with the competition.

Trust me the Hercules and our Persei line is a little intimidating.

 

[OF]

OF voltage is constant on most of these ego batteries, only a select few do a complete voltage (basically what ever the battery voltage is).

Your points are correct and I'm not saying your wrong. I'm saying no ego battery has this capability. I guarantee it so much that I'm willing to bet on it.

I can't speak for 'most of the Ego batteries' of course, I've no idea the spread, but I regularly use six or so of several designs. A all of mine are at least the 'upgrade' versions that do either regulated (typically about 3.3 Volts not the 3.7 stated before which would cut the run time in half) or 'straight through', typically by holding the button down for 5 seconds or so when it's locked out (the LED color changes as well). A couple of different ones are fully Variable Voltage (like the 'Twist' line). None of my current Ego batteries is exclusively fixed output voltage (although they do exist of course, I've owned a few and also Omicron V1.....).

That was not, however, my original point. It's possible to detect temperature though the same two leads you're supplying heating power through in at least some cases, I've done it with copper windings. Personally. It can be done. I'm not ready to call a guy a liar when he says he's done it with his vape until I confirm he has not.....because I don't think it's impossible to do so.

Your points are correct and I'm not saying your wrong. I'm saying no ego battery has this capability.

To say that voltage gets bumped up or drops because if wire resistance requires circuitry that just won't fit in that housing. The ego battery just simply provides voltage.

Now I can bet you also that the constant voltage of the battery coupled with the atomizer is what is being regarded as controlled.

If it detects temperatures then running it dry would mean that it will just simply shut down the current so as the atomizer does t over hear.

Excellent! Some progress. So it is possible to do? A guy who says he's done it might not be lying then?

Correcting for spelling I think you just said such a thing just won't fit in that little case? I can't agree, the physical size of such stuff can be tiny, there's a viable VV supply in the Ego "Twist" line and that's really all you need if you can sense the current (which they all do since they shut down for shorts). All you need to do is control that VV supply with the sensed resistance (change) in the load rather than the dial on the end or button inputs on similar VV models. It is possible I think for that fellow to make such a gadget is my point. I've no idea how we got sidetracked into 'Ego makes them', a claim I never made. I'm saying the maker (LS?) might be making it, not that Ego is, has or plans to.

Finally, yes, that's exactly what I'm saying I think is possible. The supply might be able to control the temperature so that when sitting idle it does not overheat. How much concentrate is there doesn't matter at such times, it's a matter of balance between the heating power and losses (which change over time for a lot of reasons) to keep temperature in check. Control of the temperature is the key. A closed loop system, not an open loop system of the type you keep trying to shift to where the voltage is simply regulated (entirely different from temperature control).

To get back to the home heater analogy, it's the difference between having a thermostat that can compensate for changes based on measuring the results and modifying the input (closed loop) and building a campfire or blindly firing up the wood stove and never adjusting it, and hoping the output level is right for comfort where you happen to decide to sit (open loop). Huge difference in technique and results.

To summarize, I'm not talking about Ego anythings when I say I don't believe it's a fact the fellow is lying. This is because I know it's in theory not impossible to do what he claims......I've done it, or at least something very similar. Some materials show lots of resistance change with temperature. Copper is one, you're using another in SR71. There's actually a chance he's telling the truth. I hope I've clearly enough stated my reasons for thinking so? I don't believe it's impossible.

Thanks again.

OF

 

[Rhino420]

Let's get back to the how good of a job it does or doesn't in real life,with concentrates(or flowers for those who like it for that) not Rain Man numbers/theory. Just my .
Learn me on all these different "rods";white, blue, plaid?? I didn't see them on the website.

well silversurfer, i'm hardly an expert with my SR 71 (white rod)/persei... as I've only had mine up and running for a couple weeks now, but I can assure you that there are no "ghost" hits with the SR-71, that is unless you don't have the thing loaded up with concentrate. for me I get more taste from my persei/ SR-71 than I do from a Ti nail, and if you've tried the persei with just the regular carts, it tastes better than those...
also as of right now, you would have to cut your coils down if your going to use anything other than PG or similar concentrate in the SR-71. that being said, its really not that big of a deal, pretty simple a straight forward...

as far as the different rods being available to purchase on the website separately, it just hasn't happened yet. from what I can tell, the black rod is still being tested, and not available to the public yet.

edit:

also if you do end up pulling the trigger on this set up. (imho you can't lose). an extra set of batteries is a must! the batteries for me last a good 2 or 3 sessions... but if you don't have another set ready your down for 2 to 3 hours...

another thing you mentioned was having to buy endless amounts of cartridges, this would eliminate having to do such a thing anymore...
one of the things that sold me on delta9/uptech was the customer service IS second to NONE!
I'm sure plenty of people on here can attest to that....

 

[THC SCIENTIFIC]

Of I'm not contesting the fact you can monitor the wire resistance and adjust accordingly.

What I am saying is look at the evidence. If it can control temperatures then it can control all other cartridges. If for some reason their wires are copper they arnt stating it.


Lets do the common sense here and really look at ego power supplies, I have and there is no temperature control.

Now your turn.

 

[Silver420Surfer]

@Rhino420---Thank you very much for the very informative response to my post. I really appreciate you taking the time to do that. Would I have to "cut my coils" using the black rod? or is that just with the white rod? I will have nothing like PG(I assume you mean either that Pure Gold stuff i hear about or the Propylene Glycol stuff used in e-cigs), only using top shelf honeycomb,moonrock,waxy stuff, shatter and the like. Is that not recommended to use in the persei, all pass the foil test with flying colors. I hope the Persei isn't only for liquid-y type concentrates.
If the black rod can utilize the types of concentrates I use, maybe I should just wait for the black rod, no?
2-3 sessions per set of batts, kind of sounds a bit low, but I would possibly consider buying "the core" power supply that I read about on the Persei website. I would use my Persei all thru the day, so I may go poor buying batts if they only can handle 2-3 sessions per charge.

Can you use the SS(the shorter one) body with these "rods"? That may be a deal breaker for me, I need the shorter body for stealth and portability reasons.

Thanks again for your help Rhino420!

 

[Rhino420]

@Rhino420---Thank you very much for the very informative response to my post. I really appreciate you taking the time to do that. Would I have to "cut my coils" using the black rod? or is that just with the white rod? I will have nothing like PG(I assume you mean either that Pure Gold stuff i hear about or the Propylene Glycol stuff used in e-cigs), only using top shelf honeycomb,moonrock,waxy stuff, shatter and the like. Is that not recommended to use in the persei, all pass the foil test with flying colors. I hope the Persei isn't only for liquid-y type concentrates.
If the black rod can utilize the types of concentrates I use, maybe I should just wait for the black rod, no?
2-3 sessions per set of batts, kind of sounds a bit low, but I would possibly consider buying "the core" power supply that I read about on the Persei website. I would use my Persei all thru the day, so I may go poor buying batts if they only can handle 2-3 sessions per charge

i'm not sure if you have to cut the coils with the black rod, I've yet to get my hands on one... but there are people on here that have... hopefully they chime in on that one...
I also think THC SCIENTIFIC is working on new coils that would work best with the different consistency waxes (smaller the coil size works best with your more stable waxes ie shatters, and gets slightly bigger for your budders' and you use the whole coil for your puregold type stuff... at least that's how I see it.

as for the persei with normal carts, as long as it passes the foil test you should be fine... with the herc you don't have to really worry about the foil test so much, the thing will do hash from what I read (I haven't personally tried it yet).

2-3 sessions per charge... probably could go 1 or 2 more but don't like to go till they die.

Can you use the SS(the shorter one) body with these "rods"? That may be a deal breaker for me, I need the shorter body for stealth and portability reasons.

I don't have the SS tube, so again I really can't help you with that one.


-ryan

 

[Mynameismud]

@Rhino420---Thank you very much for the very informative response to my post. I really appreciate you taking the time to do that. Would I have to "cut my coils" using the black rod? or is that just with the white rod? I will have nothing like PG(I assume you mean either that Pure Gold stuff i hear about or the Propylene Glycol stuff used in e-cigs), only using top shelf honeycomb,moonrock,waxy stuff, shatter and the like. Is that not recommended to use in the persei, all pass the foil test with flying colors. I hope the Persei isn't only for liquid-y type concentrates.
If the black rod can utilize the types of concentrates I use, maybe I should just wait for the black rod, no?
2-3 sessions per set of batts, kind of sounds a bit low, but I would possibly consider buying "the core" power supply that I read about on the Persei website. I would use my Persei all thru the day, so I may go poor buying batts if they only can handle 2-3 sessions per charge.

Can you use the SS(the shorter one) body with these "rods"? That may be a deal breaker for me, I need the shorter body for stealth and portability reasons.

Thanks again for your help Rhino420!

The black rod runs on lower power, does not get as hot, and does not glow so if your using anything thats not really runny or liquidy you will need to cut the coil down. Im assuming though. Ive only used the black rod with a 30% coil i havent even touched my un open coil cause im keeping it as a spare. But a 30% coil and the black rod can handle any oil the white rod can. I currently have been using a very solid shatter and have had no problems with the black rod/30% coil. Noithing but extremely tasty vapor and pretty huge clouds.

I also am getting more than 2-3 sessions with the black rod. At least double that but Im not exactly positive because i usually get to a charger long before i need to charge them so i havent pushed them to the max..

And yes you can use the short stealth tube. But only with the blue and black rod and 1-18350 battery. Itwont get hot enough to use the white rod

 

[OF]

Of I'm not contesting the fact you can monitor the wire resistance and adjust accordingly.

What I am saying is look at the evidence. If it can control temperatures then it can control all other cartridges.

Now your turn.

Good. As the Lone Ranger would say 'my work here is done'. My point was it is possible; you can't call the fellow a liar just for saying he's done it.

No, that's not evidence to support your point. In fact it supports mine. To work such a system most definitely will not work with "all other cartridges" in fact, just the opposite. It would only work for the specific cartridge it's designed for.....something the maker said???? What do you suppose would happen with a Revolution/DART cartridge where the alloy used has nearly no change with temperature? Not going to do too well.

The very fact he says it needs the proper cartridge to work tells me he at least understands what's going on.....and told us as much.

No turns about it, I've no interest at all in running down Ego supplies, in fact I rather like them.

My point was your competitor could actually be doing what you said was impossible? Might be alone in the idea for all I know. I don't believe you can patient it.

OF

 

[PhotoRider]

I agree with OF, if there is a linear relationship between current and temp as characterized by the mfg, then a feedback system could be designed to use this value as a feedback system.

If another cart is used with different characteristics then it wouldn't work correctly

 

[THC SCIENTIFIC]

I agree with OF, if there is a linear relationship between current and temp as characterized by the mfg, then a feedback system could be designed to use this value as a feedback system.

If another cart is used with different characteristics then it wouldn't work correctly

True but what if all carts are the same? It should work on all right?


There is a difference on being able to do it and actually having that capability is what in stating.

In fact the ego does not have that capability.

 

[PhotoRider]

yes, if the cart is the same it should be the same.

No idea if this is done, but in theory possible, but unlikely...

 

[OF]

In fact the ego does not have that capability.

Agreed. No Ego supply I know regulates temperature either.

The topic, back when, was does the Dabbler do this however. Not Ego I thought. That's what was labeled "bs and straight out lies". I think it's at least possible to do with only two leads. It does not need a thermocouple, in fact all the vapes I know off hand except the Bud Toaster use thermistors. Much easier to use, which is why they're in such common use. That was my point, I really don't understand how Ego keeps showing up. I agree, if the topic is temperature control, Ego is not the product to look to.

OF

 

[THC SCIENTIFIC]

Agreed. No Ego supply I know regulates temperature either.

The topic, back when, was does the Dabbler do this however. Not Ego I thought. That's what was labeled "bs and straight out lies". I think it's at least possible to do with only two leads. It does not need a thermocouple, in fact all the vapes I know off hand except the Bud Toaster use thermistors. Much easier to use, which is why they're in such common use. That was my point, I really don't understand how Ego keeps showing up. I agree, if the topic is temperature control, Ego is not the product to look to.

OF

Because the said unit is a ego battery and nothing else. That's why it's branded as an ego.

 

[OF]

Because the said unit is a ego battery and nothing else. That's why it's branded as an ego.

I missed that part, can you please show me where they claim it's an Ego? The web site claims it's made by 'Vape Pen' (whoever they are....) and features "Advanced microprocessor temperature monitoring" which standard Egos don't.
http://www.vaporbrothers.com/dabbler/

OF

 

[Quetzalcoatl]

I missed that part, can you please show me where they claim it's an Ego? The web site claims it's made by 'Vape Pen' (whoever they are....) and features "Advanced microprocessor temperature monitoring" which standard Egos don't.
http://www.vaporbrothers.com/dabbler/

OF

The Dabbler is push-button operated and contains a high-capacity rechargeable battery and an advanced microprocessor controller. This specially programmed chip monitors the temperature and timing, to assure a superior vaporization experience with maximum efficiency and safety.

http://vape-pen.com/Dabbler.php

 

[THC SCIENTIFIC]

Just because people arnt calling it an ego doesn't mean it's not.

The form factor is a Ego, basically a name that stuck when joy tech came out with the first ego batteries. Like cotton swabs or more commonly known as qtips.


Maybe we should all google ego batteries and see what I mean?

 

[ataxian]

The Dabbler is push-button operated and contains a high-capacity rechargeable battery and an advanced microprocessor controller. This specially programmed chip monitors the temperature and timing, to assure a superior vaporization experience with maximum efficiency and safety.

http://vape-pen.com/Dabbler.php

I threw some of those in my trash can to make room for my good stuff!

Hope your having an incredible week-end!

 

[THC SCIENTIFIC]

The Dabbler is push-button operated and contains a high-capacity rechargeable battery and an advanced microprocessor controller. This specially programmed chip monitors the temperature and timing, to assure a superior vaporization experience with maximum efficiency and safety.

http://vape-pen.com/Dabbler.php

Since you put that link up here's a link

The battery in your link looks like the battery in mine.

Interesting things you say.

 

[530rasta]

everyone talks about the battery but what about the carts and atomizers ect...are those being scrutinized as much as they could be (quality control , high grade parts, non toxic ect) ?