The Grasshopper

[Madcap79]

I guess they do have to give a release date. If I were in that position I would try to overestimate, by quite a bit.

 

[zymos]

But then they run the risk of scaring people off.
It's easy for us (and probably the GH team) in hindsight to see that their date was wildly optimistic.

I'd like to give them the benefit of the doubt and think that was due to naïveté more than deliberate deception.

 

[Madcap79]

I agree. I'm sure they were naive and not deceitful. I was under the impression they already had a business and would somewhat know what to expect when it comes to manufacturing a product. I could be wrong though.

I have nothing invested in this product but this is an intertaining thread.

 

[zymos]

I've got 99 bucks in it, but I'm patient- have an UD and a Solo to keep me busy while I wait....

 

[°k]

I got over $200 in this and I "regret" it... not because of the wait but because of the bitter taste I have in my mouth for having helped some people that play(ed) me for a fool... but I'm cool and in the end it'll be their loss: I'll end up with a vape but they won't end up with a satisfied customer and I'll make sure to tell my friends and whoever will listen to me that they're not a company to deal with.

 

[EveryDayAmnesiac]

You know, this thread reminds me of the pink slime (mood slime) from Ghostbusters 2 - the slime that feeds off of human emotion:

Oh yeah. I'm in full on pop culture reference mode today...

Must be the beer.

 

[HillaryClinton]

I got over $200 in this and I "regret" it... not because of the wait but because of the bitter taste I have in my mouth for having helped some people that play(ed) me for a fool... but I'm cool and in the end it'll be their loss: I'll end up with a vape but they won't end up with a satisfied customer and I'll make sure to tell my friends and whoever will listen to me that they're not a company to deal with.

I think its odd that you feel like they played you as a fool? How? This is basically a Kickstarter, meaning you are not really guaranteed it by a certain time, they even said it was all estimated and have been keeping backers up to date twice a month. If you needed a vape now you could have went with one of the proven dozen out already. It was delayed by many reasons, one being moving to a whole new state, having done that recently its really time consuming and a pain in the ass....others by having to ship parts back and forth because of quality issues...making everything align so when it does come out we aren't all shipping them back for a dozen defects.

I don't mean disrespect but how did they play you exactly? It sounds more like you didn't know what you were buying into when you put the money up, maybe instead of bad mouthing them to friends and family you can just shoot them an email asking for the money back? They might do it...I really dont know though, anyone try this that also didn't expect expect speed bumps in this project and wanted a refund?

 

[grokit]

I would much rather have a finished device than something rushed out the door.

 

[HillaryClinton]

I would much rather have a finished device than something rushed out the door.

Yeah I would hate to have to ship it back and forth if it came imperfect.

 

[Krazzykid]

You certainly couldn't be blamed for doing so but then I'm sure you'd also make it clear to your beloved backers that the Ti version would be released after the SS one, wouldn't you?

I would let people know in some way that the Ti would be released after the SS, which they did by saying the SS was the early bird model. Clearly the early bird model comes first, so simple logic means the Ti version must come later on.

Well... have a look at their campaign page, everything was meant to be delivered in feb 2014 no matter what metal or color.

https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/grasshopper-vaporizer

Everything was not meant to be delivered by Feb 2014, it was estimated to be delivered by Feb 2014.

They made no promises that it would be ready by then, and everyone who donated them money during the campaign should have known better than to not expect delays.

It is a brand new device, that had not even been developed yet. When someone donates money to a campaign like that there are never any guarantees of any kind. There is always the chance of failure and everyone loosing all their donated money.
Anyone who did donate to the campaign chose to accept those risks.

Edit
The way indiegogo works, you aren't buying anything. You are donating them money towards a certain campaign. If the campaign is successful and the ideas/business are successful, the company will eventually give you a gift/perk for donating your money to them and making their dreams come true.
It is not the same thing as buying something online, and it is not the same thing as a pre-order either, it is a donation plain and simple. There are no guarantees period.

 

[Deadshort480]

I wasn't aware of the risks because I only participated in one crowd funding project before this and the time frame wasn't as fucked as this. Estimated February 2014. Okay, it doesn't come out February 2014, but surely Spring / Summer of 2014, right? Okay, not Spring / Summer of 2014, but surely Fall of 2014, right? Okay, not Fall of 2014, but surely in the fucking year of 2014, right?! Okay....

When is enough actually enough? This is crowd funding, not crowd scamming. Now, it may be my fault for expecting a product in hand within the first couple timeframes given, but that would be crazy of me, wouldn't it?

They had a working prototype and video of it in use. To me, that means that they have their shit together, they've got manufacturing and machining planned out and budgeted, this is what the final product is, they need X amount of money to do it in the expected timeframe, got the money, now they just need to get copies of this produced, and go. Instead, it's about a year later and I'm still hearing about machining of pocket clips.

I wasn't aware that crowd funding was basically a license to steal. Come up with an idea, produce a prototype, get people to buy a product that doesn't even fucking exist, and then maybe it'll work out, maybe it won't. What in the actual fuck?! I'm glad I know this now so that I never get in on one of these bullshit crowd funding scams ever again.

For the record, I've only got $125 in on this, but it shouldn't matter whether it's $100 or $1000. All I know is that it's past the point of ridiculous for me and I'm sick of excuses and everyone going to bat for these guys like they're doing us all some huge favor.

 

[Krazzykid]

I wasn't aware of the risks because I only participated in one crowd funding project before this and the time frame wasn't as fucked as this. Estimated February 2014. Okay, it doesn't come out February 2014, but surely Spring / Summer of 2014, right? Okay, not Spring / Summer of 2014, but surely Fall of 2014, right? Okay, not Fall of 2014, but surely in the fucking year of 2014, right?! Okay....

When is enough actually enough? This is crowd funding, not crowd scamming. Now, it may be my fault for expecting a product in hand within the first couple timeframes given, but that would be crazy of me, wouldn't it?

They had a working prototype and video of it in use. To me, that means that they have their shit together, they've got manufacturing and machining planned out and budgeted, this is what the final product is, they need X amount of money to do it in the expected timeframe, got the money, now they just need to get copies of this produced, and go. Instead, it's about a year later and I'm still hearing about machining of pocket clips.

I wasn't aware that crowd funding was basically a license to steal. Come up with an idea, produce a prototype, get people to buy a product that doesn't even fucking exist, and then maybe it'll work out, maybe it won't. What in the actual fuck?! I'm glad I know this now so that I never get in on one of these bullshit crowd funding scams ever again.

You should have done even the slightest amount of reading on the Indiegogo site before signing up and donating money then.
There is a tab right at the top of the main Indiegogo page of the site labeled "HOW IT WORKS" that explains everything about how the campaigns work, how the perks work, and how the contributing/donating works.

I am not going to even going to attempt commenting on everything else you wrote, instead I am going to suggest you (calmly) contact both the Grasshopper guys and Indiegogo and inquire about getting a refund since you clearly weren't at all prepared to contribute(the campaign is over so realistically your only option is contacting the Grasshopper folks).

I am not in any way trying to be a dick, I am just being honest and blunt.

 

[Scott A]

Realistically the biggest problem is they gave out a ridiculous estimated ship date at the start. I know many people doubted they had a chance to hit that mark like my self but you got to hope they at least get it in 2014. At this point the money is long gone and I dont care about it anymore, I know some day I will get a grasshopper in the mail.

 

[Deadshort480]

You should have done even the slightest amount of reading on the Indiegogo site before signing up and donating money then.
There is a tab right at the top of the main Indiegogo page of the site labeled "HOW IT WORKS" that explains everything about how the campaigns work, how the perks work, and how the contributing/donating works.

I am not going to even going to attempt commenting on everything else you wrote, instead I am going to suggest you (calmly) contact both the Grasshopper guys and Indiegogo and inquire about getting a refund since you clearly weren't at all prepared to contribute(the campaign is over so realistically your only option is contacting the Grasshopper folks).

I am not in any way trying to be a dick, I am just being honest and blunt.

As I said, I used Indiegogo one other time and had no issue. What's the problem? Are people not allowed to be pissed off when they feel like they've been jerked around? To assume that I was in no way prepared to donate makes you sound like the dick you claim you're trying not to sound like. When someone has to say "not trying to sound like a dick", they usually sound like a dick and know it. Just let people vent without trying to fix things for them. I'm pissed and you can't fix it with your words, but I can get out a bit of frustration with mine. Don't like it? Ignore is an option.

 

[Krazzykid]

As I said, I used Indiegogo one other time and had no issue. What's the problem? Are people not allowed to be pissed off when they feel like they've been jerked around? To assume that I was in no way prepared to donate makes you sound like the dick you claim you're trying not to sound like. When someone has to say "not trying to sound like a dick", they usually sound like a dick and know it. Just let people vent without trying to fix things for them. I'm pissed and you can't fix it with your words, but I can get out a bit of frustration with mine. Don't like it? Ignore is an option.

You are certainly allowed to vent, I am not against it at all.

I still stand by my words that you weren't prepared to donate. It is simply that, donating to help make a product come into existence. You did not purchase a product, yet you are pissed as if you did. There is a big difference. They are still working hard as far as I can tell to make that product come into existence and gift you your free item for donating them money(that is how it works).

Going from prototype to final product is not always easy, and usually involves a lot of tweaking and redesigning individual parts til they perform exactly as wanted. This is time consuming, even more so when you are working with outside producers. The parts manufacturers set their own time schedule and commonly miss those set dates. Start adding in time lost for parts not performing as they should because they weren't produced to spec, and shipping time back and forth.

With all of that going on, a year behind schedule is a very easy thing to have happen.

Edit
By the way I never said "not trying to sound like a dick", I said "I am not in any way trying to be a dick,". As I said "I am just being honest and blunt"

It is the level of animosity you present towards the people trying to make this device happen that shows me that you weren't fully prepared to donate (it's just my opinion, and it doesn't apply to just you.) It is that reason I suggested you seek refund.

 

[biohacker]

I'm probably not as emotional as some of you on this because I didn't donate to the kickstarter (missed the deadline). All I have to say is that if some of you guys are pissed, you can probably make yourself feel better by visiting the International EVO Anticipation Thread. They have invested much more, and have been waiting longer.

I'm thinking about starting my own kickstarter....fuck, if buddy made $55k with a $10 potato salad goal, WTF not?? Maybe i'll make coleslaw.

 

[pakalolo]

I wasn't aware of the risks because I only participated in one crowd funding project before this and the time frame wasn't as fucked as this. Estimated February 2014. Okay, it doesn't come out February 2014, but surely Spring / Summer of 2014, right? Okay, not Spring / Summer of 2014, but surely Fall of 2014, right? Okay, not Fall of 2014, but surely in the fucking year of 2014, right?! Okay....

When is enough actually enough? This is crowd funding, not crowd scamming. Now, it may be my fault for expecting a product in hand within the first couple timeframes given, but that would be crazy of me, wouldn't it?

They had a working prototype and video of it in use. To me, that means that they have their shit together, they've got manufacturing and machining planned out and budgeted, this is what the final product is, they need X amount of money to do it in the expected timeframe, got the money, now they just need to get copies of this produced, and go. Instead, it's about a year later and I'm still hearing about machining of pocket clips.

I wasn't aware that crowd funding was basically a license to steal. Come up with an idea, produce a prototype, get people to buy a product that doesn't even fucking exist, and then maybe it'll work out, maybe it won't. What in the actual fuck?! I'm glad I know this now so that I never get in on one of these bullshit crowd funding scams ever again.

For the record, I've only got $125 in on this, but it shouldn't matter whether it's $100 or $1000. All I know is that it's past the point of ridiculous for me and I'm sick of excuses and everyone going to bat for these guys like they're doing us all some huge favor.

You're a victim of your own lack of understanding how crowdfunding works. There is a huge difference between failure to deliver and outright fraud. Be careful about turning your disappointment and frustration into accusations of dishonesty on their part. If you call this a scam again, you had better have solid evidence to back that up. Your feelings on the matter do not qualify.

 

[zymos]

I've been wishing that IGG and Kickstarter required you to take a brief quiz about crowdfunding before you were allowed to pay.

I'm seeing this same kind of thing on a KS campaign I'm on (not nearly as delayed, and not nearly as much griping) where some people seem to think the whole point was to enable them to get a product slightly earlier and slightly cheaper than everyone else.

 

[MM..Food]

I did go into this funding hoping that the claims of the delivery would be true. After seeing the amount of hype and support behind this I feel like it rapidly grew to something a bit bigger than they first expected. They still seemed very hopeful of establishing and developing their vape. Sure some updates have been lackluster but what do you want a day to day? You would only be more frustrated, just as they probably are. This whole experience I've learned more about the crown funding process and how the campaigner goes about the process. They're a no name company right now just trying to develop 3000 finished products? They obviously want to have a finished product that can be produced reliably and is smooth. 1 vape itself is easy enough to make as a prototype but now it seems they're working through the issues and building relationships with different outsourced manufacturers. I'm plenty happy to even get an update twice a month. I get to watch this company work out its kinks and they continue this project. I'm still remaining hopeful to have a grasshopper one day. Sooner than later would have been nice but I'm not expecting magic to happen here.

Keep on keepin' on Grasshopper!

 

[HillaryClinton]

I've been wishing that IGG and Kickstarter required you to take a brief quiz about crowdfunding before you were allowed to pay.

I'm seeing this same kind of thing on a KS campaign I'm on (not nearly as delayed, and not nearly as much griping) where some people seem to think the whole point was to enable them to get a product slightly earlier and slightly cheaper than everyone else.

Not a bad idea, but part of me feels like people would guess all the answers without reading until it went through, welcome to the human race haha...

 

[invertedisdead]

All qualms with Grasshopper is because their campaign set the impression that all they needed was money to order the parts. Watch the Indiegogo presentation with Matthew turning parts on the lathe and showing the CAD modeling of the spiral heat exchanger in action. The vaporizer is charged, cleaned, operated, and built in the video. Nothing about their presentation gives me the idea that they still needed to design, source, write software, and test parts still.

At 1:52 in the video, Matthew is talking about the "serious engineering" used to implement a 30 watt heating element into a pen. Meanwhile Apple-esque visuals showcase a depression of the pens button, and the vaporizers LEDs glow bright red.

As per their updates, they only just recently even finished this button. In the video it was in an assembled grasshopper with flashing lights. I don't see how they expect people to assume that part wasn't even designed yet, given the context it was showcased in during the campaign. Terms like "serious engineering" sort of set the tone that the "serious engineering" has already been done...


I wanted to join the campaign at many times but figured I might as well wait until it comes to market and the reviews are out. I don't mind paying a bit more if it actually lives up to its claims. The vaporizer industry isn't exactly know for it's high quality or durability; unfortunately.

 

[zymos]

It was a prototype, not a production model....

 

[HillaryClinton]

It was a prototype, not a production model....

Yep...people need to understand this, Just an fictitious example, just because Nintendo has the successor to Wii U made doesn't mean it will come out tomorrow for example.

The vaporizer industry isn't exactly know for it's high quality or durability; unfortunately.

Ehh? Just like everything in this world then? I don't see my VaporBrothers going out anytime in the next 10 years...and even if it did probably would be charged around 20-40 to fix it....Sure there are vapes that die out quick, same goes for computers, toasters, keyboards, cars, everything really....

 

[Krazzykid]

All qualms with Grasshopper is because their campaign set the impression that all they needed was money to order the parts. Watch the Indiegogo presentation with Matthew turning parts on the lathe and showing the CAD modeling of the spiral heat exchanger in action. The vaporizer is charged, cleaned, operated, and built in the video. Nothing about their presentation gives me the idea that they still needed to design, source, write software, and test parts still.

At 1:52 in the video, Matthew is talking about the "serious engineering" used to implement a 30 watt heating element into a pen. Meanwhile Apple-esque visuals showcase a depression of the pens button, and the vaporizers LEDs glow bright red.

As per their updates, they only just recently even finished this button. In the video it was in an assembled grasshopper with flashing lights. I don't see how they expect people to assume that part wasn't even designed yet, given the context it was showcased in during the campaign. Terms like "serious engineering" sort of set the tone that the "serious engineering" has already been done...


I wanted to join the campaign at many times but figured I might as well wait until it comes to market and the reviews are out. I don't mind paying a bit more if it actually lives up to its claims. The vaporizer industry isn't exactly know for it's high quality or durability; unfortunately.

Here is there projected production plan directly from their campaign
As per the very first part of that plan
1.Finish software development
2.Continue testing
3.Receive production samples.

They told everyone right in these first three points that they weren't done designing and testing it, I don't see how it gets any clearer than that. They never said all they needed was parts, they told everyone plainly that they still hadn't developed the software for it yet, or finished the testing, or received their production samples.

If they told you plainly that they still hadn't received their production samples, how did you expect them to be anywhere close to finished parts yet?
Once the first samples are received, they then have to be tweaked, more samples produced, tweaked again etc etc. This has to be done over and over for every part involved until they fit and function as expected.

I understand some peoples desire to read into the estimated dates too much, but you have to look at the information as a whole, not just pieces of it. The info was there for everyone to see that it was still being designed, you just have to pay attention to it.

 

[grokit]

Ehh? Just like everything in this world then? I don't see my VaporBrothers going out anytime in the next 10 years...and even if it did probably would be charged around 20-40 to fix it....Sure there are vapes that die out quick, same goes for computers, toasters, keyboards, cars, everything really....

I didn't agree with that generalization either.