Giving up at this point is not an option! 
Phase3 Vaporizers
- Thread starter invertedisdead
- Start date
Giving up at this point is not an option!
Hell no! I was sitting here, thinking about some heat transfer ideas, went to the parts bin (vape graveyard) and just whipped up a pretty epic all glass vaporizer that is totally different from my others. Just tried it out for the first time and it's giving that killer full body stone that can be hard to get. I always say the sign of a great hit is when you get stoned in the toes, and right now I have lead feet!
I feel like Barney Rubble!
Gonna try and wrap my head around all that's going on with this thing.....
back to the vape lab!edit: just did bowl two......... wow!
More later!!
Shadooz
Well-Known Member
"I'm sitting here in a boring room
It's just another rainy Sunday afternoon
I'm wasting my time I got nothing to do
I'm hanging around I'm waiting for you…
...
I'm driving around in my car
I'm driving too fast, I'm driving too far
I'd like to change my point of view
...
I'm sitting here, I miss the power
I'd like to go out, taking a shower
But there's a heavy cloud inside my head
I feel so tired, put myself into bed
Well, nothing ever happens
And I wonder
Isolation is not good for me
Isolation, I don't want to
Sit on a lemon tree
I'm steppin' around in a desert of joy
Maybe anyhow I'll get another toy
And everything will happen
And you wonder
I wonder how, I wonder why
Yesterday you told me 'bout the
Blue, blue sky
And all that I can see
Is just another yellow lemon tree..."
Sorry
A little buddha who sits for dayyyss....
People will have enough time to make copy of your glass capacitor
An all glass in your graveyard that u never tried ?
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People could try to copy it, but the proof is in the pudding.
And this pudding is only getting sweeter
@Shadooz He was saying that he made something new from old parts. Those parts were glass, but they probably weren’t from all-glass vaporizers so he just put them together to make something different.
Don’t tell anybody, but it’s kind of like a glass lotus............
*Drops tincture*
arb
Semi shaved ape
And thicker.............lolz.People could try to copy it, but the proof is in the pudding.
And this pudding is only getting sweeter
Don’t tell anybody, but it’s kind of like a glass lotus............
*Drops tincture*
Fired up the earlier model, but used a smaller screen in the bowl so it sits a little lower from the heater. I think it worked rather well. Feeling quite inverted this evening!
After switching back to the older housing, it was evident there was an air leak in the system I had been using. Not a big one, as it was still pulling solid vapor @ 450F coil temp, but since reverting to the ground glass connection, I am now down to 400F coil temp and still pulling respectable amounts of vapor.
Been working on some new renderings based on easier manufacturability, using the same airflow concepts as the last post, but with slight alteration for less pressure drop. I'm still thinking of going forward with the positive diameter loading system: having one inlet hole sized just slightly above the diameter of the sapphires, to retain them without employing metallic screens. This would come with a new bowl system as well, based on a slightly modified 19mm male joint, allowing the heater to sit outside the bowl, instead of inside. The goal is to achieve a good seal like a joint, but without the spotlighting, binding, or manufacturing complications. Initial testing seems promising with air, but I won't be able to truly try it until a part is built.
If it seems like I'm going slow, I am. It's because I'm really hoping to have this design completed after the next prototype, so trying as best as I can to implement everything that I've learned, based on the past year of testing this in its various forms.
Cheers to everyone following along
Been working on some new renderings based on easier manufacturability, using the same airflow concepts as the last post, but with slight alteration for less pressure drop. I'm still thinking of going forward with the positive diameter loading system: having one inlet hole sized just slightly above the diameter of the sapphires, to retain them without employing metallic screens. This would come with a new bowl system as well, based on a slightly modified 19mm male joint, allowing the heater to sit outside the bowl, instead of inside. The goal is to achieve a good seal like a joint, but without the spotlighting, binding, or manufacturing complications. Initial testing seems promising with air, but I won't be able to truly try it until a part is built.
If it seems like I'm going slow, I am. It's because I'm really hoping to have this design completed after the next prototype, so trying as best as I can to implement everything that I've learned, based on the past year of testing this in its various forms.
Cheers to everyone following along
arb
Semi shaved ape
If anyone has a grasp of what constitutes a good vaporizer its you!After switching back to the older housing, it was evident there was an air leak in the system I had been using. Not a big one, as it was still pulling solid vapor @ 450F coil temp, but since reverting to the ground glass connection, I am now down to 400F coil temp and still pulling respectable amounts of vapor.
Been working on some new renderings based on easier manufacturability, using the same airflow concepts as the last post, but with slight alteration for less pressure drop. I'm still thinking of going forward with the positive diameter loading system: having one inlet hole sized just slightly above the diameter of the sapphires, to retain them without employing metallic screens. This would come with a new bowl system as well, based on a slightly modified 19mm male joint, allowing the heater to sit outside the bowl, instead of inside. The goal is to achieve a good seal like a joint, but without the spotlighting, binding, or manufacturing complications. Initial testing seems promising with air, but I won't be able to truly try it until a part is built.
If it seems like I'm going slow, I am. It's because I'm really hoping to have this design completed after the next prototype, so trying as best as I can to implement everything that I've learned, based on the past year of testing this in its various forms.
Cheers to everyone following along
Shadooz
Well-Known Member
If it's true (only trust what i see), it's simply amazing for a full convection desktop as a coil temp
I've seen no handle with your last bowl, u use silicone sleeve like the enano bowl ? The herborizer handle is too tiny and weirdly shape, i always have to be focus not to lightly burn myself. But the glass dots which keep the screen in are just a must have
But using a male joint for the bowl will give less aperture to load/unload, and give no more seal than the other way, as it is for the herborizer.
But we come back to the too much friction issue this last one get. And without handle, i would have break my bowl already
Those are big shoes to fill, but I appreciate the encouragement!!
Thank you, I'll try to get a video at 400F later on, just took a whole row of tincture dolloped gummies and a dab of hash rosin to round out the end of the weekend
None of my bowls at present have a handle, but the glass I chose is very thick and never gets uncomfortably hot. That is correct that the bowl would be smaller and a little bit harder to load. But one of the benefits of putting the heater outside the bowl is it should eliminate smearing any resin on the sidewall.
The frictionless seal is made by utilizing the protrusion at the widest part of the joint. There is a taper there that appears to make a good seal when nested in another tube of appropriate diameter. The screen would be inserted from below the joint and sit in the 19mm taper. The joint length would be shortened to allow easier insertion of the screen, and the bowl would be sized to correspond with the dimensions of the Quartz heater enclosure. If this bowl system works it should allow for the quartz enclosure to be simpler to manufacture. And since the bowl would be a modified stock part, it wouldn't be too cost prohibitive to implement.
Vaporware
Well-Known Member
I wasn’t going to complain since you’re obviously getting good results, but I’ve always thought the joint was a bit of a drawback compared to the FP for example.
Even the FP’s heater isn’t as close to the bowl as it could be, so I do notice the difference when I use a glass bowl that gets the flower closer to the heater compared to the standard bowls. Even the old stubby Ti bowl seems to show that effect.
There is such a thing as “too close” for our purposes, but with convection heaters at reasonable temps that distance doesn’t have to be large.
Even the FP’s heater isn’t as close to the bowl as it could be, so I do notice the difference when I use a glass bowl that gets the flower closer to the heater compared to the standard bowls. Even the old stubby Ti bowl seems to show that effect.
There is such a thing as “too close” for our purposes, but with convection heaters at reasonable temps that distance doesn’t have to be large.
I wasn’t going to complain since you’re obviously getting good results, but I’ve always thought the joint was a bit of a drawback compared to the FP for example.
Even the FP’s heater isn’t as close to the bowl as it could be, so I do notice the difference when I use a glass bowl that gets the flower closer to the heater compared to the standard bowls. Even the old stubby Ti bowl seems to show that effect.
There is such a thing as “too close” for our purposes, but with convection heaters at reasonable temps that distance doesn’t have to be large.
Yeah, coming from the FP I can definitely appreciate the outside heater approach. I didn't really want to use do a female glass joint to get there though either. With this new approach I feel it retains some of the good benefits of each system, so I think it's worth exploring.
The joint on the heater is a complication in the building of this vape, so getting rid of it would be a good move. Even though the bowl capacity would be reduced, I think it could be preferable for one hitters and such. With the current bowl there's a bit of dead space with smaller-moderate sized amounts. I liked the idea of the Sublimator not having too big of a bowl, even the FP is not that big of a bowl. So I think any extra efficiency obtained would be a good thing.
arb
Semi shaved ape
How big is big.......to me any time the vapor stops before my draw is too small.
Shadooz
Well-Known Member
@arb if a 0.2g hit can't fullfill ur lungs u must found another weed.
And if like most here, u just spit it out fast and far... just a waste.
When vapor stop before i end drawing, it means super clean hit, then i can keep it more and play with it when i exhale
@invertedisdead making two size bowl is still an option, one closer to the glass capacitor and one macrodosing.
With herborizer bowl, i've got a lot of dead space, no herb touch glass, and it work like a beast.
But don't go too large to avoid middle hot spoting, like a lot of small full convection vape. Which over estimate the power of their heater, and so force to stirr... here i can't know if your flow go straight or swirl due to the balls...
Make it swirl is the only way for large bowl
And one more thing, 14mm or 18mm will limit the bowl largeness too. With the 14mm i can make hotspot, the size of the 14mm hole if i draw too forcefuly. Can't make hotspot with 18mm.
Still talking about herborizer bowl.
And i really don't know if your bowl will be easily handable without handle or silicone, i will wait and see, but herborizer bowl can't be touch direclty even more on the juncture
And if like most here, u just spit it out fast and far... just a waste.
When vapor stop before i end drawing, it means super clean hit, then i can keep it more and play with it when i exhale
@invertedisdead making two size bowl is still an option, one closer to the glass capacitor and one macrodosing.
With herborizer bowl, i've got a lot of dead space, no herb touch glass, and it work like a beast.
But don't go too large to avoid middle hot spoting, like a lot of small full convection vape. Which over estimate the power of their heater, and so force to stirr... here i can't know if your flow go straight or swirl due to the balls...
Make it swirl is the only way for large bowl
And one more thing, 14mm or 18mm will limit the bowl largeness too. With the 14mm i can make hotspot, the size of the 14mm hole if i draw too forcefuly. Can't make hotspot with 18mm.
Still talking about herborizer bowl.
And i really don't know if your bowl will be easily handable without handle or silicone, i will wait and see, but herborizer bowl can't be touch direclty even more on the juncture
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These days I like to finish a draw and still have enough room to push the vapor to the lungs, lung busters leave a lot of vapor in the esophageal tract which never makes it to the alveoli. It would still be at least as much capacity as the bowls you are used to!
That's why I like to leave some room to recycle/re-breath the vapor. Exhale partially, then inhale the same hit back into the lungs; then repeat. When I'm not making cloud porn this is usually how I vape at home, getting multiple inhales off the same single draw.
Yeah two bowl options could definitely work, though I admit I'm not a huge fan of loading big bowls, I tend to prefer fast and fresh extraction, I'd rather inhale .1g over 5 small fresh bowls, then load .5g in one big bowl. IMO large bowls are a bit of a hypocrisy because people who load a lot usually want big heavy hits, but big bowls force one to use much lower temperatures to truly avoid premature roasting/charring. I've seen this with smokers who are used to smoking big bong hits, they try and load a ton of weed in a vape and it really just inhibits performance. Baking weed with convection isnt much different from baking anything, if you try and bake a big thick cake as fast as a thin cookie, in the same amount of time, it will never bake evenly.
I'm still planning on spinning the air for improved extraction, but I've adjusted the design slightly to get there, in a way that corresponds to more similar tool paths during fabrication.
Shadooz
Well-Known Member
We do the same, except i never do porn
i won't have to sell myself.Some commercial here just make me laugh when they overheat, overdraw and just cough right away
trying to show who got the biggestI never load more than 0.1 too, but some people have light weed or 1:1 and will need more.
Use a shot for whisky but a pint for a beer
But the joint (14 or 18) will define the width of the bowl, then the thermal pressure will define how lenght it can be.
So a 14mm couldn't be too large
While cleaning my herbo i found one positive aspect of your inverted bowl male/female (u invert everything?
)When i load my bowl and there is some kief that stick to the joint it end up as tiny tiny combust, that force me to clean the heater as it will smell combustion (but not taste hopefully).
If you invert, the hot glass will not touch those kief but the bowl between
arb
Semi shaved ape
I
I was speaking to a small bowl like a nano or a basket screen.
The vapor usually stops about 15 seconds or so........about half a full hit.
Some times I like big giant head ringers and sometimes I just want a gentle taste.
Doesn't have to be all one way all the time and I am seeing a huge variation in what individual people consider a "great vape experience".
No way to make what everyone calls great........see the bowle.
Make it how you like it best.......... NOW!
Farid
Well-Known Member
I agree about an ideal bowl size being big enough to kill in one big rip, with just enough space afterwards to inhale a little fresh air. Usually around 0.1 as you said.
Vapor density is also important in this regard. I like a dense hit, where you don't need to inhale a lot of air to build the vapor, and where the vapor production ends abruptly rather than trail off. With the vapor production trailing off I find the lingering vapor in the airways is irritating.
Granted these were my preferences when I had normal usage patterns. That 0.1 estimated dose is based on the biggest hit I could take while also fully killing the load. I barely consume anymore, so 0.1 would put me on my ass these days, but I know that's not normal for most people.
Vapor density is also important in this regard. I like a dense hit, where you don't need to inhale a lot of air to build the vapor, and where the vapor production ends abruptly rather than trail off. With the vapor production trailing off I find the lingering vapor in the airways is irritating.
Granted these were my preferences when I had normal usage patterns. That 0.1 estimated dose is based on the biggest hit I could take while also fully killing the load. I barely consume anymore, so 0.1 would put me on my ass these days, but I know that's not normal for most people.
Shadooz
Well-Known Member
15 second, half a hit ...!
U're like @Zangano Cruel ? And his 25secc hit
Cleaned the Stone Glass Works WafflePerc Bubbler by Preston Hanna.
Deserved some Slymer flower, and a clean zigzag of dropdowns.
Herborizer clouds are thick and tasty!!!
Stay vaped.
Mantente de la mente!!!
I one hit in 6 sec 0.1g, stay longer will be unpleasent, and so i have room to clean
arb
Semi shaved ape
Big lungs to power my big mouth.........lolz.
Here is a question for you smart fellas.
When taking that first rip off a bowl of kieff it will milk the piece.....White wall it.
Upon exhale...........nothing,where is the vapor?
100% absorption with that volume of vapor seems unlikely so........what?
Shadooz
Well-Known Member
@arb 100% is only achieve with intravenous
Never seen someone white wall then exhale nothing, but the less u exhale the most get recondensed
But saying "where it is" will be different for people.
Some, like old smoker, are use to puff? (Traduction from "crapoter", like cigar), inconscious behavour to reduce the lung absorption.
and other use the stomach, trick used by singer to increased their volume.
Some, like me, exhale with the nose. nasal mucus is an oil trap
Never seen someone white wall then exhale nothing, but the less u exhale the most get recondensed
But saying "where it is" will be different for people.
Some, like old smoker, are use to puff? (Traduction from "crapoter", like cigar), inconscious behavour to reduce the lung absorption.
and other use the stomach, trick used by singer to increased their volume.
Some, like me, exhale with the nose. nasal mucus is an oil trap
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I haven't read all the latest comments but here goes:
If the quartz manufacture in the US is not economically viable have you thought about looking at Poland or Czech Republic? There should be some quartz blowers there...
Otherwise, I am confident that a borosilicate heater would work. I am stil using my cheap chinese 14/18 boro adapter I got last september, firing it with a torch to 450 CELSIUS pretty much every day and it's still fine....
If you got top quality american borosilicate I don;t see why it wouldn't take the heat from a coil. And these things are not likely to shatter, spilling the sapphires out.... it is much more likely that if they fail they will simply crack at one spot....
As for eliminating metal screens altogether, If the glass/quartz worker really cannot make the peice with the gems enclosed, then a two-piece design held together by a metal clip is the only way I can think of.... or a compromise with a titanium screen, but titanium is not bendy so IDK how you would put it in there.... I'm pretty sure titanium does not taint the flavour, at least not as much as steel....
As someone who knows what a good herb vape is all about
I am available for beta testing!
Absolutely correct!
If the quartz manufacture in the US is not economically viable have you thought about looking at Poland or Czech Republic? There should be some quartz blowers there...
Otherwise, I am confident that a borosilicate heater would work. I am stil using my cheap chinese 14/18 boro adapter I got last september, firing it with a torch to 450 CELSIUS pretty much every day and it's still fine....
If you got top quality american borosilicate I don;t see why it wouldn't take the heat from a coil. And these things are not likely to shatter, spilling the sapphires out.... it is much more likely that if they fail they will simply crack at one spot....
As for eliminating metal screens altogether, If the glass/quartz worker really cannot make the peice with the gems enclosed, then a two-piece design held together by a metal clip is the only way I can think of.... or a compromise with a titanium screen, but titanium is not bendy so IDK how you would put it in there.... I'm pretty sure titanium does not taint the flavour, at least not as much as steel....
As someone who knows what a good herb vape is all about
I am available for beta testing!Absolutely correct!
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The main benefit to fused quartz here is that it expands less when heated, it's not always an issue when torching, but when wearing a coil it can be.
Right now I'm running a smaller sticky brick sized screen, with a larger screen on top of it and wrapped around the sides, it seems to be doing a pretty good job at putting enough tension on the sidewalls to hold the spheres in place. I don't really plan on selling these until a more secure retaining method is implemented though. If I'm collecting money I want people to feel confident that two hundred hot sapphires wont come out while using it. Plus that's all part of the original design goals, I need this feature to check my boxes and stand out from the others. I don't think it will feel complete without it.
The three core principals of this design are:
1. Easy removal and FULL access to the entire air/vapor path for cleaning.
This is inspired by vapes like the Cloud where you cant see if the heater is all gunked up. The best desktop must be easily maintained and serviced without difficult disassembly.
2. FULL glass housing for improved safety and ease of use. Assembling the screen setup is the most fiddly part about this vape - by eliminating that, the assembly is simplified greatly. This may be important if this is sold as a DIY kit.
3. Superior airflow over other ball vapes. I think I already won this one, but I have some extra tricks up my sleeve here.
Right now I'm running a smaller sticky brick sized screen, with a larger screen on top of it and wrapped around the sides, it seems to be doing a pretty good job at putting enough tension on the sidewalls to hold the spheres in place. I don't really plan on selling these until a more secure retaining method is implemented though. If I'm collecting money I want people to feel confident that two hundred hot sapphires wont come out while using it. Plus that's all part of the original design goals, I need this feature to check my boxes and stand out from the others. I don't think it will feel complete without it.
The three core principals of this design are:
1. Easy removal and FULL access to the entire air/vapor path for cleaning.
This is inspired by vapes like the Cloud where you cant see if the heater is all gunked up. The best desktop must be easily maintained and serviced without difficult disassembly.
2. FULL glass housing for improved safety and ease of use. Assembling the screen setup is the most fiddly part about this vape - by eliminating that, the assembly is simplified greatly. This may be important if this is sold as a DIY kit.
3. Superior airflow over other ball vapes. I think I already won this one, but I have some extra tricks up my sleeve here.