Discontinued Hopper io

[JBone65]

There's no denying that the early hits are much sweeter. In fact I love the first hit at 220°, might be the best way to get maximum terpenoids and minimum THC.

I also sometimes pull 15 seconds or longer to get good hits. It might be more difficult for anyone with weak lungs to use the io.

After that first hit, every hit at the next higher temp is the same in my experience, just a good normal hit. Even though I get 8 vaporous hits before reaching the max setting, it always takes 3 hits on max to finish the load. I'm not seeing any change in taste or vapor quality unless I go back for the 12th hit, which I will do under the right circumstances.

Some people work their io extra hard by jamming it in a glass bong. I work mine extremely hard by clicking more times and drawing longer on each load. I'm pulling almost three combined minutes per load (11 x 15 seconds).

Not saying anyone else should do that, just find it pretty amazing that it's possible and I think the grasshopper design has a lot to do with it.

I would encourage folks to experiment just a tad by getting at least one extra good hit on max temperature right when you would normally change it. You might be surprised.

 

[Vaporific]

Of all my vapes, the Hoppers - OG & IO - are the harshest on my throat used dry. With the IO, anything above 3.7 is just too hot for me. I do start around 1.5 and temp step like many do but I typically get 3-4 hits per load, maybe squeezing a 5th. And that’s typical of both the OG and IO however the temps are relative with the OG starting a bit higher temp than with the IO. Also my draws are 5-7 seconds tops - I couldn’t handle 15 secs with vapor that hot with a very short vapor path. To each their own and still love them though I seldom use the OG as the IO has much more power and I like frontend and threads in general on the IO. And my IO has been running flawlessly for 14 months so I’m a happy camper (my OG started to crap out about this time - and then went into RMA for a year).

 

[JBone65]

my draws are 5-7 seconds tops

I do sometimes see a little vapor coming with the very first of the draw, so I know it's working, but the air coming out of my MP doesn't start to get warm for at least 5-8 seconds.

I do feel a slight change in my throat after 12-15 seconds, that might be my best indicator that the hit is onboard and it's time to power down the lithium ion and start the cool down.

About the only heat I notice is after the MP gets hot and that's after 12-15 seconds on the maximum setting.

Does yours combust on the maximum setting? It sounds as if yours hits hotter than mine. Mine has never combusted.

 

[Vaporific]

Does yours combust on the maximum setting? It sounds as if yours hits hotter than mine. Mine has never combusted.

I’ve only maxed the temp when going through water, and that’s few and far between. I’ve never combusted with the IO and I don’t think I’ve ever combusted with my OG too.

My routine has always been to turn it off and keep drawing for a couple secs to clear it all - and that wasn’t included in my timings above, lol. But 10 secs total draw would be a firm max for me with either Hopper. I will say it’s my fave on-the-go vape (in the car too where I keep one of my mag chargers) it’s so easy to use!

 

[JBone65]

I just tried to time a long hit. It was the third hit on the load, on mark number 2. It made me cough after about 10 seconds, more from strong vapor than from heat.

I guess there must be a temperature 'sweet spot' with a fresh load where you don't need to hit it very long. I know it makes vapor from the first instant when starting to draw on a fresh load.

The really long hits probably come later after the easy compounds next to the heater are gone. It definitely takes some amount longer to heat up the opposite end of the load.

It must take even longer to heat the entire load all the way to 430°F.

Sometimes when you open it, the exposed end of the load is green with a brown spot in the middle, as if the heat is channeling thru the middle. I have gotten the MP hot enough to burn me in order to turn the entire load dark brown.

It's an old habit. My freezer is overloaded, but I can't throw THC away.

Sorry for a nearly pointless long post. Bored. And stoned.

 

[VegNVape]

Only me, with another warranty related update . . . .

This time to let you know I contacted Hopper Support via email (which I clearly should have done several weeks ago!) & I am happy to report they responded by email within 24hrs - & they also issued me with an update on the warranty portal. They advised they are still experiencing difficulties due to Covid & the subsequent parts shortages, but will be getting my replacement body shipped out to me later in the week.

While I don't have a great deal of faith in Hopper Labs projected timelines, the reponse is greatly appreciated & has put my mind at ease.

I don't fully understand why they are replying to emails but not keeping on top of the portal - although the reason they provided is that the warranty portal is backed up due to the virus . . . .

Anyway, I can cope with that - communication is really all I needed.

Also, thanks for your response to my previous post @JBone65

Now, I think all of that deserves at least a little bit of a smile . . . .

Cheers

 

[MoltenTiger]

Well I just filed another warranty request for my stainless io
it isn't heating up properly, only getting warm enough to notice, but the chamber is barely affected and there is no visible output.

Pretty disappointing, my cool Ti io is now outperforming it by a lot, yet it still has mediocre output.

The Sublimator is king. I did smoke last night for the first time in years, which was gross but the company made it pleasant

HL haven't gotten back to me for over a month, and I've tried emailing too.

The hopper ride is an interesting one, it is merely a shame that it never actually took off.

I am finally at a point where I don't find any of this a convenient distraction anymore, which is quite nice. It was interesting observing whilst learning a similar trade.

But I simply need a functional portable unit.

This io body has been arbitrarily functioning since receipt on Aug 5th.

I am convinced the legacy is as fitting a name as any

 

[JBone65]

although the reason they provided is that the warranty portal is backed up due to the virus . . . .

Hate to hear there is a backlog of warranty repairs but it sounds like they might catch up and you should be back in business within a couple of weeks. If I recall you have a SS unit.



My io just passed 14 months of total service, although down 3 weeks at one point. How much longer can it work?

Hang in there @MoltenTiger. Don't understand a problem repairing a SS io inside the U.S. for some and not others, but I can feel your frustration. You said it appears to work just doesn't get hot enough?

I appreciate what HL has accomplished to date and I hope they can keep it up and be successful (for everyone's benefit). Found a little info on HL at this link. They have grown some, grossing about $1.1M a year.

Hopper Labs LLC

Hopper Labs LLC is in the Smokeless Tobacco business. View competitors, revenue, employees, website and phone number.

www.buzzfile.com

 

[VegNVape]

If I recall you have a SS unit.

No, I've been a total sucker for Ti since 1988 - when I first saw Robocop!

@MoltenTiger - I would definitely suggest emailing support again since I have had success very recently. Yep, as far the ride goes, it's definitely a rollercoaster. Hang on in there, dude.

 

[WhyAreWeWaiting]

I just don’t get it. The product has its faults but even with those faults so many of us are willing to support them and the customer service side ruins it for even us. I would wait patiently for a long time, quietly, if I got truthful and consistent replies.

What about that is so hard for them to get? Get rid of this John character and rebuild from the wreckage. When the IO first showed up things looked good. Then it all went to hell again.

Sad really because there really isn’t anything that works like a Hopper when it works right……..as I load my OG and rip one.

IMO the IO is the Grasshopper without the Red & Blue LEDs. The IO is just as unreliable as the Grasshopper. when I bought 2 initially, they would respond quickly to an RMA, but now you have to wait for months. And I've had to return mine repeatedly. Nearly 10 times in less than 2 years.

 

[Vaporific]

IMO the IO is the Grasshopper without the Red & Blue LEDs.

The heater is more powerful and it’s instant on. It’s a bit different. Overall shell and dimensions, yes, however there are subtle and published differences. Customer service and reliability however may be similar to the OG, yet my IO has worked flawlessly for 15 months. I use it over my OG.

 

[WhyAreWeWaiting]

I can at least say that at the moment, wife and I each have one working great, and they act very much the same.
My purchase has been "in the shop" 5 months of its' 15 month life. Wife's is service-free at 11 months. So combined and averaged, our "success rate" is about 80%.

Only if you have disposable income would I actually recommend this vape.
You need money to burn, the patience of Job and a reliable backup if you own an io. I recently bought a spare body that sits waiting for the call...

You are going to have to reach some understanding, some balance between the two perceptions below; I have had quite a few through my hands and I am more in the camp with MoltenTiger on this one.

Also noteworthy were his remarks about warranty service. The first time you need help, they are there for you and you get taken care of. After that, their interest in helping you wanes and time increases a lot with each request you make.
This may explain why JBone56 has this view. He is a relatively light user and has had 1 warranty case with the io and it was resolved in a couple of weeks. (I hope I have that right?)
MoltenTiger is more a power user, and I don't mean the way he uses it, just the amount that he does, which I think is a lot. He has had the multiple cases (as have I) and seen the response-time curve bend in quite the wrong direction.

Agree 100% with this. They suckered us into buying the Grasshopper to the point where we had to wait more than 2 years for an RMA and still not get it repaired. Then they suckered us into upgrading to an IO which IMO is a GH without the red & blue lights. Both GH and IO are totally unreliable.

The heater is more powerful and it’s instant on. It’s a bit different. Overall shell and dimensions, yes, however there are subtle and published differences. Customer service and reliability however may be similar to the OG, yet my IO has worked flawlessly for 15 months. I use it over my OG.

It's instant on for a couple of weeks. That's when the performance starts deteriorating. That's when the poor customer service kicks in.

 

[Vaporific]

It's instant on for a couple of weeks. That's when the performance starts deteriorating. That's when the poor customer service kicks in.

My instant on has been very good if not great for 15 months. Perhaps I got lucky. I know there have been reports of early issues by some and thought it was better/fewer than the OG’s issues, which impacted mine about a year in (and a yearlong RMA to boot so I do empathize with folks on that whole clusterf&ck). When working optimally they shine with fresh batts, mine do. Global supply chain issues abound which I’m sure is impacting HL and RMAs, then again it was like that before the pandemic and hopefully the quality control has improved a bit. Hard to really know without actual figures. Hope everyones’ issues get resolved soon, that’s all.

 

[WhyAreWeWaiting]

My instant on has been very good if not great for 15 months. Perhaps I got lucky. I know there have been reports of early issues by some and thought it was better/fewer than the OG’s issues, which impacted mine about a year in (and a yearlong RMA to boot so I do empathize with folks on that whole clusterf&ck). When working optimally they shine with fresh batts, mine do. Global supply chain issues abound which I’m sure is impacting HL and RMAs, then again it was like that before the pandemic and hopefully the quality control has improved a bit. Hard to really know without actual figures. Hope everyones’ issues get resolved soon, that’s all.

I'm retired, so I tend to vape most of the day. IMO the GH or IO can't tolerate that. I take good care of them, never take them outdoors. Yet I've had almost 10 RMAs in less than 2 years. Mostly the same fault. Works great initially, then performance deteriorates, then LED goes on for couple of seconds and switches off. RMA again. Rinse and repeat. It would appear that the basic design just doesn't work with regular use.

 

[JBone65]

It would appear that the basic design just doesn't work with regular use.

Been using three different units almost 5 years. My io is more than 14 months old with no deterioration in performance. It hits great. The OG was good, the io is better in several ways.

HL doesn't provide any meaningful training. I suspect these things can be damaged or used incorrectly very easily, especially by a relatively new user. It's a miracle I didn't screw it up numerous times, not the sharpest tool in the shed, etc.. Some might be damaged while cleaning, by not cleaning correctly, by fines packing around the heating element, by a tiny drop of resin in the tip, by moisture, etc.

It only takes a tiny blob of resin to plug it up, and that's a certainty to happen. It's not obvious when it's happening slowly over time. You can't see it and even if you do it's not easy to figure out a successful cleaning technique. The tendency is to jam it back up in there, which might work for a while. I'm guessing a percentage of folks lose their patience and give up when performance (air flow) deteriorates. It won't generate heat unless air is flowing. If you can draw air thru it easily, that's not what happened.

HL could tell folks to make sure air is flowing freely when loading and/or cleaning to avoid a lot of problems. Maybe they did and I just missed it.


HL's a very small company (supposedly 10 employees after 6 years) and they can be frustratingly slow to respond even in good times. To make matters worse, they've had several long term service interruptions, a change of ownership, etc. I hear all the complaints about the service, but they've completed 4-5 warranty repairs for me. I'll continue sucking up because I'm very happy with the io (and I don't wanna piss them off).

 

[RustyOldNail]

Received an email today from HL:

“Happy Halloween! Hoppers are currently in stock and this weekend only take 15% off.”

Code: HWHoppers

The older sister site hopperio.com has the 3 batteries for $36 and more accessories then the newer site.

 

[MoltenTiger]

The io addresses some but not all of the originals flaws.

It is most similar in that when purchasing you have no idea what you'll get.

I've got a legacy that is still alive and working since May 2018, and I have an io that is not performing after a few months.
And I've had about everything inbetween.

Still a gamble, still the same effective product, if you're lucky. Defective if you're not. The odds could be better, but they're also just as bad.

 

[WhyAreWeWaiting]

Been using three different units almost 5 years. My io is more than 14 months old with no deterioration in performance. It hits great. The OG was good, the io is better in several ways.

HL doesn't provide any meaningful training. I suspect these things can be damaged or used incorrectly very easily, especially by a relatively new user. It's a miracle I didn't screw it up numerous times, not the sharpest tool in the shed, etc.. Some might be damaged while cleaning, by not cleaning correctly, by fines packing around the heating element, by a tiny drop of resin in the tip, by moisture, etc.

It only takes a tiny blob of resin to plug it up, and that's a certainty to happen. It's not obvious when it's happening slowly over time. You can't see it and even if you do it's not easy to figure out a successful cleaning technique. The tendency is to jam it back up in there, which might work for a while. I'm guessing a percentage of folks lose their patience and give up when performance (air flow) deteriorates. It won't generate heat unless air is flowing. If you can draw air thru it easily, that's not what happened.

HL could tell folks to make sure air is flowing freely when loading and/or cleaning to avoid a lot of problems. Maybe they did and I just missed it.


HL's a very small company (supposedly 10 employees after 6 years) and they can be frustratingly slow to respond even in good times. To make matters worse, they've had several long term service interruptions, a change of ownership, etc. I hear all the complaints about the service, but they've completed 4-5 warranty repairs for me. I'll continue sucking up because I'm very happy with the io (and I don't wanna piss them off).

So what are the cleaning techniques that are approved by Hopper that work? All I've seen them say is to use compressed air to blow out the chamber. I've tried that, and it doesn't work. As a retired electronics technician, I was confident enough to remove the screen and cleaning behind that. That also doesn't work. Many times I've asked John what's causing the repeated problems with my IOs. Is it component failure, design issue, user error, cleaning, etc? Never even get an acknowledgement to my query. That tells me they've something to hide.

 

[JBone65]

So what are the cleaning techniques that are approved by Hopper that work?

I haven't received any significant cleaning guidance from HL. I suspect that is one source of problems for some folks.

I haven't heard about using compressed air, but I can see where that might help clean fines from around the heating elements if they are plugged.

The first question I would ask: Can you draw air thru it freely or is it restricted? Draw air thru the body and the MP independently to check each piece for restrictions.

Look thru the intake ports toward a light source and turn it slowly. You will see little glimmers of light coming thru if it's clear. Draw air thru it when it's empty and open to remove any loose fines that wanna come out. Don't stir the load, this can force fines down thru the screen onto the elements.

You should see a "full moon" circle of light when looking thru the MP screen toward a light source. Anything less is indicative of partial or total plugging at the tip. Removing this plug can be problematic. I use a medium sharp tooth pick, but it can break off inside so a big needle might be better. Insert the tool about a mm into the tip (at a very high angle) and GENTLY scoop one or two tiny resin blobs out. The point of the tool should reach in between the internal copper heat shield and the MP exterior, but only a mm or so. I slowly turn the tool while turning the body to try stick the resin to the tool and convey it out. Whenever you get little blob out, grab it with a Kleenex so it stays out. Also, I always soak the mouthpiece in ISO for a few minutes when cleaning but that alone won't do it.

I'm not pretending to be an expert or a know it all. Would be interesting to hear how others deal with tip resin.

 

[RustyOldNail]

I have yet to soak my IO MP in ISO to clean!

NOTE: I only use the performance MP, as it does NOT have any hidden internal parts to get gunked up, and I find the standard MP the pen tip style, gets hotter faster on my titanium IO, and the performance tip immediately fits my 14mm female glass rigs. I also dislike the stock tips, narrow SET airflow restriction. I can have more restriction control by using various glass 510 TIPS from my ECig collection, many will fit the performance tip by swapping orings. These tips have various internal diameters I can choose from, thus restriction control by the user.

The performance tip is as simple as it gets, just the internal screen. Every few bowls, I use a 99% ISO Qtip, to clean both sides of the screen, as well as the internal threads on the MP. I do a similar thing with the load chamber, being careful NOT to SOAK the qtip, and keep the GH load side down, so no ISO can get into the heater section. Then a DRY qtip, and often let the IO run it’s 15 second timed turn off, so I’m sure the inside is bone dry. Also wipe the body’s external threads that connect inside the MP tip section.

The ONLY thing that is not accessible to clean is the heater section located below the load screen. I don’t want to remove that screen just yet. Someone in this thread posted a picture of how bad it can look under that screen as residual vapor holds and distributes RESIN over time, coating everything you don’t have easy access to. I do however ONLY use flower that is MEDIUM GRIND, using my LG BCG grinder, so there is a bit less smaller particles and weed dust that can fall through the relatively large load screen getting trapped in the body.

None of this is that time consuming, nor do I mind, as keeping my IO as clean as I can, will hopefully keep it in my hands, and not in a long repair queue.

 

[WhyAreWeWaiting]

I have yet to soak my IO MP in ISO to clean!

NOTE: I only use the performance MP, as it does NOT have any hidden internal parts to get gunked up, and I find the standard MP the pen tip style, gets hotter faster on my titanium IO, and the performance tip immediately fits my 14mm female glass rigs. I also dislike the stock tips, narrow SET airflow restriction. I can have more restriction control by using various glass 510 TIPS from my ECig collection, many will fit the performance tip by swapping orings. These tips have various internal diameters I can choose from, thus restriction control by the user.

The performance tip is as simple as it gets, just the internal screen. Every few bowls, I use a 99% ISO Qtip, to clean both sides of the screen, as well as the internal threads on the MP. I do a similar thing with the load chamber, being careful NOT to SOAK the qtip, and keep the GH load side down, so no ISO can get into the heater section. Then a DRY qtip, and often let the IO run it’s 15 second timed turn off, so I’m sure the inside is bone dry. Also wipe the body’s external threads that connect inside the MP tip section.

The ONLY thing that is not accessible to clean is the heater section located below the load screen. I don’t want to remove that screen just yet. Someone in this thread posted a picture of how bad it can look under that screen as residual vapor holds and distributes RESIN over time, coating everything you don’t have easy access to. I do however ONLY use flower that is MEDIUM GRIND, using my LG BCG grinder, so there is a bit less smaller particles and weed dust that can fall through the relatively large load screen getting trapped in the body.

None of this is that time consuming, nor do I mind, as keeping my IO as clean as I can, will hopefully keep it in my hands, and not in a long repair queue.

I don't think the problem lies with a gunked up mouthpiece. Because even without a mouth piece mine wouldn't heat up enough to vape the weed. If it's down to gunk, and I think that's where the problem lies, it's gunk that's getting through the screen in the chamber and into the heater and electrics. And I suspect that any attempts at a deep clean in this area by an inexperienced person could result in further damaging the unit and voiding the warranty. It's a pity that Hopper aren't a bit more transparent, and come clean about what causes the high failure rate, and whether and how the user can rectify common problems.

 

[JBone65]

I don't think the problem lies with a gunked up mouthpiece. Because even without a mouth piece mine wouldn't heat up enough to vape the weed. If it's down to gunk, and I think that's where the problem lies, it's gunk that's getting through the screen in the chamber and into the heater and electrics. And I suspect that any attempts at a deep clean in this area by an inexperienced person could result in further damaging the unit and voiding the warranty. It's a pity that Hopper aren't a bit more transparent, and come clean about what causes the high failure rate, and whether and how the user can rectify common problems.

Can you draw air thru it freely?

 

[vapviking]

I don't think the problem lies with a gunked up mouthpiece. Because even without a mouth piece mine wouldn't heat up enough to vape the weed. If it's down to gunk, and I think that's where the problem lies, it's gunk that's getting through the screen in the chamber and into the heater and electrics. And I suspect that any attempts at a deep clean in this area by an inexperienced person could result in further damaging the unit and voiding the warranty. It's a pity that Hopper aren't a bit more transparent, and come clean about what causes the high failure rate, and whether and how the user can rectify common problems.

I was saying years ago that internal dirt was the Achille's Heel of the hopper.
The only time in recent years that HL have been somewhat publicly transparent was when @Hopper Labs had a presence on FC, apparently to try to improve relations in advance of the io introduction. Since May 2020, nada.

The internal screen can come out pretty easily, it slides in and out with just a friction fit. Or rather, you can tip it to an angle and remove/replace it (they even sell spares on the website now) But there is not much that is user-serviceable in there. It can help draw to get that screen clean.

HL has recommended compressed air for blowing the device out - many times when a warranty complaint is lodged this is one of the suggestions. I go a bit further, though I only do it infrequently for help with draw, I think it can help clean the innards.
I run the hopper on temp 5 while blowing air through everywhere. I try to block off all but one air intake hole (with a finger wrap) and blow air in that one open hole. With all that air going through the device does not 'time out', it stays on and does get very hot. After a bit of that action I turn it off, remove the battery and blow air in there. There was lots of debate long ago about whether the air intake path was isolated from battery and/or electronics. It is not, and you can confirm this by blowing air in there; it comes out through the chamber.
The high heat may be helpful in loosening/melting/pulverizing(?!?) gunk on internals?

I think most of these are minor points; they may not really help you or address the low heat issue you describe. It may be time for an extended stay at the HL Spa and Resort for your piece.

In other news, I got an Xmax V3Pro the other day. Between that and a Go I feel immune to my hopper's eccentricities, both of those are very inexpensive, viable alternates. Neither has any threads at all! Also recently received a new BCG grinder; no threads there either! Liberating!

 

[tryingtowin]

Friendly update since I see lots still having issues with their hopper IO.

Got delivery of brand new hopper IO June 2020 so a total of 17-18 months now.

My original IO had the back end replaced 3 months after because the temp dial was too tight and got stuck then I felt the dial turn and something snapped and it broke the backend..np submitted claim got new backend sent out within 2 weeks. Been using it ever since flawlessly. Absolutely no issues. I have an OG hopper and a solo2. As soon as I got my IO workin the solo2 and OG are collecting dust as back ups incase the inevitable happens. So far so good!

I've also put this IO through about 10OZ over this time and use it daily shared. So 2 ppl hitting the hopper back to back. I don't even turn it off to pass it back and forth and let it run for 2 mins or so straight until we're both good (and once i notice its getting hotter) and it gets used this way a few times a day and way more on weekends.

Still also using 4 model 2 batteries I've had in rotation since 2017 and 3 model #3 batteries since they shipped me the IO. Surprisingly the older batteries still charge and discharge no problem and are kept in rotation.

As far as tips..I just load the battery in slowly and carefully each time as to not let it knock the small battery contact hard.

Cleaning and maintenance I dip the front end in iso maybe once a month but have a small dental pick to pick out chunks of resin and extend the iso maintenance..can easily go 2-3 months this way with no problems. I also have an extended tip.

I never use the io to charge..always an external charger.

Anyway happy hopping!

 

[JBone65]

I've also put this IO through about 10OZ over this time and use it daily shared. So 2 ppl hitting the hopper back to back. I don't even turn it off to pass it back and forth and let it run for 2 mins or so straight until we're both good (and once i notice its getting hotter) and it gets used this way a few times a day and way more on weekends.

Thanks for the details. All interesting and useful info.

I use medium dry weed which is easily ground to med-fine courseness by hand within a minute or so. Don't have to clean it internally very often but the threads get gummed up after 4-5 loads. It only takes a minute or two but I clean it every 3-4 days just for the threads. How do you avoid this?

Looks like your experience with HLs and your current daily consumption per person with the io is similar to mine. Roughly how many hits are you getting from each load?

I wish I still had my last OG as back up, but traded it plus $85 for the io.

Very interesting that two can be satisfied with one io.