Fluxer Heaters, induction heaters for Dynavap

[Fat Freddy]

OK, thanks for explaining that a bit more. I guess I never considered using/heating the DV that way, so it's good to become aware of another blind spot, lol. I'll mull it over. I think the batteries make a vertical, axial, belt-worn orientation challenging to pull off...but I won't rule it out completely. Thanks again.

If I understand you correctly, and I think that I do, then I wholeheartedly agree with your assessment of a vertical orientation. And, assuming there will be numerous iterations of your IH's, then perhaps you will create, along the way, units with variously situated insertion points?

.

 

[mr_cfromcali]

I like your answers @mr_cfromcali and I’m happy that you are taking the time to acquire the bits that stardustsailor posted on. If you didn’t already know, he is one of FC’s technical geniuses and materials expert. That there are so many very smart people hanging on FC, happy to share or help, still amazes me. SDS is one of the most genuinely helpful people with an encyclopaedic knowledge that I’ve encountered.

Gotta say I’m super impressed with you A) understanding him & B) implementing the improvements so quickly. It speaks volumes about your desire to make the best and safest operating IH device that you can.
Some people wouldn’t be so willing to take constructive feedback on their “baby”, stubbornly insisting it’s “fine” as they’ve designed it. That you happily take the extra time & money to do it well? Well done.

Same as @mrb , I’m not trying to be a Batman with my trusty utility belt! Surely there’s a perfect pouch/carry for everyone out there who wants that? Put a belt-clip on this beauty and you’ve killed it.

Thanks, @pxl_jockey ! WRT to @stardustsailor - if you read this thread's first few posts, you'll see that SDS schooled me pretty effectively within minutes of my initial post. And he was right to. I'm kind of just a dilettante with this stuff, whereas he brings an engineer's knowledge and precision to this topic and his posts. He's also MORE than generous sharing his knowledge. I have nothing but gratitude for his contributions to this topic, and will try to be similarly helpful if I can.

"[Y]our desire to make the best and safest operating IH device that you can" - that phrase pretty much sums up my philosophy with these things. I want to make devices that I'll be proud to own myself, and I have high standards. I also recognize that carrying this much power around on your person is something that I need to design for, and I can't assume my users are going to use the device as intelligently as I might like them to. So safety has been a concern of mine, and it was a concern I wasn't sure I was adequately addressing. I mean - these devices are going to have some element of danger to them no matter what, but we would all like that risk to be as minimal as possible. SDS's circuits pretty much addressed all of the trouble points I had identified, and his solutions looked at least as effective as anything I was likely to come up with, and probably MUCH better than my own efforts. And I could just...use them, to make my devices safer. I would be a fool to turn down that sort of offer!

Of course, these heaters will ultimately need to pay for themselves or my wife is gonna pull the plug on my IH hobby, but I have a day job and this isn't it. I'm trying to settle on two or three models that are straightforward to build*, safe, perform well, have the requisite "cool" factor, and are also good values. I think the Deluxe and the MF will meet these objectives. (*The Fluxer Grande = NOT, as it is pretty far from a straightforward or quick build.) We'll see how things turn out.

> I’m not trying to be a Batman with my trusty utility belt! Surely there’s a perfect pouch/carry for everyone out there who wants that? Put a belt-clip on this beauty and you’ve killed it

Got it, and very much appreciate the clarification. "Belt wearable" makes me think of my dad and the iphone he wears on his belt, and although I love my dad, I cringe a bit at the fashion statement. I'll see if I can figure out something more practical and less dork-tastic. Thanks!

 

[ClearBlueLou]

Hi @Fat Freddy . For both devices, the boxes will be oriented so the lids face UP, and the Dynavap is inserted in via a hole in the lid.

I'm waiting for the next circuit boards before I build out any more devices, as they will be the final designs or very close to them. I'll definitely post pictures once I have them.

I get the belt thing, but for those of use who are still trying to be young and hip and don't wear utility belts . . I like the flat side down thing for when I'm at a pub garden table for example. It would be a visually more subtle process, and subtlety is my biggest draw to the IH. But as you said OMMV.

OK, thanks for explaining that a bit more. I guess I never considered using/heating the DV that way, so it's good to become aware of another blind spot, lol. I'll mull it over. I think the batteries make a vertical, axial, belt-worn orientation challenging to pull off...but I won't rule it out completely. Thanks again.

Gentlemen, I believe you all actually have the same picture: the hole will be in the lid, you say, Mr_C, arb describes the unit with the lid on the top as his preference. I agree, I think that’s an excellent place for it.

Any belt-usable design would require the insert hole be placed in the thinnest dimension: the side (one of them).

Or so it seems to me

 

[mr_cfromcali]

Gentlemen, I believe you all actually have the same picture: the hole will be in the lid, you say, Mr_C, arb describes the unit with the lid on the top as his preference. I agree, I think that’s an excellent place for it.

Any belt-usable design would require the insert hole be placed in the thinnest dimension: the side (one of them).

Or so it seems to me

Thanks, @ClearBlueLou . I get it now, and I can also imagine a way to make it work. As @Fat Freddy said,

assuming there will be numerous iterations of your IH's, then perhaps you will create, along the way, units with variously situated insertion points? .

This. You folks have given me some things to consider, and now that I'm thinking about it...I have a few thoughts on how I would do this, lol. I'll see what I can do.

One question I have to ask, though, is about the demand for this device: How many of you are only interested in buying a belt wearable device? How many might also buy a Deluxe-sized belt wearable device if one were available? Be honest, and if a belt wearable device is something you legitimately think you might be willing to buy, send me a message so I can keep a tally. No obligation, just want to get a sense of numbers - do four people want this kind of a device, or forty? Numbers help me focus my energies. Thanks!

 

[pxl_jockey]

Of course, these heaters will ultimately need to pay for themselves or my wife is gonna pull the plug on my IH hobby...

> I’m not trying to be a Batman with my trusty utility belt! Surely there’s a perfect pouch/carry for everyone out there who wants that? Put a belt-clip on this beauty and you’ve killed it

Got it, and very much appreciate the clarification. "Belt wearable" makes me think of my dad and the iphone he wears on his belt, and although I love my dad, I cringe a bit at the fashion statement. I'll see if I can figure out something more practical and less dork-tastic. Thanks!

The wife statement made me spit my evening tea, thanks for that! So relatable.

I’m not sure if I was totally clear and I dearly want to be: I meant that those who want it to be ”belt wearable” should then go find the perfect pouch for themselves. Not that you should have to find/resell a pouch that fits the enclosure. I don’t think you should have the phrase “belt wearable” anywhere on your site. Tbh, we are talking about one interested potential customer who’s brought it up multiple times, not multiple requests from multiple interested potential customers. That’s important to remember here.

Trying to figure out what everyperson wants, then source it and sell it for a profit (on a boutique item) is a fool’s errand. Your extra time, that not required by family & work, would be better spent on making as many of these as is humanly possible. Let everyone else search the interwebs for their dream pouch. Anyone can do that, but not everyone can do what you’ve been up to. So do that.

For the record, IMO, not many buyers are going to want to wear it on their belt. Anymore than they would want to wear a pager. To be clear, for me personally, a belt wearable device is not desirable at all.

 

[stark1]

You’ve brought up the belt IH w/separate batteries idea earlier in the thread, but I’m not sure exactly what you’re after @stark1 do you envision heating your vapcap whilst in full stride? You know I respect ya and I’m not trying to be a smart arse. Just trying to understand. Are most folks gonna want that?

True portability, and ease of use, requires an EDC tool to be belt anchored for the active lifestyle.

As such, the orientation of the tool should be best parallel to the longest dimension, which is usually designed
parallel to the upright body. For practicality, and ease of use. A small matter of ergonomics.

Rather than perpendicular.

Just another possibility, the sedentary May well prefer the coil to be perpendicular.

Putting out perspectives, you/me/the buyer ultimately chooses whether the product is right on the money.

Do carry on.

 

[Fat Freddy]

Hey!

I'll wear a god damned utility belt with my fashionable ensemble (admire below) if I fuckin' want to... and anyone who says otherwise is just another effete snob!

 

[Gray Area]

I get the belt thing, but for those of use who are still trying to be young and hip and don't wear utility belts . . I like the flat side down thing for when I'm at a pub garden table for example. It would be a visually more subtle process, and subtlety is my biggest draw to the IH. But as you said OMMV.

^^^ this, for me too

I'd use mine at home, but want to put it down flat on various surfaces to use... back pocket for traveling around the house and when not in use etc

 

[stardustsailor]

@mr_cfromcali

Some notes regarding portable units .
Because of their nature -not being usually stationary -the portable devices are
susceptible to vibrations of various frequencies and power .
So their design ,while being compact enough (saving space as much as possible )
must implement some vibration proofing ,at least where is needed at most.

At the case of the most DIY IH devices built ,here are some "weak " points
that need "vibration proofing " .

- The work coil vs the glass tube :
The work coil has a layer of insulating enamel over the copper wire .
If this enamel gets damaged the working coil may short and this may cause the
IH driver to fail .If the coil is wrapped around the glass tube ,eventually at some point
the insulating enamel will be scraped off by the glass tube at the contact points ,
mainly due to various vibrations & at less extend by the heat expansion of the coil .

Solution : A single layer of Kapton tape,fully wrapped around the glass tube .
Then the coil is installed at the tube .

*If a thermal breaker is installed at the work coil ,then the coil also has to be
wrapped with a single layer of Kapton tape ,before the thermal breaker is attached
to the work coil .
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
- Heavy & bulky electronic components :
At the IH drivers usually are present rather bulky tank caps and ferrite core inductors .
Those components if they are not glued to the pcb ,they might peel off the solder pad
(and part of the trace ,usually ) from the pcb ,thus destroying the IH driver permanently .

Solution : Use small drops of
( ordinary kind will do ,as long as any copper pad/trace is fully covered by solder )
RTV silicone to glue down the heavy electronic components to the pcb.
Press the silicone deeper at the cavities between the pcb and the components ,
with a plastic spade of some kind ,where is needed.

https://electronics.stackexchange.c...or-pcb-mounted-components-to-avoid-vibrations

https://www.electronicspoint.com/threads/question-regarding-using-epoxy-or-rtv-on-pcbs.71189/
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
-The borosilicate glass tube should not contact any metal surfaces and should be secourely
seated on a appropriate high temp resistant base
( BTW Nylon #6 or Nylon #66 are ideal materials for the job ) and be cushioned at the other end
with the use of silicone or rubber o-ring(s) or a case grommet or both .

https://www.ebay.com/b/Nylon-Plastic-Rubber-Round-Rods/182958/bn_93485428
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
- Optionally but preferably enough ,all the wiring should be protected from heat and friction
with high temperature silicone / glass braided sleeving .

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1-25mm-Dia-Silicon-Fiber-Glass-Insulated-Sleeving-Braided-High-Temperature-Tube/222553195235?ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT&var=521396622845&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
- And of course the battery cells have to be securely attached to their holder -in
case of tubular Li-ion battery cells .If not ,under a strong impact they may snap out of the
holder's springs and that might lead to the battery getting shorted .

 

[mr_cfromcali]

@mr_cfromcali

Some notes regarding portable units .
Because of their nature -not being usually stationary -the portable devices are
susceptible to vibrations of various frequencies and power .
So their design ,while being compact enough (saving space as much as possible )
must implement some vibration proofing ,at least where is needed at most.

At the case of the most DIY IH devices built ,here are some "weak " points
that need "vibration proofing " .

- The work coil vs the glass tube :
The work coil has a layer of insulating enamel over the copper wire .
If this enamel gets damaged the working coil may short and this may cause the
IH driver to fail .If the coil is wrapped around the glass tube ,eventually at some point
the insulating enamel will be scraped off by the glass tube at the contact points ,
mainly due to various vibrations & at less extend by the heat expansion of the coil .

Solution : A single layer of Kapton tape,fully wrapped around the glass tube .
Then the coil is installed at the tube .

*If a thermal breaker is installed at the work coil ,then the coil also has to be
wrapped with a single layer of Kapton tape ,before the thermal breaker is attached
to the work coil .
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
- Heavy & bulky electronic components :
At the IH drivers usually are present rather bulky tank caps and ferrite core inductors .
Those components if they are not glued to the pcb ,they might peel off the solder pad
(and part of the trace ,usually ) from the pcb ,thus destroying the IH driver permanently .

Solution : Use small drops of
( ordinary kind will do ,as long as any copper pad/trace is fully covered by solder )
RTV silicone to glue down the heavy electronic components to the pcb.
Press the silicone deeper at the cavities between the pcb and the components ,
with a plastic spade of some kind ,where is needed.

https://electronics.stackexchange.c...or-pcb-mounted-components-to-avoid-vibrations

https://www.electronicspoint.com/threads/question-regarding-using-epoxy-or-rtv-on-pcbs.71189/
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
-The borosilicate glass tube should not contact any metal surfaces and should be secourely
seated on a appropriate high temp resistant base
( BTW Nylon #6 or Nylon #66 are ideal materials for the job ) and be cushioned at the other end
with the use of silicone or rubber o-ring(s) or a case grommet or both .

https://www.ebay.com/b/Nylon-Plastic-Rubber-Round-Rods/182958/bn_93485428
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
- Optionally but preferably enough ,all the wiring should be protected from heat and friction
with high temperature silicone / glass braided sleeving .

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1-25mm-Dia-Silicon-Fiber-Glass-Insulated-Sleeving-Braided-High-Temperature-Tube/222553195235?ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT&var=521396622845&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
- And of course the battery cells have to be securely attached to their holder -in
case of tubular Li-ion battery cells .If not ,under a strong impact they may snap out of the
holder's springs and that might lead to the battery getting shorted .

Thank you, @stardustsailor . I mean that sincerely - that advice you just shared is worth a hell of a lot more than two cents. I don't feel that I'm in over my head with this project - there's still time for that, lol - but I'm new to many aspects of this adventure and am constantly being reminded of that. I like the challenge of bringing these ideas to fruition, but I want them to be safe, too. Thank you for pointing out some critical problem areas and some potential solutions!

I will incorporate as many of these suggestions as I can, as rapidly as I can. These will be substantially better and safer devices thanks to your generous contributions.

I will delve into these items tomorrow, as work permits. Thanks again!

 

[ClearBlueLou]

@stardustsailor, IYO would some vibration-deadening material on the opposite face be more trouble than it would be worth?

 

[mr_cfromcali]

@stardustsailor, IYO would some vibration-deadening material on the opposite face be more trouble than it would be worth?

FWIW, I wouldn’t assume there’s extra space. The batteries will be within 1-2mm of the lid. There isn’t going to be room for them to bounce “out.”

 

[ClearBlueLou]

I was thinking outside...the bottom face of the unit, not the opposite face (inside) of the lid.

Does that help?

 

[mr_cfromcali]

Ah. Ok.

 

[ClearBlueLou]

Sorry for my lack of specificity

 

[mr_cfromcali]

Hi all, it's Friday and I thought I'd share a few pre-weekend updates, as it's still Friday morning in my time zone.

The Flux Deluxe: According to DHL, I have some circuit boards coming by 9PM tonight!! This is a surprise, as their expected delivery date was going to be next Tuesday, October 9th, and stuff almost never arrives early! Due to the last week's late burst of development, these are not the latest board designs and do not incorporate the safety features we discussed last week, so these aren't final candidate boards. They are a pretty significant check-in point for overall fitment, though - my first all-on-one-board design - only the BMS circuit is separate - and a sanity check to make sure the device still fits in its enclosure, the lid closes, and it doesn't burst into flames or melt when used. The boards in this shipment will also give me a chance to build a new prototype, as I could use some pictures for the site.

I'm both excited and nervous about these boards, as they represent a big step forward for my design even if they aren't the final product. I also gambled a bit and completed a potential "final candidate" board that's based on the board that's arriving tonight. So if tonight's board works well, the next board for the Deluxe will be a final candidate for the initial release. And if tonight's board has issues...not so much, lol. I'll try to correct any issues and submit a corrected design ASAP, as the lag between submitting a board design and receiving copies of it is about 5-8 days, depending on the calendar and customs.

I don't want to cut any development corners, but I am very intent on having some heaters available by the end of this month.

The Mother Fluxer: The first "final candidate" Mother Fluxer circuit board has also been submitted for production. It's also NOT in today's DHL shipment, but it should arrive in the same shipment as the Deluxe's FC board, probably next week or early the following week. It's getting close.

I have more than 30 of the correct 1590BBS enclosures sitting in my garage (in a few colors and finishes), and enough other parts to easily do an initial batch of 20 units if the demand is there. I think it is, but I'll have a better sense of THAT once I have some product to ship.

• New Mother Fluxer Feature: I forgot to mention this earlier, but for greater compatibility and flexibility, the MF's can ALSO run on 3x 18650 batteries. The heater circuit sees both battery types as identical 12V power sources and doesn't care which is used. To make this easier for you as a user, I plan on including a set of these 26650-to-18650 adapter sleeves so 18650 batteries are held securely in place and safe to use on the go.

All Fluxer Heater portables:

• All Fluxer heater portables are going ship with a (generic) 12.6V @ 1A wall adapter. The more I looked into this, the more sense it makes to include the wall adapter. These adapters are available with in either a US or a "Euro" flavor (flavour?), but beyond that I will need to wait for them to arrive to share pics, etc.

I think that's it for the moment; thanks again for your interest and support! I'll post another update tonight or tomorrow after my DHL shipment gets here.

Happy Friday, everyone! Hoping you all have great weekends!

 

[mr_cfromcali]

It was quiet at work and I had some comp time coming, so I decided to make it a half day. I came home to all of this, none of which I was expecting this soon! Friday afternoon just got a lot more interesting

Clockwise: NVD5890NLT4G chips, Flux Deluxe prototype board 1.0b, , 80°C and 90°C Karcy thermal fuses, and 13mm Kapton tape. And a few hours with the house to myself

Cheers!

 

[ClearBlueLou]

Are you still implementing the 12v/8.4v configuration?
And are you incorporating the same into the Mother?

Just making sure I didn’t misunderstand.

 

[mr_cfromcali]

Are you still implementing the 12v/8.4v configuration?
And are you incorporating the same into the Mother?

Just making sure I didn’t misunderstand.

Sorry for the confusion, but there have been a few changes in my plans as the models have taken shape.

At this point, I am coming out with two new portable models:

The Mother Fluxer, which runs on 3x 26650 batteries or 3x 18650 batteries in a Hammond 1590BBS enclosure.

The Flux Deluxe, which is smaller and runs on 3x 18650 batteries in a CNC machined aluminum Hammond 1590B enclosure.

Just those two.

The Flux, which was going to be a 8.4v portable/12v desktop also housed in a 1590b case, was shelved for lack of customer interest once I announced the Deluxe.

Sorry. I may finish the Flux at some point, but truthfully, it got passed by a better device.

—————-

Quick update on the Deluxe PCB testing: no bueno. I introduced some error to the wire routing, which I think I’ve identified. Eh, My progress has been pretty rapid, so it was bound to happen. Shouldn’t be a big deal in the long run. More to come as I figure it out.

Update 2: Initial issue was due to a dumb (!) wiring mistake. So that was cool.

And it worked. A few times. Then the smoke escaped. So I have some QA to do.

More later.

 

[ClearBlueLou]

Thanks for the response: I’d ended up with the idea that the flux got shelved because larger box/extra battery, and that the 12/8.4v was being incorporated into your custom board. I appreciate the correction...looks like I *won’t* have a reason to get one of each.

 

[mr_cfromcali]

Thanks for the response: I’d ended up with the idea that the flux got shelved because larger box/extra battery, and that the 12/8.4v was being incorporated into your custom board. I appreciate the correction...looks like I *won’t* have a reason to get one of each.

Understood. I may do a "vanity run" of a few of these, just to put one on the shelf. I'll let you know if that happens, as there will be extras available.

Thanks for the comments. Cheers!

 

[ClearBlueLou]

Thank you for your enthusiasm, your good humor, your ingenuity, and your fulsome responses!

 

[mr_cfromcali]

Flux Deluxe Update: For anyone keeping vigil on the fate of the Deluxe PCB that showed up a few days ago - sorry, but we're gonna be on this road a bit longer.

That board was a dud, but I've made some corrections and will have another candidate here in a week or so. Stay tuned.

That's all for now. I should have some Mother Fluxer final candidate boards on hand by Friday or Monday, which will be exciting. Thanks again for your support!

 

[pxl_jockey]

I know that I am not alone here when I say: it’s cool, please take your time & get it right. Then test the hell out of it! You’ve made very fast progress and by accepting SDS’ helpfulness, it’s going to be much better than it was even a month ago. It’s rather amazing how quickly your project’s development has gone, even though there was a “map”. I’m in no way making light of your accomplishments and the work you must have put into these before introducing yourself here.

I’m excited for the Deluxe’s arrival but I will happily wait for a solid product, rather than paying $170-200 for a beta-testing opportunity. For me personally, a portable IH that goes for <$200 is a serious investment and so needs to perform as good, preferably better, than others and do so reliably. For a good time.

You seem very close on nailing your circuit board so if the next iteration works, do you have a plan to ensure that you feel confident in standing behind them? Do you have test protocol or benchmarks for units before they go out into the wild? I’m pretty certain that these are questions others will have as well. Thank you for updating us nerds that are following these products closely, your communication is great!

 

[ClearBlueLou]

Despite my interest, recent events have pushed any possible acquisitions into the new year. Still, watching this closely