Fluxer Heaters, induction heaters for Dynavap

Andreaerdna

If God is the answer, then the question is wrong
Nice holes!

little silly question: what is the added value of these holes? I see them as a liability, i mean they are open doors to electronics for liquids and dust, both possibly leading to a premature fail :hmm:
 
Andreaerdna,
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mr_cfromcali

Accessory Maker
Accessory Maker
Nice holes!

little silly question: what is the added value of these holes? I see them as a liability, i mean they are open doors to electronics for liquids and dust, both possibly leading to a premature fail :hmm:

It’s a fair question.

First and foremost, this thing is a heater, not a toy, and the coil gets quite hot. It’s in a small space, in a case made of aluminum, which is a good heat conductor. The device gets warm (but never hot) with repeated use.

There is a thermal fuse next to the coil that will shut off power if it gets too hot. The holes in the case near the coil allow heat to vent, which reduces the frequency of tripping the thermal fuse, and also permits a quicker recovery if it does trip (which is ~30 seconds, typically).

The very first drafts of the device didn’t have vent holes, and I had to add them to solve the above problems. They do expose the interior to intrusion, and not everyone liked them at the time I introduced them, but they work, so they have remained. The original discussion about them is further back in this thread, circa October/November 2018, if you are curious.

Hope that helps. :myday:
 
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Terpenetime

Well-Known Member
I’ve posted my initial impressions of Flux Deluxe #178 on the Vapelife forum if anyone’s interested...

https://forum.vapelife.com/discussion/comment/137962

Apologies for not posting it here but I wanted to include some photographs and I haven’t worked out how to do that here yet.

Thank you @mr_cfromcali, I very much appreciate the work you’ve put into this superb device.

:clap::clap::clap:
 

mr_cfromcali

Accessory Maker
Accessory Maker
As I said on the other forum, thank you, @Terpenetime , for the very well written and well documented review! :clap: Your pictures are great, by the way! Thanks for taking the time to take such good pics! I am very happy you like it, and hope it works well for you! Use it in good health. :tup:

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

I just sent out another batch of confirmation emails earlier today, and am now up to people who joined the waiting list on or before 4/19. I will probably expand this group in the next day or two as I get more replies and the current batch takes shape.

I know the holidays are at hand and these heaters aren't free, so I DO understand that the timing for these next groups is going to make it difficult or impossible for some of you to buy a heater right now. If that's your situation, just let me know that you need to wait a few weeks until you can take your turn, and then let me know when that will be. You do not have to act on your invitation immediately, just let me know your plans. Basically, your opportunity to buy a heater remains open until you either buy a heater or pass, as long as you act within a few weeks. If a LOT of time goes by, I may ask you to wait for a new batch.

Hopefully that reduces some anxieties. Please feel free to PM me or email me with questions, if you have any.

Cheers,
:leaf:
 
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AcidFlashbang

Well-Known Member
As I said on the other forum, thank you, @Terpenetime , for the very well written and well documented review! :clap: Your pictures are great, by the way! Thanks for taking the time to take such good pics! I am very happy you like it, and hope it works well for you! Use it in good health. :tup:

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

I just sent out another batch of confirmation emails earlier today, and am now up to people who joined the waiting list on or before 4/19. I will probably expand this group in the next day or two as I get more replies and the current batch takes shape.

I know the holidays are at hand and these heaters aren't free, so I DO understand that the timing for these next groups is going to make it difficult or impossible for some of you to buy a heater right now. If that's your situation, just let me know that you need to wait a few weeks until you can take your turn, and then let me know when that will be. You do not have to act on your invitation immediately, just let me know your plans. Basically, your opportunity to buy a heater remains open until you either buy a heater or pass, as long as you act within a few weeks. If a LOT of time goes by, I may ask you to wait for a new batch.

Hopefully that reduces some anxieties. Please feel free to PM me or email me with questions, if you have any.

Cheers,
:leaf:

I emailed you on 4/9 and 4/16 (wasn't sure if the first one arrived so I sent another) and haven't received any email. I can forward the old emails to you as evidence
 
AcidFlashbang,

mr_cfromcali

Accessory Maker
Accessory Maker
I emailed you on 4/9 and 4/16 (wasn't sure if the first one arrived so I sent another) and haven't received any email. I can forward the old emails to you as evidence

Sorry. If you would, please let me know the email you used - a PM here or another email is fine. I'm hpapy to send you an invite but would like to determine why I missed you. Thx!

Updated to add:
Solved. D'Oh! :doh:
Order confirmation email sent. :tup:
 
Last edited:

mr_cfromcali

Accessory Maker
Accessory Maker
Happy Friday! Apologies for the novella below, but I have some actual knowledge to share with you folks today.

:sherlock:

Let's talk about heating coils, and how to improve the performance of the Flux Deluxe!

As we know, the Dynavap + IH combo usually works quite well, but occasionally this combination produces disappointing results, e.g., sometimes an IH will heat a vapcap enough to click it, but the heat it generates is mysteriously insufficient to achieve full extraction. Or, sometimes you experience the opposite, and the IH will over-achieve and heat a vapcap to the point of combustion before the 2nd click. It can be very frustrating, even for a guy that makes these devices. :bang:

I wanted to make the FD perform better and NOT exhibit behavior like this, so to learn more (and hopefully discover a better coil), I decided to try as many different coil configurations as I could think up, including glass and carbon fiber inserts in sizes from 13mm OD to 17mm OD (in various wall thicknesses), and coil wires in gauges from as thin as 22ga to as thick as 14ga. For reference, the standard Flux Deluxe coil wire size is 16ga. Here are a few of the ones I ran through my testing units:

IMG-8857-private.jpg


It was a very worthwhile exercise, and I learned some things, which I share below. If this were a movie, this is where we'd see the montage of me trying one coil design after another...

:science: ... :science: ... :science: ... :science: ...:science: ... :science: ...:science: ...etc...

...until I inadvertently found the answer I was looking for in an unexpected place. And in truth, that is more-or-less what happened.

:brow:

Here's my big takeaway from trying a large number of different coil configurations:

Coil height height matters, and it matters a lot!

I observed best results when I heated heat the tip of the vapcap at a slightly slower rate than the body of the vapcap. To do this, I positioned the bottom loop in the FD coil above (or about equal to) the tip of the vapcap, when the vapcap is pressed into the tactile switch.

You can configure the FD to heat this way by locating the bottom loop of the coil 9mm above the PCB, as shown below.


I am am probably not the first to articulate the above concept, so consider it independent confirmation.

How does this affect the Flux deluxe? Here's the Flux Deluxe's tactile switch, with pyrex button attached:

IMG-8858-private.jpg


The button top sits 8mm above the surface of the PCB. Very early FD's had the button on a 1.5mm tall cap, for even taller initial height.

This is the Flux Deluxe coil as I have been making them to this point:

IMG-8864-private.jpg


Note that the bottom loop of the coil is flush with the top of the second o-ring. (Each o-ring has a center line from its mold, so there are really only two.) This works fine, but now...

-- [MUSIC RISES to reveal following image WITH DRAMATIC FLOURISH!] --

...it can be made to work much better (!!!) by raising the height of the bottom loop of the work coil until it sits about even with or very slightly above the height of the top of the pyrex button:

IMG-8852-private.jpg


That's all it takes! Testing has shown me that this is the ideal coil height. A vapcap (~1cm diameter) is shown at left for scale.

I have tested the CRAP out of these different coils with this device, and this is by far the biggest win to come from that testing. So far, this new coil height has improved the performance of every coil combination I have tried it with. I am making that conclusion based on the quality and quantity of the vapor being produced, as well as the quality of the extraction and color of the ABV. I will be making and posting some videos to demonstrate this as soon as I can find the time to do so.

A longer heat up time gives induction-generated heat more time to penetrate into the tip before clicking the vapcap, and this is something most of us will notice and appreciate immediately. It's an analog device, and it turns out the coil's true sweet spot is a few mm higher up than I initially thought. D'Oh! :doh:

To remedy for the future, I am increasing the number of o-rings under the coil to three, which raises the coil to the better height. I may also pull a loop from the coil to keep the overall height of things in check:

IMG-8867-private.jpg


A three o-ring stack gives a better coil height, as seen above.

This is good news for news for future FD owners, obviously, but current FD owners can still take heart: any FD can be improved with this change (!), although unfortunately not every coil has enough slack in its construction to permit it to be raised up like this. My recent coils are probably too tight for end users to adjust themselves, for example. You can certainly send it in to me, and for the cost of postage I will be happy to adjust it for you. If you have ever been frustrated with your IH heater's performance and wish it heated a bit better, this simple way to make it heat better.

If you are currently a FD owner and want to try adjusting the coil height height on your FD yourself, you can give it a try using the instructions shown here:

https://fluxerheaters.com/faq-and-other-resources

Warning: This is a potential can of worms for some people, so don't feel you need to do this! You don't! :worms:

The coil is simply a loop of copper wire and it will bend easily, so always move it gently. When adjusting the height of the coil, try to slide the entire coil upwards on the insert, starting from the bottom, without breaking the insert or otherwise damaging anything! Try moving it upwards g-e-n-t-l-y, with a slight wiggling motion. If the coil seems to be too tight around the glass to move, you can try twisting the coil very gently counterclockwise to release its tension and free it enough to move. Go slow and don't be a hero. There is no need to mess with this adjustment if you like the way your FD performs now. Good luck, and please report back as folks try this.

:worms:

Final thoughts, plus I eat some crow: We actually discussed coil height in this thread back in October - and earlier, too, though I could not find that post. Back in October I told @Andreaerdna , @lookhigh , and some others very declaratively, "There isn't any room to move the coil up or down. I suppose it could be possible to remove the top o-ring and move the coil up the equivalent space - 1mm at most - but that's it. "...

A statement that has aged like milk. Here it is in full.

I'll set things straight now: I was wrong about the impact of coil height on the performance of this device! You guys were right, and it makes a significant difference. Furthermore, when properly adjusted it definitely improves the performance of this heater. Thanks for making me aware of this parameter, and how important it is! You guys rock! :rockon:


Cheers all, and have a great weekend!
:leaf:
 
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TommyDee

Vaporitor
I've been cooking my VC with the bowl in the center of the coil lengthwise. I am retarding the click by having the cap near the end, the weakest signal. I want clicks from actual imparted heat. That is what you are finding. IH heats completely differently than conduction from one metal to another. Then again, you already know that.
I run a full length coil and push nearly 6 amps at 10V (losses in rigs) so that doesn't compare. I brought a sledge hammer to hang a picture. You've dialed in your power levels by reducing the overall inductance. Now you can also optimize the bowl position in the strongest part of the field; dead center.

I am having great control because of this. I can adjust a bit but that made little difference. A targeted coil like you are using will help make sure the IH isn't triggering the clicks. In my rig, standard issue coil, the coil also heats up too much of the cooling fins as well. That is not helpful in the least. What I am saying is that if the bowl is not dead center, error on moving toward the clicker. Heating cooling fins just makes for crusty honey.

Thanks for sharing your findings. I'm being lazy building my second unit. I might have to get lazier and contemplate the implications of your excellent info!
 

AcidFlashbang

Well-Known Member
I'll set things straight now: I was wrong about the impact of coil height on the performance of this device! You guys were right, and it makes a significant difference. Furthermore, when properly adjusted it definitely improves the performance of this heater. Thanks for making me aware of this parameter, and how important it is! You guys rock!
So will the current batch you're makin right now have the raised coil? :brow:
 
AcidFlashbang,

mr_cfromcali

Accessory Maker
Accessory Maker
So will the current batch you're makin right now have the raised coil? :brow:

Yes! I am implementing this immediately, with the current batch, and I only wish I had figured it out sooner. This is an extremely minor change from a production standpoint as it only requires one additional o-ring to install it raised, so this is really a win all around. I'll pull together a video comparing a heater with the new coil height to one of the the previous coil height. I think the differences in click timing (especially the extra time between the clicks w/the 15mm size) and AVB coloring will be enlightening. :nod:
 

lookhigh

FC member
Final thoughts, plus I eat some crow: We actually discussed coil height in this thread back in October - and earlier, too, though I could not find that post. Back in October I told @Andreaerdna , @lookhigh , and some others very declaratively, "There isn't any room to move the coil up or down. I suppose it could be possible to remove the top o-ring and move the coil up the equivalent space - 1mm at most - but that's it. "...

A little i told you so moment.:evil:sorry.
My coil is raised a little but also lowered, so one less loop seems to be about right.
 
lookhigh,

TommyDee

Vaporitor
...
...
Final thoughts, plus I eat some crow: We actually discussed coil height in this thread back in October - and earlier, too, though I could not find that post. Back in October I told @Andreaerdna , @lookhigh , and some others very declaratively, "There isn't any room to move the coil up or down. I suppose it could be possible to remove the top o-ring and move the coil up the equivalent space - 1mm at most - but that's it. "...

A statement that has aged like milk. Here it is in full.
...

..however considering you have control of your PCB, you could implement a simpler switch (membrane dome) to gain 8mm of internal height. Make it large enough and you can probably loose the spacers and the glass switch-cap. Or maybe two flexible contacts that the cap itself connects to make the connection eliminating pressure all together. 2 elevations of spring contact that requires a slight amount of pressure connected by the VC.

MFG_2329497-1.jpg
 
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TommyDee,
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mr_cfromcali

Accessory Maker
Accessory Maker
...


..however considering you have control of your PCB, you could implement a simpler switch (membrane dome) to gain 8mm of internal height. Make it large enough and you can probably loose the spacers and the glass switch-cap. Or maybe two flexible contacts that the cap itself connects to make the connection eliminating pressure all together. 2 elevations of spring contact that requires a slight amount of pressure connected by the VC.

MFG_2329497-1.jpg

Thanks for your suggestions. My wheels grind slowly sometimes, but I will give this some consideration. :sherlock: Thanks!
 
mr_cfromcali,

AcidFlashbang

Well-Known Member
Thanks for your suggestions. My wheels grind slowly sometimes, but I will give this some consideration. :sherlock: Thanks!
Have you seen what the new mag heater does to have an adjustable heating point? Not really feasible with the form factor you have right now but maybe it could give someone like you inspiration.
 
AcidFlashbang,

mr_cfromcali

Accessory Maker
Accessory Maker
Have you seen what the new mag heater does to have an adjustable heating point? Not really feasible with the form factor you have right now but maybe it could give someone like you inspiration.

No, I haven't. I don't want to sound like I keep my head stuck in the sand, but I don't keep very close tabs on other IHs, tbh. This community has already provided me with plenty of inspiration, and I have made an effort to acknowledge and thank those who have inspired me as I have progressed through his project.

This is very much my own device now and has been so for quite some time, and I feel like I have a good handle on it. For example, this is one way in which I intend to implement the new coil height:

coil-with-loops.jpg


In addition to the extra spacer, the coil also has a few extra bends near its base, to allow you to slide it up or down another 1-2 mm if you desire. Moving the coil further upwards leads to even longer heating times, while moving the coil down returns the coil towards its previous default height and heating profile.

Lowering the coil will require removing the extra spacer, but this is a simple, no-tools procedure that takes a couple of minutes, max. (i.e., "after removing the chassis from the case as above, tilt the coil 90° away from the switch, remove the extra spacer, and then tilt the coil back"). It's just copper wire, so it's easy to bend. Easy-peasy.

I will post a video showing the effects, as well as more performance info (ti vs SS tips, for example) as soon as I have the time. We have some family visiting from out of town, and while we're happy they're here, it does limit my opportunities for testing. :leaf: isn't software, lol.

Anyway, I have a bunch going on beginning the week and continuing to the end of the year but will pull together and post as much useful info on this change as I can, as soon as I have the chance. In the meantime, the testing I did over the weekend as I was building heaters -- all of it clinical, I swear :haw: - has confirmed that a taller coil height is the way to go for this device.

I feel the next steps are determining some solid coil size recommendations for "only Ti tip", "only SS tip", and "both types of tips," as my testing is showing the ti tip heats very quickly and linearly, obviously, while the SS tip's heat curve is more of a ramp and it benefits from a slightly longer, more intense heating time. It makes all of the current choices perform more like they should - so the 15mm is still hotter than the 16mm, etc., and those two sizes still serve as effective choices for "hotter" and "cooler". Anyway, there will be more info coming as soon as I have the time to compile it.

Cheers,
:leaf:
 

Moses Baca

Colorado State Reformatory #8755
Happy Friday! Apologies for the novella below, but I have some actual knowledge to share with you folks today.

:sherlock:

Let's talk about heating coils, and how to improve the performance of the Flux Deluxe!

As we know, the Dynavap + IH combo usually works quite well, but occasionally this combination produces disappointing results, e.g., sometimes an IH will heat a vapcap enough to click it, but the heat it generates is mysteriously insufficient to achieve full extraction. Or, sometimes you experience the opposite, and the IH will over-achieve and heat a vapcap to the point of combustion before the 2nd click. It can be very frustrating, even for a guy that makes these devices. :bang:

I wanted to make the FD perform better and NOT exhibit behavior like this, so to learn more (and hopefully discover a better coil), I decided to try as many different coil configurations as I could think up, including glass and carbon fiber inserts in sizes from 13mm OD to 17mm OD (in various wall thicknesses), and coil wires in gauges from as thin as 22ga to as thick as 14ga. For reference, the standard Flux Deluxe coil wire size is 16ga. Here are a few of the ones I ran through my testing units:

IMG-8857-private.jpg


It was a very worthwhile exercise, and I learned some things, which I share below. If this were a movie, this is where we'd see the montage of me trying one coil design after another...

:science: ... :science: ... :science: ... :science: ...:science: ... :science: ...:science: ...etc...

...until I inadvertently found the answer I was looking for in an unexpected place. And in truth, that is more-or-less what happened.

:brow:

Here's my big takeaway from trying a large number of different coil configurations:

Coil height height matters, and it matters a lot!

I observed best results when I heated heat the tip of the vapcap at a slightly slower rate than the body of the vapcap. To do this, I positioned the bottom loop in the FD coil above (or about equal to) the tip of the vapcap, when the vapcap is pressed into the tactile switch.

You can configure the FD to heat this way by locating the bottom loop of the coil 9mm above the PCB, as shown below.


I am am probably not the first to articulate the above concept, so consider it independent confirmation.

How does this affect the Flux deluxe? Here's the Flux Deluxe's tactile switch, with pyrex button attached:

IMG-8858-private.jpg


The button top sits 8mm above the surface of the PCB. Very early FD's had the button on a 1.5mm tall cap, for even taller initial height.

This is the Flux Deluxe coil as I have been making them to this point:

IMG-8864-private.jpg


Note that the bottom loop of the coil is flush with the top of the second o-ring. (Each o-ring has a center line from its mold, so there are really only two.) This works fine, but now...

-- [MUSIC RISES to reveal following image WITH DRAMATIC FLOURISH!] --

...it can be made to work much better (!!!) by raising the height of the bottom loop of the work coil until it sits about even with or very slightly above the height of the top of the pyrex button:

IMG-8852-private.jpg


That's all it takes! Testing has shown me that this is the ideal coil height. A vapcap (~1cm diameter) is shown at left for scale.

I have tested the CRAP out of these different coils with this device, and this is by far the biggest win to come from that testing. So far, this new coil height has improved the performance of every coil combination I have tried it with. I am making that conclusion based on the quality and quantity of the vapor being produced, as well as the quality of the extraction and color of the ABV. I will be making and posting some videos to demonstrate this as soon as I can find the time to do so.

A longer heat up time gives induction-generated heat more time to penetrate into the tip before clicking the vapcap, and this is something most of us will notice and appreciate immediately. It's an analog device, and it turns out the coil's true sweet spot is a few mm higher up than I initially thought. D'Oh! :doh:

To remedy for the future, I am increasing the number of o-rings under the coil to three, which raises the coil to the better height. I may also pull a loop from the coil to keep the overall height of things in check:

IMG-8867-private.jpg


A three o-ring stack gives a better coil height, as seen above.

This is good news for news for future FD owners, obviously, but current FD owners can still take heart: any FD can be improved with this change (!), although unfortunately not every coil has enough slack in its construction to permit it to be raised up like this. My recent coils are probably too tight for end users to adjust themselves, for example. You can certainly send it in to me, and for the cost of postage I will be happy to adjust it for you. If you have ever been frustrated with your IH heater's performance and wish it heated a bit better, this simple way to make it heat better.

If you are currently a FD owner and want to try adjusting the coil height height on your FD yourself, you can give it a try using the instructions shown here:

https://fluxerheaters.com/faq-and-other-resources

Warning: This is a potential can of worms for some people, so don't feel you need to do this! You don't! :worms:

The coil is simply a loop of copper wire and it will bend easily, so always move it gently. When adjusting the height of the coil, try to slide the entire coil upwards on the insert, starting from the bottom, without breaking the insert or otherwise damaging anything! Try moving it upwards g-e-n-t-l-y, with a slight wiggling motion. If the coil seems to be too tight around the glass to move, you can try twisting the coil very gently counterclockwise to release its tension and free it enough to move. Go slow and don't be a hero. There is no need to mess with this adjustment if you like the way your FD performs now. Good luck, and please report back as folks try this.

:worms:

Final thoughts, plus I eat some crow: We actually discussed coil height in this thread back in October - and earlier, too, though I could not find that post. Back in October I told @Andreaerdna , @lookhigh , and some others very declaratively, "There isn't any room to move the coil up or down. I suppose it could be possible to remove the top o-ring and move the coil up the equivalent space - 1mm at most - but that's it. "...

A statement that has aged like milk. Here it is in full.

I'll set things straight now: I was wrong about the impact of coil height on the performance of this device! You guys were right, and it makes a significant difference. Furthermore, when properly adjusted it definitely improves the performance of this heater. Thanks for making me aware of this parameter, and how important it is! You guys rock! :rockon:


Cheers all, and have a great weekend!
:leaf:

My wife is out of town on business this week and took our FD with her but I'll definitely try adjusting my coil when she gets back. We don't have any complaints about it but if it can be even better then count me in.

On link posted to the FD website FAQ and Other Resources, I'm not seeing the directions for adjusting my own coil. Anything special I need to know, @mr_cfromcali?
 

TommyDee

Vaporitor
Definitely looking forward to Ti performance metrics. I was wondering if the reduced mass also meant reduced electrons and slower heating. Looks like the lower mass allows for faster heating and it has sufficient electrons (conductivity) to generate heat.

Silly question for more brainstorming; at least a feature I'd like to explore.
I am assuming the switch latches the FET that delivers power by pulling the gate high.
Those switch devices can alter output by varying the gate voltage.
Has anyone tried controlling the "fast/slow" "Warm/Hot" setting by controlling voltage rather than the coil?
I'm thinking of putting a small variable voltage device to set the voltage on the gate with user-adjustability.
That's a feature In haven't seen yet.
 
TommyDee,
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mr_cfromcali

Accessory Maker
Accessory Maker
My wife is out of town on business this week and took our FD with her but I'll definitely try adjusting my coil when she gets back. We don't have any complaints about it but if it can be even better then count me in.

On link posted to the FD website FAQ and Other Resources, I'm not seeing the directions for adjusting my own coil. Anything special I need to know, @mr_cfromcali?

Uh...sorry, but I haven't posted those yet, @Moses Baca . My site currently has instructions for how to remove the battery pack and install the battery pack spacer. The new instructions continue on from there. Here's the gist of the new instructions:

This is a quick overview of how to remove the PCB from the enclosure and gain access to the work coil:

Once the battery pack is free*, remove the PCB from the case with a gentle but firm pull upwards: Use a finger to pull up from the rear of the center hole, near the white power relay). You will need to push the LED free of its holder and pull it out of the way before removing the whole PCB assembly from the case.

With the PCB exposed, you can assess your ability to move the coil upwards. I believe that most earlier coils will be fine, but some may need to be redone to provide enough "slack" in their construction to allow you to slide them upwards. It will either work or it won't, I suppose, but in most cases there will be room to move it o up, so feel free to try and see how you like it. My coil builds have gotten tighter as I have progressed with these heaters, so you may not be able to move an existing coil much without reworking it. I am happy to make you a new coil for you to take advantage of this if you need it. The charge will be modest.

*Assumes you have followed the instructions on my site and have previously removed the batteries (!!!) and battery pack.​

And, in "Breaking News", here's a quick video I just put together to demonstrate how to do this, including before and after coil position metrics. It turned out pretty well for an hour or two of effort. I hope you enjoy it. :D


The above video uses a 2018M with a SS tip.
 
Last edited:
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