Fiberglass found in Angus Enhanced

[Señor Negro]

I don't think it is fibreglass. It looked and felt odd to me (for fibreglass) when I opened mine up. I think it is actually Ceramic Fibre Insulation. I am not saying it is better, it might be worse according to a quick Google search. I mention it in the interest of accuracy.

It has been said already by Yllvape itself that there is indeed glass fiber insulation in the r/vaporents thread answer they gave 4 days ago:

Hey everyone,

Regarding the Angus Enhanced, the glass fiber insulation is completely separated from the air path, and the air path itself is fully isolated. it will not goes in lungs. and the device is not designed to be disassembled. However, since last year, we have improved the design by fully wrapping this part for better protection, and get rid of this part.

To address any concerns, our team will produce a new batch of replacements, and I’ll be reaching out to retailers about this ASAP to replace the units from the first batch.

The information was there for anyone that's willing to take his time to find it. I did post a capture of that reddit post in one of my coments above, but I guess there was too much to read and my poor formating did not help.

True! We don't need to update information!

If we did not update information we would continue to use, for example, Teflon as a cooking material.

And the 80% of that reddit post is rehash.

You keep deflecting the main point going towards minor details that don't really matter and taking out of context just the parts you want in the interest of ... I don't even want to know to be honest.
I said, literally: "we dont need updated info about the material from users what we really need is more info from Yllvape that so far has avoided giving proper explanations." implying (wheter you want to see it or ignore it) that what we really need is precise information from Yllvape or third party reputable source(s) that can adress in a profesional level every technical detail most(?) of us really want to know. Especially now that we can see how vague Yllvape's lack of communication and transparency has been to this point.
To clarify further what I'm saying I am not referring to just more tear downs but propper standarized procedures like the ISO 13485 validation and part by part chemical analysis of materials some users have been asking for.

Keep "passing the buck" (not sure if that expresion is correct sorry if it's not) and talking about teflon, air conditioned rooms and air paths (you don't suck air directly from those pipes right?) to keep the attention out of the real issue doesn't help anyone but Yllvape who, so far, it's downsiding all allegations making it sound like it's just an "oopsie, we got caught but we can assure you we'll do better".

 

[Andreaerdna]

It has been said already by Yllvape itself that there is indeed glass fiber insulation in the r/vaporents thread answer they gave 4 days ago:

What if the thing we and YLL official call “fiber glass” was not fiber glass but something more harmful?
In this scenario, would YLL be a good reference/authority to clear this point?

 

[Señor Negro]

What if the thing we and YLL official call “fiber glass” was not fiber glass but something more harmful?
In this scenario, would YLL be a good reference/authority to clear this point?

Well, at this poing anything Yllvape has to say should be taken with a ton load sack of salt. Not buying anything from them anymore that's for sure.

All I can say is that the "happy coincidence" that my unit broke with an almost perfect timing for me to notice all this drama makes me as angry and happy at the same time as I have been in a long time.

 

[UnknownEntler]

Well, at this poing anything Yllvape has to say should be taken with a ton load sack of salt. Not buying anything from them anymore that's for sure.

All I can say is that the "happy coincidence" that my unit broke with an almost perfect timing for me to notice all this drama makes me as angry and happy at the same time as I have been in a long time.

Just cross-referencing, my other post... It's not only the AE that has questionable materials and possible significant health hazards...

XMAX Starry 4, Portable Vaporizer

I put balls in the wpa used as a mouthpiece.

fuckcombustion.com

 

[kokolokokolokon]

@Señor Negro

Look, without those studies we wouldn't know the consequences of X materials. Through those studies you can now report the dangers of certain materials.
I'm not deflecting the topic, I'm adding information.
I dont say that it is not important to have that ISO 13485, or that it is not necessary to provide more (and more detailed) explanations from yllvape.
You say that "we don't need information from other users, we need information from yllvape." Well, one thing doesn't take away the other.
Nor does anyone provide information, how can we refute a brand the use of a material? Can we correctly inform users without sharing studies and informing?

We are in the same boat. But you choose to say im “passing the buck” because i used examples or because i wanted to add more info.

Do I help yllvape when i said glass fiber is not good and it should be removed, but it is good to share updated info? Really?

 

[Grass Yes]

It's not in the 3rd version, pictured here: https://ibb.co/Zz1p5d9F and here: https://www.reddit.com/r/MedicalCannabisNZ/comments/1jdpkqf/_/miliizo

If you look at the thread on EE and the updated vaporents posts you can see folks have torn down that version too. There is fiberglass insulation taped to the inner metal tube.

 

[Señor Negro]

@Señor Negro

Look, without those studies we wouldn't know the consequences of X materials. Through those studies you can now report the dangers of certain materials.
I'm not deflecting the topic, I'm adding information.
I dont say that it is not important to have that ISO 13485, or that it is not necessary to provide more (and more detailed) explanations from yllvape.
You say that "we don't need information from other users, we need information from yllvape." Well, one thing doesn't take away the other.
Nor does anyone provide information, how can we refute a brand the use of a material? Can we correctly inform users without sharing studies and informing?

We are in the same boat. But you choose to say im “passing the buck” because i used examples or because i wanted to add more info.

Do I help yllvape when i said glass fiber is not good and it should be removed, but it is good to share updated info? Really?

Talking about teflon does not add any information that's relevant to this topic.
And, by the way, if you dare to "quote" someone please take, at least, the effort of citing the exact words that were used in that quote.

You just keep talking about non related matters and deflecting what's really important here while at the same time complaining about "rehash of rehash" posts. But while you can keep spinning in your personal roundabout for as long as you want, I'm not playing that game and I am certantly not in the same boat as yours.
At this point I'm done with you.

EDIT: Another update I just found:
Verdampftnochmal is also offering refunds for the units sold as an user from Reddit pointed in the vaporents subreddit.

That's at least 3 EU retailers so far if I am correct that are offering refunds and/or bouchers for the AE.

No news about US retailers?

 

[dukes00]

If you look at the thread on EE and the updated vaporents posts you can see folks have torn down that version too. There is fiberglass insulation taped to the inner metal tube.

Can you link/screenshot those? I’ve only seen ones which either have the FG immediately exposed or wrapped up in a bunch of brown tape, not the metal tube like in the post you quote.

 

[kokolokokolokon]

Talking about teflon does not add any information that's relevant to this topic.

The teflon thing was an example of how the info changes overtime cause newer studies. I’m done with you too. Mejora tu comprensión lectora.

 

[zeebudz]

I went to YLL to see if they posted something about the AE. Didn't see anything, but did see a 2-year old post where they provided a full tear down of the regular Angus. Makes the AE fiasco even stranger, as they explicitly state there that

"Its clear to know better about the angus without taking apart your own Angus."

May have been posted here in the past, but here it is: https://yllvape.com/2023/04/08/angus-teardown/

 

[Grass Yes]

Can you link/screenshot those? I’ve only seen ones which either have the FG immediately exposed or wrapped up in a bunch of brown tape, not the metal tube like in the post you quote.

It's easier to see the fiberglass in the video than in the photos, due to the shimmer:

Discord - Group Chat That’s All Fun & Games

Discord is great for playing games and chilling with friends, or even building a worldwide community. Customize your own space to talk, play, and hang out.

discord.com

 

[dukes00]

It's easier to see the fiberglass in the video than in the photos, due to the shimmer:

Discord - Group Chat That’s All Fun & Games

Discord is great for playing games and chilling with friends, or even building a worldwide community. Customize your own space to talk, play, and hang out.

discord.com

Thank you. Ok, so it seems like there’s no “good” batch at all

 

[vapinape]

Just discovered it on YouTube...
Now they even call me stupid.

I don't care... I don't want anything like that in my vaporizer.

Exactly this. Others commenting on this too. Calling out the BS. Thank you all.
His review for the AE is done really well. I know for a fact that video alone convinced a lot of people to pull the trigger. It's exactly how a review should be done... People trust(ed) him.

Of course he has some connection with Yllvape he's had Yllvapes new product the aerolite for a while. And I'm sure he plans to make more videos for it.

He's not Yllvape, yet released a PSA video similar to what the 'downplayers' are talking about here... Like... Fibreglass in household items...

If people are still deflecting/ distracting from the real current concern is only revealing where they stand and will start talking about something new...like Teflon.

Not sure if anyone remembers but there was an hour long live video on BB YT channel where he repaired the AE for a well known vaporist in the community.. video is no longer on his channel.

If it did exist, it proves others outside of Yllvape knew what the inside looks like but did not sound the alarm. (If you know what video I'm referring to, please chime in…because the Yllvape minions surely will, to discredited this)

It's this deception that has made people more cautious...

The whole play is...
Accept that Yllvape were wrong but distance yourself.
Downplay concerns.
Delete anything that might reflect badly and affect future sales and reputation.
Convince all, that issue is fully resolved and that this was the only problem ever...

If anyone struggling to get a full refund from EU or UK please reach out, I can help here. I got my refund 3 weeks ago because I jumped the gun..after alot of back n forth. You can imagine how many people believed me at the time.... My last resort was to open it up to prove my suspicions...thanks to another user who opened it up for cleaning so I didn't have to.. That's why I'm being vocal..

Issue was known for a long time.. they didn't just learn about it this week.

Stop preventing the real conversations that need to take place first.

Thank you for all members who really care about truth and safety and are sharing vital information.

 

[Radwin Bodnic]

It's easier to see the fiberglass in the video than in the photos, due to the shimmer:

Discord - Group Chat That’s All Fun & Games

Discord is great for playing games and chilling with friends, or even building a worldwide community. Customize your own space to talk, play, and hang out.

discord.com

This one looks like taped directly on the heater outer shell...
I thought they added two metal tubes around this heater with the white plastic ring we see on @tom2199 picture closing the gap between the tubes...
Maybe I'm imagining the build differently than what it actually is...

 

[Grass Yes]

This one looks like taped directly on the heater outer shell...
I thought they added two metal tubes around this heater with the white plastic ring we see on @tom2199 picture closing the gap between the tubes...
Maybe I'm imagining the build differently than what it actually is...

That's the inner one. Have a look at that discord link for the full context.

 

[Grass Yes]

While I fully understand why people are upset by this news. I am reminding everyone to follow our rules. The first one is:

Be Nice

All members must be treated in a respectful and adult manner. All members should respect and adhere to the promotion of harmony within the community. Do not attempt to disrupt the community in any way.

I am deleting a couple of posts I feel are over the line, but I'm not handing out points yet. I will hand out points after this, if necessary.

I would also like to preemptively remind about this rule:

Public discussions of staff decisions are not permitted on the site. If you have any concerns or queries relating to a staff decision please take it up in private with a staff member.

 

[vaping herbs]

Is interesting for one or the other

https://www.reddit.com/r/MedicalCannabisNZ/s/Dq5jLYN1ms

 

[UnknownEntler]

Just a couple of questions to the great and allmighty bing:

1) How come you have been the only creator promoting the Aerolite while you claim you are not associated with them in any way?
2) What has led you to the decision to not publish your findings of fiberglass in the AE a year ago, possibly knowingly playing a part in endangering other users?
3) In conclusion—after your findings and the subsequent absence of appropriate measures of YLLVape to fix the issue of the AE—how could you justify with your conscience even promoting YLLVape's next device?

 

[RustyOldNail]

Simple answer…. It’s a PROPAGANDA video…. nothing more.

 

[Cheebsy]

This situation is so funny for me from the outside perspective. (I obviously don't want to think of any of our members being harmed by this situation) I never wanted the original Angus because the intake went through the bulb holder with it's searingly hot brass connectors. The ae was apparently the same as I suspected on that....

Areolite.... That is literally the product name for a very effective glass fiber based thermal insulation used by NASA amongst others...

Google search

I'm sure there's a reason they've chosen to use that name for the next product in line...

For clarity though, aerolite has been used successfully in the vape world. It's inside I've if the industry's past products promoted as exceptionally clean. That is the Evo. Now, that was absolutely and completely out of the air path because the glass bamboo was in one piece, and you could see the intake and output from both ends of the device. All I'm saying is that this isn't a new choice of material. The real question is weather is totally isolated, that's easy to answer when you know the construction of the Evo, less so here....

 

[Shit Snacks]

It's easier to see the fiberglass in the video than in the photos, due to the shimmer:

Discord - Group Chat That’s All Fun & Games

Discord is great for playing games and chilling with friends, or even building a worldwide community. Customize your own space to talk, play, and hang out.

discord.com

Just cross-referencing, my other post... It's not only the AE that has questionable materials and possible significant health hazards...

XMAX Starry 4, Portable Vaporizer

I put balls in the wpa used as a mouthpiece.

fuckcombustion.com

@KeroZen remembers the days of all the flower mate vapes wrapped in so much kaptan? tape as attempted insulation, you could smell and taste and see the result, they would use less and less eventually but other problems of course... Topgreen had similar problems with original xmax etc and then different grades of silicone, they took a lot of feedback and supposedly got better, but vapor quality indications can seem like otherwise? Hard to say, I don't trust much of that session conduction anymore for a variety of other reasons now, but even the more hybrid convection models could still be cause for concern? I think those are more freely cracked open and shared the details is more available but still individual material compositions etc I don't know especially as they might (not) hold up over time?? I think there are other old threads discussing these concerns, they do feel a little separate from this one, although there is some overlap of course.

It's this deception that has made people more cautious...

how could you justify with your conscience even promoting YLLVape's next device?

Exactly, I think the justification, is largely financial? ish benefits

Even with the examples above there are always people who have their own experience and opinions, want to defend for a variety of reasons: Yes supporting the company, because you feel they were good to you, and you want them to succeed remain operational etc. Also the ego of sharing your own opinion, which could be valuable to others if they agree, to help them make a decision... Sometimes that could be a little selfless perhaps although difficult to know for sure?... Another potential reason could be the cognitive dissonance, if they don't do this, then they can't be happy using the device themselves perhaps they need to convince others in order to convince themselves???

Regardless of these theories lol I knew there was something off about that BB person, that video is like outrageously exemplative.

Benefit of the doubt would be to presume people want the vape they like to continue availability, but when you go so hard, and the way you frame what you do, can suggest other motivation... Maybe it is personal, they are friends?? That drives passion too

This situation is so funny for me from the outside perspective

Yeah most of what I get out of this is entertainment personally, although I do care about others health, I was able to make my decision previously. Comes down to trust of company and their design, build quality, all practices etc. The vibe and the background?

I don't honestly care as much about the material debate or if it was used well enough, in my mind they never had the trust to consistently produce them well, even if the design felt like a good idea (which it did not, to me) but yeah it is also what helped me realize more of a distaste for session devices (getting Solo3 afterwards was a much better experience reminding me what can be good about them, although I have other reservations, mainly using different types of product almost exclusively now)

 

[Cheebsy]

although I do care about others health

Your absolutely correct in this. I omitted this originally but have edited my post accordingly.

 

[KeroZen]

@Shit Snacks: Actually this thread made me remember that we did see some suspicious cotton-like fibrous insulation wrapped inside kapton tape in some of these old conduction vapes. I vaguely recall wondering if it was some kind of rockwool but it might well have been glass fiber too...

We did test a lot of Chinese craps back then... Much later I was still sent some X-vape units for review/testing, and after smelling the same kind of disgusting off smells inside them and seeing it wasn't going away after a couple battery discharges worth of burn-offs, I just gave up and never reviewed them...

My lungs, or rather what's left of them, are too precious for this kind of shit. These Asian companies seem to never learn and they have no clue. I believe they don't even have access to greens to put inside their devices, prohibition being so strong in those areas of the world...

 

[Shit Snacks]

@Shit Snacks: Actually this thread made me remember that we did see some suspicious cotton-like fibrous insulation wrapped inside kapton tape in some of these old conduction vapes. I vaguely recall wondering if it was some kind of rockwool but it might well have been glass fiber too...

Right! I thought it did look kind of familiar, there are so many varieties of what these materials could ultimately be, but regardless they don't feel like things we want there?

We did test a lot of Chinese craps back then... Much later I was still sent some X-vape units for review/testing, and after smelling the same kind of disgusting off smells inside them and seeing it wasn't going away after a couple battery discharges worth of burn-offs, I just gave up and never reviewed them...

Yeah they stopped asking me eventually, I did make it clear I began distaste for them, because I found better options. Wasn't it liberating to move on from the free testing world of these cheap mass-produced things? There was just no reason to risk really, others I consider to offer less risk, still have some of course this is all relative.

My lungs, or rather what's left of them, are too precious for this kind of shit. These Asian companies seem to never learn and they have no clue. I believe they don't even have access to greens to put inside their devices, prohibition being so strong in those areas of the world...

Yeah so not to say they can't do a good job or with the right partners etc, but there is a lot against them there are so many negative examples. It is true they can't use the herb we love, I've seen another imo very unscrupulous company that engages in knock-offs, now making their own more original designs that influencers seem to be promoting despite unclear availability? They were using tobacco, which sure is still a form of testing and could be indicative, maybe that's enough to make something like a vaporizer that can be effective and healthy, to use with other herbs (even though we know the sticky icky is a bit more complex! resulting in many potential issues) but point being it comes down to, who do you trust and why? What is really important...

 

[vapinape]

Just a couple of questions to the great and allmighty bing:

1) How come you have been the only creator promoting the Aerolite while you claim you are not associated with them in any way?
2) What has led you to the decision to not publish your findings of fiberglass in the AE a year ago, possibly knowingly playing a part in endangering other users?
3) In conclusion—after your findings and the subsequent absence of appropriate measures of YLLVape to fix the issue of the AE—how could you justify with your conscience even promoting YLLVape's next device?

Great questions that need to be answered. Hope he comes back here to post the answers... If not the silence is loud enough.
Glad bing admitted earlier today that he informed Mike (CEO of Yllvape) about the discovery of FG in the AE over a year ago. He provided a date and mentioned he has receipts.
I had my suspicions but bing confirming it here helps.

Hope highlighting this doesn't break any FC rules.