Discontinued The Persei Vaporizer for herbs and concentrates.

[OF]

@OF

Sorry OF I have my proof.

Currently the Only Grade 2 Ti capable vape out there is the Omicron with HVD Tops, the Persei, TET's older units, some mods that can handle it but i cant think of any but no ego's. Because of the high current required to run A GRADE 2 Ti. This should tell you what currents are needed to run the coils.

Proof enough?

Cool. No need to apologize for having proof of what you say. That's a good thing. I'll be interested to see what it is.

I assume that's not your proof that follows, didn't we just establish that 'Watts is Watts' and for a given voltage it depends on resistance and doesn't matter what the heater material is. Ohm's law neither knows nor cares?

Didn't we just agree resistance changes would be compensated with gauge and 'turn count' (length) changes?

I hope that wasn't it, I sure see no proof there. In post 14087 you proposed a 'which gets hotter' question pointed this way I think? I answered 'neither, same power, same heat' in response which you didn't comment on......are you now disagreeing with that answer?

"Which weighs more, a pound of feathers or a pound of rocks?"

OF

 

[THC SCIENTIFIC]

Cool. No need to apologize for having proof of what you say. That's a good thing. I'll be interested to see what it is.

I assume that's not your proof that follows, didn't we just establish that 'Watts is Watts' and for a given voltage it depends on resistance and doesn't matter what the heater material is. Ohm's law neither knows nor cares?

Didn't we just agree resistance changes would be compensated with gauge and 'turn count' (length) changes?

I hope that wasn't it, I sure see no proof there. In post 14087 you proposed a 'which gets hotter' question pointed this way I think? I answered 'neither, same power, same heat' in response which you didn't comment on......are you now disagreeing with that answer?

"Which weighs more, a pound of feathers or a pound of rocks?"

OF

@OF you are mistaken.

7 watts reacts differently with grade 5 then it does with grade 2.

Maybe we should understand the fact that yes a watt is a watt but given in two different situations it acts differently.

Just like the fact a 64 Mustang is the same in dry conditions and wet conditions. Doesn't mean it will drive the same. It just doesn't have traction in wet conditions.

Your assumption that grade 2 and 5 have the same properties is what's causing your assumption that ego based power cells can drive a Ti grade 2.

 

[OF]

7 watts reacts differently with grade 5 then it does with grade 2.

Your assumption that grade 2 and 5 react the same is what's causing your assumption that ego based power cells can drive a Ti grade 2.

Why? On what physical property or process do you base this?

It would be interesting if you've uncovered a flaw in Thermodynamics, but until then.....

This says if the heat input is the same (which it is, right?) the equilibrium temperature is set by heat loss. Are you saying grade 5 losses are so much greater than grade 2 that so much extra power is needed to make the same temperature that 5 Watt supplies can't cut it? That makes no sense to me, either. One of the references I gave said:

"The titanium alloys generally have even lower thermal conductivities than the commercially pure material."

That says grade 5 losses here will be less, not more. All else being equal, grade 2 will be colder for that reason, calling for more power to make the same temperature.

I'm not ready to accept it can't be done, I know a guy who's constantly reminding us he's done things others say couldn't be done.......

What different property of grade 5 do you say accounts for this? I think we decided it's not resistivity of the material a while back when I pointed out that grade 5 lies between grade 2 (which you say works) and Nichrome (which seems to work)?

It's not making sense to me, but in the end it has to.....the rules are pretty simple and dependable.

OF

 

[THC SCIENTIFIC]

Yes the rules are dependable OF but your lack of knowledge on Ti is only based on scripture.

The fact the Ti grade 5 needs less power to reach the same temperature because of its alloy status is what sets it apart.


Ti grade 2 however is an unalloy. This Ti grade requires a lot more power to reach the same temperatures as a nichrome and Inconel or even a to grade 5. Something a ego can't deliver. That's what sets it apart. That's why anyone running a ego platform can't do it.

 

[Mynameismud]

Thanks! I wish this forum had a favorites option. So .02 to .03 buffer and then a like sized load to vape. a week sounds good, I am currently going through less than .5 a week with other tools.

Do you note after it cools down and you come back to it does it need any re-priming?

Do you have to re-load the buffer when re-loading after 3 to 7 days?

TIA

Sorry been busy, didnt check up to see if anyone answered but ill answer again in case no one has.

A) Yes, 0.2-0.3 buffer followed by another 0.2-0.3 to vape. Light use (once a day) will last me a week possibly more, Normal usage will get me about 2-4 days on average before i need to reload..
B) yes again, if i let it sit for more then a couple minutes i press the button and puff like a cigar until i see vapor (same process for loading) then i start to inhale (maybe about 5ish seconds before i start seeing vapor)
C) reloading depends on how heavy you use it. If you really go at it hard and the entire inside looks dry as a bone youll probably need to reload the buffer, otherwise just topping it off usually works for me...when i start seeing whispy hits i know its time to reload or top off...(im not sure but im assuming the people having problems with whispy hits and the black rod may not be loading enough and/or dont have the technique quite down right)

 

[OF]

Yes the rules are dependable OF but your lack of knowledge on Ti is only based on scripture.

Great. Please educate me. How is the "scripture" I was raised on wrong? Why does this one material behave differently than all the rest?

From the book, specific heat (the amount of heat energy you have to put into a material to get a given increase in temperature) is basically identical for all grades, so that can't be it. This says 'for XX Watts you get YY degrees' and takes the material into account.

Why can't this be done?

TIA

OF

 

[kindbeats]

Hey everyone, welcome to the titanium and thermodynamics thread.

In the last few days, I've learned more about the properties of titanium and the art of debating than I have about the Persei. Can you guys please drop this conversation until G discloses his "evidence", because the only thing you guys are currently achieving by going back and forth is driving readers and followers away. Seriously, it's really old now. No matter who is right or wrong in this situation, the truth is that nobody comes into this thread to learn about thermodynamics or to watch two grown men argue. Just drop it or take it up in another thread.

Also, stating the forum rules again isn't going to change the fact that you're simply pushing tons of readers away. Is it really worth it? Sometimes, it's just better to be the bigger man and know when to walk away from a situation.

 

[nao12000]

Hey guys
I wanted to update you on orders. We are running a few days out on shipping with the holidays approaching and the new items coming in its been a bit overwhelming. Please if your concerned about an order or warranty repair please call in to office so that we can give you an accurate timeline.
Also one of our shipping guys broke his hand so that has just added to the issue.
Thanks for your continued support !
Naomi

 

[OF]

Can you guys please drop this conversation until G discloses his "evidence", because the only thing you guys are currently achieving by going back and forth is driving readers and followers away.

Is it really worth it? Sometimes, it's just better to be the bigger man and know when to walk away from a situation.

I get it that most guys are bored, I for sure don't come here to relive Material Science. I'd go to a different forum if that was the case.

However, I'm not 'starting this'. Please check, in every case I'm responding to what I see as misinformation. That, I think, is exactly proper here. Posts that start out 'my product is better than all the rest because......' invite such questions and once this 'bully pulpit' is used for such claims moving 'the other side' into some dark corner is not right I believe.

At any point in time I'm happy to await future announcements, and have said so. And done so. So far, another post asking me questions or raising different issue follow. I then respond to that. Absent direction from the Mods, I intend to politely respond as intelligently as I can to what I see as misinformation as it's presented.

Apologies to those not interested of course, I hope it's not too much trouble for you to ignore my posts......which I point out are getting some 'likes'.......

OF

 

[THC SCIENTIFIC]

@OF go ahead and contest magical temp controllers. Leave building vapes to professionals you know the guys that actually build em and test them and have physical proof. Not just numbers on a website or a book.

I'm done with none stop contesting of my facts with your own "facts" that have no testing to back it up.

No ego has temp controller and no ego can run a ti grade 2 simple as that.

 

[Sleepin in CA]

Just found the ignore feature, ah sanity has returned to the thread at long last! Lol

 

[OF]

No ego has temp controller and no ego can run a ti grade 2 simple as that.

Please drop the 'no ego has a temperature control' bit, we've beat that to death, I never said that, even though you repeat it over and over. You branded the Dabbler 'an ego battery', not me. Or them. The claim of temperature control is theirs.....and they also say 'it's not a normal e-cig supply' (you need to use theirs to get the control).

You claim that because the egg the goose is sitting on looks like a chicken egg it's going to hatch a chicken? It only looks like an ego supply I think (it's actually about 1/4 inch longer than my equivalent ego T, there could be other stuff in there?).

I'm happy to wait out the mystery about why nobody else can make a grade 2 vape, I just don't see any of the explanations you've offered to square with established science and engineering. Something is missing from the discussion or we need to rethink a whole lot of science.

Time will tell.

OF

 

[PhotoRider]

Well, there is always a high road. Justification is one thing, but being dogmatic and behaving like there than more than meets the eye aka agenda isn't a high road.

The more this goes, the less the words are respected because the motives are questioned.

I just don't see the big deal to go around and around on this, neither side has provided anything of value really.
You are welcome to continue all you want, but don't be surprised if people lose respect for you for being dogmatic and care more about being right than anything.

 

[kindbeats]

However, I'm not 'starting this'.

Maybe not, but you sure as hell aren't doing anything to end it. Just because you are provoked doesn't mean you HAVE to respond. When it's obvious that two people aren't going change the other's mind through arguing, agree to disagree and move along until evidence or proof is presented. Simply stop responding. There are tons of other companies stating that their product is brand new and the best thing on the market, making claims that are obvious bullshit. Maybe bring your crusade over to some of those threads?

Apologies to those not interested of course, I hope it's not too much trouble for you to ignore my posts......which I point out are getting some 'likes'.......

"Those not interested"? That would be just about everyone here except you and G. Also, if "likes" matter, I guess the 12 likes my one post on this topic got should sum things up pretty well, no?

Simply put, it's gotten old and neither of you are doing anything positive for this thread at the moment.

 

[PhotoRider]

Maybe not, but you sure as hell aren't doing anything to end it. Just because you are provoked doesn't mean you HAVE to respond. When it's obvious that two people aren't going change the other's mind through arguing, agree to disagree and move along until evidence or proof is presented. Simply stop responding. There are tons of other companies stating that their product is brand new and the best thing on the market, making claims that are obvious bullshit. Maybe bring your crusade over to some of those threads?



"Those not interested"? That would be just about everyone here except you and G. Also, if "likes" matter, I guess the 10 likes my one post on this topic got should sum things up pretty well, no?

Simply put, it's gotten old and neither of you are doing anything positive for this thread at the moment.

Well said @kindbeats

I understand G's POV and OF's, I also understand G's mission to market their product they put their blood, sweat and tears into. I also understand OF's reaction if he doesn't not agree. However, what I don't understand why drive it into the ground. I wouldn't expect G stop defending his position. He went on record here and will continue to support it. He doesn't travel into other MFG threads and state things negative - at least from what I have seen.

However @OF you seem never to drop it. Like you are a self appointed judge/jury, must keep G 100% honest and drive it into the drown until he gives. Do you do that on every thread if the MFG states a marketing spin? I have not seen that, in fact somewhat the opposite behavior.

Its very evident you seem to have an agenda here, like its personal - similar to the Blazing Dog event, but not near that bad. I think you are 100% civil and respectful. No issue there. What I don't understand is the burr in your blanket on this. It just seems its more that you disagree with the statement. From a third party watching and reading this it looks like there is something more to it. Don't know and I will not speculate. I could be completely off base also.

Once there is no more real data to present why tit for tat it into the ground?
A reasonable conclusion is to agree to disagree and move on. I really don't expect G to stop defending his position, its his lively hood. What I don't understand what do you have to gain here? Informing the FC membership G is full of it? Because I see no data here. It simply just digressing. A technical person who bases their judgments on data could see there is nothing more here and move on until something is.

Peace guys (and gals too), do a big dab on me. Life is good...

 

[vape4health]

Peace guys (and gals too), do a big dab on me. Life is good...

Why, what grade are you.
Sr-71

 

[Silver420Surfer]

Spot...fucking....on.

@PhotoRider ---Excellent assessment of the situation. I have been trying to express some of those points for awhile now, but your composition summed up everything in a succint and professional manner that I never could. Kudos to kindbeats as well.
Hopefully this can be respected, and we can keep mods from closing our thread down again, athough it was rather brief.

I love the Persei and Herc talk. I get tips and tricks from all you guys and gals. We get to help people who need help. The Core has been released and more talk of the other stuff than about a super cool product that I hope to get my hands on soon.
How about the fixes for the tops? or Updates on the Iris? Links to your last Podcast you mentioned, that you still haven't given a link for?

Time to bring out all your Persei baggage again people!!


###Mods I did not bring up the closing of the thread to be negative about it. I wasn't trying to discuss it, but just mention it###

 

[PhotoRider]

Why, what grade are you.
Sr-71

4th grade, after 10 years as a third grader, I finally made the mark and was advanced to the forth grade.

This was a big success for me since it took me 18 years to get past second grade. Man can't wait to get to fifth grade!
what grade are you in?

 

[vape4health]

4th grade, after 10 years as a third grader, I finally made the mark and was advanced to the forth grade.

This was a big success for me since it took me 18 years to get past second grade. Man can't wait to get to fifth grade!
what grade are you in?

The train will arrive at 3:12pm?
Or
The color blue.

 

[PhotoRider]

The train will arrive at 3:12pm?
Or
The color blue.

I must be over medicated because I thought the bus came at 3:12PM and the train swung by at 4:24PM. Only the buses are blue, the train is a slime color normally.

 

[OF]

Maybe not, but you sure as hell aren't doing anything to end it. Just because you are provoked doesn't mean you HAVE to respond. Simply stop responding.

There are tons of other companies stating that their product is brand new and the best thing on the market, making claims that are obvious bullshit. Maybe bring your crusade over to some of those threads?

Thanks for the advice, seriously. Do you have the same for G?

For now, I'll respond to questions asked of me, to not do so is just not polite. Nobody likes to be ignored I think?

I guess you haven't been reading the other forums carefully enough, I've had similar issues with Iolite, Magic Flight, Dabbler, Liquidizer and Thermo Vape (to name the ones that come to mind). Needless to say they all went much better......draw from that what you will.

Do you do that on every thread if the MFG states a marketing spin? I have not seen that, in fact somewhat the opposite behavior.

Its very evident you seem to have an agenda here, like its personal - similar to the Blazing Dog event, but not near that bad.

Yes, as I just said, I do indeed speak my mind when I see things that I don't agree with. On this and several other threads I 'haunt'. Sorry you missed that, but it's true. I 'call them like I see them' I think. I try to be honest and fair, no doubt failing sometimes. Check for instance:
http://fuckcombustion.com/threads/vapor-brothers-dabbler.8595/#post-357043

You have brought up this 'hidden agenda' idea before, I'm still not sold on it. I make no profit from my efforts here. Very very few know who I am by intent. You know it might just be possible I'm really in it to help other Members out with reliable information?

Thanks for understanding things from my side, to the extent you do. It's appreciated.

OF

 

[ataxian]

Nobody likes to be ignored I think?
OF

I found a lighter in potted plant out side!
2 years later and it still works.
These are for loading shatter into carts!


What are you guy's VAKING tonight?
SHATTER'S not bad!

 

[PhotoRider]

Thanks for the advice, seriously. Do you have the same for G?

For now, I'll respond to questions asked of me, to not do so is just not polite. Nobody likes to be ignored I think?

I guess you haven't been reading the other forums carefully enough, I've had similar issues with Iolite, Magic Flight, Dabbler, Liquidizer and Thermo Vape (to name the ones that come to mind). Needless to say they all went much better......draw from that what you will.



Yes, as I just said, I do indeed speak my mind when I see things that I don't agree with. On this and several other threads I 'haunt'. Sorry you missed that, but it's true. I 'call them like I see them' I think. I try to be honest and fair, no doubt failing sometimes. Check for instance:
http://fuckcombustion.com/threads/vapor-brothers-dabbler.8595/#post-357043

You have brought up this 'hidden agenda' idea before, I'm still not sold on it. I make no profit from my efforts here. Very very few know who I am by intent. You know it might just be possible I'm really in it to help other Members out with reliable information?

Thanks for understanding things from my side, to the extent you do. It's appreciated.

OF

Same here @OF, I was respectful and civil. I also thank you for partially understanding my POV to the extend you do. Also, my comments are accurate from what I have seen, but I accept that you have shown other threads like this. However, we agree to disagree about the agenda. Your behavior clearly shows this to me. You do not take a high road at least from what I see. That means to me its personal to you. You can disagree, that's your right, but it does change the situation I see. I question your objectivity here. Keep in mind I have no vested interest here, a third party watching this over and over and over and over behaving like this. Don't get me wrong, there are many great things from you and you provide much benefit to the membership. But for some reason this dogma happens.

I don't expect you to see it I guess. It is what it is. Turning the other cheek seems to be outside you capability from the behavior I see. It extremely important for you to be 100% right, prove it to everyone, and never back down. I have no idea why and I expect you will disagree, but what is my agenda? Why do I see this, am I foolish, have something against you or ? Could my POV have some validity to it?

Finally, I do except I'm not 100% right here. I don't expect to be, continual improvement. I am sure I am filtering through my own experience and emotions aka my thoughts are skewed. I'm trying

 

[Silver420Surfer]

OF---That was the only post in the Dabbler thread where you challenged them. Your very next post in that thread is this:
"Thanks for your response, we obviously disagree some here. That's not uncommon of course, but we've each stated our opinion. I see lots of stretching of terms to avoid 'hot button' issues (like dancing around what's glass and what's fibers), the bottom line is I still think we have silica glass fibers. They are glass and almost all glass is silica (AlO2) based, ground quartz typically. I understand wanting to avoid using the terms silica, fiber and so on but think they're valid in this case. Just my opinion, others can have theirs. The background is easy to find on the web for those who care.

Likewise, I understand the idea of temperature sensing you suggest, have used it (resistance change to determine temperature) for copper coils and the like over the years. Never seen any a working example for something like this. It's, of course, a very easy thing to test (although I don't feel inclined to buy one just to do so.....).

Once 'spin' on technical terms for marketing advantage (what I call 'hype') raises it's head it's hard to get past, at least for me. No doubt about it, 'controlled temperature' and 'silica and fiber glass free' are sales advantages.

You have a good reputation, no doubt well earned. That fits with my tendency to take folks at their word. I'm simply calling them as I see them and giving my reasons for doing so. How seriously that should be considered folks can decide for themselves. In general, it's a very good thing new products are entering the market, in that I wish you well.

Thanks again for the response. Today folks have even more information to base decisions on, or at least to consider if they choose."


Hardly argumentative like on here with THC. You stated your opinion, VB, their's and done. I see no more questioning of a product you were so skeptical about previously. THAT, may be why it appears that there is an agenda. Profit is not the only reason for having an agenda. I, not as politely as Photorider, believe I was the first one here to publicly question your motives or agenda. Now more members, who were not vocal at that time, are beginning to as well. You have given "far" more leeway to VB's product in regards to critique of materials than you have to THC and W9Tech. Why?

Again, when VB refuted the silica claims, you accepted that you both disagree and left it alone, as evidenced by the above post, which immediately followed VB's rebuttal.

Why not do the same with THC? Agree to disagree.




@ataxian---
"You are a madman! When you stole that cow and you're friend started making it with the cow. I wanna party with you cowboy."

 

[Silver420Surfer]

please delete
sorry dp'ed

(giggle)