Hi Stu, I too wonder the same thing. My friend has one, they look the same3 bad units in a row? With that kind of luck, I wouldn't be booking any flights soon.
Are you sure the store is selling legit units? Seems like pretty long odds to have 3 units fail like that.
Can you post a pic or video of the unit?
Davinci by Karma
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OF
Well-Known Member
I'm with Brother Stu here, that would be a pretty shortsighted thing to do IMO. Nasty downside if someone sent it back to the maker.....
OTOH, I note this from the OP, "Picked up another new unit, which by the way came in a box that wouldn't close completely." I doubt such a box would have left the factory, someone was probably into it before you? What do you think of the chances you've somehow gotten into a pile of reject units that got mixed in with new?
Otherwise, Stu raises a good point. 3 such flat out failures in a forum with some people with smell, low battery life and similar problems amongst a larger bunch of happy campers makes me want to stand somewhere away from you when thunder storms are near by.......
I'd be looking for some answers, too. Good luck, sounds to me like you're about due?
OF
My friends unit worked pretty well. I will take a video & upload it shortly. I am so bummed, all I want to do is; not combust. What really turns me off is the companies customer service. In a prior post, the guy from Karma was saying that they hired a shipping/cust service rep. Wonder how that's working out for them? Bcuz, it sure doesn't appear to be working for the consumer.Sorry, I missed this part. How does your friend's unit perform?
Agreed my friend, his post made me laugh when I saw that.
I mean come on guys, how many of you here HONESTLY think that whatever is causing the mystery vapor can be any worse for you than what you inhale when you smoke a blunt (this is directed to those of you that still smoke and aren't strictly vapers).
I personally smoke blunts fairly regularly, I'm not TOO bothered by the mystery vapor (although after a thorough cleaning last night and 5 more burn off runs, it's still producing it, although it's much harder to see now). However, just for the sake of my health in case, I pm'ed the DV rep here on the site to see what they can do for me.
I dunno if there's anything they can actually do though seeing as I'd have to ship it through US customs and it's been used now :s
OF,
Since you say you've read the entire thread, I suppose you have seen that I have mixed feelings about this vaporizer. I did experience some of the mystery vapors (I actually exhaled the buggers) during the initial burn-in cycles that I did prior to loading the unit. However since I do much worse things to my body on a daily basis - yeah, I still can't kick the cigs - the mystery vapors didn't really bother me and I soldiered on and began using it.
Now that you've soldiered through the mystery vapor, is it still there after you do a cleaning? I wonder because I can't decide whether I want to convince myself it's gonna go away or not...
What's the technique for getting big clouds of vapor off this? I find I almost have to do an MFLB-speed draw to get better clouds than I was getting with my LB but people were saying a simple slow'ish suck (like 10-15 second hits) would produce them but when I do that I seem to be getting no visible vapor.
I as well doubt they would be selling grey market goods. However, the first DV I purchased had a seal that I needed to slice before I could open the box. Where as the box would not close completely & there was no seal on the one I was given in exchange. Oh how I hate returning things once, now twice
I haven't had good luck with mine so far. first one was doa batteries. sent back. second one off gassed for an hour before I even used it. The batteries take over 8 hours to charge fully. On a full charge I can barely barely get 4 full sessions (the 10 minute timer session.) and I only vape at 375. I seen other people post about getting 9 sessions? I call bull on that, there is no way people are getting 9 sessions with this device. Does it sound like I have a defective device or is this par with other people's devices?
The plastic taste did go away eventually after a few bowls but this offgassing thing has got me worried and I'm not too enthused about having battery issues on both new units I got. Overall a bad experience for me and I have to give it a thumbs down, sorry. I pretty much lost $250 that could have been spent on other portables with a longer and more positive track record.
It really really bugs me that the company rep isn't directly addressing this. It's been months of complaints of offgassing and still not explanation of what causes it aside from resin from use (which doesn't explain offgassing when new). I see a lot of beating around the bush. I don't like this. It shouldn't matter that this only happens to a small percentage of devices... what about the medical patients who use this device and don't check forums like we do, they have no idea that they are puffing from a device with potential offgassing. If one person inhales a lungful of the offgas by accident or unknowingly that is of PARAMOUNT concern.
Come clean about the offgassing, the more you stall and beat around the bush, the more anxiety about your product you create. Since it is gassing at 410F+ who's to say it doesn't offgass invisible vapors at 375F? Do I want to risk getting cancer AGAIN over vaping off of some $250 portable? hell no! and that is why people are angry and want answers including me!!
Since I don't plan to use my DV anymore I will split it apart and find out what the hell is offgassing once and for all and post up pics of any melted or deformed areas I find...
The plastic taste did go away eventually after a few bowls but this offgassing thing has got me worried and I'm not too enthused about having battery issues on both new units I got. Overall a bad experience for me and I have to give it a thumbs down, sorry. I pretty much lost $250 that could have been spent on other portables with a longer and more positive track record.
It really really bugs me that the company rep isn't directly addressing this. It's been months of complaints of offgassing and still not explanation of what causes it aside from resin from use (which doesn't explain offgassing when new). I see a lot of beating around the bush. I don't like this. It shouldn't matter that this only happens to a small percentage of devices... what about the medical patients who use this device and don't check forums like we do, they have no idea that they are puffing from a device with potential offgassing. If one person inhales a lungful of the offgas by accident or unknowingly that is of PARAMOUNT concern.
Come clean about the offgassing, the more you stall and beat around the bush, the more anxiety about your product you create. Since it is gassing at 410F+ who's to say it doesn't offgass invisible vapors at 375F? Do I want to risk getting cancer AGAIN over vaping off of some $250 portable? hell no! and that is why people are angry and want answers including me!!
Since I don't plan to use my DV anymore I will split it apart and find out what the hell is offgassing once and for all and post up pics of any melted or deformed areas I find...
GReYAReA
Amid The Vapors...
Not trying to stir the pot at all, but in response to "how bad can it be?", I believe plastic fumes can be very toxic to inhale if exposure is high enough. It can damage or scar the tissues on contact. Remember that kid that destroyed his lungs smoking out of a Pez dispenser? Not quite the same thing, I know, but... I don't know the toxic difference exactly, and I'm sure the type of plastic matters too... but I'd smoke a tobacco plant over melting plastic wires any day of the week! To me, any plastic vapor is a fatal flaw for a vaporizer, which I view as a health or medical device.
Before I buy again (which I would) I'd want to know:
1) the problem was identified by DV. Not "if you have problems send it back". Something conclusive like "we found the undercoating on some of the heater wires was not set properly..... or used the wrong material...."
and
2) the problem was fixed.
Pretending the problem doesn't exist or is too rare to care about only looks worse IMO. It seems to imply DV has NOT identified it, or if they have, do not want to admit it for fear it will hurt sales. I'm sure that is not the case, but they need to tell us!
Before I buy again (which I would) I'd want to know:
1) the problem was identified by DV. Not "if you have problems send it back". Something conclusive like "we found the undercoating on some of the heater wires was not set properly..... or used the wrong material...."
and
2) the problem was fixed.
Pretending the problem doesn't exist or is too rare to care about only looks worse IMO. It seems to imply DV has NOT identified it, or if they have, do not want to admit it for fear it will hurt sales. I'm sure that is not the case, but they need to tell us!
kushcabbage
vapor nerd
and apparently i'm the only one who's whole chamber has gone from white to deep brown? I consider something like this a manufacturing defect to have our white plastic go to a different color. That sounds to me like a chemical or heat reaction.
that is wierd, and you tried swabbing with iso to make sure it's not resin? that would concern me too.
kushcabbage
vapor nerd
yes sir, the plastic has been yellowing/browning after continuous use. Not stained, but the area underneath if you pick it away with a wax carving tool, was still brown underneath. Not sure it's noticeable in the black/grey units. Or how far the heating reaction penetrates where we can't see.. I hope I never see it again though wish I had a picture. I returned mine for inspection to karma.
I think the thing that bothers me most about these new vape units is that there is no option for a refund should they end up being unsatisfactory like this unit. Lesson learned, wait a few months before purchasing new vapes. I will take this lesson to the Pax, I really wanted to get the pax on launch date but I'm going to wait to see how others like it before taking the plunge this time. Can't really blame a consumer for being excited about a product due to false claims and hype by the manufacturer.
I wish there was more accountability in this industry. It also makes me wonder how safe are all other vapes out there? How do we know that they are safe to use? I doubt anyone has done any kind of analyzation of the clouds coming out of these devices. wouldn't it be interesting if popular models did end up producing invisible plasticizer vapors... just saying, there isn't enough oversight on these types of products and it really should be a device that gets approved by the FDA before you can sell it in a medical state/community
I wish there was more accountability in this industry. It also makes me wonder how safe are all other vapes out there? How do we know that they are safe to use? I doubt anyone has done any kind of analyzation of the clouds coming out of these devices. wouldn't it be interesting if popular models did end up producing invisible plasticizer vapors... just saying, there isn't enough oversight on these types of products and it really should be a device that gets approved by the FDA before you can sell it in a medical state/community
GReYAReA
Amid The Vapors...
The Volcano has such testing, but I think it is the only device. Such analysis would be good for all vaporizers, for certain. Absent that, I try to use some common sense. Follow the pathway of hot air. At any point, does it contact material(s) that might seem questionable? I wouldn't want to see this air mingling with any electronics, low temperature plastics, etc.
I'm extra cautious for sure. I'm probably also older than many of you, and perhaps much more focused on things like health, aging, and toxic exposure.
I'm extra cautious for sure. I'm probably also older than many of you, and perhaps much more focused on things like health, aging, and toxic exposure.
OF
Well-Known Member
I forget what this is called, but it's not logical. Just because the guy across the street beat his wife doesn't mean all husbands are wife beaters. As you so rightly point out, details matter.
Consider darn near every (tobacco) pipe made has plastic in it. I don't recall that ever being an issue. There are appropriate plastic materials available, or don't you trust TV and Iolite?
I see no evidence whatever they're "pretending the problem doesn't exist", or that they don't care. And I certainly see no grounds at all to even suggest they know there's a health issue they're sitting on.....especially if you're "sure that's not the case". If you're sure there isn't and are not trying to stir stuff up, just why say that.....in any color?
I get it you want a refund, was that part of the deal when you bought it? It was a contract you know, it gave you rights of return or did not. You agreed to the terms up front. It's the way it works. If you return it for refund, they have to scrap it out (taking a loss), right? I'm glad it's a "Lesson learned", I hope your concerns turn out to be unfounded (for a lot of reasons) and it doesn't end up being an expensive lesson.
I see no evidence at all of "false claims and hype by the manufacturer", on what do you base this charge?
I understand your opinion that regulations and oversight are needed, many will differ of course for a number of reasons. But that too is an opinion. I'd like to point out, this is NOT a medical device, nobody ever made that claim. And I, for one, would be dead set against added restrictions on my state simply because of our legal MMJ status.....why should it be banned or restricted to me, with a Doctor's recommendation in hand, over a recreational user elsewhere?
I understand the concerns, guys, but this really is speculation. Mixed with kind of a scary assumption that something evil is up. I suggest those so concerned avoid this product, although I'd be hard pressed to suggest a guaranteed 'safe vape' except maybe Eubie. No, wait, that might use a butane lighter.....
While I'm big on educated guesses and speculation, I'm suggesting we keep it between the ditches until we have some facts to work with? Either trust the man or not, but don't call him names until you can back it up?
Thanks for listening.
OF
I agree with OF, however, the manufacturer did mention having test results for
material integrity. Seems like it has been awhile since that issue was brought up.
If the Davinci folks were to follow up on this claim, I am sure it would do much to
assuage the "hidden dangers". I use my Davinci 2, 3 times daily, never checked for
offgassing. It would definitely be of concern if there are potential health impacts.
I mean no slander, just another consumer looking for a little customer support.
material integrity. Seems like it has been awhile since that issue was brought up.
If the Davinci folks were to follow up on this claim, I am sure it would do much to
assuage the "hidden dangers". I use my Davinci 2, 3 times daily, never checked for
offgassing. It would definitely be of concern if there are potential health impacts.
I mean no slander, just another consumer looking for a little customer support.
OF
Well-Known Member
Thanks for the the 'vote of confidence', I agree with you that we'd all like to know as much as possible. Safety related information more so?
I recall DV saying they 'were in testing', but I sure don't recall hearing the tests were done (or being the geek type I'd be asking.....). I assume it's for approval in Europe? Sure not needed here. I've no idea what's involved in such testing, but I have participated in UL and Coast Guard (life critical maritime gear) testing and I can assure you that testing was neither simple or fast. Perhaps this is the delay?
It's always possible they do in fact know there's a problem and are trying to make some money quick before 'heading south', but I highly doubt it. While it's happened in the recent past in China, they've executed a few folks for just that lately.....word like that tends to get around and brutal as it is by our standards is generally fairly good at getting compliance. Put another way, if I was going to pull a stunt like that I'd much rather be here (or most anywhere else) than there.
I've worked Customer Service in a few places over the years, it's never easy in my experience, but I also think for now these guys are doing a credible job. We all expect the benefit of the doubt, perhaps it's time to consider extending that courtesy as well? You know, start out thinking they are being honorable? Give the facts some time to be known?
Thanks again.
OF
GReYAReA
Amid The Vapors...
I think you misunderstand me OF. I am not saying that some plastics aren't safe with heat, nor that I am certain the DV is harmful like a burning Pez dispenser.
I do believe some units are off-gassing "something". People are sending these defective units back, but we haven't heard anything. This is the ignoring the issue I am talking about. I would hope at this point they would have figured out why said units had a problem. The longer they have these defective units under investigation without identifying the mystery vapor, the more it might appear that they don't want to tell us what it is. Again, I am trying to give them the benefit of the doubt.
I certainly do not think Karma is trying to kill a bunch of people with a toxic vaporizer. Far from it, I think they want to be a real player in the vape market. At worst, I would think they would see this as a problem they are addressing in production, but perhaps feel it is too minor to warrant panicking everyone (and themselves) with an avalanche of returns. Who knows?! But that is my perspective, no more no less. I bought this thing in the first place myself; I'm not a plastic hater.
And to add, I honestly do watch this thread because I would by a DV again if it were fixed. It was otherwise a beautifully designed piece.