IAmKrazy2
Darth Vapor
I actually think.the FF ranks highly in flavor and is.in.a.similar wheelhouse to the.Zion.on.the first few hits but overal edge to the.Zion. they both provide smooth good convection flavor IMO
Discontinued Zion vaporizer
- Thread starter lwien
- Start date
I actually think.the FF ranks highly in flavor and is.in.a.similar wheelhouse to the.Zion.on.the first few hits but overal edge to the.Zion. they both provide smooth good convection flavor IMO
HD Springer
Well-Known Member
@mestizo in a side by side comparison between the two it's a total mismatch. The ff is more of a sipper where the Zion is definitely a ripper. The flavor is much stronger in the Zion because your getting more of it in the hit IMO. They are both a convection type vaporizer but that's about the only comparison between the two. The ff is way harder to get the hang of and can get very frustrating trying to duplicate the same good hit time and time again. The Zion just keeps chugging away hit after hit after hit. Very little learning curve.
ragnorokk
DERP
I think all of the technique I learned was from watching the videos @RastaBuddhaTao posted. Once I learned to heat soak during the first hit, everything was intuition on my part, to good effect.
TheDudeNextDoor
Abiding
I don't have a production unit with the upgraded heater yet, but the flavor with my beta Zion was every bit as good as with the Firefly. Of course, much will depend on the herb itself, but in terms of equal comparison, they are both on the same level in terms of flavor. Where the Zion kills the FF is in battery life, ease of use, and versatility. I loved the FF when I wasn't hassling with failing batteries or trying to stir a load on the road. Even with only a beta Zion in early stage of production, I sold my FF because the Zion is just so much easier to use.
IAmKrazy2
Darth Vapor
I always liked the SS vapor path in the FF. I have one of the very early models (never had any issues) and can replicate large hits every time if my material is well broken up and not overly moist. Hits are surprisingly smooth in the FF IMO considering the short vapor path. But to get that massive hit, i need to slow slip for up to 30 straight seconds. Sometimes feathering the throttle. The hit may be second nature but not effortless. I always complained i couldn't hit it while walking, due to the specific type of breathing/hit effort needed. It still is very stealth and convenient vape. It works great if i don't want to repack and just need 4 hits, no stirring, in a stealth manner. When packed full for portability it comes in and out of the pocket easily for those 4 hits. I don't bother stirring, and just let it go after that. May not be full extraction to some peoples standards but meets my short term one or two bowl stealth needs.
Edit. I want the GH to replace the FF for this. The battery life alone doesn't make the GH appeal a my daily driver like the Zion if it doesn't do at least 6 bowls without replacement.
The Zion i can hit while walking in stride, and is much more powerful and quick, more battery power, Less restriction, ect. The only thing the FF beats the Zion at IMO is the all in one smaller package with built in bowl. Comes out the pocket ready to go, slips back in. But as far as vaping experience itself, it is Zion hands down. You will forget you are on batteries at all by the 6th bowl.
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HD Springer
Well-Known Member
Here's what I'm referring to in the comparison of the ff and Zion. When I hand it to a person that hasn't had the chance to "master" either vaporizer. The ff is hard to duplicate a good hit. The Zion isn't. The flavor is very comparable you just get more of it in the Zion. And I get better flavor for a longer period in the Zion.
Edit. I just realized this wasn't what @mestizo was referring too as far as new users go. Sorry for the mix up.
Edit. I just realized this wasn't what @mestizo was referring too as far as new users go. Sorry for the mix up.
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killick
But I like it!
I've never tried a Firefly, but have heard good things. Maybe some day.
I've only had one near-miss with warranty! I almost lost my stir stick, which would have been tragic... Thank goodness for lifetime warranties! (just kidding - it's not going anywhere, especially for my own dumb)
So here's my little issue... several months ago I picked up some herb from a new dispensary, It sucked! All 4 strains tasted like dirt and worse. I couldn't finish any of them and dumped them into the abv bucket. This also seems to have killed my herb palate! Where before I could get excellent citrus and floral tones, and chased flavour more than anything. After the above incident I can't really taste it any more. I sometimes get weak notes along with heat. When I really draw hard on Zion I can sometimes start to pick up flaves, near the end of a long draw. And when I stop drawing I'm at 110% lung capacity, meaning as soon as I so much as move a finger vape starts leaking from my head. I've been meaning to video it just to see how silly it looks, but even the idea makes me burst into giggles, so unlikely to happen.
I've tried doing some extra long preheating to attempt to get the flave shot earlier in the cycle, but that hasn't done it yet. Any suggestions on reclaiming my herbal palate? I really miss some of the stuff I'm missing these days...
I've only had one near-miss with warranty! I almost lost my stir stick, which would have been tragic... Thank goodness for lifetime warranties! (just kidding - it's not going anywhere, especially for my own dumb)
So here's my little issue... several months ago I picked up some herb from a new dispensary, It sucked! All 4 strains tasted like dirt and worse. I couldn't finish any of them and dumped them into the abv bucket. This also seems to have killed my herb palate! Where before I could get excellent citrus and floral tones, and chased flavour more than anything. After the above incident I can't really taste it any more. I sometimes get weak notes along with heat. When I really draw hard on Zion I can sometimes start to pick up flaves, near the end of a long draw. And when I stop drawing I'm at 110% lung capacity, meaning as soon as I so much as move a finger vape starts leaking from my head. I've been meaning to video it just to see how silly it looks, but even the idea makes me burst into giggles, so unlikely to happen.
I've tried doing some extra long preheating to attempt to get the flave shot earlier in the cycle, but that hasn't done it yet. Any suggestions on reclaiming my herbal palate? I really miss some of the stuff I'm missing these days...
ragnorokk
DERP
I have actually been heat soaking for 5 seconds at 100%, then dialing down lower than where I normally set my dial (so at 70% instead of 80%) for a draw or two, then on draw 2 or three bumping it back up (to 80% or so). I assume this is the temp stepping @Shit Snacks is always going on about, and it's been giving me a nice flavorful hit that still gives the dense cloudage I'm seeking, all through my session.
TheDudeNextDoor
Abiding
Hmmm...wonder if your issue has any relation to the "vapor tongue" where heavy users of eliquid vapes lose their ability to taste the vapor. I don't fully understand it, but it seems to have something to do with the taste buds getting "weary" -- kind of like something that tastes wonderful on first bite tastes less than wonderful after eating the same thing over and over. The most commonly cited cure is to hydrate regularly (long-term) and smell strong coffee beans (short term).
Edit: I have also found it helpful to scrub my tongue with a toothbrush. That usually does the trick for me when the flavor diminishes significantly. In terms of eliquid, though, the best method of avoiding it altogether is hydrate and switch flavors regularly.
ragnorokk
DERP
Especially if you're a tea or coffee drinker, like myself. Need a fresh palate for fresh greens, ne? Just use water and friction for your vaping prep, or you'll be tasting toothpaste instead of nugs
Shit Snacks
Milaana. Lana. LANA. LANAAAA! (TM2/TP80/BAK/FW9)
It definitely replaced my Evo, well to be fair Evo was only here to cover for Zion's absence, then when it returned better than ever Evo needed some love from another member... While it's HydraTree enjoys time perched atop Zion
Yeah I had dropped Zig pretty badly on concrete but he was still working pretty fine, despite some injuries RBT later discovered and then built extra protection for. I believe the pins of the chip or something, they are now more secure and padded. He was also a rough beta like others often mentioned here, so he had fit and finish issues (hence name Ziggy Sawdust...) and the old style bowl in Zig collected more avb trapped between it and the screen. All this is improved in the production units, and Ziggy himself has been gifted a production heater now too. Since he was still working the reason he was finally sent in was I actually fried his electronics putting batteries in backwards. Mrs DieHard did the same thing to Loki, an easy fix and again production units have a protection for this, even though it is still user error like all the other known beta failures.
These latest should be relatively simple solutions as well, and potentially improve Zion production overall once again for all customers (even if its merely improving packaging, as the potentiometers likely seemed fine prior to shipment and may have gotten knocked around... Or improperly sealed perhaps). It's almost a good thing honestly, except when it spirals like in some other more complex vapes... We'll see but I don't think that's much of a risk here based on all the other testing
Yes, and it slays it imo. FF is really great at first, fresh bowl or fresh stir, whole nugs flipping, but goes away quickly as parts get overcooked becoming really poor in my experience, pro and con. Zion maintains the flavor longer with more even heating, and better temp control with the power knob setting a limit for you (also can be cleaned entirely with glass stem system). You can preserve the terps for a very long time even without stirring, depending on strain and pack ofcourse. FF2 seems better with flavor too I will say though, I also did find that Elevape actually tasted slightly better than FF with cooler hits in my experience, though it has other differences
That's close, but true temp stepping would be starting lower imo, then your staying below like 380F and its wonderful pure taste and heady effects, golden avb if you ride it or you can then temp step and take it darker. Sometimes I go through like 8 spots on the dial in a real temp step session with a full pack, but I probably use 3 on average like a low med and high, varying % depending on the strains and other factors
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Vape Dr.
Well-Known Member
I have an update for you all!!!
Just letting you all know (drum roll please)..... I just ordered a Zion and a Milaana!!!
So... Could I possibly be more excited!!!
No. The answer is no. I could not be more psyched! I am pumped! Not only for the Zion AKA "judge" and the Milaana AKA "Jury" but to help a company that I believe in 150%!
I posted my excitement in the Milaana thread too!!!
All aboard!!!
KICK ASS!
Just letting you all know (drum roll please)..... I just ordered a Zion and a Milaana!!!
So... Could I possibly be more excited!!!
No. The answer is no. I could not be more psyched! I am pumped! Not only for the Zion AKA "judge" and the Milaana AKA "Jury" but to help a company that I believe in 150%!
I posted my excitement in the Milaana thread too!!!
All aboard!!!
KICK ASS!
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I have an update for you all!!!
Just letting you all know (drum roll please)..... I just ordered a Zion and a Milaana!!!
So... Could I possibly be more excited!!!
No. The answer is no. I could not be more psyched! I am pumped! Not only for the Zion AKA "judge" and the Milaana AKA "Jury" but to help a company that I believe in 150%!
I posted my excitement in the Milaana thread too!!!
All aboard!!!
Wow, that's Killer VapeD! Welcome aboard. I look forward to your expert review.
Just stopped in to let folks know there is a new progress update... Things are really moving fast and I am getting stretched thin working to ensure customer issues are resolved, finalizing the patent with the lawyer, starting up Milaana Beta testing and manufacturing, signing deals with retailers and building units when I can. With that said, I have very little negativity coming through my official RBT means of communication and no refunds being issued so I do believe that the noise on the WWW is just a couple of angry people working hard to smear RBT and that is unfortunate. The fact remains, all I can do for the impatient is offer a full refund or request that they wait patiently.
A special thanks to all the customers that have experienced these early hick-ups with me. You have been very understanding and patient with me and I really appreciate it.
I do want to point out that this is the last week of the FC appreciation give-away and on March 1st the Zion will no longer be offered in our web store for retail, only wholesale. We will be switching over to our retail partners at that time. This is a required step to reach commercial viability and will provide a quite period on the retail front to focus on the fleet of Zion's now entering the world. I hope many of you take advantage of this opportunity in recognition to all that FC has done for RBT.
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jim-bob
Well-Known Member
Hey! I've repeatedly tried to contact you to no avail.
I ordered your whole line in August, and have never heard one peep from you about anything. At some point, you changed your terms and conditions to leave me holding the bag for paypal fees.
This is patently unfair - I've provided an interest-free loan for the past five months, and every attempt to get in touch with you has been ignored. If you're willing to waive those paypal fees I'm happy to take a refund on everything, but I don't think it's fair to penalize me because you can't or won't do your gig.
Let me know. Your approach has changed wildly since I signed on and I no longer want to be a part of this.
AJS
Calm Consistency
"Two have been returned and diagnosed with the mounting adhesive leaking into voltage knob fixing it in the lower power position." Is there any way that this can leak into the heating chamber/heater, causing me to be vaping adhesive? Please explain this, as it is very unsettling.
Copacetic
Somewhere North of The Wall
Surely RBT isn't trying to penalise you in some way?
Hasn't his approach been the same 'one guy handling entire startup' sort of gig from the beginning?
Was it the delay that chenged your mind re' purchasing Zion/Milaana?
Delays are often the cost (a small one when they're within reason IMO) of living on the bleeding edge of newly emergent tech'.
I'm definitely not saying that you shouldn't be refunded as soon as is reasonably possible BTW, I'm just saying that RBT might have missed your request due to being bent over a hot vape forge.
He did afterall announce that he would have to step away from communications to get stuff made.
And that's what we want right?
.....stuff.....made.
I too like to get my newly purchased gear ASAP, but given that we were warned of this communication situation in advance, surely he deserves some slack?
I hope he spots your post soon, and sorts you out to your satisfaction.
In my very brief dealings with him he's been a stand up guy, and I still believe this to be the case.
I hope you come out of this happy.
I myself am desperately trying to gather funds to order a Zion before the end of the month, the price is sure to go up at full production and I DO WANT!
Hasn't his approach been the same 'one guy handling entire startup' sort of gig from the beginning?
Was it the delay that chenged your mind re' purchasing Zion/Milaana?
Delays are often the cost (a small one when they're within reason IMO) of living on the bleeding edge of newly emergent tech'.
I'm definitely not saying that you shouldn't be refunded as soon as is reasonably possible BTW, I'm just saying that RBT might have missed your request due to being bent over a hot vape forge.
He did afterall announce that he would have to step away from communications to get stuff made.
And that's what we want right?
.....stuff.....made.
I too like to get my newly purchased gear ASAP, but given that we were warned of this communication situation in advance, surely he deserves some slack?
I hope he spots your post soon, and sorts you out to your satisfaction.
In my very brief dealings with him he's been a stand up guy, and I still believe this to be the case.
I hope you come out of this happy.
I myself am desperately trying to gather funds to order a Zion before the end of the month, the price is sure to go up at full production and I DO WANT!
thekarmawhore
Well-Known Member
Mulehead
Well-Known Member
#21 is a vapor machine!
I find different techniques for different results daily.
It delivers what you're looking for at the time.
Full bowl.
Micro-dose.
Temp step session during the day.
High temp 3 hit extraction at night.
Low temp flavor session in the A.M. with your coffee.
Set it to your favorite level and forget it.
And it excels at all the above!
YOU decide the effects from our holly grail.
JB I think you should know, you're not alone bud.
I ordered every RBT device offered as soon as it was available.
I also like you heard nothing from RBT.
I feel like the updates have well, kept me updated on the progress, hick ups, manufacturing plans...I could go on, but it's all there in the progress page, and FAQ page.
I waited for an address verification email, and have since had customer service that far exceeds ANY product I've ever purchased. (outside of our FC circle of respected vendors of course!)
I wish you would carefully go back and read all the updates here, and on RBT's site, along with the FAQ.
I'm sure RBT would have responded to anyone asking a question that wasn't already covered here, or through updates/FAQ.
IMO you're about to miss out on a truly revolutionary device, that WILL change your medicating experience.
That to me, is the unfair part brother.
JMHO
I find different techniques for different results daily.
It delivers what you're looking for at the time.
Full bowl.
Micro-dose.
Temp step session during the day.
High temp 3 hit extraction at night.
Low temp flavor session in the A.M. with your coffee.
Set it to your favorite level and forget it.
And it excels at all the above!
YOU decide the effects from our holly grail.
JB I think you should know, you're not alone bud.
I ordered every RBT device offered as soon as it was available.
I also like you heard nothing from RBT.
I feel like the updates have well, kept me updated on the progress, hick ups, manufacturing plans...I could go on, but it's all there in the progress page, and FAQ page.
I waited for an address verification email, and have since had customer service that far exceeds ANY product I've ever purchased. (outside of our FC circle of respected vendors of course!)
I wish you would carefully go back and read all the updates here, and on RBT's site, along with the FAQ.
I'm sure RBT would have responded to anyone asking a question that wasn't already covered here, or through updates/FAQ.
IMO you're about to miss out on a truly revolutionary device, that WILL change your medicating experience.
That to me, is the unfair part brother.
JMHO
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AJS
Calm Consistency
There's absolutely zero possibility of what you said happening. The electronics are... damn, two guys said the same before I was able to complete my message!
Thank you, crew.
Hopefully these issues can be fixed so they aren't repeated.
IAmKrazy2
Darth Vapor
Zion battery life has me so spoiled. On those rare occassiona where i run the batteries past vapor production my brain is always like, "batteries dead already? Was that even 10 bowls?"
I never count but i think right around 10 with a full charge. Best in class for batteries?
I never count but i think right around 10 with a full charge. Best in class for batteries?