sickmanfraud
Well-Known Member
I don't think it is fair to compare two objects when one is more than double the cost of the other.
Multi-brand Vivant Alternate
- Thread starter blackbur
- Start date
I don't think it is fair to compare two objects when one is more than double the cost of the other.
mourningbell
Certified human
I've found that sessions from the Alternate are pretty short. Any bowl is finished in less than 10 mins (visible vapor at least).
It does produce big clouds and really heavy hits though.
I don't have a Mighty so I can't really compare, but I can see the Alternate as a good smaller alternative.
My 2nd NEW topcap just cracked. I ordered a spare from Vivant thinking the revamped topcaps would be fixed. I counted the sessions until it cracked... I got five. 4-5 minutes each at 392 degrees. The first crack appeared as a hairline crack, but it goes all the way through from the inner ring to the outer ring. My other NEW topcap has 4 cracks. Once you get two adjacent cracks things start to move and break.
dtaxx
Well-Known Member
I just want to say it's really awesome that so many people are performing my Crafternate mod! I expected 1 or 2 people to replicate the mod, but not this many people! 
I hope that you enjoy your device and create many good times with it.
PS. keep the Crafternate pic's coming, I love seeing them!
I hope that you enjoy your device and create many good times with it.
PS. keep the Crafternate pic's coming, I love seeing them!
mash
Well-Known Member
I just want to say it's really awesome that so many people are performing my Crafternate mod! I expected 1 or 2 people to replicate the mod, but not this many people!
I hope that you enjoy your device and create many good times with it.
PS. keep the Crafternate pic's coming, I love seeing them!
Thanks man.....they work great.....I havent even tried using the new CU Vivant sent me....and I was lucky the originals never caused me a problem either. But once I did your mod....I put away all the other tops and just your modded Crafty CU........works like a charm and I used the Arizer dome screen.
Its cooler and smoother I find....
Thanks brother...
DarkSm0ke
Well-Known Member
I don't have a Mighty, but I do have a Crafty. I posted this a few pages back: http://fuckcombustion.com/threads/vivant-alternate.23668/page-51#post-1120880
I don't know if this helps, just my
I think I may offer a good point of comparison, as I own a Plenty like yourself, and have a Crafternate w/ glass mouthpiece, a 14mm WPA (modified Crafty WPA) and an Arizer Air (as well as the OG Firefly.)
Out of the box with the original CU, the alternate was nothing special. If anything, it was a bit harsh, compared to my other vapes. In crafternate mode with the glass mouthpiece, it's a lot better. It's pretty good going through a water pipe. Not nearly as good as my the Air through the same water pipe, but it holds its own. I'd argue that it's basically a Crafty w/ a removable battery at that point. It's not quite as solid in the hand as a Crafty, but at around half the price all in (if you get from DHGate), it's a decent deal.
If you're looking for a portable, I'd personally go with an Air now. It's a great device and the prices are really cheap right now. Add in a GonG and you're set. I feel like it's a much better vape than the Vivant, for not all that much more than a Crafternate. On top of that, using a Gong is dead easy - just a different stem basically. Modding the GonG onto the Vivant was/is definitely doable, but it took me an hour or so.
In the future, I'm saving my next purchase to be a Crafty or Mighty successor. They seem to have cut prices recently, which makes me think they are thinning out the channel for something new. If they release a Mighty or Crafty with a removable battery, I'm all over it day 1. I love S&B engineering, but that was a dumb decision not to make the Crafty user-replaceable.
FWIW, the Air is far superior to my Firefly as well. Flavour is similar, but it's just a much simpler device to use. No stirring, no worrying about the pack being too loose, etc. I got great results the first time just loading and going. Oh, and way better battery life.
TLDR: Get an Air, as to make the Vivant perform well, you have spend time and energy getting it to maybe 90% of the Air's performance.
I have both the Air and the Crafternate and yes, the Air has great taste and vapor quality, but pretty restricted airflow. Main reason I got the Vivant is for convenience out and about. No separate glass parts to carry. The Vivant has its issues but with the Crafty CU it is not only convenient but has very cool-flowing vapor. Much as I love the purity of my Air and my Milaana (even with the DDave V3 cooler), the Vivant is much easier on my throat, which makes singing easier!
mash
Well-Known Member
I have the arizer air also....and love it......Im a newbie to this....but it was highly recommended by friends and it never lets me down.
May I ask tho....can you send me some links to purchase these attachments? Im not sure about using a water pipe right now.....but just for future reference. Im in Canada so I have to be careful with the exchange rate if I need to buy from a US based store.
Thanks.
well since your Mi isnt getting the love it used to.. i think you should send it to me
on a serious note.. i been eyeing one for a while.. think im about ready to pull the trigger
Sorry I was not able to keep up with this thread. I took advantage of the 420 offer and both caps have melting issue. No cracking. However I tried to get warranty but VIVANT only will send out one because the other cap is free?!
Is this really reasonable? I'm so mad right now. Anyone dispute their credit card over this?
Is this really reasonable? I'm so mad right now. Anyone dispute their credit card over this?
DownWithTheDam
Member
My Alternate hits very smoothly. I still don't have any melting or cracking. Also, the new top cap seems to not get nearly as hot. I can hold the top cap above the oven for a 2 min session and it doesn't bother me.
However, I have noticed some inconsistencies in the battery since yesterday. I only got one 2 min session out of a supposedly full battery. Has anyone determined if the issue is caused by the batteries they're shipping with the Alternate, or if it's the Alternate?
However, I have noticed some inconsistencies in the battery since yesterday. I only got one 2 min session out of a supposedly full battery. Has anyone determined if the issue is caused by the batteries they're shipping with the Alternate, or if it's the Alternate?
EverythingsSOgreen
Member
Hello people,
This might be long. If it's too long, just let me know and I'll do shorter posts in the future (though most likely I won't have much more to say after this one).
First, just want to say thanks for the forum. It helped me make an informed choice to buy the Alternate. I did so after reading about the top cap melting/cracking problems, the possible fumes, and before the software/battery issues (though I guess I could have missed that whilst skimming earlier posts). A lot has been said. Though more probably doesn't need to be said, that has never stopped anyone - and if it did it would probably make this a much less lively forum. So, I'm going to throw my two cents in and, to mix metaphors, let the chips fall where they may.
I bought the vape from Vivant on 4/20 with the hefty discount including an extra top cap, screens, gaskets, and (I think?) stir stick.
My first experience was that the manual said it could be turned on with a single button long press. Nothing happened. I then tried the five clicks until it eventually turned on. I realized they must have changed it to 5 clicks or they were just unclear, but they haven't changed the manual. Well, no biggie, but a continuing problem is that the unit never seems to turn on with the first five clicks. Sometimes it takes up to five tries to get it to turn on, and up to three to turn it off. Usually, it's two or three. Not ideal.
After the first use (at 356F), the battery dropped about a third. After the second use, it was down to 33% remaining battery life. I charged it again and it was draining significantly without even using it. After trying different charging methods and different cables, I realized it might be the battery. I contacted Vivant. They handled it perfectly and sent me another battery. The replacement worked much better than the first; though, all things being equal, I would say the device needs more power and seems to drain pretty fast. I'm still testing the new battery. If I experience more quick draining of the replacement battery I will let FC and Vivant know.
If I could design a new device, I would consider another style of battery, or maybe just make a model that takes two 18650 batteries. Now, that won't solve the other glitches, but that's another story. I will also say that every aspect of updating the firmware could be much easier. I was able to, but it was a pain in the ass and I didn't notice any difference other than being able to adjust the session time (which was needed of course).
As for the interface, regular operation is ok (excepting the hinky 5 click off and on), but the method of changing settings is, putting it generously, unintuitive. Putting it more honestly, I would call it backward. Instead of making a simple tree interface, where you can just navigate to the setting you want to change, they came up with a "secret" button pushing method. Of course it's not secret, but it might as well be if you have to go back to the manual to remember what combination of buttons you have to press in what power state to get it to do what you want. I do not like it. To get really nitpicky, there is a plus button -- and two minus buttons! And naming them "regulatory" and "firing" buttons sounds cute and high tech, but it's not really helpful. But that's just nitpicking. Well, a little more nitpicking: the airflow adjustment is not that easy to adjust and the stir stick, while a great idea, is too loose and could be a little longer. Seems like fixing that wouldn't take much.
One more thing in my fantasy next model design: the bowl would be a little larger.
I'm not a heavy user and I haven't had a cracking or melting problem yet. I haven't turned the temp above 360F. I would like to go higher (haha) but I'm trying to be conservative and cross fingers that keeping the temp relatively low will lessen the chances of cracking and melting. I imagine that could make vaping waxes and such harder or simply a no go. I'm sure someone here will enlighten me on that front.
I was curious about the new top cap, so I sent Vivant an email. They sent me one right away. Couldn't ask for more as far as that goes. I do feel limited on the temp. but I'm seeing that as a trade off for the 4/20 pricing and good CS at the moment.
On the whole issue of people demanding new top caps yesterday from the minute the issues started cropping up. I understand, but I believe that (and people jumping to slander the company) may have contributed to problems with the new top caps. I know it's easy to feel betrayed and easy to be impatient, but proper testing takes time, and, well, you see the result. On the other hand, I'm completely willing to accept that in many respects they're risk takers and flying by the seat of their pants (and fundamentally, I feel shitty for buying anything made in China and it's impossible to respect any person/company who decides to exploit other for profit, but that is the boat we're all in, i.e., late capitalism, and we're all hypocrites, and that discussion is for other forums I'm sure). But back to the issue at hand: If they don't have their shit together from a manufacturing QC point of view, this may be their first and last model. I'm hoping the next model will solve all of the problems and incorporate ideas from this forum. The jury is still out on everything at this point. If Vivant hadn't responded to all of my problems so quickly and professionally I would have returned the Alternate and washed my hands of the whole thing, but they've done everything right so far (as far as CS goes) and I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt. If new problems crop up and it ends up being more trouble than it's worth, I'll ask them to accept the return, but so far I'm willing to roll with their roller coaster and see what happens.
I'll end by shouting out all the DIYers here who solved all of the problems they could on their own and helped others do the same. It's clear Vivant has seen all of the mods, which should help with their designs down the road. Speaking of which, what is the best source for a Crafty top cap for the Crafternate mod?
Well, that my 2 cents. Sorry if it ran on a bit too long.
- Peace
This might be long. If it's too long, just let me know and I'll do shorter posts in the future (though most likely I won't have much more to say after this one).
First, just want to say thanks for the forum. It helped me make an informed choice to buy the Alternate. I did so after reading about the top cap melting/cracking problems, the possible fumes, and before the software/battery issues (though I guess I could have missed that whilst skimming earlier posts). A lot has been said. Though more probably doesn't need to be said, that has never stopped anyone - and if it did it would probably make this a much less lively forum. So, I'm going to throw my two cents in and, to mix metaphors, let the chips fall where they may.
I bought the vape from Vivant on 4/20 with the hefty discount including an extra top cap, screens, gaskets, and (I think?) stir stick.
My first experience was that the manual said it could be turned on with a single button long press. Nothing happened. I then tried the five clicks until it eventually turned on. I realized they must have changed it to 5 clicks or they were just unclear, but they haven't changed the manual. Well, no biggie, but a continuing problem is that the unit never seems to turn on with the first five clicks. Sometimes it takes up to five tries to get it to turn on, and up to three to turn it off. Usually, it's two or three. Not ideal.
After the first use (at 356F), the battery dropped about a third. After the second use, it was down to 33% remaining battery life. I charged it again and it was draining significantly without even using it. After trying different charging methods and different cables, I realized it might be the battery. I contacted Vivant. They handled it perfectly and sent me another battery. The replacement worked much better than the first; though, all things being equal, I would say the device needs more power and seems to drain pretty fast. I'm still testing the new battery. If I experience more quick draining of the replacement battery I will let FC and Vivant know.
If I could design a new device, I would consider another style of battery, or maybe just make a model that takes two 18650 batteries. Now, that won't solve the other glitches, but that's another story. I will also say that every aspect of updating the firmware could be much easier. I was able to, but it was a pain in the ass and I didn't notice any difference other than being able to adjust the session time (which was needed of course).
As for the interface, regular operation is ok (excepting the hinky 5 click off and on), but the method of changing settings is, putting it generously, unintuitive. Putting it more honestly, I would call it backward. Instead of making a simple tree interface, where you can just navigate to the setting you want to change, they came up with a "secret" button pushing method. Of course it's not secret, but it might as well be if you have to go back to the manual to remember what combination of buttons you have to press in what power state to get it to do what you want. I do not like it. To get really nitpicky, there is a plus button -- and two minus buttons! And naming them "regulatory" and "firing" buttons sounds cute and high tech, but it's not really helpful. But that's just nitpicking. Well, a little more nitpicking: the airflow adjustment is not that easy to adjust and the stir stick, while a great idea, is too loose and could be a little longer. Seems like fixing that wouldn't take much.
One more thing in my fantasy next model design: the bowl would be a little larger.
I'm not a heavy user and I haven't had a cracking or melting problem yet. I haven't turned the temp above 360F. I would like to go higher (haha) but I'm trying to be conservative and cross fingers that keeping the temp relatively low will lessen the chances of cracking and melting. I imagine that could make vaping waxes and such harder or simply a no go. I'm sure someone here will enlighten me on that front.
I was curious about the new top cap, so I sent Vivant an email. They sent me one right away. Couldn't ask for more as far as that goes. I do feel limited on the temp. but I'm seeing that as a trade off for the 4/20 pricing and good CS at the moment.
On the whole issue of people demanding new top caps yesterday from the minute the issues started cropping up. I understand, but I believe that (and people jumping to slander the company) may have contributed to problems with the new top caps. I know it's easy to feel betrayed and easy to be impatient, but proper testing takes time, and, well, you see the result. On the other hand, I'm completely willing to accept that in many respects they're risk takers and flying by the seat of their pants (and fundamentally, I feel shitty for buying anything made in China and it's impossible to respect any person/company who decides to exploit other for profit, but that is the boat we're all in, i.e., late capitalism, and we're all hypocrites, and that discussion is for other forums I'm sure). But back to the issue at hand: If they don't have their shit together from a manufacturing QC point of view, this may be their first and last model. I'm hoping the next model will solve all of the problems and incorporate ideas from this forum. The jury is still out on everything at this point. If Vivant hadn't responded to all of my problems so quickly and professionally I would have returned the Alternate and washed my hands of the whole thing, but they've done everything right so far (as far as CS goes) and I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt. If new problems crop up and it ends up being more trouble than it's worth, I'll ask them to accept the return, but so far I'm willing to roll with their roller coaster and see what happens.
I'll end by shouting out all the DIYers here who solved all of the problems they could on their own and helped others do the same. It's clear Vivant has seen all of the mods, which should help with their designs down the road. Speaking of which, what is the best source for a Crafty top cap for the Crafternate mod?
Well, that my 2 cents. Sorry if it ran on a bit too long.
- Peace
EverythingsSOgreen
Member
I think it's fair. If you have a problem with the replacement you can let them know. If they don't deal with you honestly then, you could take it from there, but going to your credit card company seems like the nuclear option. I understand being pissed off about the original problems, but, for me, the question is, are they trying to solve the problem and are they acting in good faith. In this case, I would say yes. You can read my recent post to see exactly what my experience has been so far.
- Peace
Vitolo
Vaporist
We have been very lucky in this area.
A number of local patients that I am keeping up with still have not had issues.
We are not part of the 6% of original top failures I imagine. (that was the statistic given by @Vivant)
All of us received new tops, including myself.
I stubbornly was going to use my original CU/mouthpiece till I could wear it to the ground!
I began doing sessions at 400º .
This went on for a couple of weeks... and finally I decided to keep using the original.
One friend said he saw visual wear on the rim of the CU, where it attaches down into chamber,
but for the life of me, even with photographs, I can not see it. Vision may be aging!
I still am using the original top.
No sense in using the upgraded, improved top unless the original shows signs of wear that I can see.
Mine never had a plastic odor... same as many of you reported an absence of plastic smell.
A number of local patients that I am keeping up with still have not had issues.
We are not part of the 6% of original top failures I imagine. (that was the statistic given by @Vivant)
All of us received new tops, including myself.
I stubbornly was going to use my original CU/mouthpiece till I could wear it to the ground!
I began doing sessions at 400º .
This went on for a couple of weeks... and finally I decided to keep using the original.
One friend said he saw visual wear on the rim of the CU, where it attaches down into chamber,
but for the life of me, even with photographs, I can not see it. Vision may be aging!
I still am using the original top.
No sense in using the upgraded, improved top unless the original shows signs of wear that I can see.
Mine never had a plastic odor... same as many of you reported an absence of plastic smell.
mourningbell
Certified human
They were giving out two top caps at a time during the 420 sale because they were clearing old stock. I don't think they should be expected to send you two again but maybe that's just me.
As long as the 5 clicks are in rhythm it'll work every time. The clicks don't even have to be all that fast, but you've gotta do it in rhythm. (btw when it goes into sleep mode you just click it once to wake but that's probably not relevant)
I found the update to be very very easy and it accomplished what it set out to do lol.
Yeah the interface and navigation isn't the best.
I'd suggest using it at whatever temp you'd like--if your top is destined to crack then there's no point putting off the inevitable.
Also, I feel as if Vivant had plenty of time redesigning the new top caps. Problem is they supposedly added the metal ring on the new CU kinda last minute--it was just going to be a materials change. But then I believe they may have not put the new metal-ringed caps through enough testing. The original CU problems definitely were a batch issue according to Vivant, so I'm not quite sure why they added the metal ring.
Their CS staff has definitely been great about all of this though, any fault in the company seems to be more on the engineering and decision-making side lol.
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@EverythingsSOgreen, the 5 clicks turn the UNIT on or off. The one long press of the button turns the HEATER on or off. So after turning the unit on with 5 clicks, then do the press/hold to start the heater..
At any time you are vapiing, you can do the press/hold to turn the heater off. This puts the unit in standby, so you only need to start the heater up again rather than turning the whole shebang off with 5 clicks and then 5 clicks on again.. I think someone here found it saves battery this way.
At any time you are vapiing, you can do the press/hold to turn the heater off. This puts the unit in standby, so you only need to start the heater up again rather than turning the whole shebang off with 5 clicks and then 5 clicks on again.. I think someone here found it saves battery this way.
A WPA is a DEFINITE investment. Once I've added the water pipe into my gear, that's all I use except for the rare occasional walk outside with a portable. Even then, I have 14mm microbubbler I can take
If you're in Canada, you're in luck! http://www.planetvape.ca/ has a great selection of Air parts and my favorite stem and GonG. I use the PVHEGonG and the high efficiency bent stem. I've also got the Flowmaster GonGs (14 and 18) and a generic one from China. Of those, the Planet Vape stuff is the best made and sturdiest. I highly recommend it. I really like the Shorty version, as it's a perfect small dose. I'm actually going to buy some backups from them soon.
Flowmaster makes the Crafty mouthpiece; I think it's it's a nice addition for the Crafternate, but not a deal breaker. Check DHGate for Hydratubes/bubblers. I got mine from Sunshine store and couldn't be happier. They perform great.
IckiestOfTheSticky
Well-Known Member
Mine is a bit iffy on the rhythm part. Trust me, I've got quite a bit of rhythm, and even when I do the 5 clicks quickly or more slowly, I have about a 50% success rate on getting it the first 5. Usually it's the second 5.
No idea why this is, but I promise I'm hitting them with an evenly spaced rhythm, and it's not reliable.
I will say when I turn it off with 5 clicks it works 100% of the time. Just turning it on is wonky for me.
I have the same issue. I mean, it works, but it's not 100%.
EverythingsSOgreen
Member
The 6% figure is interesting. I hadn't seen anyone mention that before. It's hard to get a sense of the failure rate from anecdotal FC comments. If I had to guess, it's probably more than 6%, but that would just be a guess.
I do wonder how much intensity of use and intensity of heat played a part in the failures. Your comments add something to the anecdotal evidence, but then again, your sample group is pretty small. It's nigh impossible to be scientific about this, but it's clear "mistakes were made" as the saying goes. They seem to moving in the right direction though. Time will tell...
- Cheers
DownWithTheDam
Member
Not I. I got an incredible portable vap for half the price of any notable competition. The only issue I've encountered with the Alternate is inconsistency with the battery.
EverythingsSOgreen
Member
Thanks! I thought I was doing it in rhythm, but apparently concentrating 1% more seems to help. It's still not perfect, but I'll take the the hit (oh man, it's impossible not to pun here) on this one and say (mostly) user error. It's the the rhythm method (i did it again - and it's not even a weed pun) from here on out!
Ok, all of that being said, I think the 5 click idea as a solution to accidentally triggering it in a bag or pocket is, um, overkill. Why not have a toggle switch or button under a flap? Or here's an idea, put the power switch under the top cap (maybe say directly across from the stir stick), so you would load it, turn it on, replace cap, and then you could turn it off with the regular controls. I'm just throwing out ideas of course. It's not like it's a huge deal, but maybe worth mentioning (?)...
As far as the firmware update and using at a higher temp goes, we may have to agree to disagree...I do wonder if there is an intensity of use and higher temp correlation with failure rate though. It might be interesting for people who experienced top cap failures to chime in with their intensity of use and average temp.
Yeah, you may be right about them having enough time on the redesign, but then, following what you're saying, they may not have taken enough time on the redesign of the redesign - and that might have been because they were feeling pressured. Hard to know.
Well, thanks for the thoughtful replies,
~ Cheers