this has been my experience as well.
Rosin Technique....Easy DIY Solventless
- Thread starter darkrom
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this has been my experience as well.
Izan
Well-Known Member
Inspired mate!! Stellar work.
I have also observed that an increasing force "squeeze" seems to produce the best/ most consistent results.
With that in mind: From Rockwell
The Jawhorse and
the benchjaw.
Jackhorse:
- Clamp work pieces 0 to 49-inches, particularly 8x4 plywood sheets
- Clamp up to 1 ton of force and supports a weight load up to 600 lbs.
- Versatile & hands-free workstation for clamping, supporting, and holding
- Folds down quickly for storage and transport
- Front scooter wheels for easy moving on all terrain even on rough ground
- Hands-free benchtop vise and clamping station
- Mounts to any standard, stabilized workbench
- 16-Inch clamping range in jaws
- Holds and supports up to 220-Pound
- Capable of generating over a ton of clamping force (2200-Pound)
Cheers
I
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PoopMachine
Well-Known Member
I think phenolic will be perfect for you. Its pretty tough and plays really well with heat. Its used as spacers between manifolds and carburetors for race cars and you can get it about as thick as you want it. It cuts like wood. Just make sure to wear a mask when cutting it.
It does seem to be the ideal material for this job.
I tried to dewax some rosin with just a 15u screen and I am pretty sure I just forced all the wax through the screen with too much vise pressure as there was very little to no wax in my screen. I will try it again later with less pressure and sneak up on it.. lol.. Maybe the wax was trapped in the bud with vise tech?
We'll see.
Edit: I did notice my meat thermometer is about 15 degrees high now at room temp and maybe I am pressing at lower temps than normal and getting less wax? fun stuff.
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Been Vapin
Fringe Class
Is anyone using anything other than parchment or slick pads? Is raw parchment the brown parchment paper? I read @herbivore21 's post back on page 27 or so here and another post against parchment in the concentrate for noobs thread earlier.
Before I thought the risk was from inhaling fumes at higher temps when pressing and to stay below 300f. I thought rosin had been tested and was clean from contaminants?
Has anyone sacrificed a non stick teflon coated pan to try and press on/collect off of?. I have never noticed anything odd with regular white parchment getting into my oils or anything coming off the paper and I was wondering if anyone else has either?
Parchment seems to be the normal here and the rest of the internet, but I would like to hear of or maybe find a possibly safer alternatives?
Before I thought the risk was from inhaling fumes at higher temps when pressing and to stay below 300f. I thought rosin had been tested and was clean from contaminants?
Has anyone sacrificed a non stick teflon coated pan to try and press on/collect off of?. I have never noticed anything odd with regular white parchment getting into my oils or anything coming off the paper and I was wondering if anyone else has either?
Parchment seems to be the normal here and the rest of the internet, but I would like to hear of or maybe find a possibly safer alternatives?
herbivore21
Well-Known Member
Hey bro, I only use teflon slick sheets for squishing purposes and dispose of them as soon as heat deformation occurs (this will be from squishing unevenly due to various potential factors usually and does not necessarily take place).
I refuse to squish on parchment (raw brown paper as you describe is the only parchment I've ever used) since I am not confident that the combination of heat and pressure (remember that pressure can serve as the functional equivalent of heat) is something that the silicone coating will withstand every time. Also remember that the tests that extracts go through are not designed to find small amounts of silicone etc.
I do not know of any laboratory that is specifically testing for these kinds of residuals from processing yet. This would obviously be a great idea now though, since we are probably all as confident as one another that Rosin has a big future in the industry
Remember, you might not notice silicone or whatever your given parchment is coated in once it gets into the oil, due to any number of possible factors. Given that rosin is a relatively recent extraction methodology, I prefer to take the parsimonious route of the simplest non stick collection surface is best. By simplest, I mean least different materials used in its manufacturing.
Pure teflon is so far best in this regard, hence my use of slick sheets. It can certainly deform, but you don't have to pay attention for whether a less visible outer coating has been coming off into your material (as you do with silicone coated parchment), instead you only need to consider whether the teflon has started deforming and get rid of it long before any teflon can get into your oil.
This is not to say that those using parchment will get bad stuff into their oil every time. However, it is harder to notice if something has come off the surface of parchment vs teflon.
ganjapharma
Well-Known Member
They show the Ptfe in this video
killick
But I like it!
@ganjapharma Great video - thanks for sharing. Oddly I've been wondering about using PTFE as I have some in the kitchen waiting for experiments! Looking forward to giving this a try...
@Joel W. @herbivore21
I've found that my problems with bleed through and difficulty collecting only occur with previously used parchment. I've moved to only using "virgin" parchment for pressing. I have a roll of slick sheet also, but struggled with deformation and haven't used it in a while- I should give it another shot.
It's easy to see damage to parchment, but it's usually overlooked. The same rules go for parchment as slick pads- if there are any cracks or you can notice any changed surface texture then damage has occurred. I've seen a lot of scary looking wrinkled up parchment in use. Damaged parchment will cause contamination even when used for storage, and it is definitely a cause of bleed through problems.
I press on virgin parchment, collect immediately, then re-press on a slick pad to form a pretty slab. Pressing on slick sheet or or pads is probably the most foolproof solution, but I think parchment is also safe if handled carefully and used only once.
I've found that my problems with bleed through and difficulty collecting only occur with previously used parchment. I've moved to only using "virgin" parchment for pressing. I have a roll of slick sheet also, but struggled with deformation and haven't used it in a while- I should give it another shot.
It's easy to see damage to parchment, but it's usually overlooked. The same rules go for parchment as slick pads- if there are any cracks or you can notice any changed surface texture then damage has occurred. I've seen a lot of scary looking wrinkled up parchment in use. Damaged parchment will cause contamination even when used for storage, and it is definitely a cause of bleed through problems.
I press on virgin parchment, collect immediately, then re-press on a slick pad to form a pretty slab. Pressing on slick sheet or or pads is probably the most foolproof solution, but I think parchment is also safe if handled carefully and used only once.
@Joel W.
Do you mean to press directly on the pan? If so I believe heat transfer and retention may be a problem. Also, the Teflon coating on pans is thin and fragile, and will start to flake as soon as it is worn or damaged.
You may want to look into thicker PTFE sheeting. I've used PTFE sheeting about 1/32 thick before when doing a job involving composite layup and vacuum forming. The thicker PTFE sheet is stiff and durable, and would probably work great.
Do you mean to press directly on the pan? If so I believe heat transfer and retention may be a problem. Also, the Teflon coating on pans is thin and fragile, and will start to flake as soon as it is worn or damaged.
You may want to look into thicker PTFE sheeting. I've used PTFE sheeting about 1/32 thick before when doing a job involving composite layup and vacuum forming. The thicker PTFE sheet is stiff and durable, and would probably work great.
@shark sandwich, yes, I was thinking about glueing the fry pan diamond shapes pieces direct to my jaws and bring them to temp. My thinking is the rosin wants to move to the cooler area, if there is no place for it to collect, gravity may take over. Dripping off the hot pan material just like frying pan grease draining from a hot pan?
I Will look into PTFE. Thanks.
Edit: That's how George Foreman would do it.
I Will look into PTFE. Thanks.
Edit: That's how George Foreman would do it.
ganjapharma
Well-Known Member
My $.02 on teflon pan
From my research I have found a HUGE difference between PTFE sheet (solid film not coated fiberglass) and Teflon coatings.
Teflon is a brand name, covers hundreds of sprays, coatings, powders,etc..PTFE is just ONE of the many polymers used in different "teflon" products.
The Slick sheets are Skieved. meaning a solid rod of PTFE is SHAVED into a film.
Pure PTFE film is used in chemistry as a liner and gasket material.
Teflon pans are SPRAYED with a mix of solvents and polymers. HUGE DIFFERENCE from my perspective.
With a pan, I would worry about 1)temp 2) scratches 3)other chemicals not just PTFE
From my research I have found a HUGE difference between PTFE sheet (solid film not coated fiberglass) and Teflon coatings.
Teflon is a brand name, covers hundreds of sprays, coatings, powders,etc..PTFE is just ONE of the many polymers used in different "teflon" products.
The Slick sheets are Skieved. meaning a solid rod of PTFE is SHAVED into a film.
Pure PTFE film is used in chemistry as a liner and gasket material.
Teflon pans are SPRAYED with a mix of solvents and polymers. HUGE DIFFERENCE from my perspective.
With a pan, I would worry about 1)temp 2) scratches 3)other chemicals not just PTFE
@Joel W.
I had entirely missed the part about dripping. That's a good idea! I think any shape would work as long as you have a drip point at the bottom.
You may be able to fabricate angled insulators to back your plates, in place of the wood. If made out of a slightly compressable but resilient material like silicone, the press would start at the top, and squeeze out the bottom as the silicone compressed and the plates aligned.
@ganjapharma brings up some good points. I think your best bet for a reusable direct pressing surface would be 1/32 or 1/16 thick PTFE sheet, rough sanded on the backside, jb welded to your heater surfaces and then trimmed.
These will have to be tiny heat surfaces, too! How much press area do you think this will have?
I had entirely missed the part about dripping. That's a good idea! I think any shape would work as long as you have a drip point at the bottom.
You may be able to fabricate angled insulators to back your plates, in place of the wood. If made out of a slightly compressable but resilient material like silicone, the press would start at the top, and squeeze out the bottom as the silicone compressed and the plates aligned.
@ganjapharma brings up some good points. I think your best bet for a reusable direct pressing surface would be 1/32 or 1/16 thick PTFE sheet, rough sanded on the backside, jb welded to your heater surfaces and then trimmed.
These will have to be tiny heat surfaces, too! How much press area do you think this will have?
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Thanks @ganjapharma , my max temp is about 240f and I am not too concerned about herb scratching the surface during pressings as of yet but I am often wrong.
Edit: my plates are about 1.5" x 2"
Edit2: I would not have guessed paper would hold up to these pressures either but it does OK.
Edit: my plates are about 1.5" x 2"
Edit2: I would not have guessed paper would hold up to these pressures either but it does OK.
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2clicker
Observer
@farscaper @shark sandwich @Joel W.
regarding using slick sheet... arent you guys turned off by the fact that this stuff will not biodegrade? continually disposing of this stuff is not good. just curious.
id be far more inclined to use slick pads.
regarding using slick sheet... arent you guys turned off by the fact that this stuff will not biodegrade? continually disposing of this stuff is not good. just curious.
id be far more inclined to use slick pads.
2clicker
Observer
or maybe one could use rigid pieces of ptfe that can be reused and never thrown away...?
I have some on order.
In the mean time. Ready to test these non stick " Foreman grill" type rosin jaws..
These were just an idea yesterday morning..
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it is of the utmost concerns to me actually. I press rosin quite often for personal, i wont sit here and claim to be a scientist... but its not like I did it this one time and formulated an opinion, Ive tried products like ptfe flim over and over and over many many time and different ways to ensure to myself im creating the best of what I can. I dont use it anymore for that reason. I haven't actually tried it with rosin, but im very familiar with oil slick PTFE products. ive used the og and the upgraded ptfe sheets and they are expensive and VERY NOT REUSABLE!
my experience with slickpads and rosin ended in a ruined slick pad. it started popping little squares of silicone out from the square holes between the fiberglass bindings.
I know what happens when ptfe film deforms I know what happens to it when you fold it. it may indeed work.. for a time... especially if your using just a hair iron and body weight to press with... but no way it wouldnt deform with my vise press. I have no quaffs with parchment. I use it to bake with too... with much higher temps.
but yes ultimately the fact that ptfe film isnt biodegradable in any way makes me say nay.
now this I could get behind because if you recall some time back we had been looking into ptfe sheets of much thicker sizes to use. I believe @CrazyDiamond can attest to the ridiculous rigidity of thick ptfe plates slabs and bowls.
in thicker samples you may notice a slight insulating property that may be helpful or counterproductive to your particular application, but it also will retain heat quite well too... not as well as aluminum or copper or some other metal plates though. the thick plates and slabs Will be reusable since they will not deform when excessive pressure is applied.
@2clicker
I recommended 1/32 inch ptfe sheet because it's thick and sturdy enough to be long term reusable, which is definitely preferable to disposal and waste. I estimate oil slick sheet is about 2 mils thick, which means 1/32 inch sheet would be about 15 times thicker. If that's not tough enough, 1/16 or 1/8 inch definitely would be, but you'd start having to deal with heat transfer and retention issues with those (as mentioned above).
@farscaper I had not heard of that issue with oil slick pads, but I believe it. I've had similar durability issues, now I think thick PTFE is the way to go, at least until we find something better.
If PTFE film is ecologically irresponsible, then parchment is worse because there's no way PTFE can be recycled once it's blended with paper. *EDIT: this statement is incorrect, read below!*
I recommended 1/32 inch ptfe sheet because it's thick and sturdy enough to be long term reusable, which is definitely preferable to disposal and waste. I estimate oil slick sheet is about 2 mils thick, which means 1/32 inch sheet would be about 15 times thicker. If that's not tough enough, 1/16 or 1/8 inch definitely would be, but you'd start having to deal with heat transfer and retention issues with those (as mentioned above).
@farscaper I had not heard of that issue with oil slick pads, but I believe it. I've had similar durability issues, now I think thick PTFE is the way to go, at least until we find something better.
If PTFE film is ecologically irresponsible, then parchment is worse because there's no way PTFE can be recycled once it's blended with paper. *EDIT: this statement is incorrect, read below!*
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parchment paper has silicon embedded into it not ptfe.
Parchment is both biodegradable and compostable, meaning it can be disposed of either in your green bin (where available) or in a composter. Parchment paper will break down in a reasonable amount of time in a natural environment, while producing no toxic residue