PBW & the Chemistry of Clean

[oldiebutgoodie]

I used to use compressed air in my glass Solo stems....they all developed these weird white lines for some reason. I posted about it and concluded it was hard water deposits, but it wasn't because when I stopped using it (someone warned about the bittering agents) I never had the problem again with other glass stems.

Thanks a lot for the heads-up!!! I thought that given the very strict change re fluorocarbon use, that the difluoroethane now used would evaporate off. I forgot about the bitters that are added to prevent idiots from huffing the stuff; those bitters leave a residue.

Too bad, looked promising for instant evaporation. I won't be using that again.

Thx again!

I do have the 60t and use the cork method now with PBW. I clean every 3 days so buildup is not really a problem for me. I am thinking a covered bucket might be the best for me that is a bit on the bigger side to take the Mobius piece. I want to make sure I can pour it back in. A covered bucket is best because I keep everything in the bathroom and don't want any of my wifes conservative friends or family to know I do this even though I am a medical user.

I am going to try this simply green stuff out this week sometime.

Tip: With some glass pieces, if you vertically submerge, air may be trapped and the solution unable to reach that area. With my Hydraline for example, I have to tip the container ~15 degrees for the air bubble to get free. Not sure about this and your stemless piece.

Tip: Just for when you lift the piece out the first time, be careful about how it drains. A change in water level between inside the tube and the outside stem could result in overflow thru the joint, depending on the piece.

 

[John Lewus]

Tip: With some glass pieces, if you vertically submerge, air may be trapped and the solution unable to reach that area. With my Hydraline for example, I have to tip the container ~15 degrees for the air bubble to get free. Not sure about this and your stemless piece.

Tip: Just for when you lift the piece out the first time, be careful about how it drains. A change in water level between inside the tube and the outside stem could result in overflow thru the joint, depending on the piece.

Ok I now understand what you mean by trapped air pockets. I don't think my 60t stemless would have that problem but likely would have a bit of trapped air in the bottom matrix. I can always half submerge it and suck some air through the top unsubmerged to hopefully fill it with water.

Thanks for the tip of draining. I am sure when I do another clean this weekend I am going to forget about it and get my counters wet again

 

[oldiebutgoodie]

Ok I now understand what you mean by trapped air pockets. I don't think my 60t stemless would have that problem but likely would have a bit of trapped air in the bottom matrix. I can always half submerge it and suck some air through the top unsubmerged to hopefully fill it with water.

Thanks for the tip of draining. I am sure when I do another clean this weekend I am going to forget about it and get my counters wet again

My container wasn't quite tall enough for my 60t, but now that you mention it IIRC there was an air pocket at the bottom perc. I think I submerged it just enough to fill the joint and then did a very quick pull on the mouthpiece, that was enough to fill the bottom. Ya don't want the SG coming up into your mouth.

When you're draining, be sure to use both hands or non-slip gloves. SG has a surfactant that makes it a bit slippery, i.e., rinse the outside first

 

[BigDaddyVapor]

I use SG a lot also. Don't dilute and I've been using the same gallon for some time now.

 

[oldiebutgoodie]

I use SG a lot also. Don't dilute and I've been using the same gallon for some time now.

I've been diluting to the "heavy cleaning" strength to keep the cost down. But ya know, if undiluted would last a whole lot longer, and there is no risk to the glass, then I might go undiluted for convenience.

Done any comparisons between effectiveness diluted vs undiluted?

(And have we hijacked this thread? - Mea culpa, t-dub.)

 

[t-dub]

No its cool, but liquid chems do deserve their own thread. I was thinking about getting one of those little electric parts washers like StickyShisha posted a while back, but no $$$ exist for the project. Instead, I took an old Bicycle water bottle I had laying around and filled it 1/2 with SG and it makes a nice dunk tank for HTs and the downstems from the Devastator. It even has a convenient pour spout

 

[Bouldorado]

I've started using dishwasher detergent to do a final clean. It seems to be pretty effective at removing hard water stains (I use iso or SG first to clean out any reclaim gunk). I put about a teaspoon of detergent in the tube, add hot tap water, and shake for a few minutes.

 

[lreindl]

Loving this PBW stuff!

Edit: To my fellow Matrix collectors... how do you go about cleaning the mouthpiece? In and around it will stay dirty despite a full submerge. And not even water stains, it looks more like faint specks of reclaim.

 

[momofthegoons]

I have to share that I just cleaned a bub for a friend who has switched over to vaping. This bub had caked on carbon crap from combusting and had never been cleaned. This is one of those times I really wish I had taken some before and after pics. Going into this, I really didn't think it would clean up, but would you believe I got all of that crap off? It took several long (smelly) and very hot soaks, but that bub is sparkling and clear as new.

My friend was amazed and thrilled he didn't need to go out and buy a new water tool.

And I just bought myself an 4 lb. tub of this stuff. I love it.

 

[Squeeky]

Wow, today was the first time I read this thread. I'd been an epson salt/iso user for cleaning, but been using PBW for years as a homebrewer. Seems like it's time to get out the tub of PBW and clean some pieces.

 

[John Lewus]

Has anyone figured out how to get out the baked in combustion smell? I used PBW and several 2 day soaks to bring a very old glass piece my friend combusted out of for years to a perfect looking glass piece. However, it still smells like someone combusted out of it even though it looks brand new. I really don't care about this piece but it gives me big pause when buying any used glass pieces if someone combusted out of it. Any ideas if you can get rid of the smell?

 

[Troi]

I am curious how it is with an individual user using the same bucket for a month. Has anyone tried this?

Figured since its somewhat on topic, and I'm OCD when it comes to keeping the VXL Glass clean at trade-shows. We use a simple green bucket, the tubes are used less then 36 hrs since there last soak/rinse. (At trade shows less then 16 hours) I keep a cap on the bucket at all times when not removing/placing hydratubes in the bucket. Usually I'll let them soak 20-60 minutes, and then a good thorough hot water rinse. This works specifically at trade shows because we can get just about everything we need at any home depot, and its easy to manage when you need to soak 20-30 hydra tubes. I think this method works best with hydra-tubes due to there size, I don't think this method lends itself well to larger pieces (Simple green bucket) and for larger pieces i'm intrigued by PBW and plan to order some myself and do some experimenting with cleaning hydratubes and larger pieces.

As for how long the Simple Green lasts in the bucket, I have had the same simple green back at the office since October, and I have probably cleaned 20 hydratubes a few times each through it and I have noticed no real difference in the simple green or how well the tubes get cleaned. At the end of the day I do throw any used tubes, so the tubes do get cleaned regularly before any stubborn buildup occurs. I think the best cleaning method is a combination of one that leaves no trace once rinsed, and is easy for the individual to do on a regular basis without feeling hassled. I think everyone is unique and whatever cleaning method has the first rule great, but the second is personal to the one doing the task. On the same note, rinsing is where I will score simple green weak. I do find that it requires a good amount of rinsing to get the cleaner smell gone, but it does fully go away once properly rinsed. If i could get it in bulk I would probably want to switch out the Simple Green with Grunge off but the price would be very expensive to fill the bucket up.

 

[Vaporisateur]

I used ISO for a long time, but I have been converted to PBW now, thanks to this thread

So I went to a local Brewing & Wine making store and found everything I needed for my first Powdered Brewery Wash.

Total cost on this picture was less than 20$ CDN with tax (1 pound of PBW = 12$.)


My piece BEFORE:

AFTER multiple PBW soaks:

Looks good, BUT WAIT! Upon closer look with a light source:

Arrrghh! I can't get rid of these two rings, which I have no idea how they appeared (they were there before using PBW). I obviously never kept any liquid at that level so it really puzzles me.

I also tried using a flexible PVC brush in that area while the beaker was filled with water and disolved PBW, with no change at all as you can see above. The stain comes back upon drying.

<...>The film seems to come back only during the final evaporation of moisture. It's not quite as bad as before the cleaning, but it still sucks that it wont go away. <...>

I have kind of the same problem. Have you figured it out?
I have not tried SG yet as I have none at hand. Using Dishwasher soap perhaps? Not sure what to do.

 

[mrboote]

^Have you tried a product that is specific to hard water deposits? Like CLR.

 

[momofthegoons]

I received this link from a good friend today about hazardous cleaning solutions that we often use. The first one listed is one of interest, especially to many of the glass lovers here.

http://static.ewg.org/reports/2012/cleaners_hallofshame/cleaners_hallofshame.pdf

Makes me even happier to have found out about PBW.

 

[Squeeky]

As a long time homebrewer, I trust the five star brand with my life and hobbies. Charlie, one of the creaters of StarSan (Sanatizing product) and PBW, has a great podcast episode over at thebrewingnetwork.com. He was extremely honest and engauraged brewers not to waste money on other brands or his own product. Even explained his Starsan product could be used over and over as long as the ph was low enough. Prior to this podcast many brewers were tossing used product out and buying more. They make their profit selling to commercial brewers and sell the small qtys to us just to ensure we are getting quality product.

 

[Troi]

I received this link from a good friend today about hazardous cleaning solutions that we often use. The first one listed is one of interest, especially to many of the glass lovers here.

http://static.ewg.org/reports/2012/cleaners_hallofshame/cleaners_hallofshame.pdf

Makes me even happier to have found out about PBW.

Very interesting find, it makes sense because if the solution worked as advertised and it "Evaporated like water" I always felt it should be easier to rinse out. While i do still think its safe to use for the purpose I stated, this information further places importance on ensuring that one thoroughly rinses out the solution, and gloves should be work when handling things in the solution. This only make me want to find a way to upgrade the bucket method to PBW or Grunge Off ASAP!!

 

[SD_haze]

Tried filling up my 17inch Apix tube with PBW+water and the pressure shot out my 18mm GonG stopper. Guess it's too tall :/

For size reference:

(The stopper is fine btw)

 

[Frederick McGuire]

The result of another satisfactory PBW run:



EDIT:
It cleaned up my lattice nicely too

 

[VapingDitto]

I found this link interesting... It is about the safety concerns of the SG product line being addressed by the people who created SG. "http://www.simplegreen.com/solutions_public_awareness.php#cbc7"
Here is an excerpt
"“Greenwashing.” This has been a recently published opinion of us and our product Simple Green. While we respect the rights of folks to have and share their opinions, we also appreciate the opportunity to respond and share some facts on this issue..."

 

[Roger D]

If you can't find PBW, percarbonate with citric acid rinse does the trick. But you will have to use lots and do multiple washes in case of heavy build up. I'm waiting for 99,5% iso to see how it will do on some of my resin stained pieces.

 

[lreindl]

What would happen if I used PBW and ISO Alcohol with the "shake-and-break" method? Probably not the smartest idea with my Mobius, but there are big globs of reclaim on the dewaar joint that won't come off with PBW+hot water.

 

[t-dub]

You certainly can alternate the methods, rinsing well between, but I wouldn't mix ISO with PBW. PBW removes soiling in layers so globs will go away with repeated hot flushing and longer dwell time. Using a salt/iso intermediate step might really help break up large "globs" so they can be flushed away or attacked in the next PBW wash which will help speed things along. Good idea

 

[lreindl]

PBW removes soiling in layers so globs will go away with repeated hot flushing and longer dwell time.

Noted. Thank you tdub

 

[John Lewus]

I found this link interesting... It is about the safety concerns of the SG product line being addressed by the people who created SG. "http://www.simplegreen.com/solutions_public_awareness.php#cbc7"
Here is an excerpt
"“Greenwashing.” This has been a recently published opinion of us and our product Simple Green. While we respect the rights of folks to have and share their opinions, we also appreciate the opportunity to respond and share some facts on this issue..."

Nice find. I recently bought a big jug of this and was regretting it. I feel a bit better now. I use it for daily soaks an and that works well.