HERBIE 510 Stainless Steel Mesh Vaporizer

PPN

TopGreen X-Max Representative
Company Rep
Got better replicable results this evening, I didn't want to increase the power since I got good hits before... so keeping the power between 28-35w I gave it another try and found the airflow adjustment have to be 1mm open, not more, in order to get a good clouds production. Now I master it very well with nice clouds&taste and evenly roasted abv without any scortched load (no blackened herb), although I stir, I'll try a no stirring load but I don't think it can do that without to scorch the load. Happy to get the hang out of my HB510 cause despite to not be a very portable device (paired with the Movkin it's pretty heavy in hand) it may be a nice "portable at home" to vape in the garden.
 

oddjobold

510 Vaporist
@PPN sorry I missed your question earlier. I think I am getting about 3/4 bowls per battery on my P80. Not great, but swapping batteries is easy.

I gave the Herbie another go and results were poor no visable vapor. Bit disappointing. Was still medicated though so could have been the light, was outside at the time.

I then changed the coil. I used one of the strips provided with the Herbie. It was about 5 to 10mm longer than the strip installed. Rather than the plan up and down of the coil installed, I went for a much more rounded bulbous shape. I tested with the chamber installed to make sure I was not touching the sides. Very close but not touching. Definatley better perfromance.

I think @Vape Engineering went on the safe side when installing the stock coil. They made it small and up and down so no chances of shorts. I think if your carefull you can squeeze a bigger coil inside, with better performance. I do think a thicker mesh would potentially work better, but not sure where to start as there are so many.
 

Vape Engineering

Manufacturer
Manufacturer
Hey folks,



first of all, sorry for the late reply. We will of course answer all questions, but this takes a little time at the moment. Since several angry users have already written to us, maybe here again as an explanation. We're just two dudes who have developed a vaporizer for e-cigars besides their full-time jobs. We try to answer all questions as soon as possible, but we still have a lot of hurdles to overcome (for example: How do I build a website, how do I set up an online store, where do I have to correctly specify the tax for an invoice, how do I integrate payment, shipping, ..... - these are all things we are just learning and we hope you understand. Unfortunately, Germany is very strict in this respect, so our focus is on doing everything right) We can only tell you that we read and answer every message, even if it sometimes takes a bit longer. I don't want to cry here, but I just want to let you know that we are doing everything in our power to satisfy every customer.

Also the project Herbie was never planned as it is now. We developed Herbie just for us. Only at the urging of some friends we decided to produce a few units, because there might be several people who would like to have a vaporizer in typical E-Cig look.

Personally, it makes me a little sad to read the messages of some users. We understand, of course, that it's very annoying to wait for an answer. But would it have been better to keep Herbie from the public?

So now enough with the bad mood. Let's get to your questions and suggestions:

- First of all: @ sashka69 I am glad to see that you managed to get good results with Herbie :) I also think it's great to see that you have found mesh that we have never seen before (I mean the Vandy Vape mesh. We'll have to give it a few tries as well)



- Price: Yes we know that Herbie with 150 € is not cheap. But Herbie in the basic version consists of 11 stainless steel parts, which were all made in Germany (in the south of Bavaria, near Munich). We have neither the means nor the capacity to order large quantities. Even 50 units still fall into the category "small series". Therefore we already have very high production costs. If it were possible to offer Herbie at a lower price, we would of course do so. But we don't want to produce in cheaper countries like most manufacturers do, because we would lose control of the quality.



- Loose screws: We had not considered this point, but it is very possible that the screws for the heating mesh loosen during transport. Please tighten the screws for the mesh again before using it for the first time.



- Tracking: Some people told us that the tracking numbers are not correct. But the tracking numbers are correct. Strangely they only work on the German DHL website. We are working on the problem that they also work for the international DHL website. Until then, please check your tracking numbers on the German DHL website. (For those who did not receive a tracking number, please check your spam folders) The tracking number is automatically generated and sent by our system after payment.



- Drip Tips: We buy the Drip Tips from a reseller. We also had quality problems with our first order. On the second delivery we checked 10 randomly selected Drip Tips and found them to be in order. If yours are not ok, please send us an email (info@vapeengineering.com) and you will get a replacement. But again about the Drip Tips themselves: In the beginning we had planned DripTips made of plastic. On the feedback of some users, we decided to offer stainless steel DripTips. We got the feedback that stainless steel gets too hot. The suggestion to us was to use glass with stainless steel, which we did. And the glass is glued into the stainless steel base. At least I don't know of any other way to combine steel with stainless steel.



In short: You are of course right that such drip tips do not work. We are going to look for another one. If you have already found something, we would be happy if you let us know.



- Box-Mods: @PPN please do not use the Tesla battery carrier. This has only one 18650 battery. Additionally the chip / software of this box mod is not very good and can only deliver the power needed to run Herbie when the battery is fully charged. As written before we would recommend:

Uwell Nunchaku 2 (1x 21700)

Wismec Reuleaux RX Gen3 Dual Mod (2x 18650)

Wismec Reuleaux RX2 (2x21700)

- Maintenance: Unfortunately I have to agree with you in this respect. Herbie is not very "comfortable". But there will probably not be a version two in the near future, because we simply don't have the time and money for it.



- UserManual: We have only added a "short user manual" to Herbie. A detailed manual (German and English) can be found on our website.


(We know that it still has some minor bugs, but it is being updated and the latest version is always online)



- Screens: Thank you very much for the hint that the screen is too coarse for you. We have not noticed that yet. But we will see if we can order finer screens somewhere. Thanks @oddjobblod ! also for the quick fix tip with two screens



- Loose Air Control Ring: Yes we know that the ring is not very tight. But we couldn't think of a better solution than to fix it with an O-ring. Nevertheless it should not be so loose that it just falls off. Is the O-ring possibly damaged?



- Start setup: Yes we wanted to be on the safe side with the short mesh. We also stated that you should start with about 30 watts. So nothing will be burned at the first time usage. It would be very annoying if you put your herbs in Herbie and they will combust you. Therefore our suggestion was to start slowly at a low value and then work your way up until you find a suitable setup for you. My personal setup on the Nunchaku 2 is: 55 Watt, air holes about half open. Resistance ~0,25 ohm. I always give Herbie 1-2 seconds preheating time. Only then I start to pull. I pull slowly but steadily. This way I get the best results for me.



- TCR setup: Unfortunately we have only been able to get TCR working with the stainless steel mesh. We had to flash the Wismec Reuleaux RX Gen3 Dual with a new firmware. At about 400°C (at the coil) and a faster pulling speed (air holes about 2/3 open) we achieved the best results. We used the software "MyEvic" for this. If you want to have a manual, please let us know. But we would like to point out that the warranty of the BoxMod will be lost if you flash the firmware.



- General manuals and videos: We mentioned before, we are working on a solution how we can show ourselves on explanation videos without getting into problems with the law. You can watch a low-temp video with the WPA adapter here:



I hope that I have not missed anything. If I have, just write to us. In urgent cases, just write us an email. We process the emails every day after work in our main job. As written above we try to answer your questions as often as possible.



Thanks for your patience.

Nils
 

VaporWare

Well-Known Member
@Vape Engineering I thought you had plans to distribute them more widely, but I understand where you’re coming from better now. I hope my post didn’t seem too negative; I really want to see the Herbie do well for you and for everyone who buys one. :)

I am at least happy to see people learning how to get great results from it, and I think most people are going to be happy with theirs after a couple of tweaks!

I know that releasing something like this and having some negative feedback is hard, but I think you guys have done a good job and with the tip and maybe the mesh switched out it’s something I would still be interested in.

Congratulations on your first shipment! Please don’t be discouraged or too upset about the negative feedback. I think it’s going to get better soon. :) :peace:
 

oddjobold

510 Vaporist
I had another disappointing session with the herbie. Seems like i can get vapor on a new bowl, but get nothing when trying to finish the bowl. The herb is still green. I must conclude it's not getting hot enough. I can only go to 45w on my P80 before it complains of low battery.

If I had know you needed a 2 battery mod or a new mod that take bigger batteries, I would never have brought this. My splinter Z has a huge heater and never has this problem.

Now I continue down this road and fork out more money or pass the Herbie on?
 

sashka69

Well-Known Member
Today my stainless steel 810 drip tip arrived. It's a bit shorter than the oem glass drip tip but it fits very snug and keeps pleasantly cool when using outside. It is very thin so it cools down very fast. But I'm not 100% happy about it because it's 5mm too short in my opinion and feels cheap on my lips.
So I will contact @Vape Engineering via mail as he suggested.
By the way, my top cap oring is intact as far as I can tell while it is installed. Because I have no spare o rings i won't mess with them. Just in case it breaks while observing, then I'm screwed.


Today I took my ecig rig with me (what I always do) and only the herbie, already loaded with a capsule, but without its nunchaku 2 mod. So it was very portable. On my way home I switched my atomizer against herbie and was ready to Vape. I wished I had a smell proof bag for it so I had to use a plastic bag instead.

Since I very often turn around my capsule/reducer clockwise as alternative to stirring, I'm very happy about my Vape Band aka silicone anti-slip ring because it helds my top cap airflow ring in place PLUS it keeps the right airflow setting. Especially in the dark this is a nice feature so it's always set correct even when you carried Herbie in your pocket and have to attach it blindly.

I found a second silicone anti-slip ring which I installed between the two body parts so it secures my preferred body airflow setting as well.
These silicone anti-slip rings should be sold on your web shop or shipped together with herbie. They help me a lot in terms of convenience because I never changed my airflow again when I found my sweet spot setting.


Needless to say I came home and was very baked. Thanks herbie!

Tomorrow my 'beefy' vandyvape mesh coils arrive but I'm a little bit afraid of using them.

Although they're one of the widest (17mm) available I'm confused how they will perform. I took a ruler and realized how small they are in comparison to the stock mesh coils herbie use. I hope the airflow design is good enough because this new coil will heat up my coil deck in no time and there is soooo much space between the coil and the herbs... I have my doubts.
 

oddjobold

510 Vaporist
So I was thinking - two claptons in a stempod or imp never overpowered my mod. So that is what I have gone for. Will report back when it arrives and is fitted. I am also thinking I can get those claptons right close to the screen. Perhaps when the herb gets sucked up to the top screen it's too far away from the heat. Reducer is also on the way.
 

sashka69

Well-Known Member
This is an excellent idea. Maybe tonight I'll give this a try. Will report back also.


Edit: impressive.

This dual fused clapton coils read 0.20 ohm. Nothing special.
IMG_20201104_012144.jpg

IMG_20201104_011515.jpg

IMG_20201104_011451.jpg

45W - 60W and the clouds are much denser then the mesh coil setup.
The dimensions (height and width) are identical to my prior modded mesh screen.

First try. Always capsuled. 45w first hit very terpy. Second hit very cloudy. Third hit at 50w and it is almost at mighty level.


When this is the status quo I have to call 'improvements complete' then I would agree with.

It was a long way but now I'm where I wanted to be. The coils seems to be very robust compared to the stock mesh screen so I don't have to fear unexpected vaporization of the mesh and they will have a long life time.
I will report back when I tested the vandy vape mesh screens which arrive tomorrow but this can take a while as I want to keep the current coils until they 'die'.
 
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PPN

TopGreen X-Max Representative
Company Rep
Hi, happy to see you back @Vape Engineering , I didn't got the time to read your whole message but I'll do it. I just want to add I gave it a try in TC mode and it was very better, although the mod I use (Movkin) is old and don't get a very good TC feature, it offers the classicals Ni, Ti and SS mode and another CC mode (ceramic maybe). I gave it a try in SS mode but it didn't worked, no vapor from 410 to 500 and I gave it a try in this CC mode and thing was a lot better, nice clouds for a small load and I'm especially happy about the taste which was'nt good in power mode, here I can taste the flowers. So here my suggestions for others, give it a try in TC mode.

Although, like many others, I'm pretty disappointed especially about price and size, it looks like it's a very DIY idea pushed a bit further, for me it works but I wouldn't recommand it at this point. I'll investigate about the @KeroZen large mesh suggestion in order to avoid to vaporize the mesh itself. I think the bad taste in power mode is coming of that specific issue, so this is important to advertise peoples to use TC mode only, giving them whole setup informations for proper use with a mod box. Airflow adjustment could be refined also by computing the right air amount to match differents vaping styles, full free airflow didn't worked for me, maybe it could work if I increased power/T° but I don't want to do that

So if you want to continue that experience and I hope you'll do it, you have to get all the testers feedbacks in order to apply the change needed in order to get a nice unit for sale. I think there is some potential but, please, try to reduce size and weight, I think you may use stainless which is half less thick than it is for now, work on something sleeker also cause atm it's very crude design. The large mesh advice is important for safe use, as well the right setup informations, maybe the larger mesh gauge will fix that and we will be able to use it in power mode, for now TC mode seems safer. I understand prototypes and low size batch increased the unit's cost but you have to reduce the pricetag... imho.

If the 150€ we payed can help this unit to become a better one I would accept the loss... I just hope we'll got the next redesigned production unit. Don't give up please, you are not alone in the 510 vaping scene, please give a look at the competition to get an idea. I like how the mesh give me an evenly roasted abv, for now I always stirred but I'll try without to stir. Yesterday evening, TC mode (Cc), 3 small pinch (1/3 of the bowl's size) of a mix Grandaddy Confidential + GG, got a dozen of low temp hits which was surprisingly thick and smooth starting at 410 and finishing at 440, when I unloaded it the abv was evenly roasted but with still plenty of life in it, I think the large vaping area and mesh screen heater are parts of this succesfull low temp hits. More to come!
 
PPN,
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VaporWare

Well-Known Member
...Although, like many others, I'm pretty disappointed especially about price and size, it looks like it's a very DIY idea pushed a bit further, for me it works but I wouldn't recommand it at this point. I'll investigate about the @KeroZen large mesh suggestion in order to avoid to vaporize the mesh itself. I think the bad taste in power mode is coming of that specific issue, so this is important to advertise peoples to use TC mode only, giving them whole setup informations for proper use with a mod box. Airflow adjustment could be refined also by computing the right air amount to match differents vaping styles, full free airflow didn't worked for me, maybe it could work if I increased power/T° but I don't want to do that...
So if you want to continue that experience and I hope you'll do it, you have to get all the testers feedbacks in order to apply the change needed in order to get a nice unit for sale. I think there is some potential but, please, try to reduce size and weight, I think you may use stainless which is half less thick than it is for now, work on something sleeker also cause atm it's very crude design. The large mesh advice is important for safe use, as well the right setup informations, maybe the larger mesh gauge will fix that and we will be able to use it in power mode, for now TC mode seems safer. I understand prototypes and low size batch increased the unit's cost but you have to reduce the pricetag... imho.

If the 150€ we payed can help this unit to become a better one I would accept the loss... I just hope we'll got the next redesigned production unit.

Also the project Herbie was never planned as it is now. We developed Herbie just for us. Only at the urging of some friends we decided to produce a few units, because there might be several people who would like to have a vaporizer in typical E-Cig look.

...

- Price: Yes we know that Herbie with 150 € is not cheap. But Herbie in the basic version consists of 11 stainless steel parts, which were all made in Germany (in the south of Bavaria, near Munich). We have neither the means nor the capacity to order large quantities. Even 50 units still fall into the category "small series". Therefore we already have very high production costs. If it were possible to offer Herbie at a lower price, we would of course do so. But we don't want to produce in cheaper countries like most manufacturers do, because we would lose control of the quality.

...

- Maintenance: Unfortunately I have to agree with you in this respect. Herbie is not very "comfortable". But there will probably not be a version two in the near future, because we simply don't have the time and money for it.
 

SixStringToker

I'm not wearing any socks!!
Has anyone in the US received their Herbie yet? My tracking info shows that it passed through Frankfurt/Flughafen, Germany on the Oct 30th... and then nothing. This is the same thing that the tracking info for my Glow RCV 18 shows; it passed through Frankfurt/Flughafen, Germany on the Oct 13th... and then nothing.

Is DHL shipping to the US from Germany normally this slow?
 
SixStringToker,

shopdognyc

Well-Known Member
@SixStringToker i experienced the same thing. I believe they ship out with DHL and it gets passed over to the regular post office. Its probably coming over slowboat.

I was told maybe 6 weeks with their method from Dreamwood. I imagine the same from Herbie.
 

oddjobold

510 Vaporist
Okay I really have got the Herbie working better.

1) I double screened the top and bottom of the chamber. My drip tip screen was clogging before, causing air flow problems. Does not happen anymore. Likewise no scobbies on the coil. Hope the reducer helps here as well, when I get it.

2) Got a nice new steel drip tip. Does not get hot for me.

3) Replaced the mesh with claptons. Setup similar to @sashka69 photos. Normal claptons not fused. Don't expect it makes much difference which you use.

4) Now using standard top - not bypass. One less factor to worry about. Airflow seems fine as it is. Now also shorter.

5) I think I had a bad 18650. That's why I was getting low battery. It was a random pink Samsung one. Not sure where it came from. Went in the bin. Using a HG2s instead.

Its like a different vape. Its gone from a vape I was going to sell, to something I want to keep. It's very stealth, looks like an ecig.

I think basically the mesh supplied is rubbish.

Very baked right now. Need to try and look sober for the wife. Wish me luck.
 
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TastyCakeWasTasty

butter your wood
4) Now using standard top - not bypass. One less factor to worry about. Airflow seems fine as it is. Now also shorter.

5) I think I had a bad 18650. That's why I was getting low battery. It was a random pink Samsung one. Not sure where it came from. Went in the bin. Using a HG2s instead.
Very baked right now. Need to try and look sober for the wife. Wish me luck.
Happy to hear you’ve been able to get her going. How hot is the vapour now you’re using the standard mouthpiece? Are you still using the the P80 (single battery) mod?
And of course, good luck :lol:
 

oddjobold

510 Vaporist
Happy to hear you’ve been able to get her going. How hot is the vapour now you’re using the standard mouthpiece? Are you still using the the P80 (single battery) mod?
And of course, good luck :lol:

The vapor was not that hot. I only had one go last night so more testing to be done. Yes still using my P80. I just ordered a smoant Ladon from fastech. I have a bit of a thing for smoant mods.

P.S. I did not get in trouble. A nice dinner helped I think.
 

oddjobold

510 Vaporist
Wake and bake, 2nd go on the new setup. It's still good! The difference from before is quite astonishing.

I might actually move back to the bypass as I found myself coughing from the thickness of the vapor. Once I do I will report back.

@PPN would suggest you give claptons a go. The stock mesh is not up to the job in my opinion.

I have some thicker mesh coils coming in a slow boat from China. Similar to what @KeroZen suggested.


I really don't know if these will be any good. However for science I will give them a go! :science:
 

PPN

TopGreen X-Max Representative
Company Rep
Wake and bake, 2nd go on the new setup. It's still good! The difference from before is quite astonishing.

I might actually move back to the bypass as I found myself coughing from the thickness of the vapor. Once I do I will report back.

@PPN would suggest you give claptons a go. The stock mesh is not up to the job in my opinion.

I have some thicker mesh coils coming in a slow boat from China. Similar to what @KeroZen suggested.


I really don't know if these will be any good. However for science I will give them a go! :science:

Thank you for sharing, last day I dismantled my HB in order to clean it... there was some tiny herb dust around I wipped out, accidentaly I touch the mesh and flatened it slightly... next time I powered the unit on, before to re-assemble everything, I can saw the mesh burning and cutted in 2 exactly by the middle like it was cut with scissors, I installed a new mesh, it appears I have some different size mesh screens, I tried to cut a mesh in and it seems to work as well or maybe better than the stock one.
I tried the Jetstream's clapton coils and I got hardly any vapor, got some at 45w, device remains to be very hot... I don't understand cause clapton coils in the Imp are working very well with 25w only. I tried a DTV3 donut , similar vapor production than the stock mesh.

I don't think I'll keep that HB510, butthere is definitively some potential... I'll give it another try, maybe using thicker mesh or others clapton's coils... is it possible to use 2 mesh, one slightly shorter and the other slightly longer?

Did you noticed the air inlets aren't well positionned? too high imho... so I inverted the main part with air inlets down, there is a gap between the base and this part, it doesn't screw down completly so I added an o-ring for a good seal (this is add a nice style touch too), this o-ring helps to keep the air inlets settings, it doesn't move free like before. I added another o-ring between the 2 parts of the bowl to avoid fresh air to be pulled directly from the air inlets to the mouthpiece although it appear the seal is done only with the top lid in place (it doesn't screw fully in the base side but apply some pressure down on the top of the bowl)... not sure if you understand me but, even with all this mods, I don't get the hits I want in term of taste, clouds and extraction level, in short when i have a good taste, clouds and extraction sucks and when I have good clouds the taste sucks. It may be possible to adjust everything for a perfect balance betwenn taste&clouds but I'm pretty tired to fiddle with that boy!
 

oddjobold

510 Vaporist
Thank you for sharing, last day I dismantled my HB in order to clean it... there was some tiny herb dust around I wipped out, accidentaly I touch the mesh and flatened it slightly... next time I powered the unit on, before to re-assemble everything, I can saw the mesh burning and cutted in 2 exactly by the middle like it was cut with scissors, I installed a new mesh, it appears I have some different size mesh screens, I tried to cut a mesh in and it seems to work as well or maybe better than the stock one.
I tried the Jetstream's clapton coils and I got hardly any vapor, got some at 45w, device remains to be very hot... I don't understand cause clapton coils in the Imp are working very well with 25w only. I tried a DTV3 donut , similar vapor production than the stock mesh.

I don't think I'll keep that HB510, butthere is definitively some potential... I'll give it another try, maybe using thicker mesh or others clapton's coils... is it possible to use 2 mesh, one slightly shorter and the other slightly longer?

Did you noticed the air inlets aren't well positionned? too high imho... so I inverted the main part with air inlets down, there is a gap between the base and this part, it doesn't screw down completly so I added an o-ring for a good seal (this is add a nice style touch too), this o-ring helps to keep the air inlets settings, it doesn't move free like before. I added another o-ring between the 2 parts of the bowl to avoid fresh air to be pulled directly from the air inlets to the mouthpiece although it appear the seal is done only with the top lid in place (it doesn't screw fully in the base side but apply some pressure down on the top of the bowl)... not sure if you understand me but, even with all this mods, I don't get the hits I want in term of taste, clouds and extraction level, in short when i have a good taste, clouds and extraction sucks and when I have good clouds the taste sucks. It may be possible to adjust everything for a perfect balance betwenn taste&clouds but I'm pretty tired to fiddle with that boy
I am getting good taste and extraction. I hope I can get yours working as well as mine @PPN

Did you raise your claptons off the deck slightly? I should have gone in to more detail - sorry.

I took a screwdriver and marked off how far to the screen in that middle part. Then i measured the screwdriver. I have my coils 6 wraps, and only slightly shorter than my measurement. I think the wire was 24/32. I suggest making your own coils as you can get everything just so. I use 32-40w. I never have to go above 40w.

My Herbie is now a total beast. Before I was totally disappointed like you. @sashka69 how are you liking the claptons?
 

sashka69

Well-Known Member
I love my fused claptons. Needless to say my herbie is a capsule ripping beast now but I have to admit my herbie gets hotter than before.
I use 55-65w now.

I will build a higher v2 clapton setup this evening as I want to play with the space between capsule and coils. Less space means less power, at least I think so.

My goal is to achieve less wattage and maybe a serious Tcr while using Ss316l wire with maybe 0.3mm space between coils and capsule.

Now I take herbie on its nunchaku, 3 capsules and a fresh battery, going for a walk with my girlfriend. Therefore I intended to buy herbie.
 
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oddjobold

510 Vaporist
My search for the perfect coil continues!

I am thinking that something very close to the RBT mesh would be best. Unfortunately nothing is sold like this specifically for vaping. All the mesh for vaping is very fine, not ideal for dry herb imo, okay if covered in e-juice.

So I have been looking for 316L mesh. I have seen a Milaana heater before when my glass came lose. I have settled on this:


Looks roughly the same. Obviously will need to be cut in to strips. What do u think? The picture with the hand gives you the best idea.
 
oddjobold,
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sashka69

Well-Known Member
I wrote an email to Nils and Til because the screw broke the last time I changed the coil. The screwdriver turns but the screw does not move. I also asked for a new drip tip and O-rings, offered them to pay a little amount for all this stuff because I want more than 2 screws and O-rings. I wrote the mail on the weekend. No response so far. I hope @Vape Engineering is still reading.
 
sashka69,

shopdognyc

Well-Known Member
I know that they mean well, but response from the past is they are watching but too busy to respond since this is their hobby.

I would email them instead, but I wouldn't hold your breath.
 
shopdognyc,

Lozo

Well-Known Member
My Air-Bypass collar kept falling off so I used a 1.2 mm O-ring (19mm ID) and it works way better, once the collar is pushed onto the O-ring it's held firmly in place, almost too hard to turn, but I guess once a happy position is found it can just stay there. A 1.1 mm O-ring I think would be perfect but I couldn't find any. I'm keen to try out different coils soon, thanks @oddjobold for the info above.
 
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