HerbalTherm 5CH (510 conduction heater for 2XV and Dyna VapCap)

Shit Snacks

Milaana. Lana. LANA. LANAAAAA! (TM/FW7/OAB/CC-H&A)
Alright looks like this project will actually precede the 2XV, which is still in development, provide feedback here or on Instagram:

From the makers:
"So the 2XV will catch a back seat to some technology that Ryan's been incubating since early 2019... a 510 vapcap heater ... many have tried the 510 conduction heater with limited success as it is a challenge to do it quickly with a reasonable wattage.... He believes he found a simple yet elegant solution, that balances some physics in the head of a pin, but achieves better than a 15 second initial heat-up with sub 10 second subsequent heat-ups at sub 50 watts... seems like competitive numbers compared to the induction heaters today.

Please answer the following questions for development of the 5CH.... teaser image below.....

1. What are the top 3 things that you would want a 510 VapCap heater to do / be?

2. Given the assumption of around a 10 second heat-up time and decent battery life, what would be a fair MSRP for the base model? and what would you expect to pay for a unit with a stabilized wood surround?

3. Given that this has been tried before, is there a reason that this product would not sell or what detractors will folks have with it (why does this idea suck)?

Screenshot-20211026-133549.png


Thanks again FC family!"
 
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Aryeah

Vape Man
This looks really intriguing. I would use one for my dynavaps. I wish instead of a wood some kind of light that would glow when in use maybe clear acrylic?. I think making it a size that would fit on some of the slimmer 510 mod boxes. A temp regulator so you don't combust.

the price? hmm.. maybe $75 to $100 dollars depending on the wood choice

The only thing I could think of is also having to purchase a 510 box mod to attach it to.
 

cx714

Space Invader
It’s tricky bc the vapcap accessory market has really taken off. Enthusiasts either have an IH at this point or have decided they like the fine control of a flame. Not to mention the advent of temp sensing induction, which is close to launch from at least one maker.

As a consumer, I’d wonder what this offers that either of the 2 dominant solutions (IH & flame) don’t. I guess if Ryan could pull off temperature control via conduction heat, that’d be worth paying for.

I’ve already got a box mod, but price point is key. Heater plus mod plus batteries plus charger as a package has to compete with a standalone portable IH— the iSpire wand is $170 at Vgoodiez.

If an affordable mod and minimum battery package comes in at ~$75 (total spitball), I reckon you’d have to come in at <$100 to be competitive and, given that it’s kind of old tech, a fair bit less than that to be attractive.

Good luck!
 

oddjobold

510 Vaporist
I have tried "the beast".

It was slow to click, and provided a crappy hit. It had a over roasted taste.

if you can't hit 10 secs per hit, you can't compete with a IH.

Having recently acquired the wand, not all vapcap heaters provide the same quality hit. That's why the wand is good because you can adjust your vapcap position to customise your hit.

Yes size would be smaller with a single battery mod, bit I found with the beast not worth the compromise.

This is not something I can get excited about.
 

jasp3r

Well-Known Member
I have tried "the beast".

It was slow to click, and provided a crappy hit. It had a over roasted taste.

if you can't hit 10 secs per hit, you can't compete with a IH.

Having recently acquired the wand, not all vapcap heaters provide the same quality hit. That's why the wand is good because you can adjust your vapcap position to customise your hit.

Yes size would be smaller with a single battery mod, bit I found with the beast not worth the compromise.

This is not something I can get excited about.
Couldn't agree more just didn't want to say it on IG. I know I have no use for another IH after I got the wand and given my mods are all usally populated with a Splinter or another 510 so don't know why I would slap my vapcap on it. I thought he was going to make a portable Woodscents but nope. Feels like this is a cash grab but could be wrong.
 

oddjobold

510 Vaporist
Things I would like to see Ryan make.

1) Splinter V2. Splinter without the glass.
2) Something like a tiny might, very portable RBT HSA heater, regulated.
3) HSA heater in SBS combo with a mod like unklmark makes
4) HSA log.
 
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Shit Snacks

Milaana. Lana. LANA. LANAAAAA! (TM/FW7/OAB/CC-H&A)
Couldn't agree more just didn't want to say it on IG. I know I have no use for another IH after I got the wand and given my mods are all usally populated with a Splinter or another 510 so don't know why I would slap my vapcap on it.

Your feedback is good! I think that's what he wants to hear, remember this is not actually IH though...

I thought he was going to make a portable Woodscents but nope. Feels like this is a cash grab but could be wrong.

Huh? You mean a portable log, like the Splinter and Milaana already are? Originally plan was to make the desktop first, on demand log rather, just curious why you expected something like a portable WS haha

Things I would like to see Ryan make.

1) Splinter V2. Splinter without the glass.
I don't think this will ever happen, maybe with a different shell, but you're not going to see a splinter heater with wood and no glass lining (need to look to CosmicXtractor or iHeat for that feature)
2) Something like a tiny might, very portable RBT HSA heater, regulated.
Yeah I think the ultimate goal is to make a mass production Milaana without the wood, but it is very involved and expensive, not sure regulation will be possible though...
3) HSA heater in SBS combo with a mod like unklmark makes
4) HSA log.
Yeah never going to see 3) from Ryan either, only from Mark (and Cosmic) but on demand HSA log is still a goal as well, but yeah there's been a lot of hurdles with production, might be possible to make a metal one without any wood though...

And I wouldn't say cash grab per se, but yeah that is the problem, this 5CH is something that can be produced for less money and sold to make more money since it could feed an existing large market of Dyna enthusiasts, to help fund the other products... Because there is just not enough demand, not enough cash flow, for these other ideas, they seem more interesting to people like you and me here, but it seems like that is the extent of the market for him lol ...trying to upscale production for any of the above seems to be extremely difficult??
 

jasp3r

Well-Known Member
Your feedback is good! I think that's what he wants to hear, remember this is not actually IH though...



Huh? You mean a portable log, like the Splinter and Milaana already are? Originally plan was to make the desktop first, on demand log rather, just curious why you expected something like a portable WS haha
Yeah I was surprised people agreed so much with me his post lol. But yes it's not an IH but it's still a Vapcap heater, how different can it really be?

And No when I saw Ryan sticking a dynatip into the heater I thought it was gonna work as a handheld portable vape that functions like the Woodscents but in a much smaller form factor. Now that would interest me. I completely thought he was going to release a convection complement to Vapcaps not just another heater.
 

Shit Snacks

Milaana. Lana. LANA. LANAAAAA! (TM/FW7/OAB/CC-H&A)
No when I saw Ryan sticking a dynatip into the heater I thought it was gonna work as a handheld portable vape that functions like the Woodscents but in a much smaller form factor. Now that would interest me. I completely thought he was going to release a convection complement to Vapcaps not just another heater.

All right, so I think you hit upon the planned secret bonus functionality of 5CH actually! Ryan mentioned it, wasn't sure if I should, so I was waiting for someone else to ask... :cool:
 

jasp3r

Well-Known Member
All right, so I think you hit upon the planned secret bonus functionality of 5CH actually! Ryan mentioned it, wasn't sure if I should, so I was waiting for someone else to ask... :cool:
Ok so in theory a conduction version of this like he is planning wouldn't be that great for it.

You need to use an injector style in my experience to create a convection hit from an uncapped Dyna tip (Just like woodscents). 1 Hot core that is roughly dynavap shaped would do the trick but not if it's a flat bottom inside the chamber. But it just seems tad silly to go after IH market. So many other IH that won't require a mod are already on the market. Going after convection hits from a dynavap now adds versatility to people who are normal vapcap users.
 

oddjobold

510 Vaporist
So let me get this straight. You stick your vapcap in with out a cap and get convection hits?

That's more interesting, but I would imagine there would still be a hell of a lot of conduction would be going on. I don't like conduction.

Still not enough not get me excited, think I would be sitting on the fence waiting for others to give their verdict.

Sometimes its hard to get a constructive review on FC. Lots of people have VAS addictions, and lots of people like me suffer from a honeymoon period. Oh well.

I shall keep one eye on this thread, and keep dreaming of my splinter V2.
 
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jasp3r

Well-Known Member
So let me get this straight. You stick your vapcap in with out a cap and get convection hits?

That's more interesting, but I would imagine there would still be a hell of a lot of conduction would be going on. I don't like conduction.

Still not enough not get me excited, think I would be sitting on the fence waiting for others to give their verdict.
Well no, his design I believe it is gonna end up with a 70 ?? percent conduction hit.. something like Woodscents though do provide a Convection hit. Hell, Ed sells portable adapter so you can use a USB C powerbank to power your log.

All in all this just seems a tiny bit silly and I know I'm not alone in that feeling. It would be easier to get excited about a new product or refresh rather than fixing a problem there are already many, many solutions to...

I don't think Dyna fans will jump on this due to needing a mod. Most people avoid 510 dry herb vapes (Hell I know I did) becuase I didn't want to deal with mods. I just find it very hard to believe people will want to trade it in for a USBC pocked IH with 100 clicks and a Magnet. And an unregulated version of this probbaly wouln't perfrom very well.
 

Shit Snacks

Milaana. Lana. LANA. LANAAAAA! (TM/FW7/OAB/CC-H&A)
Yeah I don't know, also a Dyna cooling stem prototype being tested now, here is an early prototype for it and an early conceptual 5CH:
 
Shit Snacks,

Kinick23

Well-Known Member
what’s the smallest IH on the mkt currently? The main allure for me on this concept would be producing a 510 heater that’s small enough to fit on the tiniest of mods to make it super pocketable (similar in size to a lighter though not sure from an engineering perspective if that’s possible)
Would prefer to see him take the dyna the convection route, or more so dreaming of a regulated milaana form factor. A man can dream right?
 

Abysmal Vapor

fuckmylife.com :D :D :D
what’s the smallest IH on the mkt currently? The main allure for me on this concept would be producing a 510 heater that’s small enough to fit on the tiniest of mods to make it super pocketable (similar in size to a lighter though not sure from an engineering perspective if that’s possible)
Would prefer to see him take the dyna the convection route, or more so dreaming of a regulated milaana form factor. A man can dream right?
510 induction heater is not going to happen unless some makes a 510 base from materials that wont be affected by induction heating ,also far enough from the mod electronics too.
@Farid (below) I hope the coil and the heat from it wont get the o-ring area on the tip too hot,cause they are still in the airpath.
 
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Abysmal Vapor,
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Farid

Well-Known Member
What's the benefit of this over an induction heater? I would think that the contact you'd need between the cap and the heating element would just increase the likelihood of your cap accidentally being pulled off.
 
Farid,

RastaBuddhaTao

Well-Known Member
Manufacturer
Super excited about this one! Fits easy in your pocket, cost less than an induction heater, can vary the heat intensity, can vary the amount of conduction / convection vapor ratio and can adjust the amount of heat up and down the tip.... and with some luck a mini 510 woodsent....but yeh @jasp3r your right..... stupid idea that won't work and no one will buy :)

New forum coming soon to herbaltherm.com for all positive polite friendly synergistic customers.... approximately 5.3 % of FC :)


Love your all sooopp hard
 
RastaBuddhaTao,

jasp3r

Well-Known Member
and with some luck a mini 510 woodsent....but yeh @jasp3r your right..... stupid idea that won't work and no one will buy :)
Just trying to offer feedback and not really sure where I said that.. It's a forum of enthusiasts that enjoy your creations. As a fellow engineer, I know darn well how helpful constructive criticism and an outside perspective is. We would not be commenting if we weren't interested in one way or another.

Everyone here has been friendly, at least on this thread.
 
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