Thanks! It's a starting point anyways!
Divine Tribe atty's
- Thread starter divinetribe
- Start date
OF
Well-Known Member
Gentle Friends,
Another troubleshooting tip for you. OK, the sad story of my troubles.....which hopefully you can avoid.
I have two units to play with so even though I can't use it yet I decided to confirm the second one was ready to go. After a bit of fiddling (again, lead screws and the center screw/saddle thing is important to getting the resistance down under .3 Ohms so it will work.
However, adding the 'new' heatsink/extension gave some problems. Random jumps to Power (default) and a couple of strange errors along the way. Again, I have the luxury of a working unit.......which comes of course with the change of two dead units and no ideas.......
I traced it down to a burr on the screw slot at the bottom. A thin, sharp edge had been raised and the contact was being made through it? Not good. We're talking very serious currents here, a dozen Amps or more (it changes as it heats and the resistance goes up). Normally that means a copper wire thicker than a kitchen match, we have no margin for dicey contacts. Changes as they heat and change size/shape are sure to raise hobb.
A couple light strokes on 600 grit SiC paper set it straight. Anything that removes the burr if you have one (razor blade, nail file?) should work.
Another insight is we're really hammering the poor 18650 and Mod here. Seriously. And it concerns me. To get to the 60 Watts or so we need means we're taking close to 20 Amps when the voltage 'sags' under the heavy load. 20 Amp (continuous) is basically state of the art. Electric Car battery components. There are, near as I can tell, no such thing as a 30 Amp continuous 18650, guys trying to sell them sometimes list the momentary rating but we're not momentary here. Nor are we taking few second hits like the e-cig guys (where there's time to recover and cool off) so their experience/advice is to be taken with a gram or two of salt. Avoiding 'weak battery' faults in the Mod (where the voltage drops too low and it crashes out) is going to be a factor in selection of 18650s. Only some of the otherwise top picks will work well. Rather than pushing it right to the wall to work, I've ordered a eVic Mini Dual to use. Same as the Mini but with twice the 18650s on board so each works half as hard.
Now I have two good units and some different waxes to try.....only wish the flu would leave my throat be so I can move on.
That screw is another place to look at if you have problems. Normally you'd ignore it once installed and obsess on the cart proper like I did? Regards to all.
OF
Another troubleshooting tip for you. OK, the sad story of my troubles.....which hopefully you can avoid.
I have two units to play with so even though I can't use it yet I decided to confirm the second one was ready to go. After a bit of fiddling (again, lead screws and the center screw/saddle thing is important to getting the resistance down under .3 Ohms so it will work.
However, adding the 'new' heatsink/extension gave some problems. Random jumps to Power (default) and a couple of strange errors along the way. Again, I have the luxury of a working unit.......which comes of course with the change of two dead units and no ideas.......
I traced it down to a burr on the screw slot at the bottom. A thin, sharp edge had been raised and the contact was being made through it? Not good. We're talking very serious currents here, a dozen Amps or more (it changes as it heats and the resistance goes up). Normally that means a copper wire thicker than a kitchen match, we have no margin for dicey contacts. Changes as they heat and change size/shape are sure to raise hobb.
A couple light strokes on 600 grit SiC paper set it straight. Anything that removes the burr if you have one (razor blade, nail file?) should work.
Another insight is we're really hammering the poor 18650 and Mod here. Seriously. And it concerns me. To get to the 60 Watts or so we need means we're taking close to 20 Amps when the voltage 'sags' under the heavy load. 20 Amp (continuous) is basically state of the art. Electric Car battery components. There are, near as I can tell, no such thing as a 30 Amp continuous 18650, guys trying to sell them sometimes list the momentary rating but we're not momentary here. Nor are we taking few second hits like the e-cig guys (where there's time to recover and cool off) so their experience/advice is to be taken with a gram or two of salt. Avoiding 'weak battery' faults in the Mod (where the voltage drops too low and it crashes out) is going to be a factor in selection of 18650s. Only some of the otherwise top picks will work well. Rather than pushing it right to the wall to work, I've ordered a eVic Mini Dual to use. Same as the Mini but with twice the 18650s on board so each works half as hard.
Now I have two good units and some different waxes to try.....only wish the flu would leave my throat be so I can move on.
That screw is another place to look at if you have problems. Normally you'd ignore it once installed and obsess on the cart proper like I did? Regards to all.
OF
D32320
Noob Saibot
Huh. I just gave away my last glass jar because I didn’t like the non non-stick part
reminder on upgraded parts for first batch quartz quest customers. please email me to get on the list so i can send out upgraded parts when they are produced to make it more reliable.
I will put your name on the list for 1st production batch problems and will be making an announcement on the site soon with timeframes with these upgraded parts, what they are and when I will be mailing them to everyone who bought from this 1st batch .. if you do not want to deal with all this i am willing to do a satisfaction guarantee if you want to mail it back. i will provide a return shipping label if you have a printer.
thanks
matt
I will put your name on the list for 1st production batch problems and will be making an announcement on the site soon with timeframes with these upgraded parts, what they are and when I will be mailing them to everyone who bought from this 1st batch .. if you do not want to deal with all this i am willing to do a satisfaction guarantee if you want to mail it back. i will provide a return shipping label if you have a printer.
thanks
matt
Steven
Well-Known Member
It's been quite some time since being around here. I'm excited as everyone else is with the qq. Leakage issues are problems now left in 2017. So I'm using my old single 18650 wismec mod with my evic for the qq at the stock recommended settings (tcr 470, 60w @300F). I'm not sure about everyone else but, my batteries drain ridiculously fast and the hit is a bit hot.
To take some load off of my battery and to cool the hit, Im currently am using tcr 440, 55w, @220F. It is giving me everything I need so far. I'm still playing with the settings but this is the one that is working ok for me so far.
To take some load off of my battery and to cool the hit, Im currently am using tcr 440, 55w, @220F. It is giving me everything I need so far. I'm still playing with the settings but this is the one that is working ok for me so far.
As much as I love the entire package that is the Quartz Quest, the real product is the cup itself and the mouthpiece. I'll be trying these out with other atomizer bases and coils, and I'll let you all know how it goes.
In regard to maintenance with the default atty, the screws are Phillips #000 (Triple-Zero). If you are looking to buy a driver set, be sure to get one that includes a PH000.
In regard to maintenance with the default atty, the screws are Phillips #000 (Triple-Zero). If you are looking to buy a driver set, be sure to get one that includes a PH000.
Danksta
Well-Known Member
I got my unit in over the weekend and got around to using it yesterday.
First impression is the taste was amazing and this is a really cool device Matt has created. Just looking at it you can tell you are holding the latest in tech. Just such a far out design.
Def not suited for public situations (heavy security events), but it could work in some situations. I look at this as just another way to enjoy your concentrates. The flavor of a good vape is different than when you dab an extract and this device will allow you to get insane flavor from a pretty small amount.
Are people turning their mods or mouthpiece while they hit it to get the directional effects? It's pretty fun to do and it works!
I started at 40w and got crazy flavor, but not much vapor. I have noticed I have to do a 10sec preheat before I can take a hit. I moved up to 60w and got some killer vapor and flavor.
I think that preheat caused a mini fire down by one of the posts. I have not tried to use the unit since as it has a burned smell now and it needs cleaned.
Has anyone else run into the fire by the posts issue? I think it was because I'm getting the unit too hot. I forgot to use the heat sink. I plan to use that tonight if the unit is still functional post fire.
Still VERY impressed by this unit. A big part of that was the fact Matt the manufacturer made a post on this forum citing the FLAWS with the first batch. I appreciate the transparency.
First impression is the taste was amazing and this is a really cool device Matt has created. Just looking at it you can tell you are holding the latest in tech. Just such a far out design.
Def not suited for public situations (heavy security events), but it could work in some situations. I look at this as just another way to enjoy your concentrates. The flavor of a good vape is different than when you dab an extract and this device will allow you to get insane flavor from a pretty small amount.
Are people turning their mods or mouthpiece while they hit it to get the directional effects? It's pretty fun to do and it works!
I started at 40w and got crazy flavor, but not much vapor. I have noticed I have to do a 10sec preheat before I can take a hit. I moved up to 60w and got some killer vapor and flavor.
I think that preheat caused a mini fire down by one of the posts. I have not tried to use the unit since as it has a burned smell now and it needs cleaned.
Has anyone else run into the fire by the posts issue? I think it was because I'm getting the unit too hot. I forgot to use the heat sink. I plan to use that tonight if the unit is still functional post fire.
Still VERY impressed by this unit. A big part of that was the fact Matt the manufacturer made a post on this forum citing the FLAWS with the first batch. I appreciate the transparency.
2clicker
Observer
im interested in your findings. let us know what attys, if any, fit the cap.
OF
Well-Known Member
Very interesting. Since none of the materials used will burn at likely temperatures it's probably not a conventional 'Class A' (flammable materials) fire unless you spilled something? I'm betting is a 'Class E' (Electrical) fire? That is a loose/dicey connection at a screw or elsewhere created a bad 'hot spot' in an unattended place. The Mod is going to deliver 60 Watts of power somewhere.......
I suspect it'll clean up and rebuild just fine if you didn't melt something metal. Good luck.
OF
I just had great results with the VandyVape Mesh RDA as a PoC. I wouldn't suggest anyone go out and buy one for this purpose, because it is not a perfect fit, but if you have one lying around it's worth a try. I have a lot of comments on it and how some aspects could be interesting in a future QQ iteration. I'll upload some pics later along with a more-detailed post.
Mine will arrive anyday, ill watch all the videos you made to get 'er going, thanks for advising us if we have trouble to contact you.
All di best man.
Mine too ... although I expect you'll get yours first as you're a couple days closer postal wise
8 business days in transit today ...
Bad Ocelot
Well-Known Member
When I did my first dry run with it I got a tiny and very short lived fire, couldn't determine exactly where it came from, but a quick wipe down got rid of the burned smell. I suspect there was something left over from manufacturing on or around the contact between the lead wire & the ceramic heater, but it never happened again so I can't be sure. It's working fine now though.
Regarding batteries, is anyone using anything from hohmtech? They've got a couple different types of 18650s with some higher ratings than most anything else I've seen. >21A CDR & 36-40A Pulse & Peak. Not too much more expensive than standard batteries from a domestic supplier or vape shop. Think I may pick up a few next pay period. Gonna need a couple of fresh 18650s for that new invoke headed my way on the slow boat anywho. I suppose another option would be looking at mods that take larger batteries like 20700s or 26650s. I believe wismec has a dual 20700 mod out now. CDRs on those type of batteries are considerably higher.
2clicker
Observer
i was discussing buying the internals of the QQ and installing them in a vandy vape mesh RDA but was dissuaded from doing so because it needs the cap with the direct airflow for it to operate properly. how did you get around this?
is the vandy vape mesh RDA airflow sufficient?
PandaLee
Well-Known Member
My one week experience with the QQ has been smooth.
It's a very personal device I feel, I didn't share it at all during the week. At a couple little get-togethers, I loaded and passed around my titanium-cup SAI for friends while I loaded and hit the QQ. The QQ was the only portable device I hit all week.
If I had a significant other, wife, whatever, they'd be getting their own unit that's for sure
It's a very personal device I feel, I didn't share it at all during the week. At a couple little get-togethers, I loaded and passed around my titanium-cup SAI for friends while I loaded and hit the QQ. The QQ was the only portable device I hit all week.
If I had a significant other, wife, whatever, they'd be getting their own unit that's for sure
Good thing the price point is very fair/good, my wife hates my vapes and many delivieries. But my concentrate use smells way less than rocking my beloved Mighty. So for her ill vape nice nice concentrates mostly.
Alright I got some more info. Please excuse the shitty pics; phone camera not working at the moment.
https://imgur.com/a/xZczp
Pics 1 and 2 - Battery (Lost Vape Efusion DNA200), the heatsink that comes with the Quartz Quest, the base of the Vandy Vape Mesh RDA, and the QQ's cup attached.
Pics 3 and 4 - The tube section of the Mesh RDA's top-cap connected to the base, without the actual cap.
Pics 5 and 6 - The QQ's mouthpiece fitting in the tube. It's not snug but there's less than 1mm of wiggle. Not suitable for your pocket, but definitely great for how I've been using the QQ at home.
Pic 6 - Take note how high above the cup the directional airflow tube is sitting. This is a pro and a con.
Alright, time for the breakdown. Why did I want to try the cup in another base? Well, the default atty base's fasteners along with the notch to keep the leads tight are not going to last very long IMO. Also, the fasteners do not stand up well to torque. The Mesh RDA is a postless design that uses rectangular plates which are sandwiched with a flathead screw. I was able to tighten this down much more easily, and it was very simple to swap out different coils. Here's a pic:
https://i.ytimg.com/vi/cr207mUjirw/maxresdefault.jpg
The QQ cap does not fit around the base. It sits atop, almost flush. I tested out Kanthal, Ti, and SS430 coils, and none of them provided the performance provided by the stock ceramic rod coils. They do work, but you can taste them (the coils) much more than the ceramic rods w/ the nickle lining, and the ceramic rods transfer heat more efficiently due to the tighter fit and greater contact surface area. The rods really are excellent, and I will be testing them out with other devices. The only thing that could make heat transfer better, in the current design, would be if the coils were more snug to the quartz. However, this would require smaller tolerances in manufacturing, and would result in a significantly more expensive product.
One of the great features in the default base is the shim which connects to the center pin and hugs the bottom of the quartz cup. What this provides is excellent heat transfer from the cup through the center pin directly to the heatsink. The default base cools off significantly faster than my Mesh RDA combo, and I think that part is critical to that heat exchange. This shim also keeps much of the heat off of the glass mouthpiece. Really interesting design/engineering concept.
I don't plan on taking the QQ with me on the go very often, but I intend on using the default setup completely when doing so, as everything fits well, tastes great, cools off quickly, and it just works. Modding the setup is absolutely not required to get a great experience from this device.
That being said, the loose fit of the mouthpiece within the Mesh RDA's tube allows for using the mouthpiece as a carb cap really well. I have it connected to a knockoff torus via silicone tubing and it has been giving me really tasty low-temp hits. Once you get everything dialed in, this really does provide significantly more flavor than the other portable concentrate rigs I've used. The only thing that would make it better, for me, would be if the air intake tube were deeper into the cup. Having it further away seems to work better for larger dabs, but you get noticeably less flavor the further the air is from the dab surface. I attempted connecting the cup with longer leads so that it was suspended, solving both the heat release issue and the air intake placement issue, but it wasn't as stable as I would have liked. If the ceramic rods had lower-gauge leads, then it may work better. Take note that I'm talking about my mod/combo; these issues do not exist in the default setup.
The plate system of the Mesh RDA allows for very large leads, as show in the picture above. Imagine if the QQ cup's base had one wide slit instead of two tubes, and if there where a plate heater in there instead of the rods. Imagine having leads which were a centimeter wide and 1mm or 1.5mm deep, and making a wide ribbon arch (covered in ceramic) through the wide slit in the bottom of the cup. Another idea would be to have ceramic donuts in the slit, with 4 leads instead of 2. These are two ideas which are only possible in such a design if you intend on using temp control.
Sorry if this doesn't make sense; I've done a lot of testing. If you have any questions let me know. Overall this product is a 9/10 for me; it is the best option in its price range by far IMO.
So here's what I would like to see in a future iteration:
A postless style base with sturdier fasteners
A mouthpiece with a retractable/adjustable air intake or the inclusion of multiple mouthpieces with different intake lengths/positions
A system which allows the mouthpiece to be moved freely like a carb cap, without removing the ability to also have a snug fit for handheld/on-the-go use - perhaps a second mouthpiece
https://imgur.com/a/xZczp
Pics 1 and 2 - Battery (Lost Vape Efusion DNA200), the heatsink that comes with the Quartz Quest, the base of the Vandy Vape Mesh RDA, and the QQ's cup attached.
Pics 3 and 4 - The tube section of the Mesh RDA's top-cap connected to the base, without the actual cap.
Pics 5 and 6 - The QQ's mouthpiece fitting in the tube. It's not snug but there's less than 1mm of wiggle. Not suitable for your pocket, but definitely great for how I've been using the QQ at home.
Pic 6 - Take note how high above the cup the directional airflow tube is sitting. This is a pro and a con.
Alright, time for the breakdown. Why did I want to try the cup in another base? Well, the default atty base's fasteners along with the notch to keep the leads tight are not going to last very long IMO. Also, the fasteners do not stand up well to torque. The Mesh RDA is a postless design that uses rectangular plates which are sandwiched with a flathead screw. I was able to tighten this down much more easily, and it was very simple to swap out different coils. Here's a pic:
https://i.ytimg.com/vi/cr207mUjirw/maxresdefault.jpg
The QQ cap does not fit around the base. It sits atop, almost flush. I tested out Kanthal, Ti, and SS430 coils, and none of them provided the performance provided by the stock ceramic rod coils. They do work, but you can taste them (the coils) much more than the ceramic rods w/ the nickle lining, and the ceramic rods transfer heat more efficiently due to the tighter fit and greater contact surface area. The rods really are excellent, and I will be testing them out with other devices. The only thing that could make heat transfer better, in the current design, would be if the coils were more snug to the quartz. However, this would require smaller tolerances in manufacturing, and would result in a significantly more expensive product.
One of the great features in the default base is the shim which connects to the center pin and hugs the bottom of the quartz cup. What this provides is excellent heat transfer from the cup through the center pin directly to the heatsink. The default base cools off significantly faster than my Mesh RDA combo, and I think that part is critical to that heat exchange. This shim also keeps much of the heat off of the glass mouthpiece. Really interesting design/engineering concept.
I don't plan on taking the QQ with me on the go very often, but I intend on using the default setup completely when doing so, as everything fits well, tastes great, cools off quickly, and it just works. Modding the setup is absolutely not required to get a great experience from this device.
That being said, the loose fit of the mouthpiece within the Mesh RDA's tube allows for using the mouthpiece as a carb cap really well. I have it connected to a knockoff torus via silicone tubing and it has been giving me really tasty low-temp hits. Once you get everything dialed in, this really does provide significantly more flavor than the other portable concentrate rigs I've used. The only thing that would make it better, for me, would be if the air intake tube were deeper into the cup. Having it further away seems to work better for larger dabs, but you get noticeably less flavor the further the air is from the dab surface. I attempted connecting the cup with longer leads so that it was suspended, solving both the heat release issue and the air intake placement issue, but it wasn't as stable as I would have liked. If the ceramic rods had lower-gauge leads, then it may work better. Take note that I'm talking about my mod/combo; these issues do not exist in the default setup.
The plate system of the Mesh RDA allows for very large leads, as show in the picture above. Imagine if the QQ cup's base had one wide slit instead of two tubes, and if there where a plate heater in there instead of the rods. Imagine having leads which were a centimeter wide and 1mm or 1.5mm deep, and making a wide ribbon arch (covered in ceramic) through the wide slit in the bottom of the cup. Another idea would be to have ceramic donuts in the slit, with 4 leads instead of 2. These are two ideas which are only possible in such a design if you intend on using temp control.
Sorry if this doesn't make sense; I've done a lot of testing. If you have any questions let me know. Overall this product is a 9/10 for me; it is the best option in its price range by far IMO.
So here's what I would like to see in a future iteration:
A postless style base with sturdier fasteners
A mouthpiece with a retractable/adjustable air intake or the inclusion of multiple mouthpieces with different intake lengths/positions
A system which allows the mouthpiece to be moved freely like a carb cap, without removing the ability to also have a snug fit for handheld/on-the-go use - perhaps a second mouthpiece
Vape Donkey 650
All vape, no smoke please.
More people getting their QQ's, some having some issues, others pretty smooth, seems about 50/50 at this point. Regardless, I'm sure Matt will make sure all the early purchasers of the QQ will get the same units and parts that third, fourth, 5th and future production runs of this product, and he'll do as much as he can to help you get your QQ's vaping right.
For the early purchasers of the DTV2, do you remember all the free DTV2.5 atomizers you received shortly after? (Go, big airflow holes!)
After my first weekend of playing with the QQ was free of technical glitches, I had one tiny issue: from puffing too hard on the mouthpiece, I caused a little trickle of oil to spill over and splash one of the posts and wire leads for the ceramic rods. This only caused my Ω to rise from a fairly stable 0.25 to a slightly shaky 0.26-0.29 at rest. It still worked and fired up fine in TC, but bothered me. Finally, one time it slipped to over 0.3 upon waking up and kicked to watts mode before fiiring, so I decided I should break it down for the first cleaning. @OF had a great verbal description of the parts on the QQ, so here is a pic showing that:
Cup with rods still inside, saddle, post screws and 510 pin with insulator (what material is that? is that what burned on you @Danksta?) and then the main metal base and, lets call it, floating post? Positive post?
It was a little tricky to bend the lead wires for the rods and cram them into the posts. I made a small chip off the quartz tunnel for the rods break off securing the wires, but it's ok. When I screwed the center 510 pin all the way with a flathead (too tight) it made the coil read 0.025, atomizer low! But I backed off the screw a half turn or so, and back to 0.26Ω! 
A little more work than the V3, but not very hard to rebuild the QQ.
@FMSQ great first post on FC for us! Nice review and great pics! I largely agree with your post, and it's nice to see someone else using the QQ with a nice glass setup!
@JigMelon nice work with the VVM atty and quartz cup!It seems a little tenuous, and I didn't think it could be made to work with that atty in particular, but you did it. If the quartz cup is going to work well with other RBAs, it will most likely have post-less, flat build decks. I hope everyone will be on the lookout for other RBAs that may handle the quartz cup well, something might be out there.
Anyways, I had many test sessions with my QQ over the weekend. On an eleaf invoke with 2 fresh VTC6 batteries, I was getting at least 10-12 full sessions, with a couple of burn-offs as well, before I had only 30% charge, so that was a little better than I expected. Although @ArchVape showed you can power this thing fine with a single 18650, you would probably get less than half the sessions with a single cell than you could get with 2 equivalent cells because you don't work the batteries as hard during use.
This is how I connected it to my rigs at first:
Although I felt that hose was too long, so I put a little 14/14 m/m adapter on top the QQ cap to make a shorter, more direct tube and I like this better.
I was able to get decent results without water, puffing straight off the cap, but I would have to take shorter puffs and the harshness would test my throat and cause me to cough mildly at times, usually after the 3rd-4th puff after the cup gets fully heat soaked.
Going through glass, I was able to get some good sessions too, but I would have to take much longer puffs to get a satisfying cloud, instead of being able to nibble quick, large clouds directly off the MP with no water. (because of the longer vapor path)
And with having to take longer puffs to fill the dab rig with the QQ, it would be challenging to keep the cup from overheating. Sometimes I would pulse the button just right and be able to coast the 2nd, 3rd, 4th puff to perfection, great taste, not too hot, allowing me to rapidly return to the next puff to finish the bowl. About 2-3 minutes seems like a good time frame to fully enjoy a QQ session, as some of the videos have shown. Then the cloud tapers off as only dark reclaim oil is left in the cup, and you can quickly swab this up to keep your cup tidy.
But at other times, I have held the button down for too long during puffs, and overheated the cup, causing overly harsh hits
causing me to cough and pause momentarily, all the while the rest of my dab is still cooking in that QC which holds its heat much longer than a donut, almost like a real quartz banger. If I have to wait 30 second or so to regain my breath, that reclaim has gotten pretty crusty and cooked, and is no longer pleasant to puff on, and my cotton swab comes out much more soaked, feeling like a more wasteful session.
So basically, it may take some more technique and practice to fully utilize this atty. Compared to the DTV3, which still requires a certain range of permissible pull/draw methods to not "mess up" it seems the QQ requires more judgement and timing and discipline. It's a ton of fun when you get it just right. As much as I like it so far, it isn't going to replace my V3s as the daily driver just yet....
A few more tips now that I've used it more: (could be repeating others)
(i could have loaded a tiny bit more up there)
Regarding temp stability, I tried very hard to dial in the QQ for low-temp hits with mixed results. I tried to match settings to vape with the cup surface around 450F, but this made for weak, dribbly hits that wasted my oil. Moving up to around 500-520F, I was able to get strong, satisfying vape that tasted good as long as I didn't let the cup overheat.
The problem remains for me: if you continue to hold the button down for several 15 second time-outs, the cup temp will continue to rise well above 500, to 600F if you don't give it a break! Although with some settings, I was able to see the cup remain around 480-500F, or at least rise above that temp at a rate much slower than the initial temp rise, giving you a chance to pulse the button and avoid overheat.
The settings that seemed to help me match screens and cup temps:
TCR = 240
Watts = 60
Temp = 490-510F
PI = 900, 20 also seemed to help hold it stable for a little longer than without PI control
How long you hold the button down influences the actual cup temp more than some of those settings, it seems, but at least I was able to keep screen/cup temps somewhat close in the 20-40 second time range.
For the early purchasers of the DTV2, do you remember all the free DTV2.5 atomizers you received shortly after? (Go, big airflow holes!)
After my first weekend of playing with the QQ was free of technical glitches, I had one tiny issue: from puffing too hard on the mouthpiece, I caused a little trickle of oil to spill over and splash one of the posts and wire leads for the ceramic rods. This only caused my Ω to rise from a fairly stable 0.25 to a slightly shaky 0.26-0.29 at rest. It still worked and fired up fine in TC, but bothered me. Finally, one time it slipped to over 0.3 upon waking up and kicked to watts mode before fiiring, so I decided I should break it down for the first cleaning. @OF had a great verbal description of the parts on the QQ, so here is a pic showing that:
Cup with rods still inside, saddle, post screws and 510 pin with insulator (what material is that? is that what burned on you @Danksta?) and then the main metal base and, lets call it, floating post? Positive post?
It was a little tricky to bend the lead wires for the rods and cram them into the posts. I made a small chip off the quartz tunnel for the rods break off securing the wires
, but it's ok. When I screwed the center 510 pin all the way with a flathead (too tight) it made the coil read 0.025, atomizer low! But I backed off the screw a half turn or so, and back to 0.26Ω! A little more work than the V3, but not very hard to rebuild the QQ.@FMSQ great first post on FC for us! Nice review and great pics! I largely agree with your post, and it's nice to see someone else using the QQ with a nice glass setup!
@JigMelon nice work with the VVM atty and quartz cup!
It seems a little tenuous, and I didn't think it could be made to work with that atty in particular, but you did it. If the quartz cup is going to work well with other RBAs, it will most likely have post-less, flat build decks. I hope everyone will be on the lookout for other RBAs that may handle the quartz cup well, something might be out there.Anyways, I had many test sessions with my QQ over the weekend. On an eleaf invoke with 2 fresh VTC6 batteries, I was getting at least 10-12 full sessions, with a couple of burn-offs as well, before I had only 30% charge, so that was a little better than I expected. Although @ArchVape showed you can power this thing fine with a single 18650, you would probably get less than half the sessions with a single cell than you could get with 2 equivalent cells because you don't work the batteries as hard during use.
This is how I connected it to my rigs at first:
Although I felt that hose was too long, so I put a little 14/14 m/m adapter on top the QQ cap to make a shorter, more direct tube and I like this better.
I was able to get decent results without water, puffing straight off the cap, but I would have to take shorter puffs and the harshness would test my throat and cause me to cough mildly at times, usually after the 3rd-4th puff after the cup gets fully heat soaked.
Going through glass, I was able to get some good sessions too, but I would have to take much longer puffs to get a satisfying cloud, instead of being able to nibble quick, large clouds directly off the MP with no water. (because of the longer vapor path)
And with having to take longer puffs to fill the dab rig with the QQ, it would be challenging to keep the cup from overheating. Sometimes I would pulse the button just right and be able to coast the 2nd, 3rd, 4th puff to perfection, great taste, not too hot, allowing me to rapidly return to the next puff to finish the bowl. About 2-3 minutes seems like a good time frame to fully enjoy a QQ session, as some of the videos have shown. Then the cloud tapers off as only dark reclaim oil is left in the cup, and you can quickly swab this up to keep your cup tidy.
But at other times, I have held the button down for too long during puffs, and overheated the cup, causing overly harsh hits
causing me to cough and pause momentarily, all the while the rest of my dab is still cooking in that QC which holds its heat much longer than a donut, almost like a real quartz banger. If I have to wait 30 second or so to regain my breath, that reclaim has gotten pretty crusty and cooked, and is no longer pleasant to puff on, and my cotton swab comes out much more soaked, feeling like a more wasteful session.So basically, it may take some more technique and practice to fully utilize this atty. Compared to the DTV3, which still requires a certain range of permissible pull/draw methods to not "mess up" it seems the QQ requires more judgement and timing and discipline. It's a ton of fun when you get it just right. As much as I like it so far, it isn't going to replace my V3s as the daily driver just yet....
A few more tips now that I've used it more: (could be repeating others)
- Pre-heat the cup until you see vapor rising and wisping up before you start your draw
- Take a long, slow draw to get the best results, especially through a larger glass piece. Although when the cup is cooking, it is possible to get nice, big, quick nibble-draws using just the MP dry
- Pulse the power button after good vapor production is achieved. Pulse the button for 2-5 seconds at a time with short breaks, not 8-10 seconds at a time. Based on your draw technique and mod settings, you will have to adjust and use your judgement
- Swivel the cap during use to target oil on the other side of the cup. Perhaps swivel the cap only CW (not CCW) so you don't accidentally unscrew the atty from your mod with tight-fitting o-rings by trying to only swivel the cap?
- Don't puff on the MP too hard or oil can jump the cup and spill over. Don't overload, 20-40mg, about the same you would load your V3, is a good amount. Keep it level, don't tilt that much.
(i could have loaded a tiny bit more up there)
Regarding temp stability, I tried very hard to dial in the QQ for low-temp hits with mixed results. I tried to match settings to vape with the cup surface around 450F, but this made for weak, dribbly hits that wasted my oil. Moving up to around 500-520F, I was able to get strong, satisfying vape that tasted good as long as I didn't let the cup overheat.
The problem remains for me: if you continue to hold the button down for several 15 second time-outs, the cup temp will continue to rise well above 500, to 600F if you don't give it a break! Although with some settings, I was able to see the cup remain around 480-500F, or at least rise above that temp at a rate much slower than the initial temp rise, giving you a chance to pulse the button and avoid overheat.
The settings that seemed to help me match screens and cup temps:
TCR = 240
Watts = 60
Temp = 490-510F
PI = 900, 20 also seemed to help hold it stable for a little longer than without PI control
How long you hold the button down influences the actual cup temp more than some of those settings, it seems, but at least I was able to keep screen/cup temps somewhat close in the 20-40 second time range.
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I proposed a plate heater to Divine Tribe almost a year ago. I even sent a cup design using a single modified V3 part that I think would have worked very well.
Vape Donkey 650
All vape, no smoke please.
Now I probably shouldn't get much into the debate about the merits of different versions of TC mod firmwares and different brands and chipsets for different types of applications, since many of you guys clearly know much more about how TC mods work and are constructed, and about how PID control works. I don't doubt that some premium brands have better hardware. But from a brand rivalry / performance / end-user experience aspect, this is what it comes down to me:
If I can observe my V3 donuts powered joyetech & eleaf mods running AF with PI control to display temperature stability that steadily hovers within 2-3F from my target, as I can see with an IR gun tuned to e=0.65 at a wide range of temperatures, and confirmed with the NFE device monitor, what more can I realistically expect then, and how much does the thickness of the leads on my 510 connector really matter?
All you need to set are 4 figures: TCR, watts, lock a good coil Ω, and PI figures. Get those right, and you should have a broad, usable sweep of around 300-500F where you can observe accurate temps.
Even with AF and no PI control, with a stable, accurate coil Ω locked in, I would observe normal temp oscillations around 5-7F and only a small initial overshoot. Even with the crappy stock firmware, 10-15F swings would be the typical observation on any large alumina ceramic heater that could fill up the aperature on my IR gun. Yes, there are better ways to take temp measurements than IR guns, of course, but I think that @funkyjunky's tests in dialing in the tubo evic with the "tubomyevic" software attests to the capabilities of even these "budget / entry level mods"
Really?
Like they can automatically detect and dial in perfect settings for a variety of obscure, alternative heaters (donuts?) at the press of the button? With the exception of the vaporesso omni board, (which seems kind of weird, I'd like to see how that works) I thought that all of the advanced firmwares required a bit of initial setup by the user to get the best results.
Could it be possible that the advanced resolution and sensitivity of the more premium boards could actually work against you for casual, everyday use? I dig up this old post from our friend @whatavape
Now it may be dated, and maybe the difficulties he experienced were due to trying to use a DTV3 with a profile for TFR mode (not TCR). But if using a DNA chipset with a DTV3 or any ceramic heater atty didn't allow me to simply pick it up and fire it up and expect it to work in TC mode (after it has been initially set up) then I don't want that!
And the good results that he describes at the end...that looks to be the same type of experience I get with AF & PI control now!
I've obtained many of my recent joye-leaf mods for as little as 25-30 bucks, sometimes with free shipping, although that's usually direct from china, and on sale sometimes. I have paid 40-50 bucks for them too, although usually as a kit with a tank I may or may not want, from a domestic retailer.
As @2clicker noted too, some of those premium brand mods are also getting cheaper too, and there are so many more (worthy, usable, good TC!) brands and models to choose from, so this is a good thing overall for the consumer and the industry!
DC to DC, ADC, PWM, I've got alot to learn about TC mods still You guys had me thinking it was mostly a CPU, a shunt, a voltmeter, and an ammeter, but I guess there's much more than that....
Another "small" thing that has deterred me from DNA-chipped mods is that they all seem bigger, more hefty and heavy compared to similar models from cheaper brands. Can someone show me a DNA75 mod that's the size of a VTC mini, a pico, or even better, a primo mini? How bout a DNA200 mod as small as the eleaf invoke? From what I've looked at, even the smallest DNA mods are carrying a few extra cm3 over joyetech. And in the field of tiny mods like the evic basic, their is no "premium" option. Am I missing something?
Damn...I said at the start of this post I'm not trying to get into a debate but look what I just did! 
Well, since you mentioned it, and the naughty mid-sized wild feline got into it, I went and plugged those familiar values into my QQ profile for AF, since we have known 900, 20 (or close) to help tame and control ceramic donuts in a variety of applications.
Having a session with PI 900, 20, the calculated temp #s on the screen ramp up a little more slowly as it reaches protection, and it hits protection much less, hardly at all, from what I see, hovering 2-4F under my target most of the time. I just had a couple sessions like this, but it doesn't seem to make a big difference in the vape experience with the QQ. It still takes about the same time to warm up (long) although when I looked at the cup with my IR gun set to e=0.93 it seems that adding PI control helped attain a longer period of temp stability and matching of the cup / screen temp. After reaching ~480 somewhat fast, it slowly rose to around 500F, but continuing to fire the button without pause let the cup rise to 520F and higher, which is too hot for me.
A better vape with the QQ and more PI tuning may be attainable with more testing, but I think it may be necessary to hold off on the button periodicially and pulse the button still after the cup has reached ideal vaping temps. 
Cmon you PI guys....
Continuous button-pressing resulting in a steady, non-rising cup temp might not be attainable with TCR / PI modes, or any mode, maybe it is. But if it is, I'm sure it will work on the cheap mods as well as the DNA and other high-end mods, not on some good TC mods but not others.
If I can observe my V3 donuts powered joyetech & eleaf mods running AF with PI control to display temperature stability that steadily hovers within 2-3F from my target, as I can see with an IR gun tuned to e=0.65 at a wide range of temperatures, and confirmed with the NFE device monitor, what more can I realistically expect then, and how much does the thickness of the leads on my 510 connector really matter?
All you need to set are 4 figures: TCR, watts, lock a good coil Ω, and PI figures. Get those right, and you should have a broad, usable sweep of around 300-500F where you can observe accurate temps.
Even with AF and no PI control, with a stable, accurate coil Ω locked in, I would observe normal temp oscillations around 5-7F and only a small initial overshoot. Even with the crappy stock firmware, 10-15F swings would be the typical observation on any large alumina ceramic heater that could fill up the aperature on my IR gun. Yes, there are better ways to take temp measurements than IR guns, of course, but I think that @funkyjunky's tests in dialing in the tubo evic with the "tubomyevic" software attests to the capabilities of even these "budget / entry level mods"
Really?
Like they can automatically detect and dial in perfect settings for a variety of obscure, alternative heaters (donuts?) at the press of the button? With the exception of the vaporesso omni board, (which seems kind of weird, I'd like to see how that works) I thought that all of the advanced firmwares required a bit of initial setup by the user to get the best results.Could it be possible that the advanced resolution and sensitivity of the more premium boards could actually work against you for casual, everyday use? I dig up this old post from our friend @whatavape
Now it may be dated, and maybe the difficulties he experienced were due to trying to use a DTV3 with a profile for TFR mode (not TCR). But if using a DNA chipset with a DTV3 or any ceramic heater atty didn't allow me to simply pick it up and fire it up and expect it to work in TC mode (after it has been initially set up) then I don't want that!
And the good results that he describes at the end...that looks to be the same type of experience I get with AF & PI control now!
I've obtained many of my recent joye-leaf mods for as little as 25-30 bucks, sometimes with free shipping, although that's usually direct from china, and on sale sometimes. I have paid 40-50 bucks for them too, although usually as a kit with a tank I may or may not want, from a domestic retailer.
As @2clicker noted too, some of those premium brand mods are also getting cheaper too, and there are so many more (worthy, usable, good TC!) brands and models to choose from, so this is a good thing overall for the consumer and the industry!
DC to DC, ADC, PWM, I've got alot to learn about TC mods still You guys had me thinking it was mostly a CPU, a shunt, a voltmeter, and an ammeter, but I guess there's much more than that....
Another "small" thing that has deterred me from DNA-chipped mods is that they all seem bigger, more hefty and heavy compared to similar models from cheaper brands. Can someone show me a DNA75 mod that's the size of a VTC mini, a pico, or even better, a primo mini? How bout a DNA200 mod as small as the eleaf invoke? From what I've looked at, even the smallest DNA mods are carrying a few extra cm3 over joyetech. And in the field of tiny mods like the evic basic, their is no "premium" option. Am I missing something?
Damn...I said at the start of this post I'm not trying to get into a debate but look what I just did!
Well, since you mentioned it, and the naughty mid-sized wild feline got into it, I went and plugged those familiar values into my QQ profile for AF, since we have known 900, 20 (or close) to help tame and control ceramic donuts in a variety of applications.
Having a session with PI 900, 20, the calculated temp #s on the screen ramp up a little more slowly as it reaches protection, and it hits protection much less, hardly at all, from what I see, hovering 2-4F under my target most of the time. I just had a couple sessions like this, but it doesn't seem to make a big difference in the vape experience with the QQ. It still takes about the same time to warm up (long) although when I looked at the cup with my IR gun set to e=0.93 it seems that adding PI control helped attain a longer period of temp stability and matching of the cup / screen temp. After reaching ~480 somewhat fast, it slowly rose to around 500F, but continuing to fire the button without pause let the cup rise to 520F and higher, which is too hot for me.
A better vape with the QQ and more PI tuning may be attainable with more testing, but I think it may be necessary to hold off on the button periodicially and pulse the button still after the cup has reached ideal vaping temps. Cmon you PI guys....Continuous button-pressing resulting in a steady, non-rising cup temp might not be attainable with TCR / PI modes, or any mode, maybe it is. But if it is, I'm sure it will work on the cheap mods as well as the DNA and other high-end mods, not on some good TC mods but not others.
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Vape Donkey 650
All vape, no smoke please.
Damn 10,000 character post limit 
This should have been able to be with the last post but I didn't wanna search for stuff to cut
I've been thinking the same. My vaping habits up until recently had been easily powered by mods with a single, aged, worn 18650. But with the QQ now, (and my tubo evic pushes a cell's limits too) and some of those multi-donut RBAs I've been working on, my single cell mods and non-removable battery mods don't seem up to all of the vape tasks I would ask of them. High discharge cells and 2 cell mods are more necessary and attractive to me now.
The new 20700's seem to thread a needle in between one and two 18650s mods very well, and seem to over-perform for their size. Where I would once overlook 20700 and 26650s as excessive, I should look closer at them in the future, but I already have way too many mods!
I had my hopes on a DT version of a sealed ceramic cup with leads soldered on it, like the source terra, but also with better, targeted airflow, since I had shared @Hoosier 's suspicion that the lack of direct airflow on a heated ceramic cup would hinder vapor production.
It turns out, it was not so easy to design and produce a working ceramic cup like that as it might seem.
(Matt's been trying) Maybe this type of heater with a good targeted-airflow atty can still be perfected in the near-future, it's not impossible. The larger the alumina heater, the slower it will take to heat up, like the DC Gen 2 heater, to make it not suitable for quick dabbing. And if we could get that nice sized ceramic cup that heats up quickly and accurately, with the sides too, I wouldn't even bother dropping a quartz cup inside of it! I'd just dab straight off that! Adding a QC to a ceramic cup would just make the heat-up time longer, and a bare ceramic cup without an insert could cool-down quicker after hits to make reclaim hits for later on a single load more palatable. Plus, a warm alumina cup would (almost) swab clean after use as easily as a hot quartz crucible!
This should have been able to be with the last post but I didn't wanna search for stuff to cut
I've been thinking the same. My vaping habits up until recently had been easily powered by mods with a single, aged, worn 18650. But with the QQ now, (and my tubo evic pushes a cell's limits too) and some of those multi-donut RBAs I've been working on, my single cell mods and non-removable battery mods don't seem up to all of the vape tasks I would ask of them. High discharge cells and 2 cell mods are more necessary and attractive to me now.
The new 20700's seem to thread a needle in between one and two 18650s mods very well, and seem to over-perform for their size. Where I would once overlook 20700 and 26650s as excessive, I should look closer at them in the future, but I already have way too many mods!
I had my hopes on a DT version of a sealed ceramic cup with leads soldered on it, like the source terra, but also with better, targeted airflow, since I had shared @Hoosier 's suspicion that the lack of direct airflow on a heated ceramic cup would hinder vapor production.
It turns out, it was not so easy to design and produce a working ceramic cup like that as it might seem.
(Matt's been trying) Maybe this type of heater with a good targeted-airflow atty can still be perfected in the near-future, it's not impossible. The larger the alumina heater, the slower it will take to heat up, like the DC Gen 2 heater, to make it not suitable for quick dabbing. And if we could get that nice sized ceramic cup that heats up quickly and accurately, with the sides too, I wouldn't even bother dropping a quartz cup inside of it! I'd just dab straight off that! Adding a QC to a ceramic cup would just make the heat-up time longer, and a bare ceramic cup without an insert could cool-down quicker after hits to make reclaim hits for later on a single load more palatable. Plus, a warm alumina cup would (almost) swab clean after use as easily as a hot quartz crucible!
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VapourHaze
Rexcornish on IG, Vaping since '02
High all , got a qq at the weekend (super fast shipping to UK from the states)
Enjoying the qq it certainly delivers potent rips.
Had some troubles last night with one of the screws shorting by connecting to the base plate. Required a little re build and now its fitting all much snugger and firing just fine.
It was a fiddly job and would not recommend this Atty to anyone who struggles with Manual dexterity.
Started off using it with my witcher side car mod but actually the side loading makes it very tricky to remove the mouthpiece and the tc wasnt firing properly.
Now im running with a vaporesso swag. Seems to be working well, i don't know how useful tc is though really? Or maybe i haven't set it correctly on the mod (my first time using a tc mod) ... I've turned the settings right down but its still possible to get a high temp nasty hit.
Overall tho its a great little Atty but definitely ATM tailored towards advanced users.
Cheers
EDIT - so since my rebuild my atty is reading 0.4 ohm? It seems to be performing the same ? HArd to tell really ... Is this a problem at all?
When i first got the qq the quartz banger was a little loose, but since re housing it is now solidly in place. Should it actually be looser? It obviously feels better when its more secure.
Enjoying the qq it certainly delivers potent rips.
Had some troubles last night with one of the screws shorting by connecting to the base plate. Required a little re build and now its fitting all much snugger and firing just fine.
It was a fiddly job and would not recommend this Atty to anyone who struggles with Manual dexterity.
Started off using it with my witcher side car mod but actually the side loading makes it very tricky to remove the mouthpiece and the tc wasnt firing properly.
Now im running with a vaporesso swag. Seems to be working well, i don't know how useful tc is though really? Or maybe i haven't set it correctly on the mod (my first time using a tc mod) ... I've turned the settings right down but its still possible to get a high temp nasty hit.
Overall tho its a great little Atty but definitely ATM tailored towards advanced users.
Cheers
EDIT - so since my rebuild my atty is reading 0.4 ohm? It seems to be performing the same ? HArd to tell really ... Is this a problem at all?
When i first got the qq the quartz banger was a little loose, but since re housing it is now solidly in place. Should it actually be looser? It obviously feels better when its more secure.
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