Cheap High Quality Bubbler

[Stu]

too close to the edge, @Stu.... you know what goes down around these parts!

For the price I paid, I won't shed the tears that I shed when the OG Devastator met it's maker. I'll live dangerously with this one.

One thing I quickly realized is that unlike the OG Devastator, you can swap the downstems between the can and the a/c. With the showerhead in the can and the matrix in the a/c, it only needs about half the water that the opposite configuration uses.

 

[Frederick McGuire]

I got my FC-mod today which surprised me quite a bit. Most of my Chinese glass purchases take 3-4 weeks, but I got this in only 8 days. Pretty, pretty good.

First thing that struck me was how small it is compared to the OG Devastator. It's basically a mini-devastator.

Here's some pics:

I shot a video of the first hit, but YouTube is being bitchy at the moment. The build is decent if not perfect. The mouthpiece joint doesn't need any further support IMO. Diffusion in definitely on point.

I think I'm gonna name him Max.

For the price I paid, I won't shed the tears that I shed when the OG Devastator met it's maker. I'll live dangerously with this one.

One thing I quickly realized is that unlike the OG Devastator, you can swap the downstems between the can and the a/c. With the showerhead in the can and the matrix in the a/c, it only needs about half the water that the opposite configuration uses.

How much bigger would it need to be to be a pretty close representation of the original?

I REALLY, REALLY, REALLY WANT the FC-mod to be a pretty accurate replica, so I guess there's gonna have to be a V2

TBH I'm kinda annoyed how steven has handled this one, I told him over and over again that the prototypes looked to small...
I told him where it needed to be enlarged, then just got a message that it was going up the next day...

I don't want yet another fucking mini rig...
It still looks nice, but dammit... Just dammit. This wasn't meant to be a mini rig...

I didn't realize that the OG devastator couldn't switch downstems - I thought it could?

 

[Stu]

How much bigger would it need to be to be a pretty close representation of the original?

I REALLY, REALLY, REALLY WANT the FC-mod to be a pretty accurate replica, so I guess there's gonna have to be a V2

TBH I'm kinda annoyed how steven has handled this one, I told him over and over again that the prototypes looked to small...
I told him where it needed to be enlarged, then just got a message that it was going up the next day...

I don't want yet another fucking mini rig...
It still looks nice, but dammit... Just dammit. This wasn't meant to be a mini rig...

I didn't realize that the OG devastator couldn't switch downstems - I thought it could?

My best guess is that the FC-mod is about 2/3 the size of the OG Devastator. We could measure it to be certain, but that's my ballpark guess. Between @t-dub and myself we could provide actual dimensions if you like.

The downstem for the can of the OG Devastator had a wider GonG diameter than the a/c GonG. They are the same size on the FC-mod, thus swappable. I actually like this feature, but the OG was indeed different.

Did you order one, Fred?

 

[u bwade wunner]

Just got in and this was in my inbox.this is the proto with dimensions steven is working with at the moment as a standalone or with the FC-MOD.

 

[subway13029]

Nice..i messaged him about the hydratubes..

 

[Frederick McGuire]

My best guess is that the FC-mod is about 2/3 the size of the OG Devastator. We could measure it to be certain, but that's my ballpark guess. Between @t-dub and myself we could provide actual dimensions if you like.

The downstem for the can of the OG Devastator had a wider GonG diameter than the a/c GonG. They are the same size on the FC-mod, thus swappable. I actually like this feature, but the OG was indeed different.

Did you order one, Fred?

Yeah, I ordered mine about an hour before I saw your post with the size

Do you think it needs to be wider, or just taller?

This version looks like it's the same as the prototype vid that steven posted.
I told him it looked like it needed an extra 5-10mm diameter, and an extra 1-2 inches height on both the base and ac.

 

[stickstones]

Just got in and this was in my inbox.this is the proto with dimensions steven is working with at the moment as a standalone or with the FC-MOD.

VapeXHale has had a patent pending on the HT's for a while now and it was just granted. They have always been easy to work with as far as rights, as the guys who came up with the mini HT for the Pinnacle can attest. But this is exactly what they are trying to avoid and looks like the kind of thing they could go after. A better move would be for Steven and the gang to contact VXL directly to work together on it, but his hasn't happened in this instance.

I'm all for cheap glass and I have a couple of pieces myself, but I won't be buying any of these or promoting/proliferating them until they have worked it out with VXL. Seibo is a great guy and has given so much to this community that I couldn't possibly feel good about having these without authorization from VXL.

 

[vjt324]

If we can get the hydratubes right, I'll buy an evo.
When I think about it the only reason I don't have an evo is because the glass is too expensive.
This might actually help vxl in sales when it comes to lower budget people who can't afford a vape+200-300$ glass

 

[weenstoned]

Seems kinda weird that if you have a patent then your inventions should be respected but otherwise you're fair game. For the record I probably won't be buying any hydratubes.

 

[Justpassedu]

Just got in and this was in my inbox.this is the proto with dimensions steven is working with at the moment as a standalone or with the FC-MOD.

Any way to get more info on this ? Ty

 

[Monsoon]

Seems kinda weird that if you have a patent then your inventions should be respected but otherwise you're fair game.

Pretty sure that's the whole point of patents to begin with. But patents aside Seibo has been an active member of FC since the beginning (long before the EVO existed) and I think that carries weight as well. Given that he's willing to work with others to use it I don't think it's unreasonable to ask him first for permission.

 

[weenstoned]

Ya I am aware of the point of patents, but when everyone is saying copy x, copy y it seems silly to get butthurt cuz someone has an extra piece of paper (good luck bringing a patent suit in China). I am sort of the opinion that it isn't right to patent something that seems kind of obvious. Like I feel there's potentially a world where I could have come up with hydratubes, but no world exists where I could have invented the fab egg. Yet fab egg copies are fair game and hydratubes are somehow off limits. Also copies of true pinnacle exist so unauthorized hydratubes are already in the world.

 

[MGG]

Just got in and this was in my inbox.this is the proto with dimensions steven is working with at the moment as a standalone or with the FC-MOD.

Thanks for trying to make this a reality man! I'm super keen, I think it'd be better this was the sidecar version but regardless i'm still immensely excited that this is going to be a reality.
I think anyone complaining about this but willing to buy all the other knock-offs on dhgate are hypocrites.
American glass is mostly overpriced for what it is. If you don't support it don't buy it.

I'm so glad this is going to be a thing, be awesome if he considers doing other types of percs too, but if it was going to be just one i'm really glad he's going for the circ perc.

 

[vjt324]

Thanks for trying to make this a reality man! I'm super keen, I think it'd be better this was the sidecar version but regardless i'm still immensely excited that this is going to be a reality.
I think anyone complaining about this but willing to buy all the other knock-offs on dhgate are hypocrites.
American glass is mostly overpriced for what it is. If you don't support it don't buy it.

I'm so glad this is going to be a thing, be awesome if he considers doing other types of percs too, but if it was going to be just one i'm really glad he's going for the circ perc.

I agree whole heartedly.
Besides like I said, because of this I will probably become an evo user.
I thought they outsourced the glass to another company anyway?.

 

[stickstones]

I think anyone complaining about this but willing to buy all the other knock-offs on dhgate are hypocrites.

I'm not one to draw the lines for anyone, but knockoffs are different from counterfeits, which are different from patent infringements. I don't have a problem with knockoffs because I know I am getting a pretend, inferior product. I'm usually the guy on the libertarian side saying let the market do it's thing. And to be honest, I probably wouldn't care if it weren't for it being a guy like Seibo. It's curious that VXL was to a large extent born out of this forum, and it's this same forum that's birthing an infringement on his copyright.

I don't expect most of the world to care about it, either. It's up to Seibo to protect his patent and that can get very costly. I also don't expect many who haven't been on this forum for less than five years to have feelings about it. But those of us that have been around that long remember when he was here reviewing vapes and even a moderator for a while. We remember when he was designing and testing the Cloud, and all the hard times the company came upon at the hands of a fraudulent manufacturer. I remember how he put his own financial ass on the line to make sure the customers that got bum units weren't left hanging. He's one of us and if I was ever going to spend more money on the real thing instead of a patent infringement, it would be for him.

Cheaper HT's are going to happen...I don't think it can be avoided. But I think I'm most bummed that we are the ones making it happen.

Sorry for the derail...

 

[subway13029]

Had no clue the maker of evo was a member here..lol..or shall I say was a member before a manufacture account..cool stuff..I can see both sides to it,..especially when it's personal. I'm sure seibo is a great dude..I'm sure they could all work out a world where all hydra tubes coexist..seems as though all bongs and bubblers are copied...I wouldn't know why this would be different..surprised it took this long..but I am still gonna buy a real one..and this one too most likely...

 

[MGG]

I'm not one to draw the lines for anyone, but knockoffs are different from counterfeits, which are different from patent infringements. I don't have a problem with knockoffs because I know I am getting a pretend, inferior product. I'm usually the guy on the libertarian side saying let the market do it's thing. And to be honest, I probably wouldn't care if it weren't for it being a guy like Seibo. It's curious that VXL was to a large extent born out of this forum, and it's this same forum that's birthing an infringement on his copyright.

I don't expect most of the world to care about it, either. It's up to Seibo to protect his patent and that can get very costly. I also don't expect many who haven't been on this forum for less than five years to have feelings about it. But those of us that have been around that long remember when he was here reviewing vapes and even a moderator for a while. We remember when he was designing and testing the Cloud, and all the hard times the company came upon at the hands of a fraudulent manufacturer. I remember how he put his own financial ass on the line to make sure the customers that got bum units weren't left hanging. He's one of us and if I was ever going to spend more money on the real thing instead of a patent infringement, it would be for him.

Cheaper HT's are going to happen...I don't think it can be avoided. But I think I'm most bummed that we are the ones making it happen.

Sorry for the derail...

I'm from the original OG cloud pre-order list and I don't care lol. Does Seibo even use this forum anymore? Also no offense but that's some fairly rose-tinted glasses for that companies history (No disrespect intended).

I don't want to start an argument on here because i'm already on thin ice, but I seriously think it's really hypocritical to be okay with the knockoffs of matrix, torus, sovereignty, hitman, david goldstein, the list goes on, but then claim this is different lol.

I supported Vapexhale by buying their product, as far as i'm concerned a lot of their hydratubes are made by other companies anyways, no one seems to have an issue with the f-bombs and the f-bomb knockoffs either? Personally I see this as no different as buying the arizer solo and then buying a 3rd party glass stem, Or buying a playstation and getting a 3rd party controller. Just my

EDIT : to add to this, may I also note that no glassblower wants their design stolen, David Goldstein was specifically vocal about this on these forums with his 'Patent Pending Fritted Disk' though I don't see anyone caring about that on here. Some people don't have the money to spend 200+ on a piece of glass. If you do and want to support the company all the best to you (And you'll likely be buying a slightly higher quality product that supports American business) personally i'm happy with spending 10% of the price on a still pretty good product and I'm not american so I don't care about 'supporting american made products blah blah blah'.

 

[weenstoned]

I don't really see these selling a ton anyways because shops that carry vapexhale products probably don't want to alienate their relationship with that company. If there was a big market they'd probably already exist.

 

[MGG]

I don't really see these selling a ton anyways because shops that carry vapexhale products probably don't want to alienate their relationship with that company. If there was a big market they'd probably already exist.

Exactly, It's a niche accessory for a niche product. Still, make it happen, I will buy it, kk thnx.

 

[u bwade wunner]

Yup I get ya Sticks.its already all been said before me.I watched the Torus,egg,pump,ion and numerous others have all been copied..I watched people fold and I would have too im sure.

I have respect for SM and the feelings of FC members close to him after watching the Evo get to where it is today.all born out of FC.I remember watching the VXC start up almost crash and funding running out before the good times.
how must the designers of all these US pieces feel.i personally don't own any counterfeit/clones

I feel that if steven doesn t make the circ..sooner than later someone will.They should do the honourable thing and contact VXL for sure and hammer something out.be aware that I am just passing on information from the seller who had already dimensions and designs on his desk.

Re the FC-MOD please post your thoughts on the design everyone .if not here then on the design thread.

i understand that the main can is too narrow and needs to be 1/3 taller.the current matrix perc sits so high in the piece and requires heaps of water There is also noo need imo to have a removeable perc in the ashcatcher.Concentrating on perc swap outs for the Main Can only seems the sensible way to go.

In summary :

Wider main can but by how much??

1/3 Taller Main can?

Fixed showerhead perc ashcatcher current sizing ok?

Options for perc changeout on the main 29mm joint.

Thoughts? Or the current design will become the reality.

 

[Cannabis Connoisseur]

Yup I get ya Sticks.its already all been said before me.I watched the Torus,egg,pump,ion and numerous others have all been copied..I watched people fold and I would have too im sure.

I have respect for SM and the feelings of FC members close to him after watching the Evo get to where it is today.all born out of FC.I remember watching the VXC start up almost crash and funding running out before the good times.
how must the designers of all these US pieces feel.i personally don't own any counterfeit/clones

I feel that if steven doesn t make the circ..sooner than later someone will.They should do the honourable thing and contact VXL for sure and hammer something out.be aware that I am just passing on information from the seller who had already dimensions and designs on his desk.

Re the FC-MOD please post your thoughts on the design everyone .if not here then on the design thread.

i understand that the main can is too narrow and needs to be 1/3 taller.the current matrix perc sits so high in the piece and requires heaps of water There is also noo need imo to have a removeable perc in the ashcatcher.Concentrating on perc swap outs for the Main Can only seems the sensible way to go.

In summary :

Wider main can but by how much??

1/3 Taller Main can?

Fixed showerhead perc ashcatcher current sizing ok?

Options for perc changeout on the main 29mm joint.

Thoughts? Or the current design will become the reality.

The percs on the ashcatcher should remain interchangeable it's awesome

 

[u bwade wunner]

The percs on the ashcatcher should remain interchangeable it's awesome

Thanks..Moving forward if the main can size is increased which looks likely.the downstem of the main can will no longer be interchangeable with the ash catcher.so two separate downstems will be needed for the piece.its a manufacturing detail that's all..

The other option is to increase the depth of the ash catcher to allow swap over.the ash catcher is already a nice size and maybe increasing it will look odd on the overall piece.thoughts?

As a standalone piece the ashcatcher is killer and Steven should stock it standalone..im interested to know if it will work in an ion for example.it has the aesthetics that would work well with any scientific piece.

 

[stonemonkey55]

I thought I would interject here. So you guys are correct, if they rip us off on our design, most likely we have very little recourse since they are in China. We don't have the resources or money to deal with it. What it does do to us is that it stifles innovation and hurts companies like ours that are actually doing something different and trying to do everything in the US. As the consumer, you probably don't give a shit and just want the most cost effective thing, I get it, but I don't operate that way. In the end, you guys are free to do whatever you want, just know in the end that it hurts small companies like mine.

I will say that this differs from the other knockoffs in that there is absolutely no other use for a Hydratube than to sit on top of an EVO. That's what it was designed for and what was patented. It was a new enough design that was different enough from the previous art for it to be granted to us. We can split hairs and semantics all we want but there would be no Hydratube design to copy if there were no EVO so it is very specifically proprietary to us.

In closing, what I will say is that doing something like this is like opening pandoras box. As many others have mentioned, I was a member here long before becoming a manufacturer and my thoughts were always to help this industry and push the technology forward. To have this same forum make knockoffs, definitely hurts us as a company and all the hard work that we put in to come up with and protect our intellectual property. Many manufacturers come to this forum as a place where they can test out ideas with a user base. If they begin feeling like this is just a place where their ideas get ripped off, then I'm sure that feeling will begin to change and that would totally suck.

Whether or not I participate in threads on this forum is a moot point, I am always reading and watching what is going on. I love this place for what it is, I even used to be a moderator here. But if this begins to become a place that hurts manufacturers, then this is not the place that I have once fell in love with.

 

[Stu]

im interested to know if it will work in an ion for example.

I just used it this way and enjoyed it quite a bit.

Edit: It fits the FC-187 as well as the GB-187 (shown below)

 

[weenstoned]

@stonemonkey55 I agree with most of what you are saying, but I think you need to look at this more like music piracy. Not every illegal download is a lost sale as not everyone would be willing to pay if that were the only option. Similarly the amount of counterfeits sold which represent actual lost sales is probably pretty low. If I had not found this thread over a year ago I would probably still own just the one bong (bought from LHS, most likely Chinese but hard to say). Now I own a ton of China glass and one American heady (a millied out n3rd minitube). Will probably own more American pieces eventually as others have said this is a gateway to interest in glass. Now there are American pieces I want after trying the knockoff (bates x worm diffusion pump comes to mind). Similarly cheap hydratubes could spur interest in the vapexhale/legit hydratubes.

I would also take issue that the only use for a hydratube is an EVO. The e-nano and herbalaire can both accommodate them. Also the extreme q could use them with an adapter. Or just as a mouthpiece on pieces with removable mouthpiece such as the fc-ufo.