Arizer Solo II

[Tranquility]

I can't put numbers on THC, for some strange reason vapor pressure numbers seem to be missing from available data.......clearly more (government funded) research is called for in a truly civilized society. Still we can follow the general idea?

Is there anything Trump can't do?

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S2468170917300310

The problem is, the vapor pressure theory is how they intend to create a breathalyzer for THC.

https://newatlas.com/marijuana-breathalyzer-vapor-pressure-nist/50424/
https://www.leafly.com/news/science-tech/researchers-one-step-closer-thc-breathalyzer
https://www.marijuana.com/news/2017/07/scientists-find-basis-for-reliable-marijuana-breathalyzer/
https://www.nist.gov/news-events/ne...ay-groundwork-reliable-marijuana-breathalyzer

It seems the research called for of a truly civilized society is going to be used to put some in jail. I don't really have a problem with that. But, those who think driving under the influence of cannabis is fine, especially if the influence makes them better drivers, might.

 

[I'm Ron Burgundy?]

lol
Put a solid nug in the Solo and vaporize it and then break it open.
Inside is going to be light brown compared to the outside, so there’s no way you are extracting everything versus chopping/grinding.

I think that’s pretty clear-cut. Feel free to post more useless stats and diagrams.

 

[smirak]

So, not specifically Solo2 related, but...my grinder leaves a lot to be desired. So, I’m in grinder shopping mode. The grinder I have grinds a medium -ish grind and I find that is good for my Solo2. However, it only grinds about half a nug and takes a lot of manipulation to get the nug pieces back to a spot to regrind. It was a cheapie $15/$20 aluminum grinder Fromm amazon.

Any recommendations?

 

[GoldenBud]

So, not specifically Solo2 related, but...my grinder leaves a lot to be desired. So, I’m in grinder shopping mode. The grinder I have grinds a medium -ish grind and I find that is good for my Solo2. However, it only grinds about half a nug and takes a lot of manipulation to get the nug pieces back to a spot to regrind. It was a cheapie $15/$20 aluminum grinder Fromm amazon.

Any recommendations?

I use this one and it's great for the solo 2, usually I pack it well in my stem so i don't need a screen

https://www.healthyrips.com/store/p46/Shred_Grinder_2.5_Edition.html

 

[OF]

Any recommendations?

Meditainer:
https://medtainer.com/

It's a shredder, not a grinder, so it fouls way less and gives more consistent results. It also stores a couple grams of stash and is 'smell proof'. What more could you want? Low price? Under ten bucks:
https://www.amazon.com/Medtainer-Me...ocphy=9032018&hvtargid=pla-306136965544&psc=1

Since I got my first one (from PIU IIRC) my other 'grinders' (Mendo Muncher being favorite) have been ignored.

OF

 

[GoldenBud]

Meditainer:
https://medtainer.com/

It's a shredder, not a grinder, so it fouls way less and gives more consistent results. It also stores a couple grams of stash and is 'smell proof'. What more could you want? Low price? Under ten bucks:
https://www.amazon.com/Medtainer-Me...ocphy=9032018&hvtargid=pla-306136965544&psc=1

Since I got my first one (from PIU IIRC) my other 'grinders' (Mendo Muncher being favorite) have been ignored.

OF

It seems like there's no keef collection option, right? and it doesn't get sticky inside?

 

[hans solo]

Think mobile transport.

 

[OF]

It seems like there's no keef collection option, right? and it doesn't get sticky inside?

No, just a 'grinder'. If you want to get into keef you might try what I used to do. I'd grind (in this case grinding) a gram or so at a time, well cured, in a coffee grinder. The cutter type, not burr type. Like this one:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00006IUX5/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1

The high speed blades tend to knock the trichomes off and static electricity hold them on the plastic top, especially the flat window for some reason. Just pour the ground herb into a jar, then brush the keef off the plastic with a camel hair brush. The key is being sure it's well cured going in so static is what's holding stuff up. FWIW I used to then weigh it out into 1/8 gram (.125 gram) into glass vials for instant loads for MFLB.

No, it doesn't get gummy if you keep it well cured (dry) going in. The teeth are cone shaped, no sharp edge to cut and get fouled in the process. They tear the herb instead. There's a molded in ring (very small) probably more correctly a 'radial rib' just above the grinding part that keeps stuff centered and provides the seal (smell control). This can get gummy over time, eventually making it harder to turn. ISO on a Q-tip and some poking with a bamboo skewer when it's softened make short work of that. It takes a while to build up and start annoying you. Or at least it does so with me.

BTW moisture (water) in your herb also slows down the vaping process. That is you get thicker vapor faster when it's well cured. Any moisture you bring in with the herb has to be e evaporated away before it can get hot enough to make vapor, 'stealing' heat that would otherwise make vapor.

For ten bucks, I suggest you order one and see how 'it fits your pistol'. Very handy and IMO effective tool for good.

Regards to all,

OF

 

[olivianewtonjohn]

So, not specifically Solo2 related, but...my grinder leaves a lot to be desired. So, I’m in grinder shopping mode. The grinder I have grinds a medium -ish grind and I find that is good for my Solo2. However, it only grinds about half a nug and takes a lot of manipulation to get the nug pieces back to a spot to regrind. It was a cheapie $15/$20 aluminum grinder Fromm amazon.

Any recommendations?

I have a santa cruz shredder, few years old and still preforms great. I also hear good things about the Brilliant Cut Grinder

Lots of grinder discussion here:
http://fuckcombustion.com/threads/herb-grinders.15/page-400

 

[GoldenBud]

No, just a 'grinder'. If you want to get into keef you might try what I used to do. I'd grind (in this case grinding) a gram or so at a time, well cured, in a coffee grinder. The cutter type, not burr type. Like this one:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00006IUX5/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1

The high speed blades tend to knock the trichomes off and static electricity hold them on the plastic top, especially the flat window for some reason. Just pour the ground herb into a jar, then brush the keef off the plastic with a camel hair brush. The key is being sure it's well cured going in so static is what's holding stuff up. FWIW I used to then weigh it out into 1/8 gram (.125 gram) into glass vials for instant loads for MFLB.

No, it doesn't get gummy if you keep it well cured (dry) going in. The teeth are cone shaped, no sharp edge to cut and get fouled in the process. They tear the herb instead. There's a molded in ring (very small) probably more correctly a 'radial rib' just above the grinding part that keeps stuff centered and provides the seal (smell control). This can get gummy over time, eventually making it harder to turn. ISO on a Q-tip and some poking with a bamboo skewer when it's softened make short work of that. It takes a while to build up and start annoying you. Or at least it does so with me.

BTW moisture (water) in your herb also slows down the vaping process. That is you get thicker vapor faster when it's well cured. Any moisture you bring in with the herb has to be e evaporated away before it can get hot enough to make vapor, 'stealing' heat that would otherwise make vapor.

For ten bucks, I suggest you order one and see how 'it fits your pistol'. Very handy and IMO effective tool for good.

Regards to all,

OF

Thanks for your comment! I'll get some Camel brush anyway, will see about the Medtainer - probably will get one.

I didn't know that if as the water percentage is higher it means slower/less vapor, because water evoporates from 100c, and most terpenes evaporated from 125c, and we vape at 175c+. How is that possible can you explain?
thanks alot.

 

[OF]

Thanks for your comment! I'll get some Camel brush anyway, will see about the Medtainer - probably will get one.

I didn't know that if as the water percentage is higher it means slower/less vapor, because water evoporates from 100c, and most terpenes evaporated from 125c, and we vape at 175c+. How is that possible can you explain?
thanks alot.

I think you've got it, you just haven't put it together. As the temperature in the load comes up the need to evaporate the water stalls the heating at 100C. Remember it takes a LOT of heat (in calories) to raise the heat (in degrees) to get from 100C (as water) to 101C (as vapor). Heat of vaporization (sometimes called 'latent heat' for a gram of water is 540 calories. That is it takes a single calorie to heat a gram of water from 99 to 100C, it takes 541 to get it to 101C (as vapor). This is why 'live steam burns' are so deadly. 100C is not a big deal but the number of calories (heat energy) it gives up when it hits your skin and tries to cool off burns the tissue all out of proportion.

So this adds a huge delay locally in the load as the temperature is 'clamped' there until the water is gone.

BTW, this same 'latent heat' is why your ice tea stays cool on a hot day. Melting the ice takes extra energy that 'sucks up the heat' to maintain 0C. Only this effect is really minor by comparison, latent heat of fusion (ice) is 80C per gram, making vapor is many many times that.

Eventually you'll get the load up to 200C and get the vapor, but by then that part that dried out early is spent and that that is still moist is holding it's THC. Vapes like Solo can only conduct heat in so fast, any heat that evaporates water doesn't heat the load or make vapor until the water is all gone.

If you want it quick and dense, keep it dry going in. Otherwise it comes out over a longer time in a less dense form. And your rig will stay cleaner, too. Water condensed again in the stem seems to make the most fouling......as we learned in the early days of MFLB.

Regards to all.

OF

Edit: Camel hair brushes are great for stuff like dust, keef and such. If, however, you're going to deal with 'baked on junk' like screens go with hog bristle ones instead. While the outside of the camel is soft, not so hogs...... Seriously tough, able to scrub. I cut them off very short (like 1/8 inch or less) so they are stiff. Great tool.

To easily and completely clean SS screens, 'flame' them. Hold the edge in an old roach clip (which you now have no other need for), tweezers or similar. Then use one of those small torch type lighters to heat the screen until it glows. Yes, 'red hot'. Everything fouling it will burn at those temperatures and the ask can be easily brushed off with your handy boar bristle brush. Because they have so much surface area and almost no mass they cool in seconds and can be back on duty in less than half a minute. No solvents, no drama.

OF

 

[GtrBob]

That is it takes a single calorie to heat a gram of water from 99 to 100C, it takes 541 to get it to 101C (as vapor).

Such an interesting fact.

Science!

 

[GoldenBud]

I think you've got it, you just haven't put it together. As the temperature in the load comes up the need to evaporate the water stalls the heating at 100C. Remember it takes a LOT of heat (in calories) to raise the heat (in degrees) to get from 100C (as water) to 101C (as vapor). Heat of vaporization (sometimes called 'latent heat' for a gram of water is 540 calories. That is it takes a single calorie to heat a gram of water from 99 to 100C, it takes 541 to get it to 101C (as vapor). This is why 'live steam burns' are so deadly. 100C is not a big deal but the number of calories (heat energy) it gives up when it hits your skin and tries to cool off burns the tissue all out of proportion.

So this adds a huge delay locally in the load as the temperature is 'clamped' there until the water is gone.

BTW, this same 'latent heat' is why your ice tea stays cool on a hot day. Melting the ice takes extra energy that 'sucks up the heat' to maintain 0C. Only this effect is really minor by comparison, latent heat of fusion (ice) is 80C per gram, making vapor is many many times that.

Eventually you'll get the load up to 200C and get the vapor, but by then that part that dried out early is spent and that that is still moist is holding it's THC. Vapes like Solo can only conduct heat in so fast, any heat that evaporates water doesn't heat the load or make vapor until the water is all gone.

If you want it quick and dense, keep it dry going in. Otherwise it comes out over a longer time in a less dense form. And your rig will stay cleaner, too. Water condensed again in the stem seems to make the most fouling......as we learned in the early days of MFLB.

Regards to all.

OF

Edit: Camel hair brushes are great for stuff like dust, keef and such. If, however, you're going to deal with 'baked on junk' like screens go with hog bristle ones instead. While the outside of the camel is soft, not so hogs...... Seriously tough, able to scrub. I cut them off very short (like 1/8 inch or less) so they are stiff. Great tool.

To easily and completely clean SS screens, 'flame' them. Hold the edge in an old roach clip (which you now have no other need for), tweezers or similar. Then use one of those small torch type lighters to heat the screen until it glows. Yes, 'red hot'. Everything fouling it will burn at those temperatures and the ask can be easily brushed off with your handy boar bristle brush. Because they have so much surface area and almost no mass they cool in seconds and can be back on duty in less than half a minute. No solvents, no drama.

OF

I did know the fact about 1 calorie, didn't know about the 541 calories from 100C to 101C!

I assume you are an engineer so I have another question, Why curing is important? The mass already stay there, after drying, in closed jars,for example, mass/vapor won't get outside. why it needs to be cured after drying? thanks!

PS
People say curing raise the THCA content - and I don't understand why. I don't get why and how it happens, and tried online searching.

 

[olivianewtonjohn]

@GoldenBud See this page:

https://darkheartnursery.com/from-the-garden/drying-and-curing-cannabis/

"How does our bloodlust for consuming still living fruit pertain to drying and curing cannabis? Excellent question, and I promise you I have a point. When cannabis is harvested, it too is still living. The floral tissue is still biosynthesizing secondary metabolites. Examples of secondary metabolites in cannabis are compounds such as THCA or CBDA. That tissue typically will cease to be living when it dries out to a point when the cell membranes rip away from the cell walls and therefore break apart. While the harvested cannabis is still fresh and wet, those cells are still alive and chugging away. The enzyme responsible for creating THCA (the enzyme is called THCA synthase) does not magically disappear once that flower is cut from the branch. It also doesn’t immediately denature into an inactive form. That means that as long as there’s still a supply of CBGA in the cells, THCA synthase will continue to catalyze the reaction that converts CBGA to THCA. This means that the overall THC content of a harvested flower continues to increase even after harvest; however, if you dry too quickly or at temperatures/relative humidities that are suboptimal, you can halt the continued post-harvest THC accumulation in the flower."

http://www.jbc.org/content/279/38/39767/F1.large.jpg

EDIT: Interesting fact I just learned is CBGA is the precursor to THCA and CBDA

https://ars.els-cdn.com/content/image/1-s2.0-S0014579307005728-gr1.jpg

 

[GoldenBud]

@GoldenBud See this page:

https://darkheartnursery.com/from-the-garden/drying-and-curing-cannabis/

"How does our bloodlust for consuming still living fruit pertain to drying and curing cannabis? Excellent question, and I promise you I have a point. When cannabis is harvested, it too is still living. The floral tissue is still biosynthesizing secondary metabolites. Examples of secondary metabolites in cannabis are compounds such as THCA or CBDA. That tissue typically will cease to be living when it dries out to a point when the cell membranes rip away from the cell walls and therefore break apart. While the harvested cannabis is still fresh and wet, those cells are still alive and chugging away. The enzyme responsible for creating THCA (the enzyme is called THCA synthase) does not magically disappear once that flower is cut from the branch. It also doesn’t immediately denature into an inactive form. That means that as long as there’s still a supply of CBGA in the cells, THCA synthase will continue to catalyze the reaction that converts CBGA to THCA. This means that the overall THC content of a harvested flower continues to increase even after harvest; however, if you dry too quickly or at temperatures/relative humidities that are suboptimal, you can halt the continued post-harvest THC accumulation in the flower."

http://www.jbc.org/content/279/38/39767/F1.large.jpg

Thanks! Very interesting

 

[OF]

Such an interesting fact.

Hey, it's an interesting world......it all kinda fits.....

Fun too, if ya let it.

Regards to all.

OF

 

[Tranquility]

Vapes like Solo can only conduct heat in so fast, any heat that evaporates water doesn't heat the load or make vapor until the water is all gone.

I see what you did there. As all true warriors, the fight is the way and the way is certainly not convection.

 

[CastIronHits]

I think that's very true. Not sure about 'the crumble test' but empirical results say it's happening? The issue is the rate and ratio of THC to 'other stuff'?

Consider that evaporation takes place below boiling point. I think folks get confused by looking at all the temperature charts without considering this. Water boils at 212F and yet a rain puddle drys (evaporates) on a warm afternoon? It just does so slowly.

Evaporation is temperature related. IIRC water has a "vapor pressure" of something like 20mm of mercury (out of a total of 760 in normal air) at 20C. This is what '100% Relative Humidity' is at that temperature. If we have say 10mm (pressure) of water vapor, 1 in 76 molecules, we have '50% RH'. If it tries to go higher than 1/36 (100% RH) the 'extra' condenses out into water vapor (and we have fog down here, or clouds up there). This generally happens when the air cools and the capacity to 'hold water' goes down.

I can't put numbers on THC, for some strange reason vapor pressure numbers seem to be missing from available data.......clearly more (government funded) research is called for in a truly civilized society. Still we can follow the general idea?

THC slowly evaporates, faster at higher temperatures. If we 'sweep' the vapor out (take a hit) room is made in the atmosphere inside the vape for more to evaporate to replace it. If not some condenses out to keep the total at 100%? We see this as Solo sits at idle, vapor 'recycles', awaiting our pleasure......

So it's really a matter of time (rate) and concentration? Good things for those not in a hurry.

Regards to all.

OF

@OF AFAIK Vapor pressures combine to effectively lower the pressure needed for molecules in a system to vaporize. Do you have a working knowledge of how this process is occurring in cannabis vaporization? As the moisture in our chambers is evaporating we should be losing compounds to distillation but as you said there is a reflux reaction in the stem.

 

[OF]

@OF AFAIK Vapor pressures combine to effectively lower the pressure needed for molecules in a system to vaporize. Do you have a working knowledge of how this process is occurring in cannabis vaporization? As the moisture in our chambers is evaporating we should be losing compounds to distillation but as you said there is a reflux reaction in the stem.

Actually it's the other way. Water boils in Denver at a lower temperature due to lower air pressure? Ships at sea make drinking water by heating sea water with engine heat and pulling a vacuum to lower the BP. It actually doesn't make a difference in our vapes since they are open systems (and therefore operated at local air pressure no matter what). Water vapor pressure is something like 20mm of the air around us as I recall. Add more molecules of water and you simply displace Nitrogen and Oxygen?

In our case, temperature controls the rate of THC evaporation, but basically none escapes unless we draw it off. It simply 'recycles'. Once we try to draw it off, the temperature drops and the ability to stay vapor drops with it. A fog of sorts form, which we erroneously call vapor (it's really an aerosol, collection of small particles, if we can see it).

In the early days of Purple Days (a stem vape) many of us conducted an informal experiment where we'd load the next stem, insert it to heat and forget all about it. Some wondered off, some took unscheduled naps. Later (the next day in some cases) a somewhat tasteless but potent hit was still patiently waiting.

While we're drying the herb locally though the load, zero THC vapor is forming since the temperature is below 100C at that point. Once the water is gone, then the temperature can go higher. In practical terms this means only part of the load is producing vapor at the start (the part nearest the walls and floor). By the time the center dries out the outside is darker and has given up some of the good stuff.

This is an easy test to run if you have a second Solo hanging around (as many of us do). Run an 'A/B test': load two stems, one dry the other not, and do a cold start run hitting each alternately. Dry vapes faster and sooner. Kind of a fun test, you might want to run it again, and again, and again......just to be sure?

OF

 

[Vape000]

I am considering buying the Solo 2 as my first vape.
As I understand it Arizer Solo 2 is a session vaporizer and seems to be best enjoyed when taking the time vaping rather than trying to smoke it all at once?

Is it possible to smoke and finish a bowl fast, lets say within 5 minutes?
I'm not really interested in spending 15-20mins or more vaping.
The oven gets cool as you draw? Does this prevent me from smoking fast? Do I need to take a pause to let the oven heat up again?

Vapers describe vaping a different high in comparison to joints. More numbing? And more made for medication / medicating?
Can I expect to get really baked~stoned on the Solo 2? I like to get blasted and joints get me there...

 

[GoldenBud]

I am considering buying the Solo 2 as my first vape.
As I understand it Arizer Solo 2 is a session vaporizer and seems to be best enjoyed when taking the time vaping rather than trying to smoke it all at once?

Is it possible to smoke and finish a bowl fast, lets say within 5 minutes?
I'm not really interested in spending 15-20mins or more vaping.
The oven gets cool as you draw? Does this prevent me from smoking fast? Do I need to take a pause to let the oven heat up again?

Vapers describe vaping a different high in comparison to joints. More numbing? And more made for medication / medicating?
Can I expect to get really baked~stoned on the Solo 2? I like to get blasted and joints get me there...

It's a badass vape at 220 C with a bubbler. Massive hits, hits harder than combusting a bonghead. vaping is much efficient than combusting in about 40%-60%.

Solo II is a good option for a first device. Portable, Wide range of temperatures, can rips with a bubbler, can bring amazing flavors at 180-195 C, and can finish a bowl under 1 minute if you want to.

 

[MasterChief]

@Vape000 I can vape a load in 3-4 rips. I depends a lot on the temp. If I want lots of flavor I set it at 340f. For a good mix of flavor and clouds I set it at 355f. If I’m using it with glass, I’ll set it to 370-380f. I can get good clouds and finish a load in 3-4 hits.

 

[smalltiredlemur]

Hi all, I just bought my first vape and it's pretty but it just feels...underwhelming. I've always been a smoker and have perfected making disposable teeny tiny gravity bongs that pack a punch and are fairly efficient, but we were hoping the vape would be even better for that as we live where it is sparse.

We did a medium grind, packed in about half the bowl (same amount I put in a gb that gets 2 people pretty blazed), started on 180C and kicked it up gradually, we got a bit high but didn't feel like anything was coming out of it after the first hit or two. The herb keeps falling out of the glass bowl and onto the surface below while using-- is it supposed to do that? Am I inhaling wrong?? The glass mouthpiece is definitely cloudy after a few uses though, am I just crazy?

 

[MasterChief]

@smalltiredlemur

I always pack a full bowl and always tap the material down with my finger to make sure it’s just below the rim of the stem. If your material is falling it out, you need to pack it down some. If you pack it too much, your draw resistance will be high. Before I put my packed stem in the Solo, I always do a test draw through the stem to make sure there isn’t too much resistance.

I’ve learned to never take a draw when the Solo gets up to temp. I wait a couple of minutes and then take a draw. This will get me some good vape on the first draw.

You can also try bumping the temp up to 190c.

 

[ejackyou]

I think that's very true. Not sure about 'the crumble test' but empirical results say it's happening? The issue is the rate and ratio of THC to 'other stuff'?

Consider that evaporation takes place below boiling point. I think folks get confused by looking at all the temperature charts without considering this. Water boils at 212F and yet a rain puddle drys (evaporates) on a warm afternoon? It just does so slowly.

Evaporation is temperature related. IIRC water has a "vapor pressure" of something like 20mm of mercury (out of a total of 760 in normal air) at 20C. This is what '100% Relative Humidity' is at that temperature. If we have say 10mm (pressure) of water vapor, 1 in 76 molecules, we have '50% RH'. If it tries to go higher than 1/36 (100% RH) the 'extra' condenses out into water vapor (and we have fog down here, or clouds up there). This generally happens when the air cools and the capacity to 'hold water' goes down.

I can't put numbers on THC, for some strange reason vapor pressure numbers seem to be missing from available data.......clearly more (government funded) research is called for in a truly civilized society. Still we can follow the general idea?

THC slowly evaporates, faster at higher temperatures. If we 'sweep' the vapor out (take a hit) room is made in the atmosphere inside the vape for more to evaporate to replace it. If not some condenses out to keep the total at 100%? We see this as Solo sits at idle, vapor 'recycles', awaiting our pleasure......

So it's really a matter of time (rate) and concentration? Good things for those not in a hurry.

Regards to all.

OF

Yes! and that's why I enjoy my 'Plenty', too!