Any recommendations for a good 4 slot 18650 battery charger?

[666Honeybadger]

no. charge at 1000mAh if you want your batteries to last more, charge at 2000mAh if you need them quickly. 2600mAh doesn't matter here.. you don't have to charge them in 1 hour exactly

Ooh...
Shows my ignorance...
So the chargers default current (which seems to be 2.000mA) is atually too high (?) to guarantee optimal battery longevity according to you?

 

[GoldenBud]

Ooh...
Shows my ignorance...
So the default current of the charger (which seems to be 2.000mA) is atually too high (?) to guarantee optimal battery longevity according to you?

yeah, 2000mAh will be too high for somebody that wants to keep these batteries more than 1yr of good performance. if you can get them in 4$ a piece, maybe you can replace them every year or so

 

[666Honeybadger]

yeah, 2000mAh will be too high for somebody that wants to keep these batteries more than 1yr of good performance. if you can get them in 4$ a piece, maybe you can replace them every year or so

Thanks for your reply!
Just checked and paid €5.75 a piece. Not too bad but still: i'd like to keep them in the best possible shape for as long as possible so i'll tune it down a bit in future.
Charging on the Molicels seems to stop at 2.200mAh. Is that normal? For some reason i thought the 26 went to 2.600mAh and the 28 to 2.800 but that's my noob side talking i guess?

 

[GoldenBud]

Charging on the Molicels seems to stop at 2.200mAh.

is this an old battery? like 6 months+?

 

[666Honeybadger]

is this an old battery? like 6 months+?

No, they are new. Some a couple of months old and some brand new...

 

[GoldenBud]

No, they are new. Some a couple of months old and some brand new...

try replacing store if you can. they may hold a stock a year before you brought it, it lost around 10% in the year it was stored
but for 5.75EUR it worth it. 10% here, 10% there... and your few months of usage reduced it to 84.6% from the total 100% 2600mAh it supposed to be..

 

[666Honeybadger]

try replacing store if you can. they may hold a stock a year before you brought it, it lost around 10% in the year it was stored
but for 5.75EUR it worth it. 10% here, 10% there... and your few months of usage reduced it to 84.6% from the total 100% 2600mAh it supposed to be..

It's strange to me because two of them came with vapes that i bought so they come from a different source. I appears to me the charger takes all of them to 2.200 automatically without a difference?

 

[GoldenBud]

which model of charger, i'll read the manual, but pretty sure the nitecore won't stop at 2200mAh without any reason

 

[666Honeybadger]

It's a Nitecore SC4.
One of the features that attracted me was that it supposedly does most/everything automatically so i hoped it would top them off at least...

 

[GoldenBud]

It's a Nitecore SC4.
One of the features that attracted me was that it supposedly does most/everything automatically so i hoped it would top them off at least...

no reason it would stop at 2200mAh, I think the batteries you've got spent some time in some warehouse, but still, 5.75EUR is a good price, I paid 9$ for 1 battery of Molicel. even with your 10%-15% loss, it's still better

 

[Squidge]

Thanks for your reply!
Just checked and paid €5.75 a piece. Not too bad but still: i'd like to keep them in the best possible shape for as long as possible so i'll tune it down a bit in future.
Charging on the Molicels seems to stop at 2.200mAh. Is that normal? For some reason i thought the 26 went to 2.600mAh and the 28 to 2.800 but that's my noob side talking i guess?

The charger will show how much energy the batteries have been recharged with, not the total capacity of the battery. There should have been energy left in the battery before you put them in the charger.

Your charger is working correctly.

On the SC4 you can set not only the voltage you want (4.2V in your case) but also the charging rate (300mA- 3,000mA). Ideally, for longevity, you should set it at 1,000mA. The manual should tell you how to do this.

If you no longer have the manual, I'll link you to where you can download one from the Nitecore site

 

[666Honeybadger]

The charger will show how much energy the batteries have been recharged with, not the total capacity of the battery. There should have been energy left in the battery before you put them in the charger.

Your charger is working correctly.

On the SC4 you can set not only the voltage you want (4.2V in your case) but also the charging rate (300mA- 3,000mA). Ideally, for longevity, you should set it at 1,000mA. The manual should tell you how to do this.

If you no longer have the manual, I'll link you to where you can download one from the Nitecore site

Cheers!
Good to know it's working as should.

So if i understand you correct this would mean the mAh shown will be (much) lower if i'd charge a battery that's only partly drained?
And since it says 2.200mAh for both the P26 and the P28 does that mean the 28 shuts off with more left in the tank (since it has 2.800mAh as oposed to the 2.600)?
Sorry if these are stupid/strange questions... Just trying to wrap my head around this.

Thanks for your advice on setting he charging rate! I figured out how to do that now.

 

[RustyOldNail]

The charger will show how much energy the batteries have been recharged with, not the total capacity of the battery. There should have been energy left in the battery before you put them in the charger.

Your charger is working correctly.

On the SC4 you can set not only the voltage you want (4.2V in your case) but also the charging rate (300mA- 3,000mA). Ideally, for longevity, you should set it at 1,000mA. The manual should tell you how to do this.

If you no longer have the manual, I'll link you to where you can download one from the Nitecore site

This is CORRECT. The OP is confusing the CHARGE RATE (Amp rate), with BATTERY CAPACITY (mAh).

Voltage for most lithium battery charging defaults to the STANDARD = 4.2 volts. Most modern 18650 lithium batteries can be charged with up to 3 AMP setting, if you are in a hurry. A 1 AMP CHARGE RATE is better for longer service. I don’t own this charger, but do READ the MANUAL, and never leave your batteries charging UNATTENDED.

 

[666Honeybadger]

This is CORRECT. The OP is confusing the CHARGE RATE (Amp rate), with BATTERY CAPACITY (mAh).

I admit i switched those up in my original question. I get that difference now so that's a small step already! Thanks guys

But my current question remains. The post from Squidge said that the mAh shown on the chargers display refers to the the amount they have been recharged with. But it says 2.200mAh consistently (different occaisoins and different capacity batteries P26 and P28)
Whitch raised this question:

So if i understand you correct this would mean the mAh shown will be (much) lower if i'd charge a battery that's only partly drained?
And since it says 2.200mAh for both the P26 and the P28 does that mean the 28 shuts off with more left in the tank (since it has 2.800mAh as oposed to the 2.600)?
Sorry if these are stupid/strange questions... Just trying to wrap my head around this.

 

[RustyOldNail]

Cheers!
Good to know it's working as should.

So if i understand you correct this would mean the mAh shown will be (much) lower if i'd charge a battery that's only partly drained?
And since it says 2.200mAh for both the P26 and the P28 does that mean the 28 shuts off with more left in the tank (since it has 2.800mAh as oposed to the 2.600)?
Sorry if these are stupid/strange questions... Just trying to wrap my head around this.

Thanks for your advice on setting he charging rate! I figured out how to do that now.

Think of the CAPACITY (mAh) as a cars gas tank. You buy a used car, you don’t know how much the gas tank can hold. To get an accurate measurement, you would have to DRAIN the tank, close to EMPTY, then when you FILL IT, you know how much it really holds. Empty on most electronic battery devices is when the voltage gets to a certain VOLTAGE, that is preset in the device by the device manufacturer. This is usually about 3-3.3 volts, you get a LOW BATTERY WARNING, then the device shuts down, and you need to REFILL - RECHARGE them.

For the battery manufacturer to claim the MOST amount of mAh, same as claiming their battery has the BIGGEST GAS TANK, they DISCHARGE in their own tests down to 2.5 volts, something you can do with advanced chargers to. You can see this in battery specification sheets. Since they charge LOWER, they can HOLD more, but that’s for ADVERTISING, as our devices never get down to 2.5 volts, as 3-3.3 volts is a SAFTY OVERHEAD.

 

[666Honeybadger]

Think of the CAPACITY (mAh) as a cars gas tank. You buy a used car, you don’t know how much the gas tank can hold. To get an accurate measurement, you would have to DRAIN the tank, close to EMPTY, then when you FILL IT, you know how much it really holds. Empty on most electronic battery devices is when the voltage gets to a certain VOLTAGE, that is preset in the device by the device manufacturer. This is usually about 3-3.3 volts, you get a LOW BATTERY WARNING, then the device shuts down, and you need to REFILL - RECHARGE them.

For the battery manufacturer to claim the MOST amount of mAh, same as claiming their battery has the BIGGEST GAS TANK, they DISCHARGE in their own tests down to 2.5 volts, something you can do with advanced chargers to. You can see this in battery specification sheets. Since they charge LOWER, they can HOLD more, but that’s for ADVERTISING, as our devices never get down to 2.5 volts, as 3-3.3 volts is a SAFTY OVERHEAD.

Thanks for the explanation! Nice analogy.

So when my charger says 2.200mAh when charged to 'full' for both Molicel P26 and P28 does that mean he estimates the amount charged rather than using exact numbers or does the P28 have a larger 'reserve-tank' (to stay in the car analogy) and has more left in the tank when it dies or does this imply that there's hardly any difference.

 

[RustyOldNail]

Thanks for the explanation! Nice analogy.

So when my charger says 2.200mAh when charged to 'full' for both Molicel P26 and P28 does that mean he estimates the amount charged rather than using exact numbers or does the P28 have a larger 'reserve-tank' (to stay in the car analogy) and has more left in the tank when it dies or does this imply that there's hardly any difference.

The difference in the P26 and P28, is the newer one has only 200mAh more CAPACITY, a tiny improvement.

Without a more expensive Charger-Analyzer, you would have to use your batteries in the same device, running them down till the device’s CUTOFF VOLTAGE, if you read the voltage immediately after, you would have an idea what that CUTOFF VOLTAGE really is, but in many devices it’s set at approximately 3-3.3 volts. You would do this run down for both batteries identically. Then you would charge both at the identical charger settings, and the P28 would in theory have 200 more mAh over the P26. But since you are NOT able to DISCHARGE the batteries down to 2.5 volts, you will never see 2600mAh or 2800mAh. Without a more complicated charger, you can’t really EMPTY the tank enough to get those PUBLISHED specifications, the numbers that are advertised and printed on the battery.

 

[GoldenBud]

my oldest P26A also can be charged up to 2200mAh. my newest up to 2500mAh

 

[666Honeybadger]

Without a more complicated charger, you can’t really EMPTY the tank enough to get those PUBLISHED specifications, the numbers that are advertised and printed on the battery.

Thanks for the explanation.
In conclusion it's probably better not to focus too much on the actual mAh numbers displayed on the charger since these are more indicative on a charger in this price range.
I'll just turn the charging speed down a bit and assess the batteries on how they perform rather than on the numbers.
One more question: would you say it's better to drain batteries completely before charging or is it better for longevity to charge them when they are down to say 25%?

 

[Squidge]

Thanks for the explanation.
In conclusion it's probably better not to focus too much on the actual mAh numbers displayed on the charger since these are more indicative on a charger in this price range.
I'll just turn the charging speed down a bit and assess the batteries on how they perform rather than on the numbers.
One more question: would you say it's better to drain batteries completely before charging or is it better for longevity to charge them when they are down to say 25%?

25%

 

[FlyingLow]

no. charge at 1000mAh if you want your batteries to last more, charge at 2000mAh if you need them quickly. 2600mAh doesn't matter here..

I dunno about this... In theory, charging at a lower rate MIGHT allow batteries a longer lifespan, BUT with the values you are suggesting, the difference would be so negligible it would be immeasurable. I see no benefit to ever charging under 1c, and many batteries today are capable of sustaining much higher charge rates.

Admittedly, most of my experience is with powering giant RC planes, not pipes.
There is no margin for error when launching $2-3k into the air, so us hobbyists tend to become quite educated in this battery arena. One miscalculation on power requirements for a servo, and I am in the dirt. We fly big ones with multiple points of redundancy. This Laser is running with multiple batteries for control surfaces, smoke pump, ignition, and redundancy. There are also voltage regulators onboard, along with all sorts of fun telemetry information that gets sent down tot the pilot in real time (fuel consumption, battery levels, voltage sags, etc.)

This is Jase. He is an Ace:

 

[GoldenBud]

I dunno about this... In theory, charging at a lower rate MIGHT allow batteries a longer lifespan, BUT with the values you are suggesting, the difference would be so negligible it would be immeasurable. I see no benefit to ever charging under 1c, and many batteries today are capable of sustaining much higher charge rates.

Because when people use 1 battery vape like TP80/TM the battery uses 10A-20A most of the time, if you can charge at 1A and not 2A, maybe it's better because it releases less heat or something, but still the difference between 1A to 2A is not any critical...

 

[RustyOldNail]

One more question: would you say it's better to drain batteries completely before charging or is it better for longevity to charge them when they are down to say 25%?

Personally, I consider batteries a consumable, even the GOOD ones like you have are not that expensive. I charge mine when they no longer power the device. Another words, I don’t bother babying them. Enjoy them.

In theory, charging at a lower rate MIGHT allow batteries a longer lifespan, BUT with the values you are suggesting, the difference would be so negligible it would be immeasurable. I see no benefit to ever charging under 1c, and many batteries today are capable of sustaining much higher charge rates.

Exactly, the effort in trying to squeeze a little more out of a battery is not worth it to me. I charge between 1-2 amps, and always charge to 4.2 volts, some with advanced chargers like mine, set their charge cutoff to 4.1 volts, this is again an effort to squeeze more overall life out of them, but again, the charts I’ve seen show such a negligible difference, not worth it to me.

 

[seedy53]

I use an Xtar VC4, always works fine for me.

been using xtar vc4s for over 1.5 years.
it does everything i could ever need and the ability to restore a battery and to prepare battery for long term storage. and with the qc 3.0 ability with proper wall charger for micro usb.
it can fast charge for a single battery @ 3.0amps.
for 2 batteries @ 2.0 amps
for 3 or 4 batteries @ 1.0 amp for all 4.
can check cap levels too.

 

[Madri-Gal]

For my personal usage, the SkyRC MC3000. But it’s expensive and complicated so I won’t bother with a link.

For my friend I recommended the Xtar VC4SL (link below). I believe it’s one of their NEWER models.
This bundle includes the appropriate USB power plug, allowing the most amperage to all 4 slots.
***I prefer Xtar over Nitecore (they do make good flashlights though).

https://www.amazon.com/XTAR-Battery-Charger-Protected-Batteries/dp/B09F5L9G6W/ref=sr_1_4?crid=3KCSENDR6UWXT&keywords=XTAR+VC4SL+Charger&qid=1657239697&sprefix=xtar+vc4sl+charger%2Caps%2C83&sr=8-4

I ordered this after reading the thread.
For the last few years, I've just used chargers that came with certain vapes, or handed them off to my tech savvy kid that understands batteries chargers, etc. A few questions asked, after reading this thread, revealed that I was wrong in assuming that because adult child plays video games and can set up my computer, that they know diddly about battery chargers. So, I now get to be the battery charger expert in the family, and a new chapter begins.