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next generation e-nails?

Discussion in 'Vapor Related Equipment' started by bassplayer, Dec 2, 2013.

  1. weenstoned

    weenstoned Well-Known Member

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    732
    I rarely do big dabs so I am not that worried. Might be a bit harder to dab cbd isolate though, but I will manage. Haven't used my enail much lately, interested to try out that uptemp dabbing or whatever it's called as well.
     
    hardboiledfrog and herbivore21 like this.
  2. herbivore21

    herbivore21 Well-Known Member

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    4,278
    If you do smaller dabs then the size of the dish might even turn out to be desirable, especially in a torch setup (easier to hit most of the nail dish with the torch flame at once)!

    The main thing I considered when I first saw those was the size of the dish for easy use of extracts with certain consistencies (crystals like isolate as you say, also crumbles and flakier budders/cake badder/stuff requiring scooping with a spoon that doesn't stick to tools) could be difficult to get into the dabbing section of the dish without potentially missing either down the centre hole or to the side.

    Even in the case of the above, there will be no problem for sap and shatter or anything that can be stuck to a dabber :)

    You definitely wanna check out stable uptemp, although I've never tried it with either of my SiC nails yet now that I think of it! I did notice in the D-nail write-up that it worked best with sapphire vs SiC because SiC retains the heat for a lot longer and so it takes longer to do the cooling down steps and makes the process a little clunky - then again, smaller surface area on a smaller dish might compensate for that some...
     
    hardboiledfrog likes this.
  3. hardboiledfrog

    hardboiledfrog tinkerer

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    61
    Awesome! SiC for the masses! :tup:

    Yes indeed, highly recommended. I've been using the uptemp mode on my e-nail exclusively since it was mentioned in this thread.
    Currently I have it set to start ramping up at 400F ending at 520F after 80 seconds. Amazing flavor on the low end and thicker vapor at the top, uptemp FTW! :tup::clap::science:
     
  4. Cannabis Connoisseur

    Cannabis Connoisseur I LOVE LIFE

    Messages:
    1,513
    Location:
    RIGHT BESIDE YOU!!!
    UPTEMP????? WHAT IS THIS UPTEMP TALK??
     
  5. waxdab23

    waxdab23 Well-Known Member

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    Location:
    Southern California
    Started from page 126 in this thread by @Monsoon
     
  6. Cannabis Connoisseur

    Cannabis Connoisseur I LOVE LIFE

    Messages:
    1,513
    Location:
    RIGHT BESIDE YOU!!!
  7. nosmoking

    nosmoking Fogmonger

    Messages:
    1,147
    Location:
    DC Area
    I bought one of these while it was on black friday sale too since I was already ordering other stuff from TAG. It was a no brainer even though I dont currently have an enail. I am just starting to gain interest in enails but I still rely on torch and quartz bangers for the time.

    The bolt actually leaves more room than what you would think, however I could see how it could easily be replaced or even sanded down with a grinding/cutting wheel to allow for more room.

    Since I don't have an enail, can I just torch the dish to use it for now? If so, does it need to be seasoned and how? Also, how do you know when sic is at temp?
     
    hardboiledfrog likes this.
  8. alittledabwilldoya'

    alittledabwilldoya' Sapphire Powered Dabstronaut.

    Messages:
    508
    Location:
    CO
    You can definitely torch SiC.
    I haven't torched much (and not at all of late), but here is a chart for the DNail SiC Halo: http://www.d-nail.com/analysis/SiC-torch.jpg

    ... and no need to season, but I would soak everything in ISO and then rinse in water.
     
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  9. hardboiledfrog

    hardboiledfrog tinkerer

    Messages:
    61
    Just another thought about uptemp, it seems many e-nail controllers are using 1/16 and 1/32 DIN temperature controllers. If you like your current e-nail you could replace just the controller with a ramp/soak controller which would give you the same function.
    Like this one - http://www.auberins.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=4
    "This is a brand new, dual display, 1/16 DIN (48 x 48 mm) programmable PID temperature/process controller. This controller is for applications where it is desirable to have adjusted set point automatically over time. Up to 30 steps can be programmed to A) ramp the temperature up and down at controlled rate, B) maintain the temperature for a specific period time, C) turn on/off the relays (alarm relay) after process reach a specific step, D) jump (for loops), run, hold or stop after process reaches a specific step."
     
  10. PoopMachine

    PoopMachine Well-Known Member

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    1,486
    Location:
    Somewhere Jus Lyke Compton
    I dont really NEED remote operation but people use web power switches on their vapes to turn them on so I dont really see the difference other than this is integrated.

    The only thing remote operation does for me is lets me clean the unit when no one is actively using it and lets me turn it off at night without having to get up. I know that sounds lazy as hell but its what I would use it for.
     
    hardboiledfrog likes this.
  11. herbivore21

    herbivore21 Well-Known Member

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    4,278
    I feel you on that last sentence especially man! Not lazy :) However there are plenty of offline, networkless devices that can achieve this. The D-nail 2.0 provides this functionality with a remote control for years and years now.

    Basically all I'm driving at is that as a scientist with design and engineering experience, it seems to me that vape designers are so used to relying on internet connectivity to do everything (like most of us these days!) that they don't stop to consider whether it is the best way to achieve the relevant functions in the intended application. When all that you have is a hammer - everything looks like a nail! In this case, the computer networking interfaces are the hammer. :2c:
     
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  12. PoopMachine

    PoopMachine Well-Known Member

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    1,486
    Location:
    Somewhere Jus Lyke Compton
    I can see that. As a IT support engineer I welcome the technology but I know my stuff is secure and locked down so maybe that skews my view a little.
     
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  13. mutten840

    mutten840 Well-Known Member

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    347
    Location:
    Bothell, Washington
    Seems like if you had a decent router and a solid password. You would have nothing to worry about. Also "Everything" is connected in some way shape or form now and so to have one more item that meshes with my network is not an issue. @herbivore21 The Dnail controller you referenced is roughly the price of 2 Hex-nail units. Also, they are going to make an offline version for the few that prefer this over the online versions. I have yet to see a single controller out there that will allow the user to conveniently adjust settings while being able to understand what they mean. I have built and repaired many home brew setups and know the settings can be very confusing to navigate partially because they are made for industrial use cases. Oh yeah and don't forget about online updates.
    Imagine getting a new batch of tuned settings to make your already awesome setup, even better. :rockon:
     
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2016
    hardboiledfrog likes this.
  14. Silat

    Silat When the Facts Change, I Change My Mind.

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    Location:
    Oregon
    I mean this: It is nice to see people direct others to the info they want.
    Too many times I see people tell others to read the whole thread and find it themselves.
    This thread is 128 pages.
     
  15. weenstoned

    weenstoned Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    732
    Just tried a couple uptemp dabs with my quartz dish nail. Very flavorful, think I had better results starting slightly hotter than the suggested by dnail. Also I think my enail gets to 400 too fast and isn't actually that hot yet so I had better results going up to ~550 then turning it off and letting it go down to 400. I think the effects were basically the same as a normal dab (if not slightly improved), but I wasn't totally sober when I started so I wouldn't bet on it yet.
     
  16. PoopMachine

    PoopMachine Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,486
    Location:
    Somewhere Jus Lyke Compton
    Just looked to see the Dnail 2.0 is $650 without a coil or nail. WOW!!!! I had no idea that unit was so pricey.
     
  17. weenstoned

    weenstoned Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    732
    Just got in the SiC nail from TAG. Heating up to 550 currently. As I was hoping it does fit on the chinese HE copy, but there's a tiny bit of room. The carb cap I was using on the quartz hybrid nail just barely fits so that could possibly be an issue. I guess it's like a millimeter or two bigger than the quartz hybrid dish, and I don't think it's quite as tiny as the pictures suggest. Also the walls are pretty high so it could potentially take some globs (not that I ever really do them). What temp do you run your d-nail SiC at @herbivore21 (I know you have said it a bunch of times in various threads but I am kinda lazy) or other users?

    Also shipping was really fast, I am jealous of the US mail service. Seems like Canada Post treats every US package I get like it's super important and gets it to me faster than Amazon Prime stuff.

    Edit: Very nice, took one dab at 550 that was definitely a lot tastier than the quartz enail, then I turned it down to 525 and took a couple more. Seems like there may have been more trails at 525, and I can't totally judge on whether the flavor improved much as I dabbed 3 different strains whoops.

    Won't be giving up bangers as some of my rigs are too tiny to comfortably support an e-nail, but I will likely be busting out the enail a lot more and encourage people to buy the nail or if you own a quartz hybrid already then just the dish at least.
     
    Last edited: Dec 14, 2016
    hardboiledfrog likes this.
  18. herbivore21

    herbivore21 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    4,278
    D-nails own CEO and head designer was always very up front in saying that for most people, the 2.0 controller is overkill. The additional costs come among other things from a PID with capabilities that are really more useful for applications other than an e-nail. The 2.0 controller is best for advanced users who are also using this to control other lesser-known products used in extraction etc (ie: D-nails silicone heat mats etc) or DIY projects.

    Your experiences with trails at 525 and not discernibly better flavor than at 550 is definitely what I've come to expect from SiC nails. Wasting it to taste it does not apply here. If you get trails, turn your temp up, it won't taste worse and once it does, that's when you stop turning the temp up ;)

    I tend to use 570-650 (lower end of these temps for SiC halo, the Liger SiC requires the higher temps) for my SiC nails, but I am heating larger dishes and in the case of the liger, heating titanium before the heat gets to the SiC insert. Both cases require more heat than when using a smaller SiC dish like yours, which is definitely half the diameter of the D-nail halo let alone the liger dish ;) I think that 550 is likely to be your temp from the sound of it :D

    You might actually find that if you had a base/retaining nut that held the dish to the coil more snugly, that you could get away with lower temps still!

    What you say about rigs needing to be able to support an e-nail is so true man, I've consciously chosen all of the rigs that I own by that criterion for that reason! Also IME SIC is much, much better to torch than quartz. I recommend torching your SiC nail instead of using your bangers. It will taste much better and give less trails! SiC is the absolute best substance for torch dabs once you dial in your torching technique.
     
  19. PoopMachine

    PoopMachine Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,486
    Location:
    Somewhere Jus Lyke Compton
    Thats all well and good but again, that price is nuts. I dont really care who or what its for. And its not that the price itself is nuts, its what you get for your money. If you look at all the newer controllers out there and then look at Dnail, how do you justify that price? If it was made out of gold maybe. It doesnt help that the remote unit is some external add on with a car alarm looking remote. Guess thats for people that want remote control without IoT connectivity. They could have just used a Clapper instead. Maybe they could have sold it for $595.00 then.
     
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  20. herbivore21

    herbivore21 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    4,278
    Man, I for one actually have uses for a 2.0 controller for some of the abovementioned non-enail applications and would not have a problem paying such a price (btw man you should see how much comparable lab heater controllers for these applications cost - you'd lose your shit!). For super low temp (like below rosin pressing temps) lab applications with very small tolerances for temp variation from the controller, the cheaper controllers out there (even the 1.2/1.3 d-nail controllers) are just not ideal! There are a variety of other such cases where a 2.0 could be justified.

    Of course the 2.0 unit is no longer the newest kid on the block, I am waiting to see what happens with the incoming new d-nail controllers as well as some of the other new ones before making another purchase and put up with the shortcomings of other controllers for these purposes in the meantime. Still, there is definitely shit that I avoid doing with said equipment right now because my current controllers are risking damage to heated components as they aren't quite sensitive/accurate enough.

    BTW, the d-nail 2.0 is actually quite old now man, it has been available for years. It is not reasonable to compare it to the incoming, not quite retail available units like the hex-nail that are now starting to provide more features than this one. It stands apart from the existing PID crop for the reasons I said above and the additional cost is justified in a number of cases (these just don't appear to apply to your needs or those of most others) ;)
     
  21. mutten840

    mutten840 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    347
    Location:
    Bothell, Washington
    @PoopMachine "The dab clapper" capable of turning your electronic dab tools on or off with a clap of your hands. I am feeling it over the car remote :rockon:
     
  22. alittledabwilldoya'

    alittledabwilldoya' Sapphire Powered Dabstronaut.

    Messages:
    508
    Location:
    CO
  23. herbivore21

    herbivore21 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    4,278
    There was actually a 2.0 version that was gold plated too, but that must have sold lol

    A solid gold controller would have an other-worldly cost! :lol:


    EDIT: @mutten840 actually a clap activated e-nail might not be so great for many of us who medicate neurological conditions. Conditions involving related tics and other involuntary/uncontrollable hand movements would be a challenge to say the least!
     
  24. mutten840

    mutten840 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    347
    Location:
    Bothell, Washington
    @herbivore21 then in those cases the remote might prove more useful. Personally I know I would start clapping about something and be turning my shit on and off!!!:science:
     
    herbivore21 likes this.
  25. herbivore21

    herbivore21 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    4,278
    lol! I'm imagining a dab so tasty that you applaud it before taking it, only to realize that your e-nail switched off during the applause :lol:
     
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