Reliable ShotZ
Active Member
Portable, convection and decent battery life sounds pretty damn good. Will it have spacers for lightweights like me?
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Discontinued Zion vaporizer
- Thread starter lwien
- Start date
Shit Snacks
Milaana. Lana. LANA. LANAAAA! (TM2/TP80/BAK/FW9)
With pure convection, no need for a spacer
TheDudeNextDoor
Abiding
I love that I will be able to use my 18650s as I already have several for my juice vapes. That is huge for me, especially since my Elux charger came with a car adapter.
MrPeanut
Zion, stealing faces since 2015
A glimpse of day two of 2x4 beta testing. I did not torture test the batteries (or my tolerance level) like I did on day one. I spent a lot more time with lower heat and softer draws. The cloud density seemed pretty consistent. I ran 14 sessions total.
I left fully charged batteries in the unit overnight and noted a pretty dramatic loss in power. I know RBT already plans on addressing the issue in the Zion. I was able to get 5 nice slow (sipping) sessions before the power cut off and recharge was needed.
Today I am removing the batteries in between sessions and am up to #8. I am varying load size, draw size and heat settings as well. I am working with 4 different materials which all have very different densities. I have been able to control the heat well and the duff remains un-burnt and light brown and the vapor has been fairly uniform.
With other vaporizers I have noticed that after 4 or 5 uses they need to be cleaned thoroughly or there is "that" taste... #44 sessions in and the unit is producing clean and tasty vapor just like the first night I received it.
Well it is damn cold here and time to do chores. Have a great day all.
I left fully charged batteries in the unit overnight and noted a pretty dramatic loss in power. I know RBT already plans on addressing the issue in the Zion. I was able to get 5 nice slow (sipping) sessions before the power cut off and recharge was needed.
Today I am removing the batteries in between sessions and am up to #8. I am varying load size, draw size and heat settings as well. I am working with 4 different materials which all have very different densities. I have been able to control the heat well and the duff remains un-burnt and light brown and the vapor has been fairly uniform.
With other vaporizers I have noticed that after 4 or 5 uses they need to be cleaned thoroughly or there is "that" taste... #44 sessions in and the unit is producing clean and tasty vapor just like the first night I received it.
Well it is damn cold here and time to do chores. Have a great day all.
Great find with the power drain. There really should only be milliamperes of drain. The electrical engineer is working through a failure modes analysis and is looking onto the three most likely root causes.
We will offer a "unit only" option for those that have high drain 18650s to reduce their cost provided the batteries are on the approved list.
Reliable ShotZ
Active Member
May I ask what are temperature options for this device? sorry if I've missed it.
@cybrguy is quite knowledgeable on the Zion and is fielding questions so well here I feel like he should be on the payroll lol.
He is correct in his assumption that we are driving the temperature with a potentiometer. We are still working out the resistance of the fixed and trim resistors as well as the resistance of the heating element. Today in gross numbers it ranges from a couple hundred degrees to over 450 -/+ 25. Once we prove out the base technologies with the 2x4 prototypes we will fine tune the heating system. One of the nice things about the technology is that you can tune it to run at over a broad temperature range. This will allow for it to be set for specific users and uses in the future. I have my electrical engineer looking into if we can have an interchangeable fixed resistor that would allow for you to target specific narrow temperature ranges. This will give the rheostat finer adjustment in that range rather than sweeping a broader range. This device has been so impressive in the raw I can only imagine what it will be once the finishing touches are complete. I love the Zion a little more everyday.
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cybrguy
Putin is a War Criminal
It's quiet in here. I think @RastaBuddhaTao needs to get a couple more samples out there to help keep the discussion going. I know a REALLY good place for him to send one... 
MikeInMiami
Well-Known Member
I second that!It's quiet in here. I think @RastaBuddhaTao needs to get a couple more samples out there to help keep the discussion going. I know a REALLY good place for him to send one...
MikeInMiami
Well-Known Member
Hey @RastaBuddhaTao , any chance you or @MrPeanut can put out any more usage videos ? 
I wanna see more clouds!!
I wanna see more clouds!!
MrPeanut
Zion, stealing faces since 2015
Sorry for the delays in reporting. It is still deep winter here in the Adirondacks and keeping the water flowing to all of the farm critters is no easy task.
The ability of the 2x4 to keep up with my first day's insane run/torture test of 20+ sessions on one charge was probably due to the batteries being brand new.
Since then I am consistently getting 8-12 session per charge depending on how I am consuming (sippin' vs. rippin').
I have used the 2x4 in temps now down to as low as -11 deg F.
With normal use and not suckling the thing like a newborn on it's mother teat the 2x4 remains cool to the touch with nice cool hits and even roasted duff.
If you do run 4 or 5 successive sessions the outer box gets slightly warm near the heater element but nothing like the butane vape I used mostly in the past.
I do believe that the Zion will make the 2x4 look like the old soldering iron vapes of days past. I hope I get one soon @RastaBuddhaTao
The ability of the 2x4 to keep up with my first day's insane run/torture test of 20+ sessions on one charge was probably due to the batteries being brand new.
Since then I am consistently getting 8-12 session per charge depending on how I am consuming (sippin' vs. rippin').
I have used the 2x4 in temps now down to as low as -11 deg F.
With normal use and not suckling the thing like a newborn on it's mother teat the 2x4 remains cool to the touch with nice cool hits and even roasted duff.
If you do run 4 or 5 successive sessions the outer box gets slightly warm near the heater element but nothing like the butane vape I used mostly in the past.
I do believe that the Zion will make the 2x4 look like the old soldering iron vapes of days past. I hope I get one soon @RastaBuddhaTao
KeroZen
Chronic vapaholic
Unfortunately that's quite the inverse with Li-XXX chemistries, they hate running at sub-freezing temperatures.
See: http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/discharging_at_high_and_low_temperatures
and http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/charging_at_high_and_low_temperatures
And apparently it's not recommended anymore even for "old" chemistries: http://www.snopes.com/oldwives/battery.asp
MikeInMiami
Well-Known Member
Thanks for the support all! The karma whore and I have been working hard on the new design with the cap. It caused us to rethink our manufacturing process to ensure a seamless fit of the cap to the body. The design is complete and we are working to machine the new bodies. All of the parts should be in by the end of the week. Next week we should build and test the Zion 12s. Maybe karma who're will give you a sneak peek at a 3D rendering or PDF before the actual photos and videos are released
The only draw resistance in the unit comes from the load other than a small resistance from the screens. There is a mouthpiece screen that we are working on that will be adjustable to set the load size. There is a fine mesh screen that covers and protects the heater. Both screens are 316 stainless steel and all flow path parts are washed in isopropyl alcohol prior to assembly.
This method traps the load between the two screens allowing for any orientation. The standard 19mm joint interface provides a standard connection to most water attachments.
Mr. Peanut can give more user feedback and I will be reviewing the performance of the other 2x4 user on Friday and will post an update as he is not on the forum. Other than an electrical glitch that Mr. P is having that we are working on find the root cause of the units are performing Better than I expected. If this continues we should be in a position to take pre-orders in about a month. The first run of 100 will be sold to any FC member with a discount prior to sale to the general public in appreciation of all the help, feedback and support that the FC members have shown.... FC Rocks!
The only draw resistance in the unit comes from the load other than a small resistance from the screens. There is a mouthpiece screen that we are working on that will be adjustable to set the load size. There is a fine mesh screen that covers and protects the heater. Both screens are 316 stainless steel and all flow path parts are washed in isopropyl alcohol prior to assembly.
This method traps the load between the two screens allowing for any orientation. The standard 19mm joint interface provides a standard connection to most water attachments.
Mr. Peanut can give more user feedback and I will be reviewing the performance of the other 2x4 user on Friday and will post an update as he is not on the forum. Other than an electrical glitch that Mr. P is having that we are working on find the root cause of the units are performing Better than I expected. If this continues we should be in a position to take pre-orders in about a month. The first run of 100 will be sold to any FC member with a discount prior to sale to the general public in appreciation of all the help, feedback and support that the FC members have shown.... FC Rocks!
Shit Snacks
Milaana. Lana. LANA. LANAAAA! (TM2/TP80/BAK/FW9)
This relationship works two ways though;
Truly it it is your company @RastaBuddhaTao that really rocks!
Truly it it is your company @RastaBuddhaTao that really rocks!
cybrguy
Putin is a War Criminal
Synergy at its finest
I agree. I love the relationship you (and other manufacturers) have developed with the members here at FC. It doesn't get any better than that! Keep up the good work man!
TheDudeNextDoor
Abiding
mixchu69
Well-Known Member
I'm a big concentrate fan, but would like to see a separate vaporizer if it tarnishes the flower taste. I know a lot of people do not have easy access to concentrates and only use flowers, so a separate smaller unit sounds great.
IMO, concentrate use is rapidly growing in legal states and I would focus on concentrate use too. A lot of new vapes are coming out with the ability to do both. personally, if it tarnishes the experience with flowers, I like the idea of creating a smaller concentrate alternative. However, I don't think everyone shares my feelings and would only want to purchase one unit to save on cost.
Thanks for the input! We have a method to adapt the unit to run concentrates and it worked pretty well.
There is one more design concept to try that would prevent the heater dispersion screen from being contaminated. It won't be optimal but if it works well and if it doesn't detract from the flower performance we will do it.
However, we have the ability to run the concentrates directly on our heater unit with full temperature control and the performance is mind blowing. The heater has a large surface area so you easily apply the concentrate rather than try to apply to a small coil of wire. We will also be able to power the unit with one battery making it more affordable and smaller. So, even if we enable the Zion to run concentrates we will still design a dedicated vape.
We do understand that it is a nice option to have one unit do both and plan to investigate offering a Zion with interchangeable flower and concentrate head units.
So the question is, stealth flower or concentrate vape next. What does the FC community steering committee think?