Discontinued VapeXhale Cloud

[Madcap79]

WeMo's sold out!! Dammit!

Has anyone posted the official email they received for why white evo cannot be produced? I ordered the black and wouldn't get the email, but I would love to read what they sent out thou.

Discoloration I believe.

mod note: Please avoid back-to-back posts, use Edit instead. Two posts merged.

 

[Anonymouse]

The titanium Space Case isn't made out of solid titanium, its made out of aluminum like their other grinders. The difference between the two is that the titanium models are anodized (which the "original" versions are not) and have titanium oxide additives added to the anodizing process to achieve a harder coating than anodized aluminum without additives. For those not in the know, anodizing is a common method of not only coloring metals, but also adding a hard and durable outer coating.

Long story short, the anodized finish is what is probably chipping off. There are a few different ways of anodizing metal and some methods adhere better than others.

All Space Case grinders are anodised. The extremely-misleadingly-named "Titanium" ones just have a thicker anodised layer and nominal use of titanium that seems to serve no additional purpose beyond marketing.

Anodising is not about adding colour, it's about forcing a protective oxide layer on the surface of the metal to protect it from corrosion and scratching. To be beneficial it requires a metal that has a much harder oxide than base metal, and that forms a non-porous oxide, so it's really only practical with aluminium. This oxide layer can be dyed to add superficial colouring (it's otherwise transparent), but the main point of the exercise is protection and durability.

Bits of metal are flaking off as the grinder is just aluminum, not titanium. Anodising can scratch off, but it won't "flake" off; not only is the layer incredibly thin, it's also bonded to the metal substrate on a per-atom basis.

 

[b0]

I changed my order from a white one to a black one. No way I'm giving up a new EVO with a 2 year warranty, for a $250 refund!

I hope they send my email soon, I'm sure I want a black one and not the refund lol

 

[Sinclue]

Has anyone posted the official email they received for why white evo cannot be produced? I ordered the black and wouldn't get the email, but I would love to read what they sent out thou.

eMail specifically requested that it not be reposted, etc...
Although a standard disclaimer, it is still their wish and I'd expect most would honor it.

 

[Fame Is A Vapor]

I hope they send my email soon, I'm sure I want a black one and not the refund lol

check your junk mail?

 

[b0]

check your junk mail?

Checked it just in case, not there. None of the emails I've received from VXH team went there, but I had nothing to lose checking.

 

[Fame Is A Vapor]

Hmmm.

Checked it just in case, not there. None of the emails I've received from VXH team went there, but I had nothing to lose checking.

Yeah, well if I were you I don't think I'd wait much longer before just going ahead and opening a support ticket to let them know my preference...

 

[b0]

Hmmm.

Yeah, well if I were you I don't think I'd wait much longer before just going ahead and opening a support ticket to let them know my preference...

Where is the hiden cam?

Just did that!!

 

[Vessel]

 

[King]

All Space Case grinders are anodised. The extremely-misleadingly-named "Titanium" ones just have a thicker anodised layer and nominal use of titanium that seems to serve no additional purpose beyond marketing.

The original Space Case Grinders are polished aluminum not anodized. If you'd like to test this, grab a AA battery and some metal leads. The polished aluminum will conduct a current through the lid of the grinder, the anodized aluminum will not. The surface of an anodized item is practically non-conductive (I say practically just to cover my own ass).

Anodising is not about adding colour, it's about forcing a protective oxide layer on the surface of the metal to protect it from corrosion and scratching.

Why can't it be both? Anodizing is one of the most cost effective ways of coloring aluminum, on top of that it adds durability. If I wanted to color a piece of solid aluminum I would anodize it (unless I knew someone with access to powder coating equipment), even if durability wasn't a factor.

To be beneficial it required a metal that has a much harder oxide than base metal, and that forms a non-porous oxide, so it's really only practical with aluminium. This oxide layer can be dyed to add superficial colouring, but the main point of the exercise is protection and durability.

There are different types of anodizing, but the most common will form a porous coating on the aluminum. This is why its possible to add color in the form of dye. The pores can then be closed by boiling (for non dyed parts) or with nickel acetate.

Other metals can be anodized, but I don't work with them so I can't speak to their benefits. I know that titanium can be given an extremely hard ceramic-like coating called titanium nitride.

The "main point" of anodizing varies by application. There isn't a blanket statement that can discount one of the benefits of anodizing over another.

Bits of metal are flaking off as the grinder is just aluminum, not titanium. Anodising can scratch off, but it won't "flake" off; not only is the layer incredibly thin, it's also bonded to the metal substrate on a per-atom basis.

One way or another, the anodizing coating isn't titanium. You are right, correctly anodized parts will not flake. Complications in the anodizing process or aberrations in the aluminum prior to anodizing can cause complications that can yield flake-like results. Not terribly common, I doubt thats happening here.

Here are two fantastic resources on details of anodizing:

1. http://www.defelsko.com/applications/anodizing/Anodizing.htm
2. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anodizing

 

[Fame Is A Vapor]

Where is the hiden cam?

Just did that!!

It's not a hidden cam, Norman @b0
Now finish up on your computer and come rub the lotion on its skin. It does this whenever it's told. Do you want the hose again?...

 

[Anonymouse]

For me the SS elbs taste just fine, but there is a better material, titanium. Titanium elbs would be more durable, better flavor that some may or may not notice at all, and also you can clean them with a torch. Just torch it until it is glowing red, allow it to cool and tada brand spankin new.

The problem with making an ELB out of titanium mesh is that it would require a complete redesign. Unlike stainless steel, which is readily welded, titanium is a much more reactive metal, and, when heated to a thousand degrees of molten fury in an environment containing oxygen, instead of flowing politely together like molten steel, molten titanium prefers to erupt into a blinding, white-hot, unquenchable inferno. No welding means no welded titanium mesh exists (normal stainless screens are welded mesh). If you want Ti mesh it has to be either woven (expensive, and also it frays), or expanded (where they die-cut lots of parallel, offset, perforated lines in a metal sheet, then stretch the sheet to open all the little holes from the perforations). The expanded stuff is either really large-gauge mesh, or very fragile if fine, so also not ideal. Plain old perforated sheet would work as screen material too, but it offers the worst airflow performance of all. Also consider how a stainless ELB fits together; the mesh is welded together at the bottom, and also welded to the pressed metal cup at the top end. Both not options with titanium.

A titanium ELB would have to take a totally new approach, with no welding. Maybe somethng like the elbow screens in the Arizer Extreme Q would work, where the mesh cup is pressed from a sheet of mesh rather than cut and welded together, and then the shape is retained by a rivet ring around the top instead of welding to a pre-pressed cap. Might be hard to make a full-size ELB this way, but maybe the occasionally-discussed "mini" ELB would work.

I wonder if it'd be worth all that effort, though. I'd like to propose a simple experiment. Take your Cloud, and hit through a water tool, with water, everything as normal, only no ELB in the Cloud. Really examine and savour the taste of the draw. Then, place an empty ELB and repeat the test. Can you detect the added "taste" of the ELB? (And if you can, can you still do it when you get a friend to help with the experiment and not tell you whether he's put the ELB in or not for a few trials?) I doubt anyone could pick it in a proper double-blind test.

 

[b0]

It's not a hidden cam, Norman @b0
Now finish up on your computer and come rub the lotion on its skin. It does this whenever it's told. Do you want the hose again?...

Did you know that I have a tattoo of Hannibal Lecter in my leg too? You are nailing every post today! LMAO

Edit: Sorry for the offtopic, too much Cloud+ today!

 

[Anonymouse]

Titanium is known for being a bit brittle (not bending well) I read that if you bend your titanium dabber trying to bend it back can snap it, so a SS elb might actually be the more durable choice

Titanium is extremely malleable and ductile (essentially the opposites of "brittle"), far more so than most metals, and while any metal will become brittle if deformed enough times, the process is far slower in Ti than, say, steel or aluminium. Bend a steel wire back and forth on itself just a few times, and it'll probably break. A high-purity Ti wire of the same thickness though would last hundreds, maybe thousands of similar cycles before failing. This is why titanium eyeglass frames are so awesome, You can crush them, sit on them, warp and torture them, and then just bend them back at room temperature, none the worse for wear. That'd permanently weaken a set of steel frames.

 

[WaxOnWaxOff]

I'd like to propose a simple experiment. Take your Cloud, and hit through a water tool, with water, everything as normal, only no ELB in the Cloud. Really examine and savour the taste of the draw. Then, place an empty ELB and repeat the test. Can you detect the added "taste" of the ELB? (And if you can, can you still do it when you get a friend to help with the experiment and not tell you whether he's put the ELB in or not for a few trials?) I doubt anyone could pick it in a proper double-blind test.

I like where you're going with this, but I don't think that would be a fair test. I think it's more about the way the vapor reacts with the metal.

 

[Enchantre]

Titanium is extremely malleable and ductile (essentially the opposites of "brittle"), far more so than most metals, and while any metal will become brittle if deformed enough times, the process is far slower in Ti than, say, steel or aluminium. Bend a steel wire back and forth on itself just a few times, and it'll probably break. A high-purity Ti wire of the same thickness though would last hundreds, maybe thousands of similar cycles before failing. This is why titanium eyeglass frames are so awesome, You can crush them, sit on them, warp and torture them, and then just bend them back at room temperature, none the worse for wear. That'd permanently weaken a set of steel frames.

Um, no. It is not malleable. Seriously, it is not.
You are mistaking a flexibility for actual "elasticity" and malleable-ness.

Those eyeglass frames are NOT made of Ti. They may have a thread of Ti running through them, which provides strength, but that is not being malleable.

 

[Anonymouse]

I like where you're going with this, but I don't think that would be a fair test. I think it's more about the way the vapor reacts with the metal.

I'd imagined flavour purists are just worried about the possibility of adding "hot metal" taste, but if you can't pick out the ELB's taste from the all-glass background on an empty hit, you're certainly not going to notice it under a firestorm of rich, organic aromatics evaporating.

Plus, if the prescence of metal altered the taste of vapour in some qualitative sense, imagine how crappy the Sublimator would taste.

 

[stickstones]

I tend to use my Cloud the same way all the time, with variances only ranging from nine to noon on the dial.

Yesterday I tried the 'dab' method of dropping a little bit of herb in an elb and hoofing it up on the highest setting. That was amazing! Two to four really good hits off of about nothing and the taste didn't get bad. Thanks to whoever threw that tip out to me...me likey!

 

[vtac]

I'd imagined flavour purists are just worried about the possibility of adding "hot metal" taste, but if you can't pick out the ELB's taste from the all-glass background on an empty hit, you're certainly not going to notice it under a firestorm of rich, organic aromatics evaporating.

Plus, if the prescence of metal altered the taste of vapour in some qualitative sense, imagine how crappy the Sublimator would taste.

Also an important difference between the Cloud's ELB and other vaporizers using stainless steel is that the ELB is only exposed to the herbal vaporization temperatures since it's in the airpath at the same point as the herb, and isn't part of the heater itself. I can detect a metal taste from log vapes and the Sublimator for example (nothing terrible, mind you), but nothing from the Cloud.

If you want an ALL glass setup with the Cloud it's not that hard to set up. I also find it very easy to clean SS ELBs with ISO. That's Stainless Steel Easy Load Bowls with Isopropanol for you poor newbies reading this.

 

[King]

Also an important difference between the Cloud's ELB and other vaporizers using stainless steel is that the ELB is only exposed to the herbal vaporization temperatures since it's in the airpath at the same point as the herb, and isn't part of the heater itself. I can detect a metal taste from log vapes and the Sublimator for example (nothing terrible, mind you), but nothing from the Cloud.

If you want an ALL glass setup with the Cloud it's not that hard to set up. I also find it very easy to clean SS ELBs with ISO. That's Stainless Steel Easy Load Bowls with Isopropanol for you poor newbie reading this.

I love the way you framed that picture!

 

[stonemonkey55]

It was a tough decision to make but ultimately, for a $600 product, people would have been pretty upset with the discoloration.

RIP white EVO, you were a great cgi render while you lasted...

White didn't even work out in OREO mode

 

[gigaurora]

It was a tough decision to make but ultimately, for a $600 product, people would have been pretty upset with the discoloration.


White didn't even work out in OREO mode

OMG I will sell you 1.5 kindeys and my left nut for that. Thats the next step to my dream of a zebra vape. With a zebra vape, .5 kidneys is more then enough

 

[2 Paces]

White didn't even work out in OREO mode

Would that have been an OrEvo?

 

[Fame Is A Vapor]

Would that have been an OrEvo?

FTW!!!

 

[max]

I like where you're going with this, but I don't think that would be a fair test. I think it's more about the way the vapor reacts with the metal.

What do you mean by 'react'? There's no chemical reaction between the vapor and the ss, just some condensation, and that occurs with any material that vapor contacts. It's a simple question of whether you can detect any taste from the steel, and whether it bothers you enough to try an alternative or not. As vtac points out, there is a way to eliminate the metal, but for most people the minuses of doing so outweigh the pluses.

White didn't even work out in OREO mode

That's more like Obama mode to me- half and half . Oreo sounds cooler though.