Discontinued ThermoVape Revolution for concentrates

[weedemon]

i think some air is getting in through the closed window as well. once the oil seeps up and starts to cover the edges where the window and cover meet then it's better. but this is a new problem: i get oil on my hands and clothes easily now! I dislike that even more than is dislike the airflow when the parts are clean! i'm not putting my finger over the window for 2 reasons also: it's too hot after the first few hits to do that anymore, and after then once it's oily i don't want to touch it either.

imo, it would be better without the window all together also. I prefer top loading as it's less messy anyways.

I love my rev so i think this would improve it.

 

[OF]

i think some air is getting in thought the closed window as well. once the oil seeps up and starts to cover the edges where the window and cover meet then it's better. but this is a new problem: i get oil on my hands and clothes easily now! I dislike that even more than is dislike the airflow when the parts are clean! i'm not putting my finger over the window for 2 reasons also: it's too hot after the first few hits to do that anymore, and after then once it's oily i don't want to touch it either.

imo, it would be better without the window all together also. I prefer top loading as it's less messy anyways.

I love my rev so i think this would improve it.

Thanks. I just can't find a leak in any of these carts. Next time I boil one clean I'll check carefully.

I'm sure TV will be on this in due time, but I'm thinking there's still going to be some oil getting out when you pull the top off (rather when put it back on) as the area under the o-ring is going to be wet. That's what Beta testing is for, so it's probably not important.

OF

 

[SameOldTim]

Looks like the LV is spiking some of your interests! I've been using my own LV for a while now (not quite as long as OFs) and i bring it everywhere with me. Recently I've been loading it very full in the morning and use it all day without refilling, Usually takes about 8-10 drops.

It looks like that refill kit you posted is probably some kind of VG/PG/PEG mix with oil, if that's the case then there should be no problem using it in a Rev. There are many different systems to dilute oils and many different methods for each, like OF pointed out the Rev can be "reset" by simply boiling it and flushing out your old product.

That's pretty neat that some of you have been using the AVA-LR attys as a "windowless Rev", that's part of the beauty of our modular designs. While the LV and AVA-LR are very similar there are some design changes that separate them, mostly accounting for the LVs limited "liquid cooling" that is provided by the ejuice for the LRs.
Stay tuned everyone, we have some pretty cool stuff in the works!

 

[BudBuddy]

Awe man I got excited to try out my AVA atomizer but then I realized I got the HR one to use with my REV so I'm going to keep that unit in tact cause I love my little mini hookah. ^_^

Edit* I've never had a problem with air flow problems because of the window. I just would like a windowless one for ease of use like others are finding in the LR, just want something specifically for oils.

Actually those guys are still 'a bust', at least more so than the sort I was suggesting like this one:
http://www.usplastic.com/catalog/item.aspx?itemid=40782&catid=834

I have a handful of the same guys that are clear and have caps. Like I said, I think they're from the pipette guys. Still an innovative packaging idea, let's see if it catches on?

OF

Ah ok, that one looks much less suspect without measurements and what have you. With that long of a nozzle does the cap system still work well? I would worry about how long the syringe is when loaded. I'm going to keep a lookout for more. Maybe a simple stop by a craft store or hobby shop might prove fruitful.

 

[OF]

Looks like the LV is spiking some of your interests! I've been using my own LV for a while now (not quite as long as OFs) and i bring it everywhere with me. Recently I've been loading it very full in the morning and use it all day without refilling, Usually takes about 8-10 drops.

Stay tuned everyone, we have some pretty cool stuff in the works!

Cool tip. I'll have to get brave and try two or three times more oil then. A bit too much and it starts to flood on my, but I can press past that to find a new frontier if that's the call.......

Hey, guys, didja catch that second part? More keen stuff in the works? Time to dust off another disguise and see if I can sneak back into the joint.....have to look for windowless Revolution carts I guess? Wanna bet they hide 'em if they seem me coming?

Ah ok, that one looks much less suspect without measurements and what have you. With that long of a nozzle does the cap system still work well? I would worry about how long the syringe is when loaded. I'm going to keep a lookout for more. Maybe a simple stop by a craft store or hobby shop might prove fruitful.

Yup, doesn't have that 'drug' thing written all over it. The caps on the ones I have work just fine, they're an inch and an half long like the 'needle' they cover. Seal well. I got them from the Salvage Yard back when I worked for beer money. I grabbed a box each of two sizes and used them over may years for stuff like grease and epoxy. I had a few left when I retired, they seem to have followed my home somehow???

Might be worth running a source down......

OF

Edit: Taking my own advice, I decided to at least start the search with the one's I have. I'm suggesting one of the ones at the bottom:
http://www.eppendorf.com/script/binres.php?RID=101390

Note the delivery 'needle' is actually a cone, there's a follower (also cone shaped) that is part of the piston that sweeps the product completely out....these guys dispense some really really valuable stuff sometimes. Near as I can tell near ideal for us. Small bore so you get better control and can move thick concentrates, seals tight, has zero residual when empty.... Cost is probably going to be an issue, but we can live with the lower grades? OF

 

[mestizo]

OF,
Although nobody can deny the fact that you have a wealth of knowledge on vaporization matters you are also showing a bias when it comes to issues with the revolution, the fact of the matter is this, the Revolution still has issues and there's no denial and the sooner they acknowledge that the sooner it will be solved, it is constructive criticism.
The revolution leaks air and has an initial metallic taste, too many people can't be wrong, I email thermo ape about the air leak and mention feeling burrs inside the window, I have been a machinist for twenty years so I know a little about it.
Please listen to what others are saying and thermovape handle them.
Peace.

 

[OF]

OF,
Although nobody can deny the fact that you have a wealth of knowledge on vaporization matters you are also showing a bias when it comes to issues with the revolution, the fact of the matter is this, the Revolution still has issues and there's no denial and the sooner they acknowledge that the sooner it will be solved, it is constructive criticism.
The revolution leaks air and has an initial metallic taste, too many people can't be wrong, I email thermo ape about the air leak and mention feeling burrs inside the window, I have been a machinist for twenty years so I know a little about it.
Please listen to what others are saying and thermovape handle them.
Peace.

I'm sorry to disagree with you. I believe I've been objective in this, go back and check the start of the TV thread you'll find me a 'respectful skeptic' (at least I hope I was respectful). Experience changed that, and my first hand experience (no more or less valid than anyone else's really) guides me now. I honestly don't see any problem with leaks nor have I found objectionable taste issue in any of the several Revolution carts I've tried. I've no reason to think every other guy will have problems than to doubt that some do.

To put your logic the other way, lots of folks are (apparently) not having serious issues there. The net is a strange lens for such things, distortions happen. Burrs are possible, of course, but these are CNC parts done with first rate tooling on top quality machines so they would have to be handling induced you'd think and should have been removed in tumbling and etch and plated over? For sure I didn't find any on the few units I have (nothing to hang up a q-tip fiber anyway), cuz I actually looked rather than ignore it like it seems you think I am?

I'm not TV. I'm just a local customer and early adopter who has some experience in the area and made contact with the Principles. This lead to the offer of Beta testing, something I can do and am happy to contribute as I'm sure you would if asked. My honest opinions and experiences are there for one and all. Question if you wish.

You might also want to check out my posts on other vapes, like Omicron. I'm a big fan there too for a whole different set of reasons and mince few words about it. Unlikely I'd be a shill for both, isn't it? Likewise, if I see a problem with a vape or someone's use of it I'm not bashful there either and will stand by my views or modify them as they are shown to be wrong.

I can assure TV is considering everything they're told. I haven't actually checked, of course, but my confidence is solid given their business model. They don't have proper Beta testers (remember, I don't know the others or what they're working on....) and that program for show. When you and I see it released it's been pretty much worked out. You have been heard, and my not seeing the same issues as you is just another data point to the guys that matter in the matter. Not to worry.

Thanks.

OF

 

[ThermoVape]

OF,
Although nobody can deny the fact that you have a wealth of knowledge on vaporization matters you are also showing a bias when it comes to issues with the revolution, the fact of the matter is this, the Revolution still has issues and there's no denial and the sooner they acknowledge that the sooner it will be solved, it is constructive criticism.
The revolution leaks air and has an initial metallic taste, too many people can't be wrong, I email thermo ape about the air leak and mention feeling burrs inside the window, I have been a machinist for twenty years so I know a little about it.
Please listen to what others are saying and thermovape handle them.
Peace.

Mestizo. You are correct. The Revolution as it is configured with the loading port is not an air tight design. In fact, there is an intentional gap. As the metal becomes coated with the residue from the vapor this gap is critical. Otherwise the Revolution would be very difficult to rotate open.

Although many people like the Revolution in its current configuration we recognize that some would prefer a closed tube design. As soon as this request was made to us, we responded that we would offer that configuration ASAP, we are working on it currently an have it slotted for the little machine.

Our goal is to provide products that are developed with help from the Medical community. We do are very best to be responsive to our customers requests and suggestions, proactive in getting the products tested and released, and as innovative as we can in developing these new products.

In regards to the initial metal taste. We do not view this as an issue. Sometimes design, material selection, and application require that a "break-in" period is unavoidable for optimal long-term performance. The only way to avoid this was to use a coil that was lower grade and more prone to failure. The coil we build is design to first break in, and then deliver reliable, clean heat, and the material was selected specifically because after the break in period it imparts no flavor.

Much of our deburring is done by hand. Some is tumbled and then hand deburred. As I am sure you may be familiar with the hand deburrng process, it is time consuming and there is a bit of an art to it. Some people are better then others and some parts deburr easier then others. We do our best, however all of our assembly and post machining processes are done by hand. Nothing is automated. The result is a product that does have some variation. If it is something that is bothering you, we will happily address it.

I hope as a machinist you enjoy our commitment to machining great parts, we make over 100,000 separate parts per month, every single one of them is touched by no less then 15 loving hands to built the ThermoVape T1 and Rvoltuion. Long live American Manufacturing.

Cheers,

ThermoVape

 

[SameOldTim]

OF,
Although nobody can deny the fact that you have a wealth of knowledge on vaporization matters you are also showing a bias when it comes to issues with the revolution, the fact of the matter is this, the Revolution still has issues and there's no denial and the sooner they acknowledge that the sooner it will be solved, it is constructive criticism.
The revolution leaks air and has an initial metallic taste, too many people can't be wrong, I email thermo ape about the air leak and mention feeling burrs inside the window, I have been a machinist for twenty years so I know a little about it.
Please listen to what others are saying and thermovape handle them.
Peace.

The way the door is designed it will allow some air to "leak" past it, by allowing some turbulent airflow it helps keep the vapors even. Some people Like to use the window as a carb of sorts, by covering the window and building up a large amount of vapor then uncovering the window and clearing out what vapor is in the Rev.

The metal used in the coil is an Iron based Alloy, the easiest way to think about it is like an iron skillet for cooking. When you first buy the skillet its raw iron (not the "pre-seasoned" type) and will leave a metallic taste, after it starts getting used the iron will "season". This seasoning is basically a layer of carbon that fills the voids and open pores of the metal, this creates a layer between the metal itself and the concentrate (or your food for an iron skillet).

Tim

 

[mephisto]

Well its nice to see that we can all agree that we love our TV's.
Some prefer the high def., while others prefer the standard.
Either way, there is no denying the support from the manufacturer.....
To be fair, G and the crew at THC are just as awesome! No ass kiss
here, I own both and love them both.....Thanks!

 

[mestizo]

Thank you OF and TV for your prompt and very professional response.
I said it before and I will say it again, I love my Rev. And I will recommended to anybody and I'll leave this subject alone, you have replied and I'm pleased with the answers.

 

[OF]

Thank you OF and TV for your prompt and very professional response.
I said it before and I will say it again, I love my Rev. And I will recommended to anybody and I'll leave this subject alone, you have replied and I'm pleased with the answers.

Yer very welcome, Bro.

Not to quibble with you but I ain't no stinking professional.....trust me on this NOBODY will pay me for this. Some will pay me to go somewhere else from time to time, which is of course almost as good....

I'm fully with you, Revolution is a solid product because TV is solid which means they know their business and are working a solid model. FWIW, I see it as being darn near 'the ideal model' for the job. Their being 'good guys' and more dedicated than you'd believe doesn't hurt either I think.

Thanks again, healthy exchange for sure.

OF

Edit: Just noticed this one, let's add it on, shall we?

Well its nice to see that we can all agree that we love our TV's.
Some prefer the high def., while others prefer the standard.
Either way, there is no denying the support from the manufacturer.....
To be fair, G and the crew at THC are just as awesome! No ass kiss
here, I own both and love them both.....Thanks!

Love might be too strong a word, but I sure wouldn't suggest getting between me and mine....

What you say about TVs is so true. Carries over to women too, partial to short blonds myself. I like that part, most of the world has little choice in life really.

I also think the THC bunch is a together act as well, but a whole different model. A more common, 'small business' model against TVs scaled down 'soup to nuts' model which is pretty rare at this level in my experience. THC's model hinges on 'the old Man'. Things move only as fast and in the direction he does. Given the right guy it scores biggest of course (he's multiplied his abilities many fold), if he doesn't explode from any number of reasons. Not the least are the traditional ones of too much on his plate and unexpected negative turns in the released product base. I'm talking about the model, not the specifics here, right? I'm not saying G is taking on too much or there are field issues just that this model is more vulnerable than the version used by TV.

Yup, they've both got my money and support, and both are highly likely to get more of both.

OF

 

[Xchadb]

thanks for all the info OF. has me thinking i might pick up a LV....

 

[OF]

thanks for all the info OF. has me thinking i might pick up a LV....

You're very welcome, glad to help. Hey, if you like Revolution, this one will put a smile on your face as well.....maybe even bigger. Be careful not to put it on your six volt Revolution though....you might see God. I'll save you the trip, he's gonna tell you you grabbed the wrong cart.......

OF

 

[NewSchoolExplorer]

Hey thermovape, this is just a suggestion and I think others will agree.

I hope the window-less Revolution will be slightly CONE SHAPED, so loading oils/concentrates will be easier and the heat will cause the oils to melt ontop of the heating element.

 

[ThermoVape]

Hey thermovape, this is just a suggestion and I think others will agree.

I hope the window-less Revolution will be slightly CONE SHAPED, so loading oils/concentrates will be easier and the heat will cause the oils to melt ontop of the heating element.

More like a funnel leading to the element?

 

[NewSchoolExplorer]

Yes, but the funnel is built into the device so there not looking for it, loosing it etc, and keeps everything clean.

lol nvm, its exactly how u stated. Slightly bigger diameter then the current model leading to the same (or even bigger heating element).

 

[VAPORIZER22]

I spoke with the girl at the place that sells it (the CO2 concenrate) and she swears that it can be vaporized or even used on a nail/skillet. So we'll see. I'm a sucker for experiments.

Let us know how it works out. If you good results I might have to order a couple g's.

 

[weedemon]

Hey thermovape, this is just a suggestion and I think others will agree.

I hope the window-less Revolution will be slightly CONE SHAPED, so loading oils/concentrates will be easier and the heat will cause the oils to melt ontop of the heating element.

well to simply not cut out the windows is the simplest solution. and would require no real additonal changes to their current setup.

your suggestion is really interesting and has got me thinking, could there be a better more intelligent design? your cone shape is interesting. i wonder if it would help or prevent the further climbing that the oils do when inside the revolution? humm testing will be needed before TV proceeds to retail. I have faith that they will though!

good suggestion.

 

[Xchadb]

You're very welcome, glad to help. Hey, if you like Revolution, this one will put a smile on your face as well.....maybe even bigger. Be careful not to put it on your six volt Revolution though....you might see God. I'll save you the trip, he's gonna tell you you grabbed the wrong cart.......

OF

haha thats awesome, i might pick this up! yeah i love the rev but it uses too much juice! this seems like an option for longer lasting batt's

 

[OF]

haha thats awesome, i might pick this up! yeah i love the rev but it uses too much juice! this seems like an option for longer lasting batt's

It's a good question, one I'd not given a lot of thought to. It should be very similar I'd think, easy to do a back of the envelope calculation on it....if I can find a blank envelope back. Let's see, I don't know the final value used, but let's use 1.5 Ohms like the HO Omicron cart (within the range I was given to test). Say 2.5 Amps (2500 mA), 9 and a bit Watts. The battery is 900 mAh so 900 (mAh available) divided by 2500 (mA drawn) gives us .36 hours, about 21 minutes of 'key down' time. Say 60 twenty second hits? Not a huge number, but 'a great plenty' for most uses? Those 60 hits might take ten loadings at six hits each from 50 mg 'dabs' (what I figure I run in Revolution). That's half a gram which seems good or at least reasonable.

What do you think?

OF

 

[OF]

With all the interest in the LR cart, I figure there's more than the normal number of interested folks on the thread right now? Maybe a good time to discuss technique? I'm by no means an expert, or even a heavy a user but it's a place to start.

I typically load about half a tenth (50 mg) at a time and melt it in before closing up. I pull the top straight up (twisting it makes a much bigger mess) and usually load oil in the top, everything else through the window. Kif and bubble go in the window lose, heated up some to soften them, and poked down with a toothpick before buttoning up. If anything got out and onto the widow (or any other) area I keep a small cloth patch with the concentrates to wipe it off with. Very little comes off this way, patches last a long time.

In the process suggested by Tim at TV, I fire it up and let it cook. It varies from load to load sometimes but let's say ten seconds? Take a 'test puff' and blow it out. Did it work? A second or two later, try again. Simple, works great. Finds the start of vaping (or the end of your battery) every time. As soon as it starts to 'get there' it's time to stop whatever else is going on and focus, focus on the hit that the machine delivers. Let it develop on it's own, start honking on it and you can mess it up. Don't let it back up and come out the vents either, keep a slow draw. Focus. Take it as it's produced. Until you can't hold any more or it gets away from you and you 'hit the chicken switch' (cut the power).

And you might want to be careful about taking another hit until you're sure.....

Kif and bubble get stirred every hit or two, I sometimes do this from the top, pulling the moutpiece only and fishing a long toothpick with a square end down the hole. It's easy to scrape the walls down, scoop up the mass and smash it into the wall a time or two to mix it and push it all back down again. The important part is not to scrape up the bottom. You never open it up and unlike oils and waxes only the bottom most bit is heated. It's like frying not baking. This means you can put a lot more material in without it choking. Otherwise I get half a dozen or so heavy (to me) hits this way. Then I load another few drops or bb size ball and go again (when the time comes, nice to have it ready and standing by).

Using 70% oil, each of those hits delivers about 6 mg of THC. Even 50% absorption means 3 mg to you and me. That should catch most guys attention you'd think?

Anyway that's my advice. Load small and often, take test puffs to find the start of vaping, and when it gets there focus on the hit. Works great for me. How do you do it?

OF

 

[Darb]

I've tried this method OF describes.
It works but I don't seem to be getting a very big hit. I can pull until I run out of breath without even coughing.
While reading this thread and watching some revolution videos I've noticed that others can achieve huge hits with what seems like the same technique.
Will a good cleaning possibly help increase vapor production?
I did add some low quality iso oil an one point....until I tasted it. Thinking either that crap may have gummed it up or I still don't have the technique down.
Any suggestions?

 

[OF]

I've tried this method OF describes.
It works but I don't seem to be getting a very big hit. I can pull until I run out of breath without even coughing.
While reading this thread and watching some revolution videos I've noticed that others can achieve huge hits with what seems like the same technique.
Will a good cleaning possibly help increase vapor production?
I did add some low quality iso oil an one point....until I tasted it. Thinking either that crap may have gummed it up or I still don't have the technique down.
Any suggestions?

I'd start with cleaning it. It's an easy step and it removes any lingering issues.

It's pretty easy to get thin hits. And if you take them, you can fill your lungs with this sub par vapor. Tim's technique is the key IMO, not a side show. Don't take in the hit at first, take test puffs. Fill your mouth and spit it out. Keep the heat on full time as you wait a bit and try again, and again until serious vapor is there. Keep the heat on. Quickly exhale and start the hit. Hit it slow and even looking only for thick vapor, not thin. Keep the heat on. Focus on the vapor production.

The key bit of Tim's technique is I think to keep brave about the heat. He was clear, he made tough heaters, they can take it. Half a minute of heat if that's what it takes to get into 'high volume mode'. Keep the heat on, take small puffs to sample, once you know the show is on quickly clear your lungs and get to business. It's actually a multi step deal, not just hitting it a little harder.

You might try to get too much vapor, enough to choke you, I did and it helped me understand I wasn't heating enough.

Once it's hot, the next hit takes less heat, so go back to 'test puffs' until you figure out where you are.

If you own a Vapman (or have used it) it might help your understanding. The two are actually a lot alike IMO. It was while playing with mine that Tim's secret 'clicked in' and I understood I needed to control (and raise) the temperature some to get the process I wanted.

Keep at it, I think there really is a breakthrough to be made. Tim blazed the trail, try following it. I met the guy, he's not just another pretty face.....

OF

 

[B.]

I guess im a natural...i do after some trial and error I landed on basically the same tek as OF. I also recommend micro hitting, like with the LB(a series ofshort quick puffs as opposed to a long steady draw). I load less than OF'S .05, and im able to pull lung busters if I want.


and for the record, any metally taste I experienced stopped quickly, and ivebeen in flavor country since.