Supreme V3 Electric Conversion Kit

JCat

Well-Known Member
Accessory Maker
Hey everyone ... on a roll ... here's some pictures of the setup with the modded coil. First tried without modding the coil by just connecting the thermocouple directly inside the PID and disconnecting the coil in there as well. Since this worked so well, I decided to cut the end off my coil, snake the wires (2-pair twisted from an Ethernet cable) down the length of the coil sheath, and add appropriate heat shrink then re-solder everything and seal back up :)

Here's the SV3 stable at 185C with the PID reading the temp from the external thermocouple (I also used a stainless steel pipe clamp to attach the probe instead of the silly silicone)

4AYb9N9.jpg
5N4TS9s.jpg
UDhi4pf.jpg
 

szai

Well-Known Member
Hey everyone ... on a roll ... here's some pictures of the setup with the modded coil. First tried without modding the coil by just connecting the thermocouple directly inside the PID and disconnecting the coil in there as well. Since this worked so well, I decided to cut the end off my coil, snake the wires (2-pair twisted from an Ethernet cable) down the length of the coil sheath, and add appropriate heat shrink then re-solder everything and seal back up :)

Here's the SV3 stable at 185C with the PID reading the temp from the external thermocouple (I also used a stainless steel pipe clamp to attach the probe instead of the silly silicone)

4AYb9N9.jpg
5N4TS9s.jpg
UDhi4pf.jpg

Sir genius or if that's too much, then Sir not insane what a great job! But have you forgotten us users who want both direct thermocouple connection and Butane use?
 
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szai,

JCat

Well-Known Member
Accessory Maker
I haven’t ... I just don’t see it as very practical ... after a while (weeks? Months?) the silicone ring close to the heat exchanger that holds the thermocouple gets “glued” to the aluminum.

So using the silicone so the coil thermocouple is removable and leaving the SV3 thermometer there is doable ... up to you ... just make sure you replace that silicone ring frequently!

I wouldn’t want to use the clamp to hold the SV3 thermocouple as I’d be worried about crushing it.
 

szai

Well-Known Member
I haven’t ... I just don’t see it as very practical ... after a while (weeks? Months?) the silicone ring close to the heat exchanger that holds the thermocouple gets “glued” to the aluminum.

So using the silicone so the coil thermocouple is removable and leaving the SV3 thermometer there is doable ... up to you ... just make sure you replace that silicone ring frequently!

I wouldn’t want to use the clamp to hold the SV3 thermocouple as I’d be worried about crushing it.


Awesome! I have an idea for the name! I'm going to call mine the supreme V3 mk JCat!
 
szai,
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JCat

Well-Known Member
Accessory Maker
Have a question for those of you that have pre-ordered especially, but for everyone in general:

Who would be interested in a modded coil with your order? (110v only for now) I've had someone express an interest already, but the issue is, I have to order the coil, the XLR connector, and the thermocouple from 3 different locations (ie. ~$40 USD in shipping costs to get the parts to me--which would add significantly to the cost if just making one!)

I'd like to do them for $100 USD for the assembled coil. I may eventually be able to bring the price on these down if I can find a better supplier for these parts, but for now, if someone wants one, this is about the best I can do (as it may take quite a long time to find a decent supplier, as if I go with eBay from China, or dhgate, it will take a month or two between ordering parts and receiving them ... and then they might not even be parts that work right

I of course need to know the brand of your enail in order to wire your connector accordingly.

Thanks!
JCat
 

mixchu69

Well-Known Member
Have a question for those of you that have pre-ordered especially, but for everyone in general:

Who would be interested in a modded coil with your order? (110v only for now) I've had someone express an interest already, but the issue is, I have to order the coil, the XLR connector, and the thermocouple from 3 different locations (ie. ~$40 USD in shipping costs to get the parts to me--which would add significantly to the cost if just making one!)

I'd like to do them for $100 USD for the assembled coil. I may eventually be able to bring the price on these down if I can find a better supplier for these parts, but for now, if someone wants one, this is about the best I can do (as it may take quite a long time to find a decent supplier, as if I go with eBay from China, or dhgate, it will take a month or two between ordering parts and receiving them ... and then they might not even be parts that work right

I of course need to know the brand of your enail in order to wire your connector accordingly.

Thanks!
JCat
I'll trust your judgment on its efficiency and would pay the $100
 

biohacker

H.R.E.A.M
@JCat you know my present situation, but if I continue to go forward with it i'd definitely be interested in the super coil... sounds like a completely different and better vape now! I still haven't pulled the trigger on the coil or High5 (I first need to see the outcome of this fucking paypal dispute over the god damn SV4).
 

JCat

Well-Known Member
Accessory Maker
Have a question for those of you that have pre-ordered especially, but for everyone in general:

Who would be interested in a modded coil with your order? (110v only for now) I've had someone express an interest already, but the issue is, I have to order the coil, the XLR connector, and the thermocouple from 3 different locations (ie. ~$40 USD in shipping costs to get the parts to me--which would add significantly to the cost if just making one!)

I'd like to do them for $100 USD for the assembled coil. I may eventually be able to bring the price on these down if I can find a better supplier for these parts, but for now, if someone wants one, this is about the best I can do (as it may take quite a long time to find a decent supplier, as if I go with eBay from China, or dhgate, it will take a month or two between ordering parts and receiving them ... and then they might not even be parts that work right

I of course need to know the brand of your enail in order to wire your connector accordingly.

Thanks!
JCat
One other note on the modded coils ... if you don't already have an e-nail controller, I can also include a high5 PID w/ it for an extra $85 USD (approx. my cost ... rounded up to ensure I don't lose money if the exchange rate changes a little ... :lol: )

Edit:

Here's a video from last night with the fully modded setup (coil and plates). This is a final version of everything.

 
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JCat

Well-Known Member
Accessory Maker
:lol: ... yes ... I'll send everyone a PM that wants a coil too so we can figure that out .... the coils are a lot more out of pocket for me than the aluminum, SS bolts, and tooling was ... so for those that want them, at least this early in the game, I will need some form of pre-payment to at least cover the costs (otherwise my wife might not be thrilled!)

That being said ... I don't expect the wait to be too long ... a couple days to get my parts, and assuming I can get everything ordered today/tomorrow, I'm aiming to have all orders shipped out by end of next week. (it's worth noting that it's an optimistic but achievable goal ... I'm on vacation the week after that out of town, so if I don't get them all complete next week, then everything will be completed, worst case, in 3 weeks time)
 

szai

Well-Known Member
:lol: ... yes ... I'll send everyone a PM that wants a coil too so we can figure that out .... the coils are a lot more out of pocket for me than the aluminum, SS bolts, and tooling was ... so for those that want them, at least this early in the game, I will need some form of pre-payment to at least cover the costs (otherwise my wife might not be thrilled!)

That being said ... I don't expect the wait to be too long ... a couple days to get my parts, and assuming I can get everything ordered today/tomorrow, I'm aiming to have all orders shipped out by end of next week. (it's worth noting that it's an optimistic but achievable goal ... I'm on vacation the week after that out of town, so if I don't get them all complete next week, then everything will be completed, worst case, in 3 weeks time)

Sounds like a plan! I can't wait!
 

JCat

Well-Known Member
Accessory Maker
@JCat you know my present situation, but if I continue to go forward with it i'd definitely be interested in the super coil... sounds like a completely different and better vape now! I still haven't pulled the trigger on the coil or High5 (I first need to see the outcome of this fucking paypal dispute over the god damn SV4).
It is a different and better vape now! I actually had it on (pre-coil mod though) for about 5 hours straight a couple nights ago! No problems ... worked great :) It's all I've been using as it's just super convenient now and still has that SV3 vape signature we all love :)
 

lazylathe

Almost there...
@JCat

Can you explain the nodded TC and how it works? I'm not getting your explanation at the top of the page.
The new design looks awesome!!!
 
lazylathe,
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szai

Well-Known Member
@JCat

Can you explain the nodded TC and how it works? I'm not getting your explanation at the top of the page.
The new design looks awesome!!!

I think I know the answer. What he's done is remove the temperature probe from the coil and place it at the same location as the STD temp probe in the sv3 is.

The pid then maintains the sv3 at temp.
 

lazylathe

Almost there...
I think I know the answer. What he's done is remove the temperature probe from the coil and place it at the same location as the STD temp probe in the sv3 is.

The pid then maintains the sv3 at temp.

That is what i get from it but do not understand what the first post says totally, just dont want to misunderstand what is going on.
There is talk of disconnecting the coil as well, that confused me.

Coil now reads temp at the same location as the original.
Would this not overload the coil sin e they are designed to use an internal TC?
In my mind the coil would be a lot hotter in the beginning due to amount of metal to heat and further location of TC.
 
lazylathe,
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szai

Well-Known Member
That is what i get from it but do not understand what the first post says totally, just dont want to misunderstand what is going on.
There is talk of disconnecting the coil as well, that confused me.

Coil now reads temp at the same location as the original.
Would this not overload the coil sin e they are designed to use an internal TC?
In my mind the coil would be a lot hotter in the beginning due to amount of metal to heat and further location of TC.


Good question. I don't know anything about electronics hardware. I thought pids just cycle the coil on and off. Do they have internal time limits set for on off cycle length?
 
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biohacker

H.R.E.A.M
Wish I could contribute Lazy, but what's up at the top of the page and the video is good enough for me! Works exactly how I would want it to! Don't know anything about the overloads, but it seems to be working for Jcat because it's all he's using now! :lol: Without the TC there is little control IMO, as can be seen in JCat's earlier vids. Game changer!
 

szai

Well-Known Member
Wish I could contribute Lazy, but what's up at the top of the page and the video is good enough for me! Works exactly how I would want it to! Don't know anything about the overloads, but it seems to be working for Jcat because it's all he's using now! :lol: Without the TC there is little control IMO, as can be seen in JCat's earlier vids. Game changer!

I think I found something to do with my jcat mod until I get an enail! If someone will lend an sv3 we could send them together to hex nail for a profile.
 
szai,

lazylathe

Almost there...
Wish I could contribute Lazy, but what's up at the top of the page and the video is good enough for me! Works exactly how I would want it to! Don't know anything about the overloads, but it seems to be working for Jcat because it's all he's using now! :lol: Without the TC there is little control IMO, as can be seen in JCat's earlier vids. Game changer!

The original videos had a TC, it is built into the coil.
All that was done, to my knowledge was the cut those two wires and place them in the original probes position. All this means is that the heat is measured at the tube and not at the coil.
Since heat takes a while to travel, +-90 seconds with the torch, you can imagine how hot the coil will be until the desired set temp is now read by the TC on the tube.

When heating with a torch we blast the side till hot and you can see how much energy it takes to get it up to temp, it climbs slowly and them ramps up after 30+ seconds.

Just interested in how the coil behaves with it's TC removed and now measuring at a different spot.
 

lazylathe

Almost there...
@lazylathe did you see this one? This is with the coil modded! Way more accurate temperature control vs his old videos! And that was over a week ago and i've been communicating with him, zero problems so far AFAIK with a super hot coil.

http://fuckcombustion.com/threads/supreme-v3-electric-conversion-kit.26308/page-3#post-1224381

Now i remember another detail!
@JCat mentioned he tuned his PID and set it to -55F, IIRC... That could allow for a slower coil heat up.

That last video was sweet!!
 

JCat

Well-Known Member
Accessory Maker
Just a quick update ... been super busy this week, work, furnace problems, and was waiting for parts anyways for the coils, and got accidentally side-tracked a little bit :)

Here's just a quick pic of something I started working on ...

GYYUcYM_d.jpg


Looking to build a custom enail that is really full featured but economical. This is screenshot from my phone of the running app ... the touchscren I’m still working on but UI will be the same essentially. Just some highlights:

- touchscreen display and mobile app
- wifi access (can configure wifi settings from touchscreen display)
- different PID tuning algorithms to get the best possible settings for your different nails etc being heated (or plates for a rosin press)—these algorithms are still a work in progress ... I’ve implemented some but also want to implement lambda tuning amongst others
- option to support multiple coils maybe as an option with ability to have different PID settings for each.
- ability to setup different PID profiles so as you switch from one device to the next you can change profiles so it is always tuned optimally for your use

I’m open to other suggestions as well. I’m also starting to consider some ideas on building a complete vape, but not sure I’ll get around to that :lol:

Aiming to make these so they could be $200 ... maybe less. Really depends on if I can get material costs down and if the beta product is deemed to be solid and stable.

Now i remember another detail!
@JCat mentioned he tuned his PID and set it to -55F, IIRC... That could allow for a slower coil heat up.

That last video was sweet!!
i did have the PID set to -55c at one point to make it accurate, but now with the modded coil it reads the SV3 temp and not the coil temp.

Pre-modded coil, it was running with the SV3 stable at 365F when the PID was set to 480F with no offset. No problems with a super hot coil. I’ve been running it a LOT. It’s been my exclusive and have been working a lot so often it’s been on pretty much straight for hours on end. It’s by far my favourite vape now and am missing it because I’m out of town right now! :lol:

Edit: to answer your question about the modded coil @lazylathe, the location of the thermocouple has no relation to the heat output of the coil, except that the end temp is controlled. A PID will typically output at 100% of your coil output for the first bit of time to get it to heat fast, then will start cycling it on and off (this cycling is how it controls power % output as the coils don’t take variable voltages to control output ... they use PWM basically). So through this cycling it decreases the power as the set temp is approached. If going up it slows down the cycling to slow the heating so it doesn’t overshoot ... similarly when coming back down to temp it will start increasing the frequency (output) to get it to turn around as the set point is reached ... the PID settings (calculus) determine how steady the temperature is under various situations.

The location of the TC only affects where the set point is measured from. Either way I was setting the PID such that the SV3 thermo would get to the temp I want, so the PID would essentially be doing the same thing. The only difference now is I’m actually measuring the temp I’m interested in. Hope that explains it!

Also, you’ll notice with just your regular enail, the only time a coil gets red hot is in initial heat up. The reason behind this is that if you are heating up a nail, quartz banger, etc. The heater is at 100% output for the first ?minute? well you approach the set point. Once the set point is reached, it will only ever be on at 100% for seconds and will generally be at much less, often 0%, through the PWM cycling (you’ll notice the same behaviour on the elements on your stove too by the way!)

Not my first BBQ and I think my understanding of PID control and heating is sufficient to say this is ok :)
 
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