Sapphire and Ruby inserts for bangers

[biohacker]

Funny this morning Constant was live on ig with dabbin_grandma and Greek posted to his stories to check them out? Maybe because dabbin_grandma was failing to get a good dab off the ruby insert from Constant? I dunno but theres that.

There's what? @gunmetalshark how's your Constant Gems Prestige ruby treating ya?

@biohaker how did u get ripped off?

I explained it all already, check my post history.

I pulled the trigger last night on one of those 75$ ruby inserts just because, well come on! the price is right! whats another 75 to the thousands ive spent so far on dabbin equipment

That's why I bought two! I'm not expecting it to exceed the Constant Gems Prestige I have on its way. I've chatted with Greek about the lead glass, but like Constant and everyone else, everyone denies that their product is inferior. China has low, med, and high grades of materials, and they ALL only use the high grade manufacturers

Very expensive!

Compared to VAS flower vapes, I think it's a bargain! I think the Herbalizer might have been the most expensive... I dunno, I owned them ALL. $200 for a gem is fuck all in comparison IMO.

710coils is awesome tho and a pleasure to deal with! Ive been dabbin off sapphire for a year now and its love it! I'm the envy of all my dabbin friends

That's awesome dude! Wish I joined you a year ago! lol I've barely even been dabbing for a year! I couldn't go back!

 

[pghjd]

There's what? @gunmetalshark how's your Constant Gems Prestige ruby treating ya?



I explained it all already, check my post history.



That's why I bought two! I'm not expecting it to exceed the Constant Gems Prestige I have on its way. I've chatted with Greek about the lead glass, but like Constant and everyone else, everyone denies that their product is inferior. China has low, med, and high grades of materials, and they ALL only use the high grade manufacturers



Compared to VAS flower vapes, I think it's a bargain! I think the Herbalizer might have been the most expensive... I dunno, I owned them ALL. $200 for a gem is fuck all in comparison IMO.



That's awesome dude! Wish I joined you a year ago! lol I've barely even been dabbing for a year! I couldn't go back!

They all literally use the same manufacturer to make their inserts this lady Jessica Wen is the sales rep. They post their convos with her. Their either all low grade or all high grade basically lol. Its up to us to find out lol

 

[biohacker]

They all literally use the same manufacturer to make their inserts this lady Jessica Wen is the sales rep. They post their convos with her. Their either all low grade or all high grade basically lol. Its up to us to find out lol

Whatever, I don't believe anything anymore lol Everyone is full it! If the lead glass in the insert doesn't kill me, the lead in the CCELL cartridges will!

At least my Prestige Ruby insert will look pretty

 

[pghjd]

Whatever, I don't believe anything anymore lol Everyone is full it! If the lead glass in the insert doesn't kill me, the lead in the CCELL cartridges will!

At least my Prestige Ruby insert will look pretty

Did they say it was ccells specifically with lead? Jesus. I thought it was clone carts but now you've got me scared of this cart lol. If you want to avoid lead stick with white sapphire. It doesn't have any metal to give it color so it should be pure sapphire.

 

[biohacker]

Did they say it was ccells specifically with lead? Jesus. I thought it was clone carts but now you've got me scared of this cart lol. If you want to avoid lead stick with white sapphire. It doesn't have any metal to give it color so it should be pure sapphire.

Check out the article... It think authentic CCELL TH2's had a very low fail rate, but still...it all comes down to "who do you trust" just like everything in life.

So my white sapphires from Greek and Constant are no concern, but the rubies might be? Wonder if i'll be able to feel or taste the lead!

You don't order Chinese food with extra MSG??

 

[helpoverthere]

Did they say it was ccells specifically with lead? Jesus. I thought it was clone carts but now you've got me scared of this cart lol. If you want to avoid lead stick with white sapphire. It doesn't have any metal to give it color so it should be pure sapphire.

if you use lead oxide to make your sapphire via flux or there is lead glass fillers...not going to help you. lead concern was something other than the doping agents for ruby / saph.

 

[biohacker]

if you use lead oxide to make your sapphire via flux or there is lead glass fillers...not going to help you. lead concern was something other than the doping agents for ruby / saph.

Greek says his sapphires and rubies are flux grown in a lab and have no lead. He says even super cheap rubies shouldn't have lead in it, and that the cheapest kind of lab made ruby is flame fusion usually, which is aluminum oxide with chromium. I dunno man, it's all Greek to me!

 

[pghjd]

if you use lead oxide to make your sapphire via flux or there is lead glass fillers...not going to help you. lead concern was something other than the doping agents for ruby / saph.

Making sapphire via flux is more expensive and gets you closer to what the crystal is in nature. So it is more likely a higher quality stone then lower

 

[helpoverthere]

Greek says his sapphires and rubies are flux grown in a lab and have no lead. He says even super cheap rubies shouldn't have lead in it, and that the cheapest kind of lab made ruby is flame fusion usually, which is aluminum oxide with chromium. I dunno man, it's all Greek to me!

@biohacker if you want, check out that pdf I posted that shows flux grown rubies in lead oxide have significant lead. flux is the most expensive method. I never denied that.

the only way cheap was brought in, is that many cheap rubies have lead glass as a filler.

if he's not doing it in house, he's just as clueless. we need to talk to this Jennifer chick apparently.

@pghjd where did i say it was cheaper pr inferior? also than what? hydrothermal? natural? synthetic gems are cleaner than natural, and flux grown can be very clean and not have lead. Can also have tons of it competitively to wallpaper from the 60s.

alot of this nonsense is from Chatham gems or whatever.

If you're doing flux w/ lead oxide as the solvent or whatever its hands down going to have lead in it.

 

[biohacker]

Fuck! So now I have to sell all my gemstones and support Fadespace's SiC insert!?

 

[Dubmonkey]

Or get Russian grown gems and US prices

 

[biohacker]

Or get Russian grown gems and US prices

Where!? Apparently Adapt Tech's are sourced in China too, and only processed in Russia or some bullshit. They didn't start their biz advertising Russian made. This industry just seems so non transparent, it's hard to decipher real from fake.

 

[pghjd]

@biohacker if you want, check out that pdf I posted that shows flux grown rubies in lead oxide have significant lead. flux is the most expensive method. I never denied that.

the only way cheap was brought in, is that many cheap rubies have lead glass as a filler.

if he's not doing it in house, he's just as clueless. we need to talk to this Jennifer chick apparently.

@pghjd where did i say it was cheaper pr inferior? also than what? hydrothermal? natural? synthetic gems are cleaner than natural, and flux grown can be very clean and not have lead. Can also have tons of it competitively to wallpaper from the 60s.

alot of this nonsense is from Chatham gems or whatever.

If you're doing flux w/ lead oxide as the solvent or whatever its hands down going to have lead in it.

I don't think you understand the use of flux as much as you think you do. Here's some reading: http://www.ruby-sapphire.com/flux_healing_mong_hsu_ruby.htm Flux is used for treating the gem not growing it. 95% of the corundum gems today have huge cracks when grown and the flux can be used to make the gem "heal". The residual flux is dissolved out after the gems heals leaving "fingerprints" and air pockets.

 

[helpoverthere]

I don't think you understand the use of flux as much as you think you do. Here's some reading: http://www.ruby-sapphire.com/flux_healing_mong_hsu_ruby.htm Flux is used for treating the gem not growing it. 95% of the corundum gems today have huge cracks when grown and the flux can be used to make the gem "heal". The residual flux is dissolved out after the gems heals leaving "fingerprints" and air pockets.

@pghjd I think that misuse of the growing nomenclature threw you off, but with all due respect I don't think you know the process as well as you think either...

Ignoratio elenchi aside, if I don't understand it then educate me. where does the lead in flux "healed" rubies that use lead oxide come from?

"Dissolved nutrients (solute) may come from solvents dissolving surrounding crystals, the exterior of the crystal itself, or the interior walls of the fracture. This dissolved nutrient material then regrows on the walls of the ack, “healing” it closed. But an internal scar remains, something we term a “fingerprint” inclusion."

What you posted, literally has it at the end. Undigested fluid in that inclusion, conservation of matter there is trace lead in that inclusion...please see the muhlmeister et al paper I posted from 1998 for data.

 

[pghjd]

@pghjd I think that misuse of the growing nomenclature threw you off, but with all due respect I don't think you know the process as well as you think either...If I don't understand it then educate me. where does the lead in flux "healed" rubies that use lead oxide come from?

"Dissolved nutrients (solute) may come from solvents dissolving surrounding crystals, the exterior of the crystal itself, or the interior walls of the fracture. This dissolved nutrient material then regrows on the walls of the ack, “healing” it closed. But an internal scar remains, something we term a “fingerprint” inclusion."

conservation of matter there is trace lead in the matrix. see the pdf I posted for evidence. prove me wrong.

Looks like you stopped reading right there. "Any flux glass present on the surface can be dissolved away with acid. The synthetic ruby in the crack is unaffected by the acid, as is the ruby as a whole." Also, "The Mong Hsu ruby treatment is not a fracture filling, but a permanent healing of the fractures and fissures, with any filling merely a remnant of the process. In many respects, it is a welding of fractures, similar to the joining of two pieces of metal with heat and a flux to lower their melting point." If you've ever welded you know that during welding, the flux material decomposes and turns in to fumes.

 

[helpoverthere]

Looks like you stopped reading right there. "Any flux glass present on the surface can be dissolved away with acid. The synthetic ruby in the crack is unaffected by the acid, as is the ruby as a whole." Also, "The Mong Hsu ruby treatment is not a fracture filling, but a permanent healing of the fractures and fissures, with any filling merely a remnant of the process. In many respects, it is a welding of fractures, similar to the joining of two pieces of metal with heat and a flux to lower their melting point." If you've ever welded you know that during welding, the flux material decomposes and turns in to fumes.

With all due respect I read the article and it supported what I said in several places. I would wager you haven't looked at the article I suggested, so please don't critique me on my reading comprehension of yours. Especially when your own article states what I have been saying all along, with HD images to boot.

Kindly illuminate me as to what the fingerprints of flux fluid are made out of: the undigested fluid? What do you think it is with lead oxide.

Where is the lead in lead oxide flux healed rubies coming from, when it is not in similarly appreciable amounts in flux healed rubies that seperate solvent? Isn't the simplest solution to assume through the flux process itself.

Also please tell me more about fumes in a 1000C min heated and pressurized reactor.
What happens to them?

This isn't welding...

edit: on a side note, they wouldn't use lead as a solvent for flux if it decomposed at the temperatures needed for flux. lead isn't going to "decompose" or sublimate at the chosen flux temp if it is the solvent used.

 

[pghjd]

With all due respect I read the article and it supported what I said in several places. I would wager you haven't looked at the article I suggested, so please don't critique me on my reading comprehension of yours. Especially when your own article states what I have been saying all along, with HD images to boot.

Kindly illuminate me as to what the fingerprints of flux fluid are made out of: the undigested fluid? What do you think it is with lead oxide.

Where is the lead in lead oxide flux healed rubies coming from, when it is not in similarly appreciable amounts in flux healed rubies that seperate solvent? Isn't the simplest solution to assume through the flux process itself.

Also please tell me more about fumes in a 1000C min heated and pressurized reactor.
What happens to them?

This isn't welding...

edit: on a side note, they wouldn't use lead as a solvent for flux if it decomposed at the temperatures needed for flux. lead isn't going to "decompose" or sublimate at the chosen flux temp if it is the solvent used.

You literally get trace amounts in the order of microns left within the crack. You can't remove that in a laboratory so I would be extremely skeptical of you being remove it by dabbing off it. If you could you'd be inhaling ruby anyway. Which would lead to lung disease regardless. We're kinda arguing science that has little use in the application we're speaking of. Lead flux would be dangerous if it were on the surface, same thing with fritted quartz. Fritted quartz is dangerous to the lungs and leads to silicosis, but sealed in the bottom of a quartz banger the danger is little to none. Cad bangers are another good example. Cadmium is extremely dangerous to the lungs but if sealed properly is of little to no danger. Just saying "it's in there so im inhaling it" is making a lot of assumptions.

 

[helpoverthere]

You literally get trace amounts in the order of microns left within the crack. You can't remove that in a laboratory so I would be extremely skeptical of you being remove it by dabbing off it. If you could you'd be inhaling ruby anyway. Which would lead to lung disease regardless. We're kinda arguing science that has little use in the application we're speaking of. Lead flux would be dangerous if it were on the surface, same thing with fritted quartz. Fritted quartz is dangerous to the lungs and leads to silicosis, but sealed in the bottom of a quartz banger the danger is little to none. Cad bangers are another good example. Cadmium is extremely dangerous to the lungs but if sealed properly is of little to no danger. Just saying "it's in there so im inhaling it" is making a lot of assumptions.

A inclusion is close to the surface and is broken during the polish. The lead dust remains on the insert and then is inhaled when an individual doesn't clean out of the box.

who knows.

at least its not lead glass, but trusting Jennifer without knowing her doesnt seem smart.

I trust china quartz more than i do china ruby by a long shot.

you wouldn't have to smoke the ruby imo, but whatever.

 

[pghjd]

A inclusion is close to the surface and is broken during the polish. The lead dust remains on the insert and then is inhaled when an individual doesn't clean out of the box.

who knows.

at least its not lead glass, but trusting Jennifer without knowing her doesnt seem smart.

I trust china quartz more than i do china ruby by a long shot.

you wouldn't have to smoke the ruby imo, but whatever.

I'm not in to the ruby/sapphire hype either tbh. I might try one just to see what its like. Maybe a SiC insert too, but I'm happy with quartz atm.

 

[invertedisdead]

Fritted quartz is dangerous to the lungs and leads to silicosis, but sealed in the bottom of a quartz banger the danger is little to none.

opaque quartz is not frit though.

@biohacker if you want, check out that pdf I posted that shows flux grown rubies in lead oxide have significant lead. flux is the most expensive method. I never denied that.

the only way cheap was brought in, is that many cheap rubies have lead glass as a filler.

if he's not doing it in house, he's just as clueless. we need to talk to this Jennifer chick apparently.

@pghjd where did i say it was cheaper pr inferior? also than what? hydrothermal? natural? synthetic gems are cleaner than natural, and flux grown can be very clean and not have lead. Can also have tons of it competitively to wallpaper from the 60s.

alot of this nonsense is from Chatham gems or whatever.

If you're doing flux w/ lead oxide as the solvent or whatever its hands down going to have lead in it.

It seems pretty unlikely that these ruby parts are flux grown, considering the ultra low price and rapid turnaround time? And machine time to finish each insert into an actual bucket with a diamond tipped blade would be super expensive I would think.

 

[pghjd]

opaque quartz is not frit though.



It seems pretty unlikely that these ruby parts are flux grown, considering the ultra low price and rapid turnaround time?

Opaque quartz is quartz microcrytals fused together, its the same thing. Also the rubies/sapphire aren't grown with flux. Flux is used when treating the gems to heal cracks.

 

[invertedisdead]

Opaque quartz is quartz microcrytals fused together, its the same thing. Also the rubies/sapphire aren't grown with flux. Flux is used when treating the gems to heal cracks.

Are you saying opaque quartz is porous like frit?

Flux is a VERY different grow method. It's well documented...

 

[pghjd]

Are you saying opaque quartz is porous like frit?

Flux is a VERY different grow method. It's well documented...

It is well documented but the name seems to mislead people. Chatham details the flux process on their website. You use a naturally mined slice of crystal placed in a crucible chamber filled with liquids that later become the crystal/facilitate its growth at 1000C for 10 months. During the process no contaminants are allowed. After the crystals are made they usually have significant crack that are healed during the treating process with flux. Also, im not saying its porous, It's fully sealed with more quartz. I'm saying its a bunch of microscopic quartz crystals, just like frit.

 

[invertedisdead]

It is well documented but the name seems to mislead people. Chatham details the flux process on their website. You use a naturally mined slice of crystal placed in a crucible chamber filled with liquids that later become the crystal/facilitate its growth at 1000C for 10 months. During the process no contaminants are allowed. After the crystals are made they usually have significant crack that are healed during the treating process with flux. Also, im not saying its porous, It's fully sealed with more quartz. I'm saying its a bunch of microscopic quartz crystals, just like frit.

I was referring to the Ramaura method.

"The Ramaura™ Cultured Ruby is grown by the Flux technique, in a high temperature molten magma. While some manufacturers use a seed of synthetic ruby to start the growth process, only the Ramaura™ Cultured Ruby grows spontaneously, without a seed, just as natural ruby grows in the earth’s molten magma. The result is that Ramaura ruby looks like natural ruby, with many of the same inclusions, veils, fingerprints, growth lines and color zoning that occurs in natural ruby."

 

[pghjd]

I was referring to the Ramaura method.

"The Ramaura™ Cultured Ruby is grown by the Flux technique, in a high temperature molten magma. While some manufacturers use a seed of synthetic ruby to start the growth process, only the Ramaura™ Cultured Ruby grows spontaneously, without a seed, just as natural ruby grows in the earth’s molten magma. The result is that Ramaura ruby looks like natural ruby, with many of the same inclusions, veils, fingerprints, growth lines and color zoning that occurs in natural ruby."

Flux was revolutionized by Chatham and their process uses a seed. Its well known that growing from a seed creates a far better ruby/sapphire as its closer to a natural one and its relatively cheap. Your gonna trash tier jewels if you use no seed. Also, the process you described is the same thing just without a seed. They just used trigger words like molten magma instead of science. They use molten liquids under pressure over time. The seeding method is more common due to being inexpensive and better for jewelery.