Saionara Atomizer thread

[tennisguru1]

Don't use Ti mode! The bucket is Ti but the actual donut heater is Nickel.

But if you can set TCR to 315... that should do it. .723 ohms for the resistance is good. Lock that.

30 watts is good to start with. I usually start hitting it after 3 seconds... a nice long draw should do it.

You're Da Bomb Man!!! Cool Thx
Went straight to 315 TCR 380 25 to 30 watts to start ramp testing
Nice & Smooth, only hit a TI nail before, this sweet, with very little.

So the Donut underneath the TI bowl is like all my others Nichrome?
I get it, nice. Si it's hidden in the TAF attachment. My eyes are gone
along with my brains sometimes, hahaha

Never used a Donut for a heater, just vaped off it in TC mode.
Can I get a cheap Quartz Cup to drop in there also.
Thx for the Triton suggestion, I'm going to wit & see also.
If I can get a Cheap Yocan & Cerum Donut's to last 6 months,
this TI Bucket looks like a Tank that will outlive me.

Hope the Actual Ceramic Donut is as sweet, looks well made
& put together solidly, just Waiting on TCR #'s Suggestions?
Bigger than Evolve + , looks more like the Awesome V.3 smaller
donut I gave my buddy, love the taste on Matts V.3 Donut, but too
much work keeping it clean with bad eyes hard to rebuild anything.
Leaves me out of the QQ :<( also sad

 

[florduh]

You're Da Bomb Man!!! Cool Thx
Went straight to 315 TCR 380 25 to 30 watts to start ramp testing
Nice & Smooth, only hit a TI nail before, this sweet, with very little.

So the Donut underneath the TI bowl is like all my others Nichrome?
I get it, nice. Si it's hidden in the TAF attachment. My eyes are gone
along with my brains sometimes, hahaha

Never used a Donut for a heater, just vaped off it in TC mode.
Can I get a cheap Quartz Cup to drop in there also.
Thx for the Triton suggestion, I'm going to wit & see also.
If I can get a Cheap Yocan & Cerum Donut's to last 6 months,
this TI Bucket looks like a Tank that will outlive me.

Hope the Actual Ceramic Donut is as sweet, looks well made
& put together solidly, just Waiting on TCR #'s Suggestions?
Bigger than Evolve + , looks more like the Awesome V.3 smaller
donut I gave my buddy, love the taste on Matts V.3 Donut, but too
much work keeping it clean with bad eyes hard to rebuild anything.
Leaves me out of the QQ :<( also sad

Nice! You can play with the bucket temp too. I usually start at 350 since the Ti retains a little heat from previous hits. But you can bump it up if you want more of a lung-full.

I don't know if I can help with the plain Donut though. Theoretically the ceramic should provide a tastier hit, but I don't think donuts are worth the trouble now that buckets exist. You could start with Nickel mode and like 25 watts. Otherwise peruse this subreddit:

https://www.reddit.com/r/Saionara/

 

[analytika]

Funny. I'm a Sai guy who wants to try the Triton.

I don't want to take the Triton out and about.

Sai seems better priced for inevitable loss and perhaps [edited] better reinforced against damage.

 

[florduh]

I don't want to take the Triton out and about.

Sai seems better priced for inevitable loss or damage.

Loss? Sure. Damage? If this thing gets damaged, my guess is you'd have bigger worries. It's built like a damn tank. Can't argue with the price for sure though.

@tennisguru1

For the plain donut (yum!) try TCR 240, bring the wattage down to 28.... and start with temps around 330.

 

[tennisguru1]

Loss? Sure. Damage? If this thing gets damaged, my guess is you'd have bigger worries. It's built like a damn tank. Can't argue with the price for sure though.

@tennisguru1

For the plain donut (yum!) try TCR 240, bring the wattage down to 28.... and start with temps around 330.

Trying that, sadly disappointed in the Whole Sai thing so far.
The Kantral Ceramic Coil is the only one that hit's anywhere
near as nice on my Cerum coils or Evolve + coils on same mods,
Get twice as much vapor tasting about the same with a $2 atty.

Kanthal Coil is a Torch that burns a weeks supply in a day.
The Donut coil is Big compared to my others that work GREAT
Lots of cool vapor with very very little shatter.
I'm going to take a break, clear my head & try again later.

Not impressed with the TI Cup either, as what I already do on a
$2 atty is way better, lol. So it must be me.
The Quality of the TAF & TI Cup is Excellent but the
Ceramic donut is slanted way up to one side and I'm not
wasting any more valuable shatter on this sloppy donut.
Not the Quality you get from Matt at DT.

I need a break, just went back to my Cerum on the Evic
and the Evolve + on the DMA75, WOW What good hits.
Glad it wasn't defective Shatter, lol.
Like I said it must be me & this new equipment, but
I will try again later. More work than I wanted,
but at least I'm high now thanks to Yocan, lol.

Sad , Tired & feeling OLD , not much support for the Sai
up on FC & I really don't want to Redditt, like it here.
Strange, as I see the Sai in almost Every Other Tag line

 

[florduh]

Trying that, sadly disappointed in the Whole Sai thing so far.
The Kantral Ceramic Coil is the only one that hit's anywhere
near as nice on my Cerum coils or Evolve + coils on same mods,
Get twice as much vapor tasting about the same with a $2 atty.

Kanthal Coil is a Torch that burns a weeks supply in a day.
The Donut coil is Big compared to my others that work GREAT
Lots of cool vapor with very very little shatter.
I'm going to take a break, clear my head & try again later.

Not impressed with the TI Cup either, as what I already do on a
$2 atty is way better, lol. So it must be me.
The Quality of the TAF & TI Cup is Excellent but the
Ceramic donut is slanted way up to one side and I'm not
wasting any more valuable shatter on this sloppy donut.
Not the Quality you get from Matt at DT.

I need a break, just went back to my Cerum on the Evic
and the Evolve + on the DMA75, WOW What good hits.
Glad it wasn't defective Shatter, lol.
Like I said it must be me & this new equipment, but
I will try again later. More work than I wanted,
but at least I'm high now thanks to Yocan, lol.

Sad , Tired & feeling OLD , not much support for the Sai
up on FC & I really don't want to Redditt, like it here.
Strange, as I see the Sai in almost Every Other Tag line

If you're looking for bigger bucket hit... bump up the wattage to 40 and temps to 390 or 400. I'll do 400 for "harder" concentrates. If it's too hot or burnt tasting... bring the temps down to 340-350. You can get as big a rip as you want on it.

 

[tennisguru1]

If you're looking for bigger bucket hit... bump up the wattage to 40 and temps to 390 or 400. I'll do 400 for "harder" concentrates. If it's too hot or burnt tasting... bring the temps down to 340-350. You can get as big a rip as you want on it.

You know at the beginning of a setup I don't know what I'm
really looking for, but I know I can find it if I can get a start.
It took me a while to get the other donuts to work as great as
they do now, but there was a lot more going on at the beginning.

Tomorrow is another day, I'll try the DNA Mod & play around.
With all yours & great peeps up here we will get it going.

 

[tennisguru1]

Loss? Sure. Damage? If this thing gets damaged, my guess is you'd have bigger worries. It's built like a damn tank. Can't argue with the price for sure though.

@tennisguru1

For the plain donut (yum!) try TCR 240, bring the wattage down to 28.... and start with temps around 330.

What box mod are you using / recommending for on-demand convection 510 vapes?

I need to get at least as good as my own concoction, lol
Why is it good? This was off .01 of shatter
I hit it too hard to show off for 20 seconds
I use the whip to show & learn the proper Pull &
Vape thickness + study the bouncing #'s.
Then you don't need the training wheels any more.

 

[tennisguru1]

Loss? Sure. Damage? If this thing gets damaged, my guess is you'd have bigger worries. It's built like a damn tank. Can't argue with the price for sure though.

@tennisguru1

For the plain donut (yum!) try TCR 240, bring the wattage down to 28.... and start with temps around 330.

OK, I went backwards & just went to the Pico 75, started from scratch with your TCR #'s Watts range & kept Temp range in middle.
Figured my problems stemmed from using my dialed in mods Evic's
Dialed in for V2.5 Evolve+ + Cerum Donuts, each having own setup
Most/all 510 are flakey and as Head of The "VIA" @VapeDonkey wisely
advises, Leave the Atty on the Mod and it's all good, lol.
Easier to buy another $24 Evic from Faster than before tech.

So I got the TI going well as you all described at those settings.
Seems as if the Ceramic Donuts would be around where Awesome
Matt (High Ranking Brain of VIA from DT fame) 10mm V3 donuts?

No go, hmmm, me thinks because it no lay flat, one end way higher
than the other, is just bad luck defect?
Seen this on cheap V.2 Ceramic Donuts of Fastech,
but never on Quality stuff like Matt's or "genius "G" @THC SCIENTIFIC
another high ranking member of the Vaping Intelligence Authorities!

I ordered the Donut (DUH) thinking it was actually a Bucket Sealed
Coil (Holy Grail lol), but now with it being slanted, stuff just slides down bottom, sad. Anyone have a good level working coil to compare to
Matt's V3 or even V.2.5 ?
Stuff looks solid, but as I have said before, everyone seems to have a Sai
but Mum's the word lol, just kidding, seems strange tho...

So I like the TI bucket easy to load & clean & maintain, but does not give me as big a hit or stretch it as far as my rigged up donuts, but close enough and will get better at it. Just Donuts taste better than TI to me.

 

[kuzko]

OK, I went backwards & just went to the Pico 75, started from scratch with your TCR #'s Watts range & kept Temp range in middle.
Figured my problems stemmed from using my dialed in mods Evic's
Dialed in for V2.5 Evolve+ + Cerum Donuts, each having own setup
Most/all 510 are flakey and as Head of The "VIA" @VapeDonkey wisely
advises, Leave the Atty on the Mod and it's all good, lol.
Easier to buy another $24 Evic from Faster than before tech.

So I got the TI going well as you all described at those settings.
Seems as if the Ceramic Donuts would be around where Awesome
Matt (High Ranking Brain of VIA from DT fame) 10mm V3 donuts?

No go, hmmm, me thinks because it no lay flat, one end way higher
than the other, is just bad luck defect?
Seen this on cheap V.2 Ceramic Donuts of Fastech,
but never on Quality stuff like Matt's or "genius "G" @THC SCIENTIFIC
another high ranking member of the Vaping Intelligence Authorities!

I ordered the Donut (DUH) thinking it was actually a Bucket Sealed
Coil (Holy Grail lol), but now with it being slanted, stuff just slides down bottom, sad. Anyone have a good level working coil to compare to
Matt's V3 or even V.2.5 ?
Stuff looks solid, but as I have said before, everyone seems to have a Sai
but Mum's the word lol, just kidding, seems strange tho...

So I like the TI bucket easy to load & clean & maintain, but does not give me as big a hit or stretch it as far as my rigged up donuts, but close enough and will get better at it. Just Donuts taste better than TI to me.

I don’t use the donut coils other than with the Ti bucket so can’t help you there.

I recently ordered a 10mm quartz bucket insert from Source vapes and it slides perfectly into the Ti bucket on the Sai. Surprisingly, I didn’t have to jack up the heat that much more than with just the bucket. The hits are so smooth and definitely has a different flavor profile than the titanium.

 

[tennisguru1]

I don’t use the donut coils other than with the Ti bucket so can’t help you there.

I recently ordered a 10mm quartz bucket insert from Source vapes and it slides perfectly into the Ti bucket on the Sai. Surprisingly, I didn’t have to jack up the heat that much more than with just the bucket. The hits are so smooth and definitely has a different flavor profile than the titanium.

That's really interesting, Thx.
I like the TI hits for TI but the Donuts taste better,
flavor lasts a little longer, but my Quartz XVape Vista
all Quartz does taste best, if it was TC I'd stop looking.

Got a size for that insert & a link, ty.
wonder if anyone tried vaping off the bottom donut heater?
Do you put quartz inside Ceramic Over or TI cup?

 

[tennisguru1]

If you're looking for bigger bucket hit... bump up the wattage to 40 and temps to 390 or 400. I'll do 400 for "harder" concentrates. If it's too hot or burnt tasting... bring the temps down to 340-350. You can get as big a rip as you want on it.

It's all cooking good now at your settings, basically.
I'll be able to move it my my Evic Dual now that I understand
the differences better.
Had a chat with that Vic fellow at HVT & he was very helpful
and answers me back with 2 follow up emails, cool support.

 

[kuzko]

That's really interesting, Thx.
I like the TI hits for TI but the Donuts taste better,
flavor lasts a little longer, but my Quartz XVape Vista
all Quartz does taste best, if it was TC I'd stop looking.

Got a size for that insert & a link, ty.
wonder if anyone tried vaping off the bottom donut heater?
Do you put quartz inside Ceramic Over or TI cup?

https://www.sourcevapes.com/products/sourcevapes-eternal-quartz-american-quartz-vape-pen

Here’s a link to one their quartz options, they have a few different ones from different brand quartz makers, I think mine was a little cheaper.

 

[tennisguru1]

https://www.sourcevapes.com/products/sourcevapes-eternal-quartz-american-quartz-vape-pen

Here’s a link to one their quartz options, they have a few different ones from different brand quartz makers, I think mine was a little cheaper.

Thx I'm been wanting to play with TAF Quartz Cups.
Still expensive, going to check china Fast or DH if I
like the vape & if it's worth the Diff?

Vape Pen Sales have them in Stock

I got 2 TAF Sis w TI Buckets for $76 Ship Inc out the door.
PRE-TARIFF-15 is the Code for 15% off
These have the New Good (my opinion) Ti Skillet Buckets)

Also underneath sail Ti Skillet Bucket is a 10mm Ceramic
Donut that you can vape off Fabulously with same settings as DTV3
I got Two Ti Bucket Coils so I tried it, what the Hell blow $7
I like it better than the one the sell as the Ceramic Donut Atty.
& I got a Extra Ti cup to be cleaning while I mess up the other.


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[tennisguru1]

I don’t use the donut coils other than with the Ti bucket so can’t help you there.

I recently ordered a 10mm quartz bucket insert from Source vapes and it slides perfectly into the Ti bucket on the Sai. Surprisingly, I didn’t have to jack up the heat that much more than with just the bucket. The hits are so smooth and definitely has a different flavor profile than the titanium.

I'll let you know how the $2.50 Quartz Cups from DHG are when I get them. What are the settings you are using with the inserts?
I wonder if my trick in cleaning the TI Buckets in seconds with work on Quartz Cup Inserts?
I even found a way to clean the TI Skillet Instantly, even if you
det lazy and missed cleaning bucket & Gunked it up, lol.

First do part 1 as in my post in wrong thread?
"The Ti Bucket Cleaning is My Dream Come True!!!
I got one on a DNA75 Lavabox mini & Another on a dual
Evic & WOW it just keeps getting Better.

AWESOME Discovery, When you finish up your bowl in the
Ti Skillet, don't iso it. after about 5 pulls on it for me
Just Swab with Dry QTip and "Here's the Magic" add a few drops
of Wally World's Sterile Saline Contact Lens Soaking Solution.
Pulse the power a second or two, it will bubble a little.
You can wait or not , Swab Perfectly Clean.
The waste jumps on the Qtip in a matter of seconds."

To Speed it up without scratching Anything & Even Loosen the Worse
Gung Black Crap Ring After tou pulse Power with Saline in the cup
I use a Long Strong Wooden Skewer and just put point end in &
Stir & it all breaks free, Qtip soaks up Saline Drops ALL NEW AGAIN!

 

[Mr. Gweilo 420]

Alright! Just ordered a black Sai Atomizer with black Pico. Im upping my concentrates game at the moment. I keep hearing how great these things are so Im quite excited to try☺☺

 

[tennisguru1]

The black one looks really cool on my gold pico.
FC Classy Deals... lol $50 combo Great Deals on FC Ads

If you're into doing small 2 hitters on the TI/Bucket Combo
there is so much info on setting ect but if you want to throw
in say .2 of a g (this is stay at home vape-not travel in pocket )
Set TCR to 333 Watts to 40 & temp start at 310 low - ramp to 360)
Keep like a pool similar to a cart but much nicer & I just keep toping
it off as long as it has oil covering bottom of TI CUP.
You can blast all the way to 480-500 to clean or finish bowl when done
I put some distilled water in an old eye drop bottle
(easy to squeeze out a few drops to boil clean by pulsing))

 

[tennisguru1]

Nice! You can play with the bucket temp too. I usually start at 350 since the Ti retains a little heat from previous hits. But you can bump it up if you want more of a lung-full.

I don't know if I can help with the plain Donut though. Theoretically the ceramic should provide a tastier hit, but I don't think donuts are worth the trouble now that buckets exist. You could start with Nickel mode and like 25 watts. Otherwise peruse this subreddit:

https://www.reddit.com/r/Saionara/

This is what got me started nice from same source

When you first get the Sai you will want to remove all the manufacturing oils by boiling it for a few min (Only the TAF sai parts, not the mod or battery of course), soak in 99% iso while hot (not the o-rings) for a few min, boil for a few min in fresh water to remove iso and then dry completely before using.

Take GREAT care in the assembly order putting it back together!

1. Flash Red Panda to the Mod. (Mac or Windows)
2. Set to TCR315, 40W, 320-380°F and lock your resistance in a 68° room 0.63-0.70Ω (SAI TAF Profile #1 )(Fight the urge to play with it before programming it!!! Many people try it in wattage to just try it and melt the coil.)
3. Tightly screw bucket into coil. (needs to be tight or heat transfer will not work)
4. Screw the Sai base onto your mod.
5. Lightly screw the coil with the bucket attached into the base until it makes contact the base. (Over tighten this and you will crack the donut under the bucket, or if you tighten the coil into the base then attach to the mod you will break the coil.)

 

[tennisguru1]

Alright! Just ordered a black Sai Atomizer with black Pico. Im upping my concentrates game at the moment. I keep hearing how great these things are so Im quite excited to try☺☺

This is guy to follow for diff atty settings & TCR base accurate #'s to start.

daltesean an hour ago

The Ceramic Donut is identical to the DTv3, the Sai is a 10mm and the Seq is a 13 min. The TAF Sai on the other hand secures a Ti Bucket ontop of that 10mm donut sealing off the bottom, the airflow comes straight down from the cap. There is a little heat loss in the transfer but I solve that by running at TCR315 instead of TCR240 (TCR315@380°=TCR240@480°).

Only real way I know of to kill them is to take them over 1200° in wattage mode or TC-Ni.
https://imgur.com/a/C2ifDz1

 

[ChurroForSure-O]

https://www.sourcevapes.com/products/sourcevapes-eternal-quartz-american-quartz-vape-pen

Here’s a link to one their quartz options, they have a few different ones from different brand quartz makers, I think mine was a little cheaper.

I would also like to know if yours fits inside the Ti bucket, or if you have to take that off and put it over the ceramic heater? If you have calipers, could you tell me the outer diameter? I’m assuming 10mm because it’s called a 10mm insert, but sadly, that’s not always the case.

 

[nosmoking]

I would also like to know if yours fits inside the Ti bucket, or if you have to take that off and put it over the ceramic heater? If you have calipers, could you tell me the outer diameter? I’m assuming 10mm because it’s called a 10mm insert, but sadly, that’s not always the case.

I did not have the Eternal inserts that source now sells, but I do have one of their standard quartz inserts and it does fit into the Sai almost like it was made for it. If I recall correctly, the insert is 10mmOD x 6mm tall.

 

[kuzko]

I would also like to know if yours fits inside the Ti bucket, or if you have to take that off and put it over the ceramic heater? If you have calipers, could you tell me the outer diameter? I’m assuming 10mm because it’s called a 10mm insert, but sadly, that’s not always the case.

Yes, the insert fit perfectly into the Ti bucket. I bought a 10mm Insert and one of their source 13mm quartz bucket atomizers. The 10mm Insert is what fit into the Ti bucket, when I tried to take the 13mm quartz bucket out and fit it into the Sai it was too big for the bucket or donut.

So 10mm Insert is what you want if you are using it for Sai Ti bucket, obviously the Sequoia would require a bigger insert, perhaps the 13 or 15mm.

One thing I’ve noticed, the quartz inserts work great but over time from usage and cleaning the quartz insert can become slightly raised up in the Ti bucket so it’s not perfectly touching the bottom and this can cause it to not heat up right. But you just have to use a tool and make sure the insert is snug on the bottom.

 

[nosmoking]

I was told the Sequioa Ti bucket has a 13mm ID by Vic himself so I would expect it should work with the 13mm Source quartz insert.

 

[tennisguru1]

Yes, the insert fit perfectly into the Ti bucket. I bought a 10mm Insert and one of their source 13mm quartz bucket atomizers. The 10mm Insert is what fit into the Ti bucket, when I tried to take the 13mm quartz bucket out and fit it into the Sai it was too big for the bucket or donut.

So 10mm Insert is what you want if you are using it for Sai Ti bucket, obviously the Sequoia would require a bigger insert, perhaps the 13 or 15mm.

One thing I’ve noticed, the quartz inserts work great but over time from usage and cleaning the quartz insert can become slightly raised up in the Ti bucket so it’s not perfectly touching the bottom and this can cause it to not heat up right. But you just have to use a tool and make sure the insert is snug on the bottom.

Perhaps because of the shape of th TI Bucket, not flat, but peaked in the
center, a redesign of bucket , flat for more contact with the Quartz.
Would be a seperate Atty Combo like the now Donut under TI Bucket.
I think for now it would be nice if someone could just fit the Quartz or another Ceramic Cup insert into the Donut Heater & leave out the TI Skillet.
Not flat inefficient uneven heating , the Donut part of heater Flat & doing the job well
already in place, just fit the insert & find TCR & Temp & GO!
I just guessing, don't really know shit, but would like to play & learn.
Would the peeps who know please chime in, thx.

 

[tennisguru1]

I was told the Sequioa Ti bucket has a 13mm ID by Vic himself so I would expect it should work with the 13mm Source quartz insert.

This seems to be very important & due to lack of info on the Sai in general
I am going to repost some of his tips & hints & AF Atty settings.

@daltesean Multiple Devices
1 point 2 hours ago


In TCR600 (Nickel) set to a temp of 480°F with the resistance locked correctly it translates to a coil temp of 1184°F. The melting point of the coil is around 1220°F, if the resistance is locked high (90% of users lock it way to high!) then it could have easily exceeded that melting point. However this does not typically result in cracking of the donut but rather a slight flow of the metal that is used to connect the legs to the donut, resulting in a poor electrical connection. This poor connection results in a very inconsistent Ω reading, due to the fact that the mod cannot get a stable resistance reading temp control is then impossible on that coil after. (It will still limp along in wattage only mode of 18-15W however manual pulsing to regulate the temp is required.)

The OP however listed that his coils broke in half, which is not related to settings but rather how it was assembled, many users want to tighten all the sai parts together then torque it on the mod. However if you look the bucket coil sits lower in the Sai than the length of the center pin, so when screwed tightly together first the center pin sticks out farther than the depth of the 510 connector on your mod. So when you screw it on the mod and it reaches the maximum depth of the 510 pin there is still a gap between the top of the mod and the Sai so users twist it tighter trying to get them to meet and this is when the pin drives up flexing the ceramic.... which we all know will make it snap in half. This is a design flaw but can be easily prevented by a specific assembly order. (detailed elsewhere in this post.) I assume the Op noticed that there was a gap there a few days later and gave it a hard twist to make it meet and " bam, donut cracked".

My recommendation has not changed just the settings to get there. Previously my recommendation was TCR240@40W@480°F, this was the temp control for the actual donut coil underneath, but there is a 50-150°F heat loss between the bucket and the vaporizing surface of the bucket (not the hottest point), every single new user however questioned why I would recommend vaping between 420-500°F. So I did the math on how the target resistance based on the TCR value actually calculated out and found that TCR240@480°F=TCR315@380°F while still maintaining a safe operating temp across the full temp scale of the mod. If you look at the chart you can also see why while TC-Ni works for the bucket at low temps , it is far from ideal and leads to users running WAY HOT.