DaVapeGuy
Well-Known Member
A wireless zirc ball vape would be very niceEveryone comment below what you’re looking for in a new desktop powerhouse
Phase3 Vaporizers
- Thread starter invertedisdead
- Start date
Cheebsy
Microbe minion
I dunno what size I'd prefer tbh. 16 may make more sense for a hybrid possibly having a more even temp across the entire load, unless you intend to lean on the possible flavour benefits of convection, in which case the larger could be desirable?
I dunno, what are you trying to achieve with this design?
I dunno, what are you trying to achieve with this design?
salentoreggaesea91
Member
I see myself wanting a 20mm for a metal hybrid concept...I think I'll use it in the evenings, weekends or with friend in some occasion, or anyway when I wanna get deeply medicated...so in that usage kind of style I think that more mass and bigger bowl could help...honestly as 16mm, the ZX is already so good, is my daily driver, hasn't been off 1 day since I got it and is simply so taste and easy on your throath that became like an addiction on top of another addiction to hit it , lol, and if I just turn up the temps between 550-570 then I have those deep effect with the ZX too, so for me 20mm is the way...
About the ZXbowl, I thinked about it and honestly I still can't decide if I need an improved one with more screen shelves...I mean, I want it, but do I need it??
...usually I load between half and 2/3 of the bowl, and this give me a nice hit and perfect roast, when I wanna go full bowl I still have perfect roast, so giving that hardly I see loading more than 0.2 on the ZX I would no need of an extra shelve for bigger load...the microload shelve got my attention and thats why I want it, but as you stated above, the ZX works so well like it is, and I can already microdose super efficiently with actual bowl 
About the ZXbowl, I thinked about it and honestly I still can't decide if I need an improved one with more screen shelves...I mean, I want it, but do I need it??
...usually I load between half and 2/3 of the bowl, and this give me a nice hit and perfect roast, when I wanna go full bowl I still have perfect roast, so giving that hardly I see loading more than 0.2 on the ZX I would no need of an extra shelve for bigger load...the microload shelve got my attention and thats why I want it, but as you stated above, the ZX works so well like it is, and I can already microdose super efficiently with actual bowl
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A wireless zirc ball vape would be very nice
Should I post the 25MM ZXXL? 🫡 what size are you thinking of?
I was thinking 16MM with a deeper bowl but most seem to be thinking 20MM.
What I’m trying to achieve is the hardest hitting and lowest maintenance/easiest to use device. With a new ultra high surface area low drag convection heating system to supplement a new bowl design. It’s inspired by legacy favorites like the Supreme and Sublimator, but with my personal spin on it to…
A. Alter the convection/conduction balance
B. Improve the airflow
C. Improve the flavor/purity
D. Improve the ease of use.
All that said, I’m not totally sure there’s a market for this concept device. When I write all that down it sounds great but I have to wonder if even that is “enough.”
I also think since it’s not a ball vape that might actually detract from interest, I’m curious to introduce new technologies, but I’m not sure the market is really looking for different tech now that ball vapes are so popular and in the spotlight. Look at the thermal twist thread…
I see myself wanting a 20mm for a metal hybrid concept...I think I'll use it in the evenings, weekends or with friend in some occasion, or anyway when I wanna get deeply medicated...so in that usage kind of style I think that more mass and bigger bowl could help...honestly as 16mm, the ZX is already so good, is my daily driver, hasn't been off 1 day since I got it and is simply so taste and easy on your throath that became like an addiction on top of another addiction to hit it , lol, and if I just turn up the temps between 550-570 then I have those deep effect with the ZX too, so for me 20mm is the way...
About the ZXbowl, I thinked about it and honestly I still can't decide if I need an improved one with more screen shelves...I mean, I want it, but do I need it??
Appreciate your input friend!
It sounds like people are saying they like the ZX so much as it is, that a new vape would be better off in 20MM to avoid overlap?
Wireless 14mm, SS bowl for conduction, adjustable screen height. This is the way.
I was going to do a wireless ZX a year or two ago, I talked to DC about making me a custom 16MM coil and everything.
For what it’s worth stainless steel is not really a great material to make a bowl from. It’s extremely dense/heavy and is going to not only rob tons of heat from the system, but also retain it by staying hot for a long time too.
Adjustable screen height is something I’ve been thinking about new ways to implement, but it’s a feature that would be more beneficial in a full convection vape - as a stainless bowl is almost always going to result in conduction dominance, so getting the load closer to the heater isn’t as impactful since the sidewalls of the bowl are going to do most of the vaporizing.
To observe the conduction properties of a stainless steel bowl , boil water, then pour in a stainless kitchen bowl. It will almost instantly become too hot to hold. That’s only ~100C Now imagine a vaporizer heater mating to the bowl at 200-250C.
The more I think about it, if I want to make a conduction based device perhaps I should unplug and get away from all the wires and wired heating systems. Even the “wireless” ball vapes still need to be plugged into a wall for heating. It reminds me of the Volcano - you can carry a hit into the other room, but for anyone looking for true cordless freedom it’s not a “real” solution.
Last week I was working on a design for the torch/induction market, but thermodyamically optimized for faster extraction AND faster heat up time. I believe that’s the magic combo missing. There’s so much focus parroting the same heat retention concepts, but the problem with heat retention is it’s only achieved by heating something up for more time. IMO that tends to make for a clunky experience, especially for people coming over from combustion seeking instant results and ease of use.
This! Oh, and maybe make it hybrid ready for wired/wireless like the omega.
If I did that the best solution might be to make the ZXXL coil compatible with 25mm coils and just drop the 20MM ZXL since most wireless systems are based on 25MM coils. The main issue I’ve mentioned previously with this is the coil fitment on a wireless is different from what you want on a plug-in.
The thing is, from experience testing basically everything you could possibly do to a ball vape - increasing the diameter of the housing isn’t really a great idea, as you lose the concentration of heat from the coil and then have to rely on the beads to sustain temperatures since the coils effectiveness is reduced when spread out over a larger mass and circumference of beads. That said, there is a solution to this I could probably propose pretty easily and add insulation through other means, similar to what I did with the ZXL.
You just have to be prepared to make some sacrifices when trying to do that jack of all trades approach - for example the ZX can change between temperatures very fast for a ball vape, something designed with high heat retention for wireless isn’t going to be able to do that.
AssistedLiving
Well-Known Member
Ryan- you obviously understand everything involved in making a top performing ball vape, have you considered designing & selling an all in one PID/coil, with the coil protected, similar to what cannabis hardware is doing with the moab, using a material for the case that can be inexpensively made, specifically made to work with your zirc heads?
Sultana lungs
Well-Known Member
I have 7 industry ballers and 6 home jobs most free from the leash the little 16mm beast still wins the inevitable and ultimate reach test for nearly two years now I’m in awe
Oden
Well-Known Member
It looks completely crazy! I personally would love to see this and I wouldn't be the only one.
It would bring freshness to this industry where devices are so similar lol.
@invertedisdead
from your reply i personally think that the induction based unit sounds the most promising and innovative. Nothing like that on the market yet, except for the tempest. Which works amazingly, but can be a bit of a hassle to load, let cool down etc…
So an induction based desktop ball vape in 16mm for me please
It would also allow for big saving on the power bill, as one would not have the heater running all the time. No problem for people in the us, but we have crazy energy prices in the eu. It would also be kind nice for the environment
If you would make the body in a 14mm diameter, people could use their wands to heat it.
from your reply i personally think that the induction based unit sounds the most promising and innovative. Nothing like that on the market yet, except for the tempest. Which works amazingly, but can be a bit of a hassle to load, let cool down etc…
So an induction based desktop ball vape in 16mm for me please
It would also allow for big saving on the power bill, as one would not have the heater running all the time. No problem for people in the us, but we have crazy energy prices in the eu. It would also be kind nice for the environment
If you would make the body in a 14mm diameter, people could use their wands to heat it.
Dudemeister
Member
Well put sir! I agree that a 20mm hybrid would be sweet for evening use.
Flavor Vaper
Well-Known Member
I personally prefer smaller sized bowls and would absolutely love something wireless.
I’ve considered it for sure, there’s a bunch of designs I put together last year for something like that.
My average customer base is the type to already have one of these, so I don’t know that there’s much of an opportunity though.
That’s the real PHASE3 experience!
I built 9 generations of ball vapes to get to this point where I’m also truly satisfied. There’s only like two things I would change to the ZX to try and improve the experience but for my preferences it’s nearly perfect.
Cheers friend thanks for your interest
Noted friend, thanks for your input!
Thanks for chiming in!
I was thinking of making a more conduction heavy desktop, as some have been asking for something like that.
Sultana lungs
Well-Known Member
What two things could improve the zx lm Intrigued
I don't care about wireless but an affordable hybrid heavy hitter leaning towards conduction would definitely fill a niche in the market.
At least that's something I am still looking for
What price range are you thinking?
Honestly I’m not certain that my hybrid vape would really be any cheaper than a ZX as the manufacturing technology is specialized. I know I’ve mentioned my higher manufacturing costs previously with the Z vapes, but the reality is I can’t innovate without doing innovative things.
I need to check some price quotes to see what I’m actually looking at. But I haven’t finished the design as I’m still trying to figure if I want to do 16MM or 20MM; and if I want to do an injector or a diffuser. Even though my injector bowls function as a diffuser, a lot of people don’t realize this, so it might be preferable to just change.
Here’s something I want to add - I notice most people said they would prefer 20MM for my hybrid vape concept but if we really want more conduction impact we want to use a narrower bowl. This will put more herb in contact with the sidewalls, which is what provides the conduction heating. For an extreme example look at the Supreme bowl, it’s about the same ID as a Dynavap.
Well I really, really want to build my other bowl design to try, that’s the main thing. Cause I think it’s going be the icing on the cake!
And I think the airflow could still be improved a little bit. I think I have that part figured out finally but I need to try an experiment, maybe this afternoon!
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Sultana lungs
Well-Known Member
All sounds great Can’t wait I’ll definitely be buying some icing for the cake
Vapeymcvaperson
New Member
Has anyone ever figured out how to calculate the offset between the temperature in the zirconium bowl and the temperature on the PID unit? I've been using 450 F with a small matrix perc bong which seems roughly equal to 380-385 in my S&B Mighty. The flower obviously doesn't get close to 450 since it stays light brown. Just curious what temperature the actual vaporization is taking place at.
David Root
Well-Known Member
Its what ever works right for you. Its a repeatable reference number. the number only has to do with temp at the sensor.
Set it where it works best for you.
David
Set it where it works best for you.
David
This is great advice for all vapes. The "temperature" is definitely bullshit. Just think of it as a number relative to others on the same display and you'll be golden. And don't buy anything from someone who says anything about boiling temps.