PBW & the Chemistry of Clean

[2clicker]

i got the 1lb for $7 at a local joint.

stuff works great, but i found myself using more than i thought i would and having to do multiple washes/rinses.

either way i love the product. sure beats soaking and waiting. it took me all of 20 mins to clean my mobius straight tube (no labels) to a sparkling crystal clear. i still followed up by a really quick ISO shake and then rinsed the hell out of it.

as far as i can tell i will never use anything else from here on out. really happy i saw this thread. only negative is that it can destroy any labeling your glass may have, but i think you could probably mask them off somehow and not worry about it.

 

[momofthegoons]

My first few attempts, I found myself using a lot of the PBW too. I think it was because even using ISO and salt or Simple Green, my pieces just weren't getting completely clean. So all that old buildup had to come off. Now, my cleaning is a quick and easy job. I don't let my glass get overly dirty (party because I now cannot stand it dirty Thank you for this affliction t-dub ) so the dwell time isn't very long. Using really hot water has also sped up the process.

And yesterday my Rezblock came..... cleaning is about to get even easier...

 

[Jeppy]

I've been trying,,,and this peanut butter and jelly just doesn't clean my Ion very well. Maybe I'm doing something wrong?

 

[Frederick McGuire]

Is it Wallberry jelly?

Ya know its gotta start with "W" don't ya?

 

[Stu]

I've been trying,,,and this peanut butter and jelly just doesn't clean my Ion very well. Maybe I'm doing something wrong?

I feel ya' Jeppy. I just tried my hand at PB&W cleaning today with mixed results. Specifically my Mobius Ion is still very cloudy, as are my HTs. I think I ran too weak of a mixture, so I'll probably have better results when I get the ratio down.

I just posted this in another thread, but you can see that the Ion below is not as clean as it should (and will) be after this attempt.

 

[momofthegoons]

Stu, get some water real hot in the microwave (but not boiling) and let it soak for a good hour with about 1T of PBW. I think you will notice good results. It takes a few tries with well loved pieces.

 

[Frederick McGuire]

I had some sort of a film develop in my matrix bub when I first introduced it to PBW, but a 2nd wash cleared it up

I haven't cleaned it again since, but my guess is that it was because either it was just quite dirty, or I used too much PBW.

Looks like we all have the same brand

 

[momofthegoons]

Frederick, you may not have rinsed well enough if you noticed a white film. I've noticed white streaks if I'm not careful to really rinse with hot water. This especially applies to any areas on the outside that may have had spill over and dried during dwell time.

 

[Frederick McGuire]

That's certainly a possibility

My matrix still needed a bit more of a wash anyways when I got the film, and after the last run it was sparkling

 

[2clicker]

so will this stuff work on sink and shower drains? as in clean and unclog them?

i just cleaned out 2 really old P-traps in my house. pretty nasty.

 

[BigDaddyVapor]

The damn BDV Megatube is a bitch to clean. I'm thinking my best bet, is with a 5 gallon bucket, pre-mixing then soak. I keep getting a nasty spot ring, around the top of the perc chamber.

Plus, I can wash multiple pieces, as the water stays hot for quite some time.

 

[Stu]

The damn BDV Megatube is a bitch to clean. I'm thinking my best bet, is with a 5 gallon bucket, pre-mixing then soak. I keep getting a nasty spot ring, around the top of the perc chamber.

Plus, I can wash multiple pieces, as the water stays hot for quite some time.

Please let us know how much PB&W you use and how it turned out. I tried this with a ~3 gallon soak and I don't think I used enough PBW. Problem is, I forgot to measure and just eyeballed it, so I have no idea how much I actually used.

I'd love to know that magic ratio to use.

 

[BigDaddyVapor]

3 gallons and I used the 6 ounces.

I tried some smaller pieces, which it was already pre-mixed by that time and they got mostly clean. Had to do the Lattice, twice.

Think I'll bump it up to 3 ounces, per gallon. Mix it really well, then let the pieces soak.

 

[Venomous]

I got the same 5 star stuff as Frederick off eBay. Tried it on my glass with 1.5 ounce in a gallon. Works very well, so thanks t-dub. I got glasses in the cabinet with a lot of white film from years in the dish washer...gonna try pbw in them now.

 

[momofthegoons]

I've used the PBW in my 30 year old dishwasher a couple of times now. I cannot believe the difference. It got all the stains off the sides and it looks like new inside now. The dishes in those loads got exceptionally clean too. My coffee pot had a "perma stain" on it that is now gone. Amazing stuff.

Since switching to this for my glass, I can't imagine going back to ISO and salt with the "shake & break" method.

 

[2clicker]

so will this stuff work on sink and shower drains? as in clean and unclog them?

anyone tried this?

 

[Venomous]

I've used the PBW in my 30 year old dishwasher a couple of times now. I cannot believe the difference. It got all the stains off the sides and it looks like new inside now. The dishes in those loads got exceptionally clean too. My coffee pot had a "perma stain" on it that is now gone. Amazing stuff.

Since switching to this for my glass, I can't imagine going back to ISO and salt with the "shake & break" method.

Good to know... I'm going to try this out with all of the white filmed glasses and clean out this dishwasher

 

[VaporEyes]

Just got my 1lb container of PBW today. My pipe wasn't extremely dirty so I didn't let it dwell for too long(~15min). Didn't get all of the little specs out but it cleaned it very well nonetheless. Thanks t-dub for recommending this . Will have to do some more experimenting later.

 

[John Lewus]

How many tablespoons to put in the dishwasher? Is it OK to put plates in there or should I only wash glass items?

 

[momofthegoons]

How many tablespoons to put in the dishwasher? Is it OK to put plates in there or should I only wash glass items?

t-dub posted about this earlier. Use less dishwasher detergent by about half in the main compartment. Then put about 1T in the smaller compartment. I added the same amount of detergent to the small compartment too. And you can put dishes and pots, etc, in there too.

 

[AdmiralAlpacha]

I agree for the combusters. I respectfully disagree on the reclaim for 2 reasons. One I can discuss, the other is proprietary. The amount of reclaim that you will get from the Cloud and its HydraTubes or your glass, is negligible imho, a waste of time, and creates something I don't want to ingest anyways.

I agree with you on this. I spend plenty of money on the art of vaporization (vaporizers, herb, and other accessories) The little I save from reclaim is just not worth it for me. Also I really enjoy how much thought you put into your posts, they all seem to have a scientific root and are just a joy to read, keep it up!

 

[Tstat]

After a particularly fun Friday night, I awoke to this mess:

Yuck! So, I filled her up with some hot water and PBW:

20 minutes later and a good rinse:

Ahh.. good as new! Thanks guys!!

 

[oldiebutgoodie]

. . . The downfall i'm noticing is that even after a hot water rinse, once dry I can see some type of residue scale type film of some sort that I don't get with ISO.

. . . A product with similar ingredients (sodium metasilicate) warns: Do Not Use On Glass. Seemingly because it can leave a hazy film . . .

I've read thru this terrific thread twice. Thanks to all for the great info and efforts.

I'd like to have my new cleaning setup ready in time for my two Mobius pieces arriving next week. I'm going to be mixing my own PBW with 1:2 of Red Devil TSP (metasilicate) and OxyClean Free (percarbonate).

The metasilicate is what causes the film. The package says that it can be removed with a non-abrasive cleaner. But separately it also says to "avoid all contact" with glass, which I take to mean that it's possible that the film effect can be more severe on glass. Some have posted having the film problem, others have not encountered it.

I can see where a short dwell followed immediately by a hot thorough rinse, could prevent the film. What baffles me is the overnight soaks. Is anyone doing the long soak on their pieces and having/not having a film residue issue? Will the long soak add the requirement for a solvent rinse (acetone, no less?). I'm currently doing an overnight Simple Green soak, reusing the solution; I'd like to do essentially the same with my "PBW" solution.

As a side note, I read on another oxy brand product's label (it's also percarbonate), not to store solution in a container with a lid because oxygen continues to be released which can conceivably cause the container to expand and burst. I'm curious if the pre-mixed PBW has any such caution?

 

[t-dub]

I can see where a short dwell followed immediately by a hot thorough rinse, could prevent the film.

Exactly, which is why I only use it that way. Longer soaks of PBW to clean ELBs have left a film on the waterline of my boro only (and it took a week), it was hard to remove, but it did come off. For longer soaks regular TSP will be your ticket oldie, but of course it has a larger environmental footprint, which I wanted to avoid.

 

[oldiebutgoodie]

Exactly, which is why I only use it that way. Longer soaks of PBW to clean ELBs have left a film on the waterline, it was hard to remove, but it did come off. For longer soaks regular TSP will be your ticket oldie, but of course it has a larger environmental footprint, which I wanted to avoid.

Thanks for the quick reply. I'm surprised that phosphate TSP wouldn't leave residue too; it has always been emphasized to rinse thoroughly and I assumed that was at least part of the reason. But I'd rather not use it anyway because it is so caustic.

Also percarbonate when dissolved becomes soda ash and hydrogen peroxide, the latter which degrades to water and oxygen. So a prepared solution will dilute and become ineffective eventually, which also kinda quashes the soaking tub idea.

I wondered if Roger's percarbonate + calgon solution would be better for an overnight (?), but presumably this solution too can't be kept for any length of time for the same reason.