Microdosing with Phase 3 ZX vs other ball vapes

[simba]

Dynavap is pretty darn on demand and conduction

Would be going full circle

You know it's funny though, I've recently been using my DV after it living in the drawer most of the time, but exclusively with old skool hash which it's great for.

Unfortunately the old school hash I currently have is not a bedtime one.

Tbh I'll probably just continue with dabs, but in emergencies maybe go with Vapman and Dynavap

 

[BeltedCoyote]

Would be going full circle

You know it's funny though, I've recently been using my DV after it living in the drawer most of the time, but exclusively with old skool hash which it's great for.

Unfortunately the old school hash I currently have is not a bedtime one.

Tbh I'll probably just continue with dabs, but in emergencies maybe go with Vapman and Dynavap

I know it is. But I'd argue like the vapman it's been a staple for a reason.

My m+ is my backup. I rock a minivap and a phase3 zx. Despite everything, somehow the m+ still hangs.

I still love my DV. It ain't the tastiest, but man they punch above their weight if you take the time to get your personal technique down

 

[simba]

You can say all that about a DV, but they're still lacking and I'm never going to choose it over a TA for flower, but it's a good niche to use it for old skool hash.

 

[BreadStick]

Does anyone have any ideas as to why many feel conduction vapes give a more couch lock indica like high and convection a more cerebral sativa like high? I think conduction vapes might get the herb to higher temps and extract more CBN or some other compounds that create the sleepy high.

My tempest came last Friday and I've ran about 10-15 bowls through it since. I'm loving it so far but it hasn't gotten rid of my desire to own a ZX yet. Even though the tempest has good heat retention I find I need to reheat more than I'd like to for slower low temp sessions. Maybe this is because of my heating and drawing technique?

Atm my sessions with the tempest consists of 2 heat cycles. I have the wand set to 525F and I heat until the LED goes from blinking to solid white, I then take my first set of hits until the vapour becomes wispy. I then reheat with the wand and check every few seconds until the VI is back just before the 3rd marker, this gives me enough heat to fully vape the bowl. The effects are brilliant. I would put it about equal to the anvil, but the flavour is better because of the double heat cycle.

Most of the discussion I've seen about the ZX describes one hit quick sessions, I'm guessing the ZX would still work well at lower temps for a longer session? As much as I love the aesthetic, taste and safety I'm starting to get tired of waiting on the couchlog to reheat during low temp slow sessions so I'm considering selling it to get the ZX for that fast PID heating. I'm also considering the Herborizer for longer sessions if the ZX can't go slow.

 

[coolbreeze]

Most of the discussion I've seen about the ZX describes one hit quick sessions, I'm guessing the ZX would still work well at lower temps for a longer session? As much as I love the aesthetic, taste and safety I'm starting to get tired of waiting on the couchlog to reheat during low temp slow sessions so I'm considering selling it to get the ZX for that fast PID heating. I'm also considering the Herborizer for longer sessions if the ZX can't go slow.

Yes, it can go slower. You would want a bigger bowl like the Couch Log bowl or a @VGOODIEZ 14mm injector bowl; the distance will help. Because of the geometry, more herbs will mean deeper herbs, so stirring and all that implies will be necessary. I would think that that depth vs diameter at this size could alter the effectiveness more than it might a broader load surface, but I don't see why it wouldn't be doable and probably doable just fine. I would have to experiment later to be more specific.

 

[BreadStick]

Yes, it can go slower. You would want a bigger bowl like the Couch Log bowl or a @VGOODIEZ 14mm injector bowl; the distance will help. Because of the geometry, more herbs will mean deeper herbs, so stirring and all that implies will be necessary. I would think that that depth vs diameter at this size could alter the effectiveness more than it might a broader load surface, but I don't see why it wouldn't be doable and probably doable just fine. I would have to experiment later to be more specific.

Thanks for the insight! Do you think the zirconia ZX bowl places the herb too close to the heater for slower sessions or are you suggesting the glass bowl for fitting bigger loads because it's difficult to get multiple hits out of small amounts of herb? I have one of Joda's CouchLog WPAs so I think I'm sorted either way, it's such a good bowl with the adjustable screen depth and ease of stirring.

 

[coolbreeze]

Thanks for the insight! Do you think the zirconia ZX bowl places the herb too close to the heater for slower sessions or are you suggesting the glass bowl for fitting bigger loads because it's difficult to get multiple hits out of small amounts of herb? I have one of Joda's CouchLog WPAs so I think I'm sorted either way, it's such a good bowl with the adjustable screen depth and ease of stirring.

The heater will be close but I was thinking more of the amount, yes. The Joda wpa aught to work fine, with caveats for the breadth v depth. I will try it later for anything unexpected but I think it will work great.

 

[howie105]

Thanks for the insight! Do you think the zirconia ZX bowl places the herb too close to the heater for slower sessions or are you suggesting the glass bowl for fitting bigger loads because it's difficult to get multiple hits out of small amounts of herb? I have one of Joda's CouchLog WPAs so I think I'm sorted either way, it's such a good bowl with the adjustable screen depth and ease of stirring.

An observation, when dialing the ZX screen depth I tried a screen on the ledge that positions the head depth. It was workable, but it made the head prone to falling off the bowl. Preparation wise I adjusted the temps up and down and went with finer and coarser grinds (MFLB finish grinder to scissor cut) but performance (taste as goal) was not enough of an improvement to justify the breakage and burn risks. After working the load depth down the bowl to the stock position I stopped.

 

[coolbreeze]

I have one of Joda's CouchLog WPAs so I think I'm sorted either way

Just tried it with the basket screen full and about .5" down from the bottom of the joint. ZX set to 325F on the DC PID (~400F probably). I got 5 nice, cool, tasty hits off what would usually be a full hit and a cleanup, probably. It seems like between the temperature, the am't, and the placement of the screen, you have parameters you can modify to make it comfortable for yourself, along with more headroom if you ever need it. I think it would work.

 

[BreadStick]

Just tried it with the basket screen full and about .5" down from the bottom of the joint. ZX set to 325F on the DC PID (~400F probably). I got 5 nice, cool, tasty hits off what would usually be a full hit and a cleanup, probably. It seems like between the temperature, the am't, and the placement of the screen, you have parameters you can modify to make it comfortable for yourself, along with more headroom if you ever need it. I think it would work.

Thanks a million for testing this set up for me! That kind of session sounds like exactly what I'm looking for, the small size of the ZX probably makes it easier to temp step with too if needed I'm guessing. After seeing that Ryan might be discontinuing the ZX & ZXL I decided to get a ZXL because it looked like he still had a few in stock. If he does do another run of the ZX I'd strongly consider putting my name down if it's noticeably better at microdosing and faster at temp changes!

 

[lluther]

Yes, it can go slower. You would want a bigger bowl like the Couch Log bowl or a @VGOODIEZ 14mm injector bowl; the distance will help. Because of the geometry, more herbs will mean deeper herbs, so stirring and all that implies will be necessary. I would think that that depth vs diameter at this size could alter the effectiveness more than it might a broader load surface, but I don't see why it wouldn't be doable and probably doable just fine. I would have to experiment later to be more specific.

Do you have any other thoughts around depth vs. diameter? Specifically, something I have been wondering recently is: At what point is it better for me to reach for a bigger chamber ball vape, versus packing a larger load into a glass bowl for use with a 14mm injector.

In other words, while we can probably agree that using 0.3-0.2g may extract better in the ZX, at what point does it become better to use a bigger bowl and device? For example, would I be better off putting 0.25 into a Screwball (I don't have one, this is just an example) or into a glass bowl and using it with a ZX? I hope this makes sense.

 

[BreadStick]

Do you have any other thoughts around depth vs. diameter? Specifically, something I have been wondering recently is: At what point is it better for me to reach for a bigger chamber ball vape, versus packing a larger load into a glass bowl for use with a 14mm injector.

In other words, while we can probably agree that using 0.3-0.2g may extract better in the ZX, at what point does it become better to use a bigger bowl and device? For example, would I be better off putting 0.25 into a Screwball (I don't have one, this is just an example) or into a glass bowl and using it with a ZX? I hope this makes sense.

I think it would depend how you want the session to go with the bigger load. If your no. 1 priority is fast extraction then a bigger vape like the screwball will be able to provide more hot air and the bowl is wider so all the herb will be getting hit with hot air fresh off the rubies. If you also really dislike stirring the screwball will probably also handle the larger load better because again you're hot air isn't losing as much energy before it reaches the herb at the bottom of the bowl so you won't need to stir. If you don't mind stirring I think you'd be fine with the ZX and a good glass bowl to hold bigger loads, the extraction shouldn't be any less efficient you'll just have to stir to bring the herb at the bottom of the bowl to the top. The glass bowl also lacks conduction heating so you might notice the herb doesn't roast as well round the edge of the bowl.

 

[coolbreeze]

Thanks a million for testing this set up for me! That kind of session sounds like exactly what I'm looking for, the small size of the ZX probably makes it easier to temp step with too if needed I'm guessing. After seeing that Ryan might be discontinuing the ZX & ZXL I decided to get a ZXL because it looked like he still had a few in stock. If he does do another run of the ZX I'd strongly consider putting my name down if it's noticeably better at microdosing and faster at temp changes!

The ZXL! Well, you'll certainly be able to go larger with it! It's really great, you won't be disappointed. I haven't fully got a handle on it yet because it seems crazy efficient in terms of temps--I haven't run it above 480 yet--though it varies per pipe more than others will, I guess because it's so open? The flavors are detailed. With the screen on the upper ledge, .1g will be a screen covering; with the screen lower or a deeper injector bowl, low-temp sipping sessions should be great. I'll have to try it at lower temps and see how it is.

Do you have any other thoughts around depth vs. diameter? Specifically, something I have been wondering recently is: At what point is it better for me to reach for a bigger chamber ball vape, versus packing a larger load into a glass bowl for use with a 14mm injector.

In other words, while we can probably agree that using 0.3-0.2g may extract better in the ZX, at what point does it become better to use a bigger bowl and device? For example, would I be better off putting 0.25 into a Screwball (I don't have one, this is just an example) or into a glass bowl and using it with a ZX? I hope this makes sense.

~.2g in the ZX bowl is about the limit of what will fit. That or more in the ZXL or Zeal or Screwdriver would roast more efficiently.

I think @BreadStick is exactly right, below.

I think it would depend how you want the session to go with the bigger load. If your no. 1 priority is fast extraction then a bigger vape like the screwball will be able to provide more hot air and the bowl is wider so all the herb will be getting hit with hot air fresh off the rubies. If you also really dislike stirring the screwball will probably also handle the larger load better because again you're hot air isn't losing as much energy before it reaches the herb at the bottom of the bowl so you won't need to stir. If you don't mind stirring I think you'd be fine with the ZX and a good glass bowl to hold bigger loads, the extraction shouldn't be any less efficient you'll just have to stir to bring the herb at the bottom of the bowl to the top. The glass bowl also lacks conduction heating so you might notice the herb doesn't roast as well round the edge of the bowl.

 

[BreadStick]

The ZXL! Well, you'll certainly be able to go larger with it! It's really great, you won't be disappointed. I haven't fully got a handle on it yet because it seems crazy efficient in terms of temps--I haven't run it above 480 yet--though it varies per pipe more than others will, I guess because it's so open? The flavors are detailed. With the screen on the upper ledge, .1g will be a screen covering; with the screen lower or a deeper injector bowl, low-temp sipping sessions should be great. I'll have to try it at lower temps and see how it is.

The more I think about it the more convinced I am the ZXL will suit what I want better. I have the tempest for smaller doses and the screwball for larger. I was hoping the upper screen load would be around 0.1g so that's great to hear, I imagine the extraction could be even faster than the ZX with that wider diameter assuming it has enough energy to keep up! The max bowl size I think I'd be looking for is 0.25 to 0.3 so unless the glass improves the flavour I think I'll be more than happy with the zirconia bowl. Looking forward to hearing how the low temp session goes!

 

[coolbreeze]

Looking forward to hearing how the low temp session goes!

1.5g in the Zi half-bowl, ZXL set to 450F=5 decent low-temp hits and a couple cleanups. Temps could maybe go slightly lower; with the screen at the bottom you might have more flexibility. As long as you load enough you would be able to use it the way you'd like, and you'll have a lot of reserve power for roasting larger bowls or quick snaps--it's . Works nicely with Ed's newest injector bowls and the SBL bowls, too.

 

[Cheebsy]

1.5g in the Zi half-bowl

TARDIS technology?

 

[coolbreeze]

TARDIS technology?

I fucked that up so bad I don't even know what I was trying to say!

 

[howie105]

Darn it, Coolbreeze, I was hoping you were on the verge of reaching critical pot mass.

 

[CreatureGlass]

Hi all,

I've been reading about the ZX and it seems to be a brilliant piece of kit. I see it being touted as the best ball vape for microdosing. Is this because it genuinely performs better than other ball vapes with a smaller load or is it because the form factor of the ZX forces you into taking smaller doses? I already own a screwball and I'm loving it so far but I'm curious if the ZX would perform noticeably better than the SB with 0.1g loads or less.

Good question I'm also looking into one of these. There are some ceramic ball vapes on B2CVape, the Tiodw V3 Ceramic. It's great for flavour but not as good for one and done as the Screwball and they can deliver good flavour at the right temps.

I've been reading about the ZX and it seems to be a brilliant piece of kit. I see it being touted as the best ball vape for microdosing…. I have a ZX as a daily driver because it is so easy to use with small loads (~.03 g) but it is not the taste champ. That laurel belongs to a modded, PID controlled Elev8r.

I see it being touted as the best ball vape for microdosing. Is this because it genuinely performs better than other ball vapes with a smaller load or is it because the form factor of the ZX forces you into taking smaller doses? ... With my type of use, the ZX can run loads up to .024 g well, but preference hold the doses sizes well below that.

I already own a screwball and I'm loving it so far but I'm curious if the ZX would perform noticeably better than the SB with 0.1g loads or less. ... I don't know the SB, but based on their maximum to minimum load sizes, both the ZX and Elev8r both are good in the sub .1 g range in comparison to my other small load vapes.

I've found the Tiodw Mini Pro (injector style) wireless ball vape good for small loads. They use an 18mm joint type bowl though and the best one is a normal joint adapter I've shoved a screen in. It performs the best I think because I'm going from the 10mm male joint to the 18mm female it opens up into a ball shape at the bottom of the 18 and top of the 10. I basically just cover the screen with 1 to 2 mm of herb for micro bowls.

Enano XL - looks better, equally safe and way better performance IMO.

It is as ball vapes although aren't that dangerous you definitely don't want to leave them turned on

Your other option is the dfreeze micro dose bowl that works with the screwball. I haven’t used one but it’s a much cheaper option than a whole other ball vape setup.

Also Vapvana are now producing new & different bowls for the Screwball, one of them is especially for micro-dosing too. Dare say this is old news to most of you but just incase thought I'd best share.

 

[Cheebsy]

It is as ball vapes although aren't that dangerous you definitely don't want to leave them turned on

Actually you can leave on the whole time without worry. For myself, I tend to fall asleep with my P3 heads switched on... I medicate to help me sleep. I know @invertedisdead leaves his on most days and nights without issue too. This should be the same for all coil based vapes, as long as the coil isn't in danger of touching anything flammable, they are very safe.

 

[Rodney]

All over reddit and this forum people prefer the ZX over other vapes. I myself do not own a ZX yet but I do own a screwball TA & Ruby Twist and they are all amazing vapes but the more I read the more I am reading that people prefer the ZX vape for small amounts. Reading again and again that the ZX tastes better than the other vapes I mentioned that I own.

In time I will hopefully own a ZX myself.

The other thing about the ZX is that the guy who makes them is very active on here.

Also I keep my ball vapes on all day as they take too long to heat up and imo it is very safe to do so as long as you have a good stand and use common sense.

 

[invertedisdead]

Actually you can leave on the whole time without worry. For myself, I tend to fall asleep with my P3 heads switched on... I medicate to help me sleep. I know @invertedisdead leaves his on most days and nights without issue too. This should be the same for all coil based vapes, as long as the coil isn't in danger of touching anything flammable, they are very safe.

My ZX is on nearly 24/7, I only turn it off if I'm going to be away from home for a few hours.

It's always on at night and at the ready

All over reddit and this forum people prefer the ZX over other vapes. I myself do not own a ZX yet but I do own a screwball TA & Ruby Twist and they are all amazing vapes but the more I read the more I am reading that people prefer the ZX vape for small amounts. Reading again and again that the ZX tastes better than the other vapes I mentioned that I own.

In time I will hopefully own a ZX myself.

The other thing about the ZX is that the guy who makes them is very active on here.

Thanks for your interest friend!

The ZX is definitely my baby, it's great to see folks preferring it as I really made it from the ground up for passionate dry herb enthusiasts.
Not for nothing, the ZX is an 8th generation design, so it's the longest running ball vape concept on the market.

It's pretty easy to make a vape that's good at one thing, with the ZX the goal was to create a vape that would excel at the top of the pack in delivering outstanding flavor, potency, and efficiency.

Running a small batch boutique vape company hasn't been super easy, but I'm delighted with the positivity in which the community has received the ZX and I'm happy to be able to offer them as long as the interest is there.

 

[Spy Car]

Would be going full circle

You know it's funny though, I've recently been using my DV after it living in the drawer most of the time, but exclusively with old skool hash which it's great for.

Unfortunately the old school hash I currently have is not a bedtime one.

Tbh I'll probably just continue with dabs, but in emergencies maybe go with Vapman and Dynavap

DVs are good with hash? Any special prep? Do you heat a small chunk and flatten it prior to inserting it into the DV?

I have an old college buddy who will be visiting with me over the holidays, who will be coming from Lebanon, where the Beqaa Valley hashish is legendary. Hmm.

Bill

 

[simba]

It is as ball vapes although aren't that dangerous you definitely don't want to leave them turned on

I'm not talking about the danger of leaving them turned on. I've left ball vapes on all day without worry. I'm talking about the danger of having an exposed coil that you use. The number of coil burns I've had on myself and the carpet are just annoying.

With a log vape I can drop it into my lap between hits. The convenience is huge compared to vapes with exposed coils. And I'd put the performance of my Enano XL against any ball vape in terms of power.

DVs are good with hash? Any special prep? Do you heat a small chunk and flatten it prior to inserting it into the DV?

I have an old college buddy who will be visiting with me over the holidays, who will be coming from Lebanon, where the Beqaa Valley hashish is legendary. Hmm.

Bill

If you don't mind the extra cleaning you can stick it straight in the bowl and go.

 

[Spy Car]

If you don't mind the extra cleaning you can stick it straight in the bowl and go.

Back in the day, we would always "feather" the hash by gently pre-heating a bit and then flattening it out if we were going to smoke it in a pipe.

It has been donkey's years since I've had any Lebanese or Afghan hash. However I can still conjure the taste (and the high) in my mind.

I will need to score some kind of hash to try in my DV. What's a little cleaning? LOL

Bill

ETA: Apologies for doing "off topic" in this thread. I'm actually looking at getting a ZX for microdosing, so please excuse the rabbit hole DV/hash side conversation. Play on!