Have we reached the portable end game?

Cannabis-Hardware-Ed

Seeking Higher Ground
Manufacturer
Not to derail the discussion NewVape 710, but would you consider shining some light on the upcoming implementation of the PACT act from your perspective? Perhaps in another post? Thanks
one day soon you may need to come to palm beach florida to pickup your order and get a NewVape factory tour. Who knows what's going to happen? This industry's pretty good at navigating these types of uncharted waters. As far as i'm concerned it's a weedeater nut for a vrod.
 

SatanLovestoVape

Well-Known Member
Portables vaporizer can always use some improvements. I think in a couple of years, there will be end-game portables. An end game portable will have to hit like a heavy hitter desktop vape, be pocketable, and accommodate USB C charger/wireless charger.

Now for the real truth bomb that people don't want to hear:
VAS comes from unsatisfying vapor.

People that are thrilled with their current vaporizers aren't going around buying every new market release. They simply aren't. Most modern VAS is just camouflage for people with high tolerance, hoping to find a magic bullet of a vaporizer that will prevent them from taking a tolerance break. I also don't feel that large vape collections help the frequently questioned efficacy of vaporizing compared to combustion, in general. Ive shared some of the finest vaporizers ever made, with a good number of people; and quite frankly, I'm still amazed at how unconvincing even the very "best" have been to outsiders.
That's a terrific theory on VAS, which makes sense to some but not all. I have VAS for a very different reason. The innovation behind vaporizers is cool. A new vape comes out, and the current vapes owned will not support that new feature. That what gets me into buying more vaporizers. The reason it is hard for "outsiders" to get into vaping because of the price point, and it is easier to combust.
 
Last edited:

Shit Snacks

Milaana. Lana. LANA. LANAAAA! (TM2/TP80/BAK/FW9)
@Shit Snacks your exactly right. I do need to stay more up with the times. I apologize for that. Which one's your personal favorite?

All good! Those that I listed, are my top tier convection portables now, I would also include the Firewood7 as a conduction on demand with some convection hybrid. If I had to have only two it would probably be Tinymight and Firewood7, but I love RBT vapes (Splinter Milaana Zion) and Lamart Tetra is great too, while the new Tafée Bowle is pretty fantastic as latest mass produced!
 

btka

Well-Known Member
where there's flower there's rosin. The rosin masters here in the US have figured out how to get that rosin into a cartridge without chemicals. This plant-press-cart process should be able to be replicated anywhere.

rosin_1024x1024@2x.jpg
also think for portability this will be the future (ok for you it is present :) )... I am wondering why there is no good portable device which works like this carts but with flower rosin...

It is not easy to make this live rosin carts for you own (tried and failed all the time), but if there would be carts which you can fill with flower rosin and which work like live rosin carts that would be the future of portable vaporizing in my opinion...

or a machine which can make your flowers into rosin which you can put in carts... like rosin press which everyone can buy and make easy rosin carts..
 

510vaporent

Well-Known Member
All good! Those that I listed, are my top tier convection portables now, I would also include the Firewood7 as a conduction on demand with some convection hybrid. If I had to have only two it would probably be Tinymight and Firewood7, but I love RBT vapes (Splinter Milaana Zion) and Lamart Tetra is great too, while the new Tafée Bowle is pretty fantastic as latest mass produced!
It is comments like this that keep my VAS going! I love my splinters and milaana but now feel like I need the tinymight and firewood! What am I missing out on 🤔😂
 

Shit Snacks

Milaana. Lana. LANA. LANAAAA! (TM2/TP80/BAK/FW9)
Ok I'm buying a tinymight. Sneaky Pete did a nice job on his review. Any must have accessories? Thanks @Shit Snacks - made in Finland?

Haha awesome! Yup, I recommend grabbing both of the WPAs from TM, and to make sure you have a nice jayhook or other dry cooling mouthpiece (I'm sure you've got water tools covered). Grab the extra long stem too, though I have not tried it yet I hear good things and ordered one with my own second TM last week... Also get the spare o-ring kit added onto your TM just in case! Some like to get a spare cooling unit too, if they plan to be using it a lot, to save on cleaning time, plus spare stems are smart!
 

Ramahs

Fucking Combustion (mostly) Since February 2017
100% correct. I remember just trying to convert normies to using a wax pen or Peak over carts. They bounced as soon as they saw me q-tipping the thing. Dabbers underestimate how fucking weird and dorky that looks to normal people. I'd wager that most of the newer users we're seeing in legal States are exclusively buying carts and edibles. If they buy flower, it's prerolled for combustion. They certainly aren't interested in mastering the best grind consistency and draw speed for the latest convection portable. That all sounds insane to them.

Their loss :shrug:
 

bossman

Gentleman Of Leisure
Ok I'm buying a tinymight. Sneaky Pete did a nice job on his review. Any must have accessories? Thanks @Shit Snacks - made in Finland?
I got none of the accessories for my Tinymight and use it pretty much exclusively with two custom j-hooks from OregonGlassBlower and an RBT short stem upside down as a WPA. @Shit Snacks and I both do this for home use to keep the stainless steel cooling unit out of the airpath and preserve better flavor.

You'd do well to try a Splinter Z on a Red Panda mod too. The Z is the on demand convection portable with the biggest heater and the best flavor. Tinymight has a more elegant design but the modular approach of the Z has a lot going for it despite the awkward wizard wand stack height.
PXL_20210225_205115763~2.jpg
 
Last edited:

hinglemccringleberry

Well-Known Member
Maybe a hard look should be taken at what really makes this such a forever niche market?
I feel like there might be a big factor contributing to the industry's rut that isn't being talked about. The type of portables that would convince more herb smokers to switch to herb vaping, are the very portables that are both out of reach currently, and "unappealing" to many vapers to begin with. I'm talking about unregulated vapes like the Lil Bud and Milaana, and just the general concept of an unregulated dry herb vape.
Smokers' biggest gripe with vaping is that it's "not potent enough" or "too gentle and doesn't get me high". So right off the bat, the device produces a sense of need. What if instead, the device fulfills the combustion desire up front, and then things can be fine-tuned to achieve big clouds and effects without burning?
The smokers who are the biggest holdouts are the ones who need potent vaping experiences the most, and it's not happening. To have a shot at converting them they NEED to get into vaping by accidentally combusting and then dial it down from there. Instead whats happening is they start out with a weak device or maybe a decent one that doesn't have the ability to combust, and it gives the illusion that there is no way to dial it up, so they're like "screw this, smoking is better". These people need to start out with something unregulated, something portable that's powerful as a desktop and something where they can just grab a pinch of ground bud with their fingers and drop it in and it's ready to go (this tech is already available). that way it's as simple to prep as a smoking method, and the worst case scenario is that they accidentally combust. Except the smoker doesn't view that as a worst case scenario, they view it as normal. Then they need to be taught that a potent experience without combustion IS possible, and with this powerful unregulated vape we're going to get there. THAT would convince more of them to switch.

Except for the part where the price point of those devices completely prevents this from happening. Nevermind. Oh, and throw in the fact that there's a stigma and safety issue around unregulated boxmods, and so the idea of unregulated anything has the illusion of being a bad idea (nevermind that it's a very nuanced engineering topic - but who the hell knows that? Lol)...I feel like this a problem flying under the radar that has sabotaged the scene and these types of breakthrough moments that would facilitate wider vaping adoption just aren't economically possible.
 
Last edited:

Farid

Well-Known Member
I agree with your main point mccringleberry, but one issue with unregulated devices is a smoker's willingness to clean their piece after combustion. Unless the stem is completely clean it will taste awful and they won't be able to experience one of the main benefits of vaping - the taste. They're also likely to be annoyed if they think they just wasted money on something that doesn't work.

I think a bigger factor which keeps this a niche market is the fiddley-ness of vaping. So many people want easy. With vaping you often have to work a little, be it a learning curve, a special grind needed, or a certain type of breath. The vaporizers which have the most mass appeal are ones which are relatively easy to use, and forgiving on technique.
 

Zuhdj

Charles Mingus
Heater shape is something that can be improved on as well. We want there to be turbulence in the heater so that, regardless of draw speed, all the air gets to touch the heater, not just some of it. I don't want to have to draw slow while the air in the center of the heating tubes gets heated up. So that already rules out TP80 and tinymight tech as "end game" heaters since, due to the straightness of their heaters, the air gets unevenly heated. I love these two vapes but we could do better. The reason ball vapes work so well is because of this idea of turbulence. They force all of the air to run into heated surface. This idea is the entire concept behind the Supreme's design as well. If someone (I wish I could) made a hybrid heated vape where the air was heated like this (with maximum turbulence in the heater), draw technique would be irrelevant and it would satisfy even the most stubborn smokers. Maybe have an adjustable bowl like the tinymight, use sturdy materials like ceramic wood and steel/titanium and you've got the perfect portable in my opinion. Now someone go do it cuz lord knows I can't haha
 

oddjobold

Vape swap shop
Thank you for the replies everyone. I started this thread as a discussion point and there are some very interesting replies!

Perhaps rather than the end game we have reached a period where the low hanging fruit of improvements have gone. Now the improvements will be small rather than big leaps of the past.

At least with the help of FC classifieds and entexchange I have manage to minimize my spend. I have keep my collection small (currently 6 vapes), while still having the latest vapes.
 
Last edited:

jardri

Vapor Dreams
Very interesting thoughts everybody!!

@mccringleberry I agree that hight temp vaping is the way to go for converting smokers, right at the edge of combustion. But it still isn´t smoke and smokers crave smoke.

I had a difficult time converting to vaping because I smoked too much spliffs. My body wanted that chemical cocktail with a lot of bad stuff and nicotine. My mouth wanted that awful combustion taste. I got sick every morning and was still smoking aggresively, until one day I got fed up. I bought insane amounts of herb and the Plenty, and decided to make the transition by inhaling so much vapor that i couldnt even think about smoking. It was a very difficult week but one day something in my body clicked. My taste had changed, my body adapted to the new pure substance and started rejecting adulterated shit. Somehow I could not even smoke a spliff anymore, It just felt bad. I bought a Vapcap and the ritual and efficiency quickly lowered my anxiety and my daily consumption (from smoking 4 grams a day to vaping 0,1 nowadays!!!). That was 4 years ago and i am now unable to smoke, I even prefer no weed than smoking.

Told my personal story to make a point here: We have great vaporizers, and vaping is incredibly efficient but no matter how good technology is, It will always be different than smoking. Most smokers are craving smoke and vaping can not satisfy their desires. A small personal sacrifice is needed in order to change that, and many people arent willing to make any.

I have made lots of futile attempts trying to convert my smoker friends, even my dad. Everybody loves the Flowerpot and the Vapcap but they all say it is not the same. No success among the smokers.

On the other hand, all of my non smoker or ex smoker friends who have tried vapes have absolutely loved every bit of it. They saw its benefits immediately and as soon as they tried vaping, they all bought a vape.

Hoping my experiences can throw some light into this complicate matter.
 

guyonthecouch

Well-Known Member
End game to me is a silly concept, that's the beauty of our community, endless stream of conscious creation and wanting to hack-smith/wannabe engineer vaporization contraptions and apparatuses, it goes hand in hand with every aspect of the plant - get high and think of new ways of getting high. The sacred peace pipe will one day become a laser powered/infrared heated, with vacuum pressured chamber allowing for lower heat temps/boiling points, triple distilling the vapor after its extracted for use on Mars. 👽

Mary's been on lockdown for the last 100yrs, there's going to be plenty more of us who will get touched by her love and have a wacky idea to create some kind of new method of consumption in their garage. Take our beloved Monsieur Pipes for example, one dude out of his garage did a lot for the game. Inverted working away on his piece. Or Hippie Dippie's long awaited cube! :science:

As for VAS and collecting, personally it's just that, a hobby. Trying out new vapor signatures and collecting my favourite pieces. I'm a big advocate on having multiple pieces to use throughout the day/week, with more variety(quality pieces) comes less tolerance IMO. I don't really find myself ever needing to take a t-break because of tolerance but more so because of wanting to take a break from the plant all together. I guess switching up devices every now and then keeps the endocannabinoid system guessing and not get accustomed to a single vape signature. Being a flavour chaser the hunt is never over.. but the search is the fun part for me and keeps me young at heart. With only one vape I'd get bored and eventually turn back to the dark side of combustion.

l-ion battery technology recently got a nobel prize for its (positive) impact on society (https://www.nytimes.com/2019/10/09/science/nobel-prize-chemistry.html); vaporizers have reaped the benefits, and it's a good bet things will continue to improve in that department. still, it's already kind of a golden age for vaping now, with all the choice available. given the abundance of excellent devices in every category, it's hardly surprising that it feels like christmas for a lot of people with all the new toys out there.
We've reaped the benefits but also have been a major proponent in propelling the battery industry, tech and design, forward from our demanding "never satisfied" needs. :whip:
The normies can thank us later. :clap:
 
Last edited by a moderator:

Farid

Well-Known Member
I've personally reached my endgame, and I don't even consider purchasing new vaporizers anymore. But that's because I feel my desires for what I want in a vaporizer have been perfectly met. I used to be a 1 hitter smoker. The vapcap mimics that perfectly, and there's nothing about the experience that I would change.

But there is infinite room for innovation outside my own desires. Batterry technology is always improving. The look and feel of vaporizers could be made much better. Heaters could be made more efficient.
 

Seek

Apprentice Daydreamer
Batteries could use some development, theoretically we could make them charge so much master and hold so much more power per volume than they can do now. Once theres some breaktrhough in battery technology, a lot of tech industries including vapes will havea breakthrough from that as well. Heater is definitelly about a lot more than just size and power, it's a lot about design and the airflow dynamics within. Making a heater with reliable and uniform heat output no matter how fast you are inhaling is very hard and it can still be improved. And even when all of this is perfect, there could still be progress made in price.
 

hinglemccringleberry

Well-Known Member
I agree with your main point mccringleberry, but one issue with unregulated devices is a smoker's willingness to clean their piece after combustion. Unless the stem is completely clean it will taste awful and they won't be able to experience one of the main benefits of vaping - the taste. They're also likely to be annoyed if they think they just wasted money on something that doesn't work.

I think a bigger factor which keeps this a niche market is the fiddley-ness of vaping. So many people want easy. With vaping you often have to work a little, be it a learning curve, a special grind needed, or a certain type of breath. The vaporizers which have the most mass appeal are ones which are relatively easy to use, and forgiving on technique.
Fair point. But my idea was that the smoker is taught to use the vape correctly / to produce lungbusters with no smoke, and if he screws up its ok because he's already used to combustion. There's also a good chance that learning to use the vape like that and messing up would result in hot spot charring, not a cherry of the entire load. Hot spot charring would produce a combination of smoke and vapor, and that should still taste better than full-on cherry burning.
Alot of smokers aren't impressed by the most popular vapes, some to the point where they literally think the vape "doesnt work" and that's the whole problem. They need to take huge rips on something powerful enough to char the load, learn to use it correctly without charring, and experience getting choked out with white-thick vapor and use that as the catalyst to convert from smoking to vaping. But I do realize this is a pipe dream.
 
Last edited:
hinglemccringleberry,
  • Like
Reactions: arb

Duba

Well-Known Member
Accessory Maker
interesting thoughts there! thanks!
Innovation has the resource to satiate our VAS and invent new toys. (I trust the engineering of the stoners...)
I agree with the idea (a little) expressed here that the VAS would try to fill an unsatisfied desire to regain the feeling of power of smoke. I'm fine with my devices which are efficient but despite everything, I'm always looking at re/exchange for the one that will sound the end of the game...why? Are we prisoners of the system like collectors of cars, garden gnomes or weapons?
I wish I could free myself from the VAs like I freed myself from combusting and tobacco but shit, I love having my vapors in my hands and mouth, all day long and every day...next one?
 

Shit Snacks

Milaana. Lana. LANA. LANAAAA! (TM2/TP80/BAK/FW9)
You know what would be cool is a Desktop/portable combo. Think of the Nintendo Switch.

Back before the company died, iPuffUSA supposedly had some sort of dock in the works for the Elevape that would have allowed it to fill bags of vapor for home use!
 
Top Bottom