bizwaxzion
Enigmatic Cannabist
Still diggin the V3 on the primo mini for a simple and portable way to enjoy some home squished rosin. Thanks @divinetribe and happy holidays.
Divine Tribe atty's
- Thread starter divinetribe
- Start date
V4 crucible testing problems. So it seems as if the lower chamber that is pretty much sealed off is getting resonated after two uses. Like a vacuum aggressively pulling vapor toward the heat source. At a loss figuring how to completely seal it off or leave it open like the quest. , concentrate is not spilling over, it just seems like the vapor is finding it's way into the lower chamber through the bottom and through the screw holes.
Haywood
Onward Thru the Fog
I get pretty resonated after two uses of my QQ.
OF
Well-Known Member
I'm not sure I completely follow this. I think the 'vacuum' part might be happening, just not like you'd think. If there's a path for vapor to get to a cooler area (not "pulling vapor toward the heat source" but the opposite) it condenses there. There's a class of (high) vacuum pumps that use this technique to capture and hold remaining gas molecules you could otherwise not remove mechanically (like you can with 'soft' vacuums). Extremely cold refrigeration (using Helium rather than Freon) gives you cold surfaces much below boiling points for Oxygen, Nitrogen and other typical gasses, like ten degrees above absolute zero kind of cold. Only works if the vacuum is already quite good to provide thermal insulation to get that cold. Most remaining gas molecules are trapped and held as either liquids or solids until they 'cryo pump' is allowed to warm up when a normal mechanical pumping system removes them.
I suspect that's what you're seeing. just on a different scale. Vapor is finding a cooler place (not hotter) to condense and hide. This, of course, creates a lowered pressure (vacuum) locally that draw yet more vapor in. Since heating the area hotter is probably not an option, sealing it completely seems the only way to go?
Or perhaps venting a bit of cold air in so the vapor doesn't get in? All the leaks would be into the upper chamber, not out of it. That is sealing the lower chamber off might be a factor and an intentional leak there might be the solution?
Thanks for the update. Food for thought......
OF
Copacetic
Somewhere North of The Wall
That's so weird, I woulda thought that even without an 'airtight' seal between cup and heater chamber, there would be zero reason for vapour to move to there.V4 crucible testing problems. So it seems as if the lower chamber that is pretty much sealed off is getting resonated after two uses. Like a vacuum aggressively pulling vapor toward the heat source. At a loss figuring how to completely seal it off or leave it open like the quest. , concentrate is not spilling over, it just seems like the vapor is finding it's way into the lower chamber through the bottom and through the screw holes.
I assume that there's no bottom air flow holes, or other holes in the deck?
Maybe if you had some small ones, air would be drawn in through the heater chamber, forcing 'escaped' vapour travel in the right direction?
It would have to be a small hole/s so as to not cool the heater unduly, or dilute vapour production.
......I type too slow!
OF got there way ahead of me [tips hat], and with a suggested cause even!
I'd be amazed if that tiny volume of air heating up, then cooling would pull much vape back into the heater chamber, but I guess it must be something like that
tennisguru1
EXCELSIOR!
Vic - HVT Sai, Matt DT, QQ Brent AVS MoleThat's so weird, I woulda thought that even without an 'airtight' seal between cup and heater chamber, there would be zero reason for vapour to move to there.
I assume that there's no bottom air flow holes, or other holes in the deck?
Maybe if you had some small ones, air would be drawn in through the heater chamber, forcing 'escaped' vapour travel in the right direction?
It would have to be a small hole/s so as to not cool the heater unduly, or dilute vapour production.
......I type too slow!
OF got there way ahead of me [tips hat], and with a suggested cause even!
I'd be amazed if that tiny volume of air heating up, then cooling would pull much vape back into the heater chamber, but I guess it must be something like that
Saturday meeting of the minds & hearts of our vapes :>)
Looking forward to long lasting friendships. Customers win when vape companies come together vape out and share ideas. L to r - Vic HVT w/ the Sequoia, Matt dTribe w/ the quest ,Brent AVS w/ the Molecule. Happy Saturday everyone. (i.redd.it)
submitted 2 hours ago by divinetribe1Divine Tribe Rep/Owner
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21stCenturyVape
Well-Known Member
Probably prohibitively expensive to manufacture, but what about treating some sort of glass-on-glass ground joint to connect the crucible to the base, and using smaller screws for the posts that don’t protrude out of the glass base?
Ok guys,
I went out and got me a QQ even though I was recommended getting the DT2.5. I had the DTv3 a little over a year ago and had problems with it. The problem is I don't know what I'm doing and all my learning is via internet.
I'm 46 yrs old, but only 2 years old with concentrates. All self taught from the internet. Never seen an enail in real life. I have had only DTv3, Dr. Dabber Boost, and now this QQ. Wife doesn't want me smoking. Says its bad for me, so now I'm either using cartridges, or this thing. No desire to bring the torch thing into the picture. I would just stay with carts.
As for the QQ... I have went through 2 grams of cheap shatter and so far... I love it. It's easier to use and I don't feel as if I wasting material. I live in a non legal state, so...
I have 6 more grams of a little better shatter that I plan on finishing my learning curve on before trying anything more expensive. I wanted to ask some stupid questions first. I have read a lot of this thread over the past two years, but some things I'll never find answers to. Based on this thread and Matt's videos...
1. A session is combination of more than one hit. Do I have to take all those hits back to back like in Matts video, or can i take my time between hits? What happens to the oil between hits?
2. Can I load too small of a hit? My though is depending on the answer to question 1, a 1 hit session makes sure i have no wasted material, and the ability to chill / recover before taking my next hit. The reason I question this is because this is where I seam to get the most of my "Burning" on the bottom of the cup. If i load it fat, taking 4-5 hits for the session, it never seams to run its self dry and turn to char.
3. If using Matt's setting for an example, once i reach 500, I hit it and start letting off trigger. I do I need to keep the trigger pulled and just let the mod and the TC do its thing and not worry about it? I keep wanting to let off the trigger, keep the temp down to just where I see vape, and pulse it only when see it not vaping. I'm questioning this making my sessions longer, loosing material with cool downs and reheats.
4. I know the cleaning after each use, but is there cleaning I need to do every few G's or so? I like to keep it clean, but don't want to break it while doing so.
Thanks for any and all the help, Cody
I went out and got me a QQ even though I was recommended getting the DT2.5. I had the DTv3 a little over a year ago and had problems with it. The problem is I don't know what I'm doing and all my learning is via internet.
I'm 46 yrs old, but only 2 years old with concentrates. All self taught from the internet. Never seen an enail in real life. I have had only DTv3, Dr. Dabber Boost, and now this QQ. Wife doesn't want me smoking. Says its bad for me, so now I'm either using cartridges, or this thing. No desire to bring the torch thing into the picture. I would just stay with carts.
As for the QQ... I have went through 2 grams of cheap shatter and so far... I love it. It's easier to use and I don't feel as if I wasting material. I live in a non legal state, so...
I have 6 more grams of a little better shatter that I plan on finishing my learning curve on before trying anything more expensive. I wanted to ask some stupid questions first. I have read a lot of this thread over the past two years, but some things I'll never find answers to. Based on this thread and Matt's videos...
1. A session is combination of more than one hit. Do I have to take all those hits back to back like in Matts video, or can i take my time between hits? What happens to the oil between hits?
2. Can I load too small of a hit? My though is depending on the answer to question 1, a 1 hit session makes sure i have no wasted material, and the ability to chill / recover before taking my next hit. The reason I question this is because this is where I seam to get the most of my "Burning" on the bottom of the cup. If i load it fat, taking 4-5 hits for the session, it never seams to run its self dry and turn to char.
3. If using Matt's setting for an example, once i reach 500, I hit it and start letting off trigger. I do I need to keep the trigger pulled and just let the mod and the TC do its thing and not worry about it? I keep wanting to let off the trigger, keep the temp down to just where I see vape, and pulse it only when see it not vaping. I'm questioning this making my sessions longer, loosing material with cool downs and reheats.
4. I know the cleaning after each use, but is there cleaning I need to do every few G's or so? I like to keep it clean, but don't want to break it while doing so.
Thanks for any and all the help, Cody
looney2nz
Research Geek, Mad Scientist
Smaller hits work better, WAY less splatter, pulling gentler while watching yourself in a mirror helps quite a bit.
I don't have it in front of me right now, but if I recall correctly, you can get 3 or 4 hits in a row in a session and then the heat diffuser will be pretty hot. Give it a 5 min break, lather rinse repeat. You can also take your time in between hits. Are you cleaning the mouthpiece and atomizer assembler with an ethanol soggy organic q-tip? If if you use ethanol (ETOH) I suggest an organic 195-200 proof, if you're using ISO alcohol, make sure you air/heat dry them to burn off any leftover (leftover ISO not good). I keep a bottle to throw all my qtips into, I'll reclaim the oil from them for future re-use (lots of good stuff leftover in concentrates!). Matt also recommends using a fine steel wool to clean the carbonized material off of the Quartz Cup.
Predicated on which BoxMod you're using most have a 10-15sec limit. I take it you're using TCR on yours?
Once I borrow my nephew's Windows Laptop, I'll install PID software like ArticFox (I'll send off a flare to y'all when I do, yeah, you too @Vape Donkey 650 !) for all of my palm vapes.
I watch my temp on my mods, and when I'm ramplng up and have hit 50-75F beneath my peak temp, I start pulling then.
I am running a 75W Pico that I got from Matt with the DTv3. I like Articfox because I like tech. I really like having profiles. I label the profiles with you guys users names. Plus, i like to have a couple profiles for a few carts I maybe keeping on backup. I also use the little mod of my e-cig.
I am using regular q-tips from Walmart and 92% ISO. Where do i get the better stuff and do I need it?
I have been doing all my sessions in front of a mirror. defiantly helps.
Would love to try your settings. maybe even get you on a profile. lol
Thanks, Cody
looney2nz
Research Geek, Mad Scientist
best advice for the q-tips, search for organic cotton q-tips
I pulled one off my Joyetech Vtwo Mini's, here's the setting I had on here for the QQ:
TCR 280
450F
42.5W
locked in @ 0.28 ohms
I keep my eye peeled on the ceramic tube atomizers to see if they are changing color, a little red ok, a lot red NOPE, sometimes the boxmod gets a little wonky and I have to goose it closer to 500F.
92% ISO is fine, but you'll have to purge the toxic part (air/dry, light heat, burnoff)
You don't want non-organic q-tips, they have chlorine and other products in them
(not to mention plenty of pesticides). Some folks are using organic hemp wipes instead of
q-tips. I just throw the 'dirty' tips into an empty jar, and I'll collect them until I can extract it all back into an ethanol or ISO base, and make a re-concentrate out of it. Prolly go in a batch of edibles.
hope that helped!
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Man, the QQ is on fire today. I can't get over how much better I like this over the DTv3 experience last year. Sometimes, I actually start to think I'm doing it right and its working like its suppose to. Then the medicine starts to kick in.
Ok, a few more questions...
1. Can I load say a large session (4-5 hits), take one hit, let it cool down completely, and then finish session an hour later? I understand this is a LAYG device, but I'm still needing to understand the material. Does something happen to the oil while heating and cooling that would lead to just wasting the material.
2. How do you know if your getting too hot? Crusting would be one sign i would think, but I have one wax that is dry that I think will just do that be design. In Looney2nz's post above, I learned about the coil color. I never seen the color before, so I would say I'm not on the too high side. I actually had to turn the lights off to see any color.
3. Can I start hitting it at too low temp? For example, using Looney2nz's settings above (which I like BTW) he said he started hitting it 50-75F beneath peak temp. Before I knew that, I was doing kind of the same thing. I was taking first hit as soon as it started smoking (300-350) while trigger off almost the whole inhale. only on the second or third hit did i have to let the temp get into the 400's. it seams as if the material just stops hitting at one temp, but if you take temp up 50 degrees, it starts burning a different layer of material.
4. Kind of piggy backing on question 2, on my last hit of session, it seams as if all my oil material is on the sides on cup and not going down to the hotter bottom of cup area. This seams to be preventing it from vaping. I can't help to think its because its too hot, but when thinking about the theory in question 3, I thought i would burn off more, eliminating waste, regardless of the taste, buy turning it up. My hottest setting, of all that I've used or am using is Matt's 500 in his advertise settings.
5. About what percent of people save their q-tips? I am a big believer of waste not want not, but I never saved my seeds and stems to smoke later. I haven't been saving my leftovers because I'm still keeping it on the down-low. I rent "part" of my house out to daughter and her husband, and manager at work. All in non legal state. I also would imagine it would take a but load to be worth making it into something else. If i only saved half of mine when I could...
Thanks FC, Cody
Ok, a few more questions...
1. Can I load say a large session (4-5 hits), take one hit, let it cool down completely, and then finish session an hour later? I understand this is a LAYG device, but I'm still needing to understand the material. Does something happen to the oil while heating and cooling that would lead to just wasting the material.
2. How do you know if your getting too hot? Crusting would be one sign i would think, but I have one wax that is dry that I think will just do that be design. In Looney2nz's post above, I learned about the coil color. I never seen the color before, so I would say I'm not on the too high side. I actually had to turn the lights off to see any color.
3. Can I start hitting it at too low temp? For example, using Looney2nz's settings above (which I like BTW) he said he started hitting it 50-75F beneath peak temp. Before I knew that, I was doing kind of the same thing. I was taking first hit as soon as it started smoking (300-350) while trigger off almost the whole inhale. only on the second or third hit did i have to let the temp get into the 400's. it seams as if the material just stops hitting at one temp, but if you take temp up 50 degrees, it starts burning a different layer of material.
4. Kind of piggy backing on question 2, on my last hit of session, it seams as if all my oil material is on the sides on cup and not going down to the hotter bottom of cup area. This seams to be preventing it from vaping. I can't help to think its because its too hot, but when thinking about the theory in question 3, I thought i would burn off more, eliminating waste, regardless of the taste, buy turning it up. My hottest setting, of all that I've used or am using is Matt's 500 in his advertise settings.
5. About what percent of people save their q-tips? I am a big believer of waste not want not, but I never saved my seeds and stems to smoke later. I haven't been saving my leftovers because I'm still keeping it on the down-low. I rent "part" of my house out to daughter and her husband, and manager at work. All in non legal state. I also would imagine it would take a but load to be worth making it into something else. If i only saved half of mine when I could...
Thanks FC, Cody
looney2nz
Research Geek, Mad Scientist
Glad that was helpful, let's see if we can clarify more (although between chemo, edibles and vaping up a storm... expect brain-farts).
#1: in a word, yes.
With the various expansion characteristics of the concentrates before they change phase, the quartz bucket in the QQ could (and has) overflow if you're loading that much (and people still tend to pull WAY too hard for that mouthpiece to begin with).
#2: You'd hope you could rely on the controller to read out an accurate temp, but it starts before then.
Many folks on here have purchased those 'relatively inexpensive' laser guided infrared temperature gauges used for everything from cooking to working on vehicles. This is a starting place, reliable baselines, and all.
If I'm lucky twisting the assembly back on the MOD, the ends of the ceramic tubes are visible to me, I cup my hand around the mouthpiece to block the light and see if they ever get hotter than a gentle pink.
(you can see the same thing in the mirror while you practice more efficient pulls with the QQ).
(p.s. it's not limited to these ceramic rods, I've seen many atomizer/boxmods love communications, have a digital aneurism, and get crazy hot. Old days of burnoff cleaning v2.5 & v.3 DT's (in all sizes) was a piece of cake just watching the intensity of the pink/red ('course I'd set my v3/VTwo Mini @600F)
#3: Since you're using a QQ, you certainly cover more ground in regards to the boiling points of the various cannaboids. I just like to start a little lower, ease my way into it... push comes to shove, get a water tool ready
#4: Basic thermodynamics, heat gravitates to cold... the heated area in the QQ cup, as long as you don't put too much in, and/or pull too hard (causing splatter) is going to go towards the cooling glass and the cooling heat sink. In one of the threads on FC here, there is a chart of someone who tested reclaim from concentrate and it was quite surprising in how much active cannabinoids were leftover.
you already know I save mine, I think you'll find many that do (not just those who save ABV!), but you raise good questions, can you secure them (small locking safe), and when you have enough, can you process them? There's a long 'Source Extractor' thread on here, it is a home unit for processing ethanol or ISO to make concentrate.
OF
Well-Known Member
It's not, it's a cart/connection problem. It can't 'find' the cart either because it's defective (heater/connection problem) or not making proper contact.
Good luck sorting it out. It was a big problem early on, but seems to have been fixed for some time?
OF
OF
Well-Known Member
No, that screw must be snug/tight. Don't mess with it. The two 'side screws' at the heaters can sometimes need tightening after a few heatings.
'Contact was fine until I unscrewed it and put it back on several times'? Troubleshooting tip there? What was the last thing you did before the lights went out?
OF
With you confirming that i could turn the bottom screw, I snugged it up and found it to be a little loose. About 1/6th of a turn is all though. I put it back on the mod and it registered. I instantly was able to finish my session. lol
Thanks OF for the quick help.
Now, was that all it was? I got to say, a few days ago i had a few sessions where the unit didn't register. All I had to do was unscrew a little, push the button, then screw it back on again and it worked. this happened 2-3 times. Could it be that my screw worked itself loose? Maybe it was just never tightened?
I don't know how touchy that connection is, but.... I'm just happy as can be its working. I have a tendency to break things now and then. That's why I haven't taken this one apart yet, plus i remember reading people breaking off their little wires tightening them too tight and what not. If it ain't broke, don't fix it.
Thanks again FC, Cody
KeroZen
Chronic vapaholic
These 510 connectors are the source of a lot of problems. Especially since many use a brass or copper center pin. The idea is nice on paper but these materials, contrary to plated contacts, will develop pretty quickly an oxide and contaminants film. This film must be mechanically broken apart (scratched and not just alcohol wiped) otherwise the connection will develop contact resistance and become unreliable.
The problem is usually solved by having wiping contacts. That's what is supposed to happen when you unscrew and screw your atty back again. So far so good, but here's where it becomes tricky: these 510 ports, especially on cheap Chinese mods, tend to be crappy and wear super easily. This is why many people in the e-cig world will recommend you to dedicate one mod to one atty, so the threads don't wear too fast (and when the 510 port is worn, it develops other kinds of bad contact resistance, the one on my evic VTC primo took less than a couple of months to become unusable with some of my attys for instance)
You can also use 510 heatsinks / extenders to protect your mod 510 port, wearing the heatsink instead, but those can introduce extra resistance and you need to correct for that in the mod firmware (not all mods expose that resistance offset parameter) It's important as the mod+heatsink resistance is a fixed value which should be subtracted from the variable resistance of the heater to perform proper temperature control.
So to wipe or not to wipe? That is the question!
The problem is usually solved by having wiping contacts. That's what is supposed to happen when you unscrew and screw your atty back again. So far so good, but here's where it becomes tricky: these 510 ports, especially on cheap Chinese mods, tend to be crappy and wear super easily. This is why many people in the e-cig world will recommend you to dedicate one mod to one atty, so the threads don't wear too fast (and when the 510 port is worn, it develops other kinds of bad contact resistance, the one on my evic VTC primo took less than a couple of months to become unusable with some of my attys for instance)
You can also use 510 heatsinks / extenders to protect your mod 510 port, wearing the heatsink instead, but those can introduce extra resistance and you need to correct for that in the mod firmware (not all mods expose that resistance offset parameter) It's important as the mod+heatsink resistance is a fixed value which should be subtracted from the variable resistance of the heater to perform proper temperature control.
So to wipe or not to wipe? That is the question!
tennisguru1
EXCELSIOR!
You're so right on there "K", since I got my 2 DNAc mods atty's that were unusable for TC (I thought) jump out to wattage on my Mirage & Therion SS 510 connection, they are now all spot on perfect & stay in TC on all my atty's.
So , are you saying that if I scratch or scoff up the copper & brass ones I can get them
back to read & operate correctly?
I've already sold off half my Junketech Mods at 1/2 price to those who just pulse in wattage mode & guess and pray. *very skillful souls, lol
Once you get a real accurate mod with modern chipset & awesome software, you realize
what a waste of time & it wasn't you more than half the time.
If you think AF fixes that junk, sorry it's just a patch , get an Evolve /Escribe combo
with replay and stop beating yourself up & enjoy more taste & efficient product use.
Well, That didn't last too long. I'm down and out again. Any good starting points for trying to trouble shoot this thing? I have no tools with me, but will play when i get home. I guess just take it all apart, clean, resemble?
looney2nz
Research Geek, Mad Scientist
I wouldn't disassemble the ceramic rod heaters, I'd soak it in ISO or ethanol, tighten everything and do a burn off to rid yourself of the ISO. Otherwise you'll end up breaking leads from moving them too much.
Doesn't hurt to keep a spare heater around (I've got spares for all my DT equipment).
There's enough play in mine where I can see the bucket rock a little bit when I'm wiping down with ethanol, so be sure you've allowed enough play in your wire bends to accomodate the movement of the bucket so it doesn't break a lead from too much tension. And I wiped down EVERYTHING with ethanol on the QQ, the mouthpiece, the bucket, the contact posts and o-rings on the heat exchanger, just to keep oil out of critical contact points and raising resistance that way.
Is it possible you let it get REALLY hot? Where you see the ceramic rods under the bucket glowing red?
THAT can end up with a 'no atomizer found' message as well
I wouldn't disassemble the ceramic rod heaters, I'd soak it in ISO or ethanol, tighten everything and do a burn off to rid yourself of the ISO. Otherwise you'll end up breaking leads from moving them too much.
Doesn't hurt to keep a spare heater around (I've got spares for all my DT equipment).
There's enough play in mine where I can see the bucket rock a little bit when I'm wiping down with ethanol, so be sure you've allowed enough play in your wire bends to accomodate the movement of the bucket so it doesn't break a lead from too much tension. And I wiped down EVERYTHING with ethanol on the QQ, the mouthpiece, the bucket, the contact posts and o-rings on the heat exchanger, just to keep oil out of critical contact points and raising resistance that way.
Is it possible you let it get REALLY hot? Where you see the ceramic rods under the bucket glowing red?
THAT can end up with a 'no atomizer found' message as well
Well, a few hours after I posted that it quit working, I got it working again. I didn't have any small tools, so all i could do was work on the center big screw. i don't want to over tighten and break something, but i was able to get another little bit of a turn before feeling like i was going to tight. I put it back on the mod and it has worked fine for a few days now. I'm back to loving it again.
I dont want to mess with little screws, specially now that its working. I will however give it a good cleaning.
question... is it ok to completely submerge unit is bag of iso?
as for do i think i got it too hot? No, i dont think so. I didn't even know the coils changed color until you told me and even then i had to check it in the dark. i actually think i am a low temp guy. i like the tasty hits. using your settings, i like to let off button once it starts smoking and then no heat until next hit. first hit i usually start hitting it about 350-375. i hardly even let it bubble much. no splatter ever. it doesn't even look like its dirty, but i have cleaned the cap a time or two.
Matt and i have emailed a few times and he mentioned ohms? no one has ever asked me what my ohm was. i always just locked it in the settings when creating the profile. I use articfox because i use a ecig tank as well and those little pre filled carts. I just started to get back into the waxes past 30 days. I have a "Matt" and a "Looney" profile. Matts setting were the first i was using but i wanna stay on the low side. Fernand is my third profile, but i haven't played with that much.
Thanks, Cody