Wet or Dry?

[Ace of Space]

@kellya86, i'm not completely sure of what you mean by snotty reclaim, but from what i'm reading i understand that you vape herb and oil/hash, right?
I find that when i dab or vape bubble, i see little spots (snot?) of reclaim appearing in my bubbler, and when i vape herb, it's more of an even, slow build up, that eventually, as it grows, gets the same, golden/brown color as the snotty looking pieces.
My guess is that that is because the concentration of actives in the bubble/oil vapor is higher than that of herb vapor and therefore somehow condensing easier in the bubbler. (i use warm, not hot water)

You can clean your bubbler daily with hot water for any particles, and the reclaim just stays there.
Clean that with iso, and maybe make shatter, butter, or something like that. (i never done that)

 

[kellya86]

@Ace of Space I vape mainly flower, from what I can tell there is 2 types of reclaim, the inevitable slow build up on the centre stem in the bubbler, and the random snotty shit that seems to end up on the sides of the bubbler, the latter is the one I don't like...

I just want to know exactly what it is, and how it's caused, so I can avoid it, as I know this is possible...

The majority of people voted that they use water, so someone must know...

@CuckFumbustion ???
@OF ???

 

[Nugg]

@kellya86 I think the best way to keep your piece clean is to use an inline filter, cranberry extract and hot rinse your bong every night.

Check out the rez block thread for more info about cranberry extract.

 

[kellya86]

Thanks @Nugg , iv been looking into cranberry extract... but I'd use loads of it as I empty my water and refill with hot after every basket..
I only ever do one basket per session, so water is cool by the time I come back to it..

It's nice to know how to keep it clean, but I want to know what causes the problem in the first place...

 

[CuckFumbustion]

@Ace of Space I vape mainly flower, from what I can tell there is 2 types of reclaim, the inevitable slow build up on the centre stem in the bubbler, and the random snotty shit that seems to end up on the sides of the bubbler, the latter is the one I don't like...

I just want to know exactly what it is, and how it's caused, so I can avoid it, as I know this is possible...

The majority of people voted that they use water, so someone must know...

@CuckFumbustion ???
@OF ???

Flower +1. Still consider myself very new to water, Wish I had more to offer. But knew of several poor design choices from my combustion days. Some so desperate of being unique, that it helped with my skepticism of certain designs for 'vapor bongs'.
Smaller bits...
As a trend. The d020-d is the becoming equivalent of the tube bong for vapor, I've noticed. BTW.
Whip is good for getting all things good. Water can allow you to play with the draw speed, diffusion etc.

Still new to reclaim. It is a wide subject. But when design is concerned, any pinching of corners and edges, and narrow throat ways seem collect more. (I have a theory brewing for another discussion.) Reclaim likes to stick to glass and tight corners in general. In a water piece it gets wet slides collects and forms poo or in one piece I had barnacles.
I think the crystals and salts attach to each other and bond. This might even be a type of glass thing? Soda glass? (Sorry, another discussion.)
ISO or ISO and sea salt are TIME are good for simple cleaning. Some use ISO (and TIME no salt) so they can get reclaim, Others say they can detect a bad chemically taste. Perhaps to evaporation method or concentration? But there is some discussion on that on the appropriate threads.

Had some glass tubes with a 2mm pathway. Over only a few short skinny straw draws. Globs of soft amber jelly would collect. Could fish it out with a toothpick. It all seemed of the plant cell mass extraction. The cell walls break from the heat, the pulps is pulledpushed by say a fan or a draw.
Would like this to carry over to making essential oils.

Until I know more, rez block or cranberry extracts are suspect.
What would clean well and be a food safe (and reclaim safe) alternative is my question? Some sort of citrus? An Essential Oil? How about something that compliments the flowers? Or something that has no taste or aftertaste? Or a single drop of white vinegar? Would there be less risk, If I were accustomed to emptying and refilling daily?

 

[kellya86]

@CuckFumbustion thanks for the reply...

I don't think adding additives to the water is the answer, I believe that is covering the problem, not finding the source and understanding it...

Once I understand it, then I can think about suitable additives....

I was planning to get some snotty reclaim last night, and put it under scope to start, but sods law, the one time you want it, wouldn't happen...
Vaped 3 baskets and it was still clean....
Why????

Was it caus I swapped out the water for fresh/hot, everytime???

Is it purely condensation of actives collecting...

I will do the same 3 baskets tonight, but in room temp water, and see...

 

[Pyr0]

The clumps of crap n snot (lol) in watertools are just condensed reclaim (actives)
Cold water will condense more of it
I used to use rezblock, but don't bother anymore. I don't even rinse my glass everyday.
I just run some hot water & PBW through it every now n then and it comes up sparkling.

 

[kellya86]

So all the time that iv been suggesting that water robs the actives, people assured me that there was no noticeable actives lost...

No body ever mentioned this snotty stuff...

So basicly, it's looking like I was right all along... and water does hold active compounds that have condensed....meaning weaker vapour, as I have noticed... ????

 

[Pyr0]

I certainly don't get weaker vapour.
I actually get thicker denser vapour because I wouldn't be able to take thick hits like that if I used my vapes dry.

The small amount that builds up in my watertool doesn't worry me, but I used to combust in a bong anyway so I'm used to build up appearing on glass over time.
When combusting the build up was even worse - dark brown & tarry eww lol

 

[h3rbalist]

But doesn't vaping through anything 'rob' actives?

Any long vapour path will collect resins.


A whip, coil, stem... whatever, you'll still need to clean it every now and then.


If you are experiencing weak hits I'd look at your vape first.

I found there to be more build up if there is a spec of avb for the resin to attach to.

As for putting warm water in everytime you hit, man that's dedication.

It takes me a couple mins to clean and dry my bub every time I fill it so i stopped with the hot water thing and just use room temp RO/di which I highly recommend.

 

[kellya86]

I understand that because it's not as dry, you can take more, meaning you get higher...
But this is not my experience, I will get higher from the same equivalent load, dry...

Also I believe the reason you can take more isn't just due to the moisture, I believe that the main reason vapour is irritating, is due to the thc and other cannabinoids...and filtering through water removes an amount of these actives making it more bearable in large amounts...

So I believe through water you are taking more, but it's equivalent activities levels are lower, ???

@h3rbalist I'm not getting weak hits, I can milk the shit out of it...I just feel water takes more product to get me high compared to dry...

Maybe I'll use my grow room water and see if that helps...

 

[Pyr0]

I understand that because it's not as dry, you can take more, meaning you get higher...
But this is not my experience, I will get higher from the same equivalent load, dry...

Also I believe the reason you can take more isn't just due to the moisture, I believe that the main reason vapour is irritating, is due to the thc and other cannabinoids...and filtering through water removes an amount of these actives making it more bearable in large amounts...

So I believe through water you are taking more, but it's equivalent activities levels are lower, ???

Possibly so, but I love my dense lung busting (thc irritating) hits as they suit my high tolerance
A good one will leave me coughing and breathless for a few good mins lol

It's the throat irritation that water helps for me, not the lung irritation.
Hitting my vapes dry, (even with plenty of water to drink) often leaves my throat feeling raw which then prevents me from vaping as much

 

[kellya86]

Iv never had lung irritation from vaping, only throat...
I like vaping dry, I love the breathless, gasping for air feeling, i get from a nice big hit, wet or dry...

I know I'll lose actives along the way, whatever I do...
But least in the whip and wand, it don't look so disgusting, and is easier to clean...

At the moment my main method is to vape wet when I first get in, to ease my throat into it, then I give it a rinse and vape dry all night....

It's nice to have the bubbler for dabbing and what not... but I much prefer dry....
Better taste...
Better effects...
Less maintenence...

 

[Pyr0]

Thats why I think its so great we have so many vapes (and accessories)
It's all down to individual preference.
People like different things and with so much variety, it allows everyone to enjoy different aspects.

I just wish it was cheaper to find the method you prefer rather than having to buy so much gear lol

 

[h3rbalist]

Iv never had lung irritation from vaping, only throat...
I like vaping dry, I love the breathless, gasping for air feeling, i get from a nice big hit, wet or dry...

I know I'll lose actives along the way, whatever I do...
But least in the whip and wand, it don't look so disgusting, and is easier to clean...

At the moment my main method is to vape wet when I first get in, to ease my throat into it, then I give it a rinse and vape dry all night....

It's nice to have the bubbler for dabbing and what not... but I much prefer dry....
Better taste...
Better effects...
Less maintenence...

That's funny because my oil rig I use dry and only water filter my herb vaper because of the fine particles that seem to make me cough and give me more buildup inside my bubbler.

Fyi I cough more vaping herb than oils.

At this point can we clarify your beef?

Poor taste? Weak vapor? High maintenance?

Nore of these are issues for me and my setup and I'm thinking your problem is your vape.

Edit
When you say 'dry' do you mean same setup but without water in bubbler?

 

[Pyr0]

Maybe I'll use my grow room water and see if that helps...

lol
Recently I've been using some leftover 'ultra pure h2o' water I purchased for use in my PC watercooling loop.
It's distilled then filtered through 10, 5, 1 micron stages, before 5 & 1 micron carbon filters, 3 reverse osmisis filters, 4 DI polishing filters and a UV treatment

Nicest water I've ever tasted lol and I can't stand drinking plain water of any kind

 

[throwawaytre3s]

I typically just use cold spring water, and dump it out after the session. It's easy enough to refill it. I haven't ever had a piece go funky or anything on me, although my hammer pipe has gotten pretty gross before. Nothing a quick ISO and Epsom salt wash wouldn't fix though. I had a d020-d for a week or so, but my friend knocked it over before I ever had a chance to even need to clean it. I have a new one coming though, soon, and I'm hoping my usual maintenance routine of emptying every use, and cleaning once a week or so with iso will work. That birdcage perc must be a pain to clean with salt, so I probably won't use any salt.

I was sick a few weeks ago with the flu, as was my girlfriends brother. We both vaped a few bags from the EQ (I've posted photos of this setup in other threads, it's just the MFLB UFO connected to the bag mouthpiece from the EQ, alternatively, you can connect it directly to the stem) through my UFO using warm water. It was beautiful for my throat and nose, it felt great, and got us toasty.

 

[I'm Ron Burgundy?]

dry vaping can be harsh...too hot, more particulates going into your mouth and smaller hits. This is why I vape through water virtually every time. Never noticed any potency difference or lessening of flavor whatsoever.
When I broke my WPA a few weeks back I was forced to dry vape....made me realize how much water helps the whole experience.
Really wouldn't be concerned with losing potency through water.

 

[throwawaytre3s]

Really wouldn't be concerned with losing potency through water.

That's Chem I right there. Almost all (possibly all? I don't know for certain), of the actives from cannabis that we want, are fat soluble and not water soluble. Unless you're vaping through hot whole milk (ugh, even typing that sounds terribly gross), it isn't a concern. Vapor condensation though is, but not enough to be a concern about loss of effects. That's what we reclaim from our stems anyway though, and happens regardless of vaping through water. So yeah, there is no potency loss through water.

 

[kellya86]

Just because the majority of cannabinoids are fat soluble, doesn't mean they are immune to being trapped by the water....

The fact that this snotty shit happens, is surely proof that you do lose actives in the water, otherwise what is it????
If I was to test it, are you saying t would contain zero actives????

Is it emulsified??? Like when the head gasket on your car goes, oil and water mix and emulsify...

This is my main question, I want to know what it is, and how to stop it...
I don't have weak or bad tasting vapour...
But science tells me that something is going on here, I think to say there is no potency loss, without evidence, is possible misleading...

I'm really surprised there is no definitive answer here, why has no body figured this out yet..

 

[Pyr0]

I think I know what you're talking about..
I don't really bother reclaiming, but I have two types in my hydratube.
In the bottom section which is away from the water, it is the usual golden brown, translucent, syrupy stuff.
In the top section where it comes into contact with the water, it is more opaque & emulsified.

Rezblock or cranberry can make your glass non stick to prevent build up, but then all your snotty bits are floating in the water all the time instead

 

[throwawaytre3s]

Just because the majority of cannabinoids are fat soluble, doesn't mean they are immune to being trapped by the water....

The fact that this snotty shit happens, is surely proof that you do lose actives in the water, otherwise what is it????
If I was to test it, are you saying t would contain zero actives????

You may not find actives, but it's entirely possible that it's a buildup of nonactives. I couldn't find anything on the plant waxes from cannabis, but I do know carnauba wax has one of the highest melting points for a natural wax, and it's only 90C. I think it's entirely possible that carrying with it, in the vapor, is some type of nonactive plant material, like whatever waxes the cannabis plant secretes. That would also explain the snotty texture of the waxes clumping together and not dissolving the water. This is entirely just a theory, but it seems plausible.

 

[Pyr0]

I'm sure the stuff in contact with the water is just emulsified as @kellya86 alluded to earlier.

I think it's a bit like rosin turning waxier/into budder if there's too much moisture left in the plant or when left out in a humid atmosphere

 

[MinnBobber]

This is my main question, I want to know what it is, and how to stop it...
I don't have weak or bad tasting vapour...
But science tells me that something is going on here, I think to say there is no potency loss, without evidence, is possible misleading...

I'm really surprised there is no definitive answer here, why has no body figured this out yet..

.....................................................................................................
I'd say your water goop has to be a combo of herb particles and/or oil (condensed or emulsified vapor).

Potency loss thru water: it appears in my experience to be minimal. More resin seems to collect on the glass surface. Water does seem to collect (thankfully) herb particles that are carried upstream--as do the the glass walls as the resin is resin PLUS herbage.

An inline hemp filter placed 1/2" from the vape chamber seems to collect a small amount of resin and a large amount of herb particles. Water stays 10X cleaner. Glass still collects resin over time but it is 10X better looking resin as it's almost pure oils with almost zero particles.

Degummed hemp or organic cotton filter help the vape experience, thru water or without water, IMO