'The Misty Log' - DIY wooden Log Vaporizer

[Abysmal Vapor]

@blokenoname Actually i have already tried this but i prefer having few rings at the bottom for better stability,just to note that the rings i have fit tightly the tube,no need of retaining clip on top.It is exactly the way it was done in my Wychwood vaporizer.
Have you gotten around trying to make threads on the tube,i recall you mention you got a thread cutter tool ?
I am no fan of Teflon,so this is a step up for in your design just form my point of view ,keep it up !
Do you get you retaining clips online ? What material are they ,any specified grade SS ?

 

[blokenoname]

@blokenoname Actually i have already tried this but i prefer having few rings at the bottom for better stability,just to note that the rings i have fit tightly the tube,no need of retaining clip on top.It is exactly the way it was done in my Wychwood vaporizer.
Have you gotten around trying to make threads on the tube,i recall you mention you got a thread cutter tool ?
I am no fan of Teflon,so this is a step up for in your design just form my point of view ,keep it up !
Do you get you retaining clips online ? What material are they ,any specified grade SS ?

Got the clips from Landefeld.de via Amazon:
https://www.landefeld.de/gruppe/en/safety-rings-i-for-boreholes-din-472/472-8

They come in either common spring steel (the black ones) or stainless 1.4122 (no AISI designation). Got me a pack of both.
https://www.nicromal.de/en/stainless-steel/1-4122/43

I actually just found a 28 mm OD washer with a fitting 9 mm ID, which would fit the heating tube perfectly, while still being wide enough to fit the 30 mm bore of the wood, so that I could dispense with the additional smaller M8 washer then and make the design even more simple. Thing is, that I don't think I want to actually do that, as the smaller M8 washer provides a much smaller surface area in direct contact with the wooden bottom of the bore, than having a big 28 mm washer in direct contact with the wood there.

The clip ring's purpose there is also primarily in fastening the whole core arrangement to the log's body (fulfilling the function of the two screws now, that held down/fast the teflon washer and heater cover before), while at the same time providing enough pressure onto the M8 washer below the bigger 30 mm washer, to stabilise the heater cover. Once I set the core in and fasten it with the clip ring, brute force alone is not enough to twist or move it or to get it out again. You'd need clip ring pliers for that. So stability isn't a concern here for now, even with two washers instead of just one. Those clips provide an enormous force, when they expand again after setting in. I tried a #32 instead of the #30 clip before that, which resulted in me first cracked body, as the pressure radiating outward from the too large clip ring there was already more, than the thin wooden sleeve could stand

Nah. Didn't get a thread cutter yet, nor a flaring tool, as cutting threads wasn't really needed so far and the heating tube's steel is so thin (0,3 mm), that it can be easily flared out a bit, by just fastening it within a vice and then forcefully twisting some needle nose pliers within the end to get flared

 

[blokenoname]

So.... one Mahogany High Mass Core with a 7w cartridge (@Megaton) and one Mahogany Standard Core with a 7w Ohmite resistor (@brainiac) coming along nicely... but as other things came up yesterday, I'll need the weekend for burning them in and extensive scientific testing, so that shipping is delayed till Monday, folks

Hope, you can live with that

 

[Megaton]

I also very much believe in extensive scientific testing!

Cant wait to try out the new High Mass Core!

 

[blokenoname]

Because.... science

 

[virtualpurple]

Lol, I’m a jealous yankee over here! As usual, this is one of my top threads to date and I can’t wait to hear the feedback roll in from the fine testers!

 

[blokenoname]

So... quite a productive weekend, it has been

Both the two beta units are ready 'n willing to go, and at least for me own taste, I think they turned out quite beautiful The mahogany-sapele is a really gorgeous wood for those little loggies

Heaters soldered in;
Multi-tip-size bushing and debris screen installed;
Bottom sealed up with a natural cork plug and covered with a layer of wine red felt, to provide a bit more grip on the table top;
Log bodies sanded and waxed!

In the pipeline are also fitting bottom caps, that can come either in the same wood as the log itself, or be made from a different colored wood, to provide some contrast, but this is no job for my heavy jigsaw and I also need some smaller diameter screws there.

@brainiac

The resistor in yours comes in a bit on the hot side of 20 ohm, and when fed directly from an unregulated wall wart (w/o vvps or dimmer), which usually turns out 12,2v - 12,4v, churns out a whopping 7,3w to 7,4w already, which can easily combust your load, if you're not careful.
I find it satisfying set to a 12,0v straight, with a vvps, the resistor turning out a comfortable 6,8w then. With your inline dimmer for the UD, you've to experiment a bit there, as it might well be, that when set to its max, it already turns out the straight 12,0v desired, because the dimmer itself eats up a few tenths of volts for himself. If this proves too hot still, I'd start with the dimmer set to maybe 8h, and then work my way up from there, as these potentiometers are most effective within the 1/2 of the dial, while in the latter half, the voltage change is only in the decimal places, till it reaches max. But guess, this is the same with the UD.

Your loggie is also the first unit, I had to cut the heater cover for from ss tubing, ordered from a different steel outlet than my usual one, and which has a wall thickness of about 0,5 mm, i.e. 0,2 mm more, than my usual 0,3 mm ss tubing. Means: the 8 mm ss tips will fit quite snugly into the heater port. If you've problems getting the tip in all the way, just pretend slowly screwing it in or out
Have to widen the top end of that thicker steel tubing a bit more next time. But should work for you, as is.

@Megaton

Yours is a true beast, with the cartridge heater in that high mass core
Even at a 12,0v straight from the vvps, it churns out a monstrous 7,8w
So I'd start the serious scientific testing at about 11,6v, which gives you a comfortable 6,8v. You might even consider going a notch down from there, once the core temps have stabilized
I made the unit about 1 cm longer, than my usual 9 cm hight, to increase surface area for excess heat dissipation, as the HMC units can get real hot to the touch. That way, the body's hot spot is about 1/3 down from the top, where the large top washer touches the wood and the air intake is located. Above and below that spot, the body is just comfortable warm
Due to the air intake in the HMC units being confined mainly to the small air gap, between top washer and heating tube, they've also a bit more of a draw resistance, which I find quite satisfying personally

Oh... and if something rattles now and then, that's just the bushing on-top of the heater port, which I gave a more loose fit, so that folks can remove it for use with my own glass stems and GonGs I'm still working on, which will only slide directly over the 9 mm inner heater tube. So if it becomes loose, just give it a twist till it's snug again, when the log is cold.

Go both out tomorrow! Enjoy

 

[KeroZen]

Out of curiosity, what is the time from cold to operational with 7.8W?

 

[blokenoname]

Out of curiosity, what is the time from cold to operational with 7.8W?

I can not say actually, as this is the first unit with the latest modified (high mass) core and body design that has a cartridge heater (the first two I made had the resistor and took their 15-20 minutes) and I didn't pay attention while it was heating up. When I came back to it 10-15 minutes later, it was already humming along and ready.
I'll measure it for you later on, as I wanted to heat it up one more time tomorrow anyway, before I send it out.

But with the cartridge in there, you can speed up heat-up time for the HMC units considerably anyway, using it with a stronger PS in combination with a vvps or buck. Just set it to 13v or 13,5v or maybe even 14v temporarily (careful with the wood here), as it's a 24v/30w cartridge, so that you've plenty of reserve then to apply more heat whenever need be. Just need to remember to dial the temps back down below 12v, once it has reached op temps and don't get a PS with more than 15v.

The standard core (SC) units with the resistor are operational within somewhere under 10 minutes. Say 7 or 8 or so, but I give them 15 minutes anyway, for best results. As a rule of thumb: just wait, till the wooden shell starts feeling warm to the touch.

 

[KeroZen]

A ballpark figure is enough, don't worry.

I was curious because you see, I'm using quite a lot of on demand convection vapes, and it appears anywhere between 20W and 40W is ample enough for that application, even for elephant lungs users. I'm around 30W most of the time for instance and a lot of other users seem to be too.

So with just some extra power and a trigger... and of course a different heater with less inertia... well, you could have nearly instant vapor in your log too, and on demand, without having to worry about heat build up or wood charring etc.

Yeah yeah I know easier said than done. But a coil is all you need after all.

 

[Megaton]

Whoop! Looking forward to trying out the new high mass core! And as it gets colder i really appreciate warming my hands on a log, i get the feeling the high mass will keep me toasty!

 

[brainiac]

I'd start with the dimmer set to maybe 8h, and then work my way up from there

OK, start with dimmer set for 8 o'clock - got that.
As well as the dimmer I use a 2 meter extension lead which I understand also lowers the voltage reaching the unit. Dimmer for UD is set at about 11:30 which gives me the mid-brown abv that I tend to aim for (abv usually gets qwiso'd at some point so I've no need to thrash it).

The mahogany-sapele is a really gorgeous wood for those little loggies

Yer absolutely right, mate. Can't wait to get my hands on it

I can’t wait to hear the feedback roll in from the fine testers!

I'll be working overtime on it, I assure you

Atb ppl

 

[blokenoname]

@Megaton @brainiac

Sorry mates! Had a business meeting this afternoon, that took a whooping 3 hours, instead of the mere hour, I had planned for it. And as Mr. Procrastination here told himself the whole day long, that he had more than enough time left after the meeting had concluded, to go and take your betas to the post office across the street... well. Didn't exactly work out that way, as it was already 20h over here by then
So... tomorrow morning it is then! Don't shoot me!

Whoop! Looking forward to trying out the new high mass core! And as it gets colder i really appreciate warming my hands on a log, i get the feeling the high mass will keep me toasty!

Oh.. no worries there The HMC unit will make a good little hand warmer
And with a bit of luck, it'll still arrive in time for extensive weekend testing

OK, start with dimmer set for 8 o'clock - got that.
As well as the dimmer I use a 2 meter extension lead which I understand also lowers the voltage reaching the unit. Dimmer for UD is set at about 11:30 which gives me the mid-brown abv that I tend to aim for (abv usually gets qwiso'd at some point so I've no need to thrash it).

Yup. From my experience, you'll loose about 0,1v/meter with the extension, due to rising resistance with length. And the dimmer itself also needs a small fraction of the input voltage, to do its thing. Around 8h is nevertheless a good starting point, as with that little diamond shaped pwm dimmer you mentioned, you have most of the voltage range (say from 4v to about 11v) already within the first 1/2 half of the dial, while from about 6h onwards, the voltage only changes in fractions. So you'll be around something like 11,5v or so at 8h and 11,7 at 10h and so on, till it settles at around 12v at max. But that's all a bit dependent on your PS, as they all vary a bit in their initial voltage output. Some read at 12,4v. Some at 12,2v.. some even at a mere 11,9v. So it's a bit of trial and error.

I found a neat little buck converter with a digital display showing voltage (and current) output a few weeks ago, that's about the same size of the dimmer mentioned above, costs about EUR 15,-, and can be easily fitted with two DC jack/terminal block adapters (about 1,- EUR for each), so that like with the dimmer, you can then plug in the PS on one end and the extension cord on the other end. Much much more comfortable in adjusting temps, than the dimmers
I'll look for a link later on.

So with just some extra power and a trigger... and of course a different heater with less inertia... well, you could have nearly instant vapor in your log too, and on demand, without having to worry about heat build up or wood charring etc.

Yeah yeah I know easier said than done. But a coil is all you need after all.

Well, frankly speaking... personally I find the idea of an on demand desktop log, you've to power up for each and every session, not very appealing. On the one hand, it fucks with the simple aesthetic of the log design, adding another layer of complication, which means adding more things that can break. I'll need a push button that can cope with some current, probably different gauge wiring and of course a low mass/high wattage heater, like a mesh heater or an e-ciggie type coil, which do not exactly shine in the longevity department, AFAIK.

With a power consumption of a mere 7w/hour, akin to what a classic non-LED night light eats up, I also see no real improvement in the economics department there . If you run it for a straight 10 hours (70w/day) on 365 days, you're at about 25kWh/year, which at a price of ~ EUR 0,30/kWh, will cost you not even EUR 7,50/year.

Heat build up and wood charring is also more or less a non issue, as long as you go for a lightweight open core design, like with the HI, but also still manageable with the semi closed high mass core units, once you get the hang of it.

For a semi portable, or rather portable/desktop hybrid, like Alan's iHeat, the on demand idea makes sense even when used plugged into the PS, as that comes with a mesh heater anyway, that is optimised for running short sessions from a 510 box mod, but would probably vaporise itself in no time, should you try to run it non stop from the PS, like a classic log. So making the plug in base for that on demand too, is only the natural consequence there.

Edit: Thinking about it again and disregarding the classic log design with the steel core for the moment, which I had in mind when reading your comment first... something like a desktop/plug in Splinter comes to mind
Or rather a typical log body, with an all glass airpath/core, 18 mm female heater port and powered by a coil heater, set into some kind of suitable RDA, it's 510 connec then soldered to the logs wiring for DC input from the PS and of course a kind of switch/button, to fire it up. I did a unit with an 18 mm all glass airpath/core like that a few pages back (should be a pic there too), but finally gave up on it, as the 18 mm glass air path is simply too wide for a low powered resistor or cartridge, to heat up the passing air volume sufficiently, while with the high powered 40w or 50w cartridges, you're already at the brink of glowing the cartridge, to get sufficient heat there, while heat distribution across the full width of the bowl is still not ideal, due to the tiny diameter of the cartridge.

So, this is something, where your idea might shine and that I would be interested in to try
Are there any ready made coils for something like this?

 

[Abysmal Vapor]

@blokenoname I have successfully managed to make few coil heaters for logs ,after having the idea of making my own ceramic resistors with SS wire.It gets redhot with 12v6.5A supply,but it is not really an instant thing . Sofar i am enountering two major problems with it. There is too much heat projected to the leads or 510 (have tried both) in continuous operation. The second one is in order to get it instantly up to vaping temps ,i need to shoot a lot of amps to it and if i had to power it with a PSU i will need like 10-15 amps and those a bit bulky to my liking to be honest.Anyway i am waiting for the 120w 12v to arrive so i can test if it is going to be enough. Eventually i might reduce the coil size,but will it be able to achieve vaporization without a glow this is yet to be found.
Anyway i am quite determined to make self designed either some like a DIY resistor,cartridge or simply a bare coil and will share about it if i get any breaktrough ).

 

[blokenoname]

It gets redhot with 12v6.5A supply,but it is not really an instant thing . Sofar i am enountering two major problems with it. There is too much heat projected to the leads or 510 (have tried both) in continuous operation. The second one is in order to get it instantly up to vaping temps ,i need to shoot a lot of amps to it and if i had to power it with a PSU i will need like 10-15 amps and those a bit bulky to my liking to be honest.

Well.. figures, I'd say, when you look at the math and experience from experiments with the portable. Drawing 10-15 amps at 12v would mean a resistance between 0,8 to 1,2 ohm, resulting in something between 120 and 180w as an output, which would be beyond good and evil in any case . This rather calls for a bit higher resitance and lower voltage, I'd say.

What's the upper resistance range for ready made coils anyway, if I don't want to fiddle with building minuscule coils myself? From what I see in my portable with the 40 or 50w cartridge, I'd rather think of something within a 2 and 3 ohm range, with about 6 to 9v applied, to aim at maybe 20-25w output as a reasonable take off point for on demand, which would mean currents around 2-3 amps, which looks more doable. With DC input voltage, we're not glued to 12v PSUs either. There are tons of 6v, 7v, 9v etc. PSUs available there with the needed amperage between 2-3A, which can be used, once yo've settled for suitable wattage output, so that you could dispense then with a vvps and run it directly from the wall for on demand, just closing the circuit with the switch for firing it up, like in a portable.

@KeroZen What coils does The Project utilise there?

 

[Megaton]

@blokenoname no worries here mate, ill just clear my diary and prime myself for some serious scientific experimentation over the weekend!

 

[blokenoname]

@blokenoname no worries here mate, ill just clear my diary and prime myself for some serious scientific experimentation over the weekend!

Juuust in the process of wrapping them up here

 

[blokenoname]

Evening!

Both betas on their way

Also tore down the spruce body prototype for the new HMC (high mass core) design, I made ten days ago, to check on actual charring and wood degradation. Unit has been up and running at 12,3v since then for at least 10 hours/day.

Well... I'd say, 'hardly any' is the operative term here!

And as this is with the super soft spruce... guess we won't see much problems in that area with the hardwoods too

I'll transfer the innards into a new beech body now, I made alongside the new mahogany betas

 

[brainiac]

Both betas on their way

@Megaton incoming

 

[Megaton]

@brainiac whoooop! Gotta love vapemail from @blokenoname!

 

[blokenoname]

@Megaton incoming

@brainiac whoooop! Gotta love vapemail from @blokenoname!

Enjoy


Meanwhile, the spruce prototype's guts reincarnated successfully into a MistyBeech HMC body... which I'll now be putting to some serious

 

[brainiac]

The Misty has landed
Plugged in, heating up and looking good .
A lovely piece of work matenoname .
Now, time to get busy on the testing .
Will report initial results soon

My main computer's in the workshop until next week so I can't post pictures atm.

 

[Megaton]

Whoop! Mine has arrived today too! Heating up ahead of tonights extremely scientific testing!

This little loggie is gorgeous! Will report back late tonight when iv spent some quality time with it!

 

[blokenoname]

@Megaton @brainiac

Great news!
Hope, you'll enjoy the ride

ETA: Meanwhile, I was playing around a bit with an alternative (non wooden) take on the 510 portable last night and ended up with this neat and simple steel&glass body design, simply utilizing the housing of the Velocitx base itself and an inline 14/18 mm adapter to put the cartridge heater and ss heater cover into.

Tech specs are unchanged:
50w/2,8ohm heater cartridge
Best for use in VW mode at 22w
Preheat time of about 50 secs from stone cold
Then use like any on demand vape, just holding the firing button when taking draws or need be.
Can be used with the standard Nylon stems/NonGs and 8 mm ss tips or your Vapcaps.

 

[ubardog]

@Megaton @brainiac

Soooooo!?? Whats ya inital thoughts its been 4 days now ?