The Magic-Flight Launch Box (Beta)

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magicflight

Manufacturer
Manufacturer
Hi,

Introducing one of our new products: The Magic-Flight Launch Box. This product aims to be a fast, convenient, portable vaporizer, and is currently in beta test (not yet released). For members of the FC community who are beta testers and who may have comments about this product, please post here.

-- Magic-Flight.com

PS: Moderators/operators of the FC site; can you please move posts regarding the Launch Box from the Launch Tube thread to here (and re-open the Launch Tube thread)? Thanks in advance!

mod note: Thread reopened. Posts can't be moved. Anyone wanting to copy/paste a post from the Tube thread to here is welcome to do so.
 
magicflight,

Beezleb

Well-Known Member
The Magic Flight Launch Box
(brought over from other MF thread)

I would say this is a great vape to compare mainly with any lighter based portable vape such as the vapor genie and I would compare it to the vapir oxygen at the far end to the ubie on the low end.

I have to say it is a very good solid little vape that should appeal to those who are looking for a vape to bridge small gaps of time between a desktop or home vaporizer.

The construction is simple and should not have breakage issues as other more complicated portable vapes have.

It also is a very fast vape to use, generally in the time frame it takes one to smoke a bowl or smoke a joint. It also has very little to barely noticeable smell and it is totally silent. Do not expect much visible vapor but it does get you where you want to be.

Any where you may smoke a joint, bowl, cigarette or whatnot you can use the launch box. I fit mine in an eyeglass case with a zipper, it holds everything perfectly or it can easily fit into a pocket. I recommend grinding your weed fine.

Keep in mind this is not a desktop/home vape such as PD, DBV, Vaporwarez, Vapor Bros, SSV etc. To think of it along those lines is to make an incorrect comparison.

For those in the market for a quick inexpensive, functional portable vape that can be easily used in outdoor and indoor locations this little box just might be the magic you are looking for. It is with confidence that I recommend the magic flight launch box in that respect.

Sincerely,
Beezleb
 

stickstones

Vapor concierge
I used it last night and really enjoyed it. I must have gotten about 8 or 9 hits off it, similar to the results I get with the Iolite. Henny, I was unable to get much for visible vapor, but the effect was definitely there in spades. The manual states to try and get a swirl of vapor in the box for maximum effect. I was unable to get this, as I didn't see much vapor. The vapor I got was light and wispy, and I got a little bit of vapor leakage from somewhere, but not enough to matter. I used up one load over the course of about ten minutes and 8 or 9 hits with one battery.

Things I like:
--It is small as shit! This thing just might get lost in my pocket!
--I love using the whip and watching the herb vaporize...getting darker, etc.
--It's the first vape I've used that got me whacked without much visible vapor (this may be user error), and I've had in the back of my mind the chase for invisible but effective vapor.
--This design is simple like the Launch Tube (LT), but has a refined feel that takes it out of the science project category, imo.

I don't have anything negative to say yet...it does what it should.

I treated it a little like a VG in that I kept stirring the herbs between hits. It's easy to stir with either a shake or a draw through the chamber. This I like better than the VG because you can see your herb stirring and moving, getting into position for the next hit. I like the visual feedback. The ability to see the herb and move it like this (and its size) just might put it at the front of my portable lineup...but I don't want to get ahead of myself after just one use.
 
stickstones,

stickstones

Vapor concierge
MF...do you have an idea of what the price point for this thing will be yet?

Also, should I wait to start my draw until I see vapor building up in the chamber?
 
stickstones,

magicflight

Manufacturer
Manufacturer
stickstones said:
MF...do you have an idea of what the price point for this thing will be yet?
Also, should I wait to start my draw until I see vapor building up in the chamber?
Hi,

The price will probably be similar to that of the Launch Tube. The main factor affecting price at this point (assuming the design does not change) is the batteries and charger -- if we find that we have to go with a different (faster) charger, that will probably make it a bit more expensive.

If you find you are waiting more than about 10 seconds, I would begin drawing for a brief moment, while simultaneously watching the bowl to see if you notice a slight wisp of vapor dissipate. It can be hard to tell that vapor is accumulating in the bowl when it happens gradually -- drawing it away will immediately let you know if vapor is there.

Part of the reason we want feedback from testing is to figure out how to best describe to someone how to use this thing. Visual feedback is hard when the vapor is barely visible in any case, and taste feedback is tricky when there is very little taste to begin with. Is there a better way to explain to people how to use it?

-- Magic-Flight
 
magicflight,

Hennessy1414

Terrorist
IMG_0431.jpg

IMG_0428.jpg

IMG_0429.jpg

IMG_0427.jpg

IMG_0436.jpg


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=muQt-VlaDAU

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SvI4M1R0uoI

launch box^^

I can do better..ill make new vids later

:peace:
 
Hennessy1414,

NoSmoke

Well-Known Member
Hell yeah hennessy sweet vid you can definetly see the vapor steaming out from underneath. Also looks a lot more attractive then the tube. I wonder if the tube will eventually be discontinued, especially if they are both at competing prices??? Looks like you can load quite a bit in there too.
 
NoSmoke,

Haywood

Onward Thru the Fog
In celebration of 4/20, my mailbox contained a little box, in which was an even smaller little wooden box. Magic Flight had mailed me a prototype (beta) Launch Box!

It is really beautiful. It's tiny, about the size of a small box of wooden matches. Not significantly larger than two AA batteries sitting next to each other. (2.5" wide by 1.3" deep by 0.9" high). It is even more cleverly designed than the Launch Tube, though its lineage is obvious. The left half of the Box is taken up by the chamber used to hold the screen (and your load), while the right half of the box holds the single AA NiMH battery used to heat the screen. The entire top of the Box is covered with a 1/4" plastic cover that is attached in one corner, and swivels out of the way to provide complete access to the chamber. The cover is held firmly in place, yet is trivially easy to slide out of the way. I don't know what type of plastic is used. You can refer to pictures uploaded by Hennessy1414 in his Box message to further clarify my description.

Note that I am talking about a prototype unit, and there may well be small changes to the Box I have and the final release Box. That is, after all, the purpose of a beta test. My Launch Box came with a foot long flexible tube, with a small rigid plastic tube on each end. One end goes into a suitable hole in the left side of the Box, and the other end goes in your mouth. My prototype did NOT include what looks like a straight, rigid breathing tube that Hennessy1414 shows in his pictures. I do plan on trying the rigid tube that comes with Magic Flight's Launch Tube vaporizer later tonight. The advantage to the flexible tube is that it coils up to a tiny size, and is easy to carry. A six to twelve inch rigid tube, even with a 90 bend, is much harder to carry. The disadvantage to the flexible tube is that it really "overwhelms" the tiny, lightweight Launch Box. I did try using the Box with no tube at all, just breathing from the hole drilled in the side; I didn't care for that method at all. It's not just that you can't watch what's going on in the chamber, I found the draw to be much harder as well. This is one area I feel needs more experimenting, though I suspect I am going to prefer the flexible tube to a fixed tube (or no tube). Remember that I've only been using the Box for one evening so far.

Here are some stream-of-consciousness thoughts I emailed to Magic Flight last night as part of my testing efforts for them. They are much less polished, and certainly much less organized than what I would present in a formal review. Again I need to reiterate that this is a beta prototype unit, and there may be changes before Magic Flight releases the Launch Box to the general public.

Magic Flight included two AA NiMH batteries which already had the wrapper removed for use with the Box. If you use your own batteries, you'll have to remove the outer wrapper before they'll work. Filling up the bowl is SO much nicer and much, much more secure than the screen/bowl arrangement in the LT. You fire up the unit by pushing the AA battery all the way into the Box. You don't have to press and hold the battery in while using the Box, at least in my unit. This may change in the final Box, as Magic Flight did ask me if I thought I'd prefer a spring loaded battery chamber, which would require holding the battery in. At this early point of using the Box, I really like the operation the way it is, which I think is much nicer than having to press in on the battery all the time. There is a down side to this though; you really must remember to slide the battery out a little when you're done, and it's not nearly as easy to regulate the heat by "pulsing" the battery (since the battery is held pretty firmly in position). You can travel with the battery completely removed (even if the bowl is full), or you can reverse the battery so it doesn't work electrically, but is held in place in its spot in the Box. You could also travel with the battery inserted correctly, but not pushed in all the way, but this makes it all too easy to accidentally fire up the unit when it's in your pocket.

Before inserting the battery all the way, I sucked on the tube, and was astounded to see the air patterns in the bowl. The finely ground load swirled nicely around the bowl. Another big smile. It wasn't until much later that I discovered the little hole in the bottom, which is what must provide the nice venturi air flow. (As a comment to stickstones, the tiny bit of vapor you saw escaping was probably from this tiny hole in the bottom. If you blow into the tube a little, you should be able to see what I'm talking about). You don't want to suck hard enough to swirl the load around in the chamber when you're using it, however! So I push in the battery and wait for a hint of vapor to appear before inhaling, and... nothing. After about 20 seconds of not seeing any vapor in the chamber I take a hit, and everything is fine, sweet taste and WAY more vapor density than I got from the LT. Nearly as much vapor density as I get with my Volcano. This is really great. Even after more bowlfuls, I still don't really ever see much vapor in the bowl. I am using other methods to learn the best way to use this as I just don't see much vapor in the chamber. (I had no trouble seeing the vapor in the LT). So I stop trying to use the "visible vapor in the bowl" method to figure things out, and just use the vapor in the lungs method, and discover I certainly don't have to wait 20 seconds before taking the first hit! I am alternating between leaving the battery in for all three hits, versus removing it in between hits while I'm holding my breath. Both work. The former is faster, but kills the battery faster as well...

The Box holds WAY more than one hit. I think of it as a three hitter to twelve hitter. If I fill the bowl (the "trough") full, I get a dozen good hits, with the last hit or two not being very tasty. The last couple of hits actually seem to have more vapor density than the previous ones, probably due to my current technique which allows the screen to get hotter at the end. Interestingly enough, I don't get the "roasted popcorn" flavor at the end, just less good flavor and more grunge flavor. I'm a flavor kind of guy, so most of my experimenting was with a partial filling of the trough, about a third of the way full. This gives me three or four really good hits before the load appears to be done. Speaking of which, the Box appears to do a good job of evenly extracting the good stuff. The load turns uniformly brown to a much greater degree than I experienced with the LT. If I pack a full load (12 hits worth) into the trough, the outside does turn brown before the inside, but stirring between hits (either manually with a NON-SHARP tool, or by just inhaling too strongly through the tube, which stirs things up) takes care of keeping the flavor sweet though more than just the first hit.

Contrary to the preliminary instructions, one battery lasts way longer than one bowlful for me. I don't know how much longer yet. Note that I am currently only filling the trough about a third way up each time, not all the way. I prefer it this way when I'm by myself, but this doesn't take into account the times I'll want to preload it and use it elsewhere (from where I'm loading it), or when I want to share with a friend or two. It looks like a full load is going to be perfect when I want to share with a friend or two.

I FAR prefer the Launch Box to the LT. It has the same charm with none of the "science project". It works better for my needs, whether I'm sharing with a friend or by myself. It's considerably more stealthy. It's considerably easier to use. It appears to be considerably less fragile.


I did have one problem with my prototype Launch Box that I wanted to mention, even though it is something that I am sure will be worked out before the final release. I only mention it to see if the other beta testers have experienced the same thing. The contact that connects to the shell of the battery (the negative electrical connection) is a little too large, and sometimes doesn't make a good connection to the battery (maybe when the Box is cold?). A few tense minutes with a pair of needle-nosed pliers seems to have fixed the problem for me, but I don't know if it's a temporary fix or a permanent one. I am currently discussing the details with the Magic Flight people in email, and will report back as we figure out if it's a one off problem with my prototype, or a design oversight that needs adjusting to be corrected.

Vape is good.

Haywood
 
Haywood,

NoSmoke

Well-Known Member
The rigid tube is his pd stem... :lol: I'm also liking the fact that the hits are thicker then with the LT, a lot of good things so far on this vape. Good post Haywood!
 
NoSmoke,

spooky

Well-Known Member
magicflight:

what's all this fussing with the battery about? why not have an on/off switch, or at least a button you hold down to make contact with the battery, which could then remain installed in the device...

this corner-cutting makes an otherwise interesting product seem like a cheap hack.. same goes for the previous magic flight contraption


Haywood said:
...You fire up the unit by pushing the AA battery all the way into the Box. You don't have to press and hold the battery in while using the Box, at least in my unit. This may change in the final Box, as Magic Flight did ask me if I thought I'd prefer a spring loaded battery chamber, which would require holding the battery in. At this early point of using the Box, I really like the operation the way it is, which I think is much nicer than having to press in on the battery all the time. There is a down side to this though; you really must remember to slide the battery out a little when you're done, and it's not nearly as easy to regulate the heat by "pulsing" the battery (since the battery is held pretty firmly in position). You can travel with the battery completely removed (even if the bowl is full), or you can reverse the battery so it doesn't work electrically, but is held in place in its spot in the Box. You could also travel with the battery inserted correctly, but not pushed in all the way, but this makes it all too easy to accidentally fire up the unit when it's in your pocket.
 
spooky,

lwien

Well-Known Member
spooky said:
magicflight:

what's all this fussing with the battery about? why not have an on/off switch, or at least a button you hold down to make contact with the battery, which could then remain installed in the device...

this corner-cutting makes an otherwise interesting product seem like a cheap hack.. same goes for the previous magic flight contraption
It's called trying to hit a retail price point, spooky. An on/off button not only adds to the cost, but it's also just another thing to break.

Ya know, awhile back, I said the Launch Tube looks like a high school science project. This one has the same kind of look, but the more I look at these pieces the more endearing they become. Yeah, they have that home built flux capacitor look to them, but that's the charm, I think.

It remains to be seen, however, how these units will hold up over the long haul and if the general public will buy into their design concept but calling them a cheap hack is kinda hitting below the belt, however, the word, "contraption" sure does fit, and not necessarily in a bad way.
 
lwien,

stickstones

Vapor concierge
haywood...I have had no problem with my battery connecting. And I suspect you are right about the vapor leaking from the hole in the bottom...I never saw this until you pointed it out. That little bugger is hard to see! Next time I use it I will try to cover up that hole until I draw and see if the leakage stops.
 
stickstones,

duh

Well-Known Member
A few words on design, before I get into my own experience. I follow spooky's logic and have made some private suggestions to them as well for future products. However, from a business standpoint, I think what they are doing is brilliant.

On customer service, they are currently unmatched as far as I can tell and the only company coming out w/new products (like this LB beta). I know I am not the only one who will have a drawer full of Magic Flight devices and be happy to try to make any one of them part of the rotation. BTW: When I saw drawer full, I paid for a single LT and they are already replacing it for free along w/the other unit...

I'm glad lwien brought up my B2TF reference, cuz it totally applies and even more so to the LB beta. I had Henny's same problem - only I damaged the unit when trying to pull the negative side. However, I did get one good test out of it...

The temp seemed to be between the low and reg temps Magic Flight. This means it should heat up after a few seconds and assuming you provide the draw, no material should become too darkened. I did notice the hole in the bottom too but figured it is for air flow and heat distribution - otherwise you are drawing fresh air against the wood grain and the crack between the box and the glass top. I'm curious to hear what stickstones comes back with, I'll try Henny's covering the hole idea too - maybe it's a vapor carburetor?!?

IMO - I think the whole visible vapor thing is based on plant moisture, strain, top-off juice on the battery etc. As a matter of fact, I couldn't care less if I see the vapor or not - it's not an art project for me - its about taking my meds and getting on w/it. As such, I feel the wand also goes in this direction - I used my LT pipestem and then went 'native' w/no attachment.

As a matter of fact, this LB beta may the world's smallest functional vape, period. I have had a few toy train whistles and they are all made out of pure wood - I have no issue taking a drag from this little vape directly w/no stem, wand, etc. I mean, there is a screen, why waste time if you can take a very slow drag - plus how much more portable can it be than just taking the box + a couple of AAs with you ;)

Oh and BTW - no dissing my 'unfortunate name' as it was put, I give permission to Magic Flight to pull quotes from me as long as they include the full FC name as well. I think they'll find it may work well in lights or on the cnn scroll (yeah, it could happen :lol:) - think of it...

"The Launch Box is the world's smallest functional vape, period."
- 'duh'
FuckCombustion.com forum
4/22/09
 
duh,

magicflight

Manufacturer
Manufacturer
Hi,

Thanks everyone for moving their posts to the correct thread, and Especially for the comments themselves! It is good to know what works so that we can be sure to continue to provide that.

In regard to this being the "smallest functional vape ever", I must confess that it is not actually -- I have an even smaller prototype from our lab -- less than 2 cubic inches (2 x 7/8 x 7/8 in) -- about 1/2 of the size of the Box and it can be preloaded as a one-hitter. Unfortunately, it is a little tricky to use, and requires a fairly experienced vaporist to get a good taste. If anyone here remembers the old-timer brass "Perfect Pipe", it looks a lot like that. However, given that the Box is easier to use, delivers more vapor density, and has better taste, we elected not to build them (realistically, the only advantages were smaller size and lower power consumption -- the battery lasted longer, but you had to load it more often).

Also, it is best to note up front that the Box will most likely be classed as a "conduction" vaporizer -- which tends in conventional wisdom to be "very unpopular". However, the real criterion of success here is "does it work well enough". The emphasis with the Box is on convenience, price, and utility rather than on an adherence to more abstract principles such as absolute efficiency and/or purity of taste. We do not expect that everyone will like the Box. Yet if we always did what everyone recommended as "popular", nothing new would ever get tried or found out.

We have also been getting a lot of requests to make modifications to various products oriented towards building a true convection vape. We have actually built many of the suggested configurations already. While all of these can "work" to varying degrees, the unfortunate reality is that 1) they are much more complex (and therefore more expensive) and 2) there is no way to do so (at least that we know about) without consuming *much* more energy and much longer warm-up times (the details would take a book to describe). All of these issues dramatically affect the convenience, price, and utility -- making it impractical for us to pursue it as a business at this time. If you want a "convection vape", please buy one -- perhaps I can recommend the PD vaporizer or the Iolite for this. Otherwise, please let real experience, rather than opinion, be your guide.

Finally, what we are most interested in at this time is recommendations as to how to best instruct new users on how to get the best utility out of the Box. Comments on how to give instruction to get a first time user a great hit would be most helpful! What is the best technique? what is the easiest technique to learn?

-- Magic-Flight

PS: I will be out of the office most of today and later this week -- email/forum responses may be delayed.
 
magicflight,

max

Out to lunch
Thanks for explaining your research and marketing strategy magicflight. I think you're filling a much needed niche in the market for affordable electric portables. And if conduction is what works best for price and simplicity, I'm all for it.
 
max,

stickstones

Vapor concierge
Here is a quote from MagicFlight that he didn't post, that I think is an excellent point:

As far as conventional wisdom is concerned regarding convection vs conduction, I note that anything poorly designed will perform poorly, and that as a result, conduction systems tend to have a bad reputation. The Launch box is much more of a conduction system than the Launch Tube. However, it makes special use of several infrared and thermal mass effects to improve its performance well above that of a simple plate conduction heater (which tend to perform very poorly).
Of course, your own experience will be the judge of that.


That's a great point, and especially to a community that has no problem busting the 'Volcano is best' myth. I had never tried a conduction vape before the Box, but I would never have knowingly tried one based on reputation alone. Shame on me for being close minded towards new ideas! Because the bottom line is that this thing works!

I will give you my two cents on the best operating procedure once I have figured it out.
 
stickstones,

Beezleb

Well-Known Member
The fact it is conduction has not turned me off in the slightest, it does its job well. The launch box effectively brings conduction vaping technology into the market.

I would not want people to get a misunderstanding of general conduction vapes that they are a good option for other types of vapes such as the BC vape. While it works great in miniature with the Launch Box I would not in good faith recommend another conduction vape at this point in time.
 
Beezleb,

Pitzpon

Well-Known Member
This seems like a nice portable, we will have to see how it does with durability and reliability, the price is nice too.
what materials is this product made of, safety wise ?

I think that currently there is no way to get a perfect portable, with any portable something has to be sacrificed... conduction is a perfectly valid way to vaporize, as log as it works well i cant see a reson to care if it it convection or conduction ...

There is demand in the market for an electric totally portable vaporizer (no offense to the PD) & being extra small is pretty nice ...

i is there some sort of efficiency problem ? or is the non visible vapor related to high air ratio ?

It would be nice if you could have some kind of control over the heat ... maybe if you could leave a diagonal strip on the battery that would give more or less contact as you turn the battery ?
 
Pitzpon,

DeepFried

A Legend in my Own Mind
I don't think you can regulate voltage from a battery based on contact area. I agree the unit does look durable. Does the plexiglass lid seal tight enough to keep pre loaded herb in the bowl from falling out if you put the box into a jacket pocket for a while and it tumbled around a bit?.
 
DeepFried,

stickstones

Vapor concierge
Pitzpon said:
i is there some sort of efficiency problem ? or is the non visible vapor related to high air ratio ?
I am not noticing an efficiency problem...it seems to do well with what I give it. The non-visable thing could be the vapor-to-air ratio, or it could be it is operating at a lower temp. I doubt the lower temp, though, because it is built with the smoker in mind.
 
stickstones,

Beezleb

Well-Known Member
DeepFried said:
I don't think you can regulate voltage from a battery based on contact area. I agree the unit does look durable. Does the plexiglass lid seal tight enough to keep pre loaded herb in the bowl from falling out if you put the box into a jacket pocket for a while and it tumbled around a bit?.
Yes, but rubber band around it would be wise. I put mine in an hard cover eye glass zipper case, it all fits perfectly and is protected from movement.
 
Beezleb,

Hennessy1414

Terrorist
Clouds-Yes I get them...if I'm vaping the LB inside and there's not much air movement...I can see ploomage. not anywhere close to any home unit..but it gets the job done.

The lid- It has ALWAYS stayed in place for me...what I do to keep a pre-loaded bowl in place is simple cut out a piece of cardboard paper that fits the inner dimensions of the launch box bowl when a green bowl is loaded up. if the weed is a lil sticky and if its semi tightly packed...the piece of cardboard paper should stay in place nicley keeping the bowl from spilling all over the place. :2c: the lid stays air tight...vapor only leaks from two points in the vaporizer...but thats a good thing it does because it allows me to get air flow. ;)

I just picked up 4 more re-chargeable batts...should tide my portable needs over well :)

also I like the instructions MF gave me with this box...at first I read it in a haze...then as I figured out how to hit the thing the directions started to makes sense. Very user friendly directions if you have the patience for vaporizing in the first place.

Thanks MF...should I read the directions better. I did get this thing on 420 after all :brow:

:peace:
 
Hennessy1414,
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