Discontinued Zion vaporizer

[nkotb]

Nice!

Water can help unleash the beast easily

How did the E-Nano GonG fit though? It only has 18mm on one end no? How can it seal with the Zion bowl? I hope you're not just resting it in there on the oven screen, bc it is not meant to be supported by the screen like that and could void warranty (ofcourse yours didn't come with the manual yet so im sure you're all good regardless). Just wanted to make sure you and other early users are aware...

Oh, I knew about the potential issues with the gong and Zion screen, so I expected it to not work, but the silicone sleeve on the gong creates a seal with the Zion close to the opening of the heating chamber that works well enough that I can hold the joined Zion and bubbler with one hand (I don't but just to give you an idea). The added benefit is that the gong sits further away from the heater, and the glass stays cool.

 

[PCPrincipal]

You can criticize but you can't insult. That goes for everyone. While I'm at it—and this is also meant for everyone—repeating the same criticism over and over is also against FC rules.

Everything I said was constructive criticism. You can take that out of context and make it an insult - since you are the almighty one here and anything you determine insulting must truly be - but if it were me in RBTs shoes I'd want to know how me/my business is being perceived - good or bad opinions its incredibly useful knowledge, and you usually learn more from the bad/constructive opinions.

I'm just giving RBT my honest feedback. If he doesn't want that (or if I might've made him cry or something) then by all means delete my post.

From what I've learned, though, is that smart, intelligent, and successful persons/businesses welcome such criticism and become better from it.

But what do I know I'm still vaping from a Firefly.

 

[herbivore21]

Everything I said was constructive criticism. You can take that out of context and make it an insult - since you are the almighty one here and anything you determine insulting must truly be - but if it were me in RBTs shoes I'd want to know how me/my business is being perceived - good or bad opinions its incredibly useful knowledge, and you usually learn more from the bad/constructive opinions.

I'm just giving RBT my honest feedback. If he doesn't want that (or if I might've made him cry or something) then by all means delete my post.

From what I've learned, though, is that smart, intelligent, and successful persons/businesses welcome such criticism and become better from it.

But what do I know I'm still vaping from a Firefly.

Check your privilege brah, that was a mod. Criticizing mod's decisions is not PC (oh wait no, it is not FC, breaks the rules lol).

Good to see that you're PC though brah. Please don't consider this a microaggression.

 

[PCPrincipal]

Check your privilege brah, that was a mod. Criticizing mod's decisions is not PC (oh wait no, it is not FC, breaks the rules lol).

Good to see that you're PC though brah. Please don't consider this a microaggression.

Hahaha I know who it is. I just felt like my post was reasonable and worth defending. I think maybe Pak and I should swap usernames. Read his OP in PCPrincipal's voice. It fits too damn perfect!

 

[HD Springer]

you know she doesn't wash between her toes

Funny.wash not see not.

 

[Stu]

Everything I said was constructive criticism.

Calling someone a dick isn't very constructive.

Let me remind you of a couple of the rules that you agreed to when you registered.

• All members must be treated in a respectful and adult manner. All members should respect and adhere to the promotion of harmony within the community. Do not attempt to disrupt the community in any way.

• No flaming. Do not post any content that harasses, insults, belittles, threatens or flames another member. Please be nice to newbies.

Also

• Public discussions of staff decisions are not permitted on the site. If you have any concerns or queries relating to a staff decision please take it up in private with a staff member.

Please take a moment to re-read the rules. You're relatively new here so I'm giving you a break by not giving you a warning point. I'm not usually so gracious but the Platinum OG I've just vaped has me feeling generous.

 

[Shit Snacks]

Oh, I knew about the potential issues with the gong and Zion screen, so I expected it to not work, but the silicone sleeve on the gong creates a seal with the Zion close to the opening of the heating chamber that works well enough that I can hold the joined Zion and bubbler with one hand (I don't but just to give you an idea). The added benefit is that the gong sits further away from the heater, and the glass stays cool.

Ah nice! Forgot they had silicone, that can help pretty much anything seal up for water connection! Just requires two hands typically

@HellsWindStaff I feel for ya brother, but I believe all of this won't matter months from now when it is kicked up with proper CS in place instead of the crazy CEO engineer handling it all himself, clearly he is an eccentric creative genius who is best left in the garage to tinker, maybe come out for a wink and a tutorial vid, some day those other parts will come together... But come on dude 8 pages?! That sounded like supporting RBT ignoring you bc reading and responding to a diatribe like that would certainly take away some precious build time right?! Seriously though you know I love you man, helped me many times, I hope you do get to try one for yourself some day (especially as such an Evo guy). When you do I think you'll re realize you have to have one, even if it is at full retail price down the line

Also I can definitely help you on the exotics question: not anytime soon. It is a low low priority, Zions have to be standardized to get upscaled to the full production we all want (ofcourse there also needs to be a demand...). Exotics, particularly a singular custom blank, creates too much potential variation and no room for error if the blank is ruined. Some day maybe additional woods aside from maple will be available, but i dont think a custom blank really ever will... Now the single battery could be different, since it uses much less wood and is a simpler design overall. I think we'll see that in a variety of woods before we see Zion in anything other than maple, and that'd be more likely to accept a blank if they ever are at all

 

[MrPeanut]

Spent the day with my Zion on a frozen lake today. Wow was it ever windy! I am sure glad I told combustion to fuck off. No fighting with lighters! Evangeline chugged along like a champ. I packed extra batteries because I figured the low temps might kill my battery mid session. Never needed the second set. 8 good solid stems from 4am-2pm from a cold start (approx. 20 deg F). I did a do my first two hits on full power on the dial and stepped back down to 1/3 to complete the session. Evangeline kept me busy as the fishing sucked! I have a production heater but I am real jealous of all of you caressing production pieces. Back to the frozen lake tomorrow. Cheers.

 

[RastaBuddhaTao]

Yes, I have learned a valuable lesson. 97% of my customers understand what happened...

I missed the delivery date
I communicated that I had two heater failure modes with 5 root causes
I explained that I was getting barraged by PMs, emails and thread questions that where redundant and asked that all questions go through the www forms and that questions already answered in the FAQ would be ignored. This is a typical ISO9000 technique
I then shut the store down sacrificing revenue to ensure focus on delivering existing orders
I then Fixed the heater issue making the Zion a viable product while continuing to update FC
Fabricated prototype tooling to build initial units now shipping (Folks are really loving them hah?)
Kicked-off production tooling for future supply
Turn the store back on (kinda important for a business to make $)
Built and shipped units to take care of the initial customers as fast as I could
Stopped for just a moment to watch the Zion reach beyond the Z-Team

3% (I have given three refunds to date) of my customers either took it personally that I was late, or that I didn't get back to them on a personal request of some sort. So this is the 3% that are the squeaky wheels like you. The lesson is the squeaky wheels usually get the grease at he expense if the other wheels... and that just a couple of squeaky wheels can make a lot of noise.

But in your case, you dislike me so much and yet you can't bring yourself to ask for a refund. Now that's an almost impossible situation unless the vape is that Epic.... So, you my friend, just became my favorite customer and poster child for the Zion.

"The Guy is such a dick, but I can't bring myself to cancel my order" That is the ultimate VAS that gives me such sweet satisfaction so thank your for making my day.

So, now that the heater issue is fixed, units are shipping and all of the parts for the next 200 are in hand and the give-away is underway I can do what I always planned to do at this point and start to focus some effort on the business practices like customer service now the crisis mode in nearly over.

...and Yes, @Bizkat I need to shut up and put up.

 

[hackslasher]

I know there has been a lot of criticism tonight, and I'm gonna have to add a little more... Rasta in my opinion you should of wore a watch in your videos. Don't get me wrong slick ass suit, but think a watch woulda tied in very well.
Also know was already answered but hard to search through for and not easy to find in the search bar, but how much can be held in that little compartment on the lid?
Anyway wait sucks, but can't wait to enjoy
Happy weekend all

 

[Bongologist]

Making fun of a customer, really? I used to enjoy coming to this thread and now it's just sad.

 

[VegNVape]

Making fun of a customer, really? I used to enjoy coming to this thread and now it's just sad.

Way to get involved Bongo!



Whahey - it's a free for all!

And that's not sad is it.



Man, fuck this shit.

Johnny's puttin' on . . .


And I'm still celebrating bitches!


PËÅÇÊ&LÖVÊ2each&every1.

Mod note:
If you feel someone is breaking the rules or causing some kind of problem, don’t try to deal with it yourself. Use the Report feature located at the bottom of each post.

 

[PCPrincipal]

Yes, I have learned a valuable lesson. 97% of my customers understand what happened...

I missed the delivery date
I communicated that I had two heater failure modes with 5 root causes
I explained that I was getting barraged by PMs, emails and thread questions that where redundant and asked that all questions go through the www forms and that questions already answered in the FAQ would be ignored. This is a typical ISO9000 technique
I then shut the store down sacrificing revenue to ensure focus on delivering existing orders
I then Fixed the heater issue making the Zion a viable product while continuing to update FC
Fabricated prototype tooling to build initial units now shipping (Folks are really loving them hah?)
Kicked-off production tooling for future supply
Turn the store back on (kinda important for a business to make $)
Built and shipped units to take care of the initial customers as fast as I could
Stopped for just a moment to watch the Zion reach beyond the Z-Team

3% (I have given three refunds to date) of my customers either took it personally that I was late, or that I didn't get back to them on a personal request of some sort. So this is the 3% that are the squeaky wheels like you. The lesson is the squeaky wheels usually get the grease at he expense if the other wheels... and that just a couple of squeaky wheels can make a lot of noise.

But in your case, you dislike me so much and yet you can't bring yourself to ask for a refund. Now that's an almost impossible situation unless the vape is that Epic.... So, you my friend, just became my favorite customer and poster child for the Zion.

"The Guy is such a dick, but I can't bring myself to cancel my order" That is the ultimate VAS that gives me such sweet satisfaction so thank your for making my day.

So, now that the heater issue is fixed, units are shipping and all of the parts for the next 200 are in hand and the give-away is underway I can do what I always planned to do at this point and start to focus some effort on the business practices like customer service now the crisis mode in nearly over.

...and Yes, @Bizkat I need to shut up and put up.

Why, yes, now I will absolutely be getting a refund. Thank you for making it so easy!

You realize my OP was reiterating a post from another poster right? I emphasized his point because in your response to his post you didn't seem the least bit sorry to be losing a customer and didn't seem to have learned a thing from his post (which was much more constructive than mine, I admit, but I guess you really don't like constructive criticism seeing how you just responded to me.)

Do you really not see the problem with your last post? I mean, I've sent you money and have nothing to show for it. I was probably one of the first 75 to order, and you come at me like that? I'm the customer, I have the right to be upset. Like when you say production is close to 8 months behind original schedule, I could be pissed about that. Or you admit to big problems with the heater, I could (and did) doubt you then, but remained quiet. I watch all this production shit go on and didn't care, but you know what really stuck with me? How you treated and talked to your customers - that's how I got a look at YOU, YOUR personality as a HUMAN, - and most importantly how you treated the ones doubting you (bc doubt is reasonable with the state of vape pre-orders), and you didn't seem to give a damn about any of them, and you don't about me right now.

You've treated the majority of posters that have reasonable doubts with nothing but disrespect. You've pushed every customer on the fence, over the fence and flipped em the bird as they go. I was really looking forward to the Zion, but just like that with one post, I don't want anything to do with you or it.



And to be more detailed on what you should be aware of - in the bad posts that you've made, you come across as an arrogant, condescending, pompous, too-hip-to-be-a-hipster asshole. Ease up on the mustache wax, bro.


You and your butt buddy pakalolo can get back to finger-blasting Pauahi and whatever dumbass name you gave to your fucking piece of drug paraphernalia.


PC, OUT.

 

[PCPrincipal]

Making fun of a customer, really? I used to enjoy coming to this thread and now it's just sad.

Customer no longer. Same with my friend who canceled both his Zion and single battery order.

 

[Lahey]

Soo... the give-away looks cool.

 

[RelaxedNow]

I think I'll vape another bowl, and chill. But that's just me.

 

[HD Springer]

It's sad that you just can't refund an item with out a soap box. But that's just me.

 

[Copacetic]

Soo... the give-away looks cool.

Yes it does, and it's killing me!
I'd love to pitch in with a Zion order to help things along, but personal finances don't allow it ATM
I'll just have to wait for my single battery

It's a shame that a couple of folk aren't happy with anything less than deferential bowing and scraping from their vendors.
On the rare occasions that MY customers get their panties in a bunch and behave like I'm their personal punchbag I respond in a much less restrained manner than RBT.
And my soup business hasn't suffered in the least

On another topic:
Re exotic woods, I've read that stabilized woods can be easier to machine than regular exotics.
Since the wood is out of the (hot) air path would stabilized wood be a good or bad idea?

(This question is directed to the thread, rather than RBT, as he's busy, and has ruled exotics out for the forseeable anyway, which is fine by me).
I'm just curious what people think?
Would the 'plastic' involved put you off?

 

[thekarmawhore]

I personally think it wouldn't matter. Any plastic that touches the airpath would do so only at the cool 'inlet' portion of the path.


In fact, I have and continue to use a 100% nylon 3d printed unit that is tuned considerably hotter than any other Zion, beta or production and I've never once smelled even a hint of warm plastic. It would only potentially be an issue in a fail mode, where the power was left on.

 

[Copacetic]

I personally think it wouldn't matter. Any plastic that touches the airpath would do so only at the cool 'inlet' portion of the path.


In fact, I have and continue to use a 100% nylon 3d printed unit that is tuned considerably hotter than any other Zion, beta or production and I've never once smelled even a hint of warm plastic. It would only potentially be an issue in a fail mode, where the power was left on.

Wow! that's an eye opener.

 

[WoodVillain]

This vape looks awesome. I'm posting to subscribe.

As an outsider possibly considering this vape, I'll post my thoughts on his CS.

I have personally designed, made, and sold my own creations and I'm quick to point out that dealing with customers was the absolute worst part of all of it. The repeated questions, the multiple emails, trying to stay friendly...

It takes a lot of time. I was spending more time doing CS than actually making products. So I can understand the makers frustration.

That being said, it sounds like he had a difficult day, vaped too much and then vented a little publicly...

I'm sure we are all guilty of such things...

But he does try, in his own way, to apologize. Shit happens. We all get stressed and vent... I don't think a couple bad days should destroy his customer base.

Think about that time you yelled at your kid, dog, sibling, or coworker when they didn't deserve it. Imagine if your bad day completely changed how they looked at you forever....

 

[thekarmawhore]

Also know was already answered but hard to search through for and not easy to find in the search bar, but how much can be held in that little compartment on the lid?
Anyway wait sucks, but can't wait to enjoy
Happy weekend all

As much a you can stuff in a hole an inch in diameter and three quarters of an inch deep. Cork is outside this dimension.

Wow! that's an eye opener.

Yeah. I believe the body could be injection molded no problem. Not that any such notion is being considered at the moment.

 

[Andreaerdna]

Think about that time you yelled at your kid, dog, sibling, or coworker when they didn't deserve it. Imagine if your bad day completely changed how they looked at you forever....

Actually it does change how you are looked at, at best if you admit your fault you can regain trust otherwise not a chance IME.

 

[Alan Partridge]

Will you be shipping units outside of the USA?
Other than the Lifetime Zion’s already sold we will not be shipped outside of the US due to the cost of shipping

I suppose human trafficking can get quite expensive, but I was only after a Zion.

But it's heartening to see you will honour the warranty, that arrangement sounds reasonable enough.

If anyone in the US wants to hook a limey up let me know....

 

[nkotb]

Took Zion over to a friend's house. I think Zion might have converted 3 combusters.

The response I liked most from my "high-before-the-hit-ended" friend was "that thing destroyed my world!"

Two were a little reluctant to try, but once they did, they were glad they did, and everyone got a great hit on the first try (dry and bubbler).

Zion, Destroyer of Worlds.