Japanese actually, meaning "improvement" but more often interpreted in terms of quality initiatives as "continuous improvement". Popularized by Toyota and a component of many Six Sigma, Lean Manufacturing and Total Quality Management systems. @thekarmawhore & @RastaBuddhaTao - you guys rock and I have total confidence in your quality given your approach and accomplishments so far. Eagerly awaiting for October (despite the shorter days!).
Discontinued Zion vaporizer
- Thread starter lwien
- Start date
thekarmawhore
Well-Known Member
Ahhh, duh, that's right. Triz (abbreviation) is the Russian method I was thinking of.
Shit Snacks
Milaana. Lana. LANA. LANAAAA! (TM2/TP80/BAK/FW9)
How'd you compare the taste with dry ones? I kinda only vape with attachment, coz strangely enough my throat and upper respiratory system seem to get f##### really really soon... Followed by antibiotics cause of bacteria.. Def. think it's induced by vaping - tho I'm a very light user. You guys know that problem?
Well, here is number three! I'm on my holidays on a nice little isle but I gotta check this forum ever so often and yearning for news... I guess this is a bad case of VAS (only got an AIR by now, so I still might be infective...attention.)
Love you guys, such a blast!
Hey bud, if you're only coming from the Air you may do better with Zion dry than you think... I always found the Air and Solo extremely harsh (had to also only use Air with water after a while and then just sold them both), especially once I had pure convection on demand from Elevape and then Firefly to compare too, the conduction elements in the Air really dry out your throat more imo, not that pure convection can't get hot and harsh too, but you have much more control. I use Zion dry most often and its fantastic for me, despite being someone who can be quite sensitive to harshness
Especially with Zion's wide open airflow you can take a smaller hit with a lot of air and not even feel it sometimes, and lower temp hits are also often shockingly smooth, can't believe it when I breath out the cloud (this was very common for me with Elevape too). The instant on demand hit is a game changer vs Solo/Air, and it can still be sessioned like that as well, but not constant cooking and much much mversatile and versatility.
I think Zion is an excellent follow up coming from an Air or Solo, anyone looking for something similar to that but a huge step up in practically every way should really get on the pre order imo, this baby is like a portable LSV and its damn sexy and oh so tasty smooth
Sasquatch_Jr
Well-Known Member
This is exactly what draws me to this vape. I have had a Solo for a few years and love it. Late last year I went looking to step up to a more powerful portable and settled on the Crafty. Ended up having endless issues with flaky bluetooth, terrible battery life and failing units. Meanwhile my 3 year old Solo is still reliably chugging along with no issues other than a dead battery after 13 months of daily use but that was easy/cheap enough to replace. Solo also gets 5 or 6 sessions on a single charge with a 1.5 year old battery vs the Crafty's 2.5-3 sessions with a fresh out of the box unit.
The Zion seems like it will get me improved performance like the Crafty but coupled with simplicity and reliability that beats the Solo as well. I think this will be a much better fit for my needs. My only regret is not finding this thread early enough to get in on the pre beta! Now I have to slum it with my Solo and the occasional combustion session until October.
nosmoking
Just so Dab HAppy!
@Shit Snacks -How do you find your consumption in relation to the ESV? I use the ESV in sessions of 2 or 3 packs per session. I don't cram it down, but I do press it down lightly. What your use like on the ESV and how does it compare/contrast with the Zion.
I'm pretty certain the Zion is everything I want the ESV to be and the ESV is already a great tool for me. I'm just really curious to how the 2 compare/contrast.
I'm pretty certain the Zion is everything I want the ESV to be and the ESV is already a great tool for me. I'm just really curious to how the 2 compare/contrast.
Shit Snacks
Milaana. Lana. LANA. LANAAAA! (TM2/TP80/BAK/FW9)
Totally, aside from size ofcourse Zion is basically doing what I used ESV to do but better and more overall
I mainly used Elevape during the day, often in the car, or in a house with others when stealth was called for (once in a theater too, still plan to try same with Zion). I used it at night some too, dinner parties, situations where I need just a quick strong puff to keep me going, in a bathroom say or quickly outside. I did also session with it as well, back to back hits, like before a movie, during TV, walking the dog etc, but never really back to back bowls. Typically would load fullish bowls with fineish grind for best effects and tastes, doing whole bowl at 305 though I step up to higher levels sometimes, but mostly that one low temp most recently. I've posted a lot about the various ways I've used it in that thread (was probably my most valueable and impressive personal vape overall), and its hard to remember how to describe it all at the moment bc since getting Zion I actually haven't used my Elevape once...
With Zion hits on demand are super tasty and strong as well, not quite as instant I suppose but certainly on demand, especially higher on the dial. It also works better sessioned than ESV, which I would stir every hit pretty much so kind of annoying to session, Zion you can finish without stirring if you want more easily. Just a better session experience overall, and sessioning means less preheat time even at lower voltages. Ive done the quick hit in a crowded house thing too though super stealthily with Zion at the beach. Also easier to cash and load, so better for back to back sessions, or just adding green on top toward end of a session is really great.
Zions more versatile in how you can use it and more even extraction in one hit than with ESV, with narrow bowl vs wide bowl, Zion only start to see hotspots when you're at higher temp and not stirring enough, like most pure convection. Much more temp control here as well, the dial is so so so much more intuitive than Elevape's guessing game based on draw speed and settings. Also Zions airflow is always open, where ESV is far more prone to clogs that can restrict airflow and cause combustion potentially. More screens and cleaning more often with ESV, more stirring, no replaceable batteries (and battery life better in Zion, more bowls, though I never had issues with the Elevape battery for my use, even when I relied on it more, since I really needed it when dealing with several failed/faulty Indicas and Solos).
Both have the kind of cloud density and hit in you in the face effects, used both often in my car before the gym where I'd session several low to mid temp hits, where the sun shines right in my windshield on the black interior and makes vapor is extremely visible, every wisp. Both produce the kind of ridiculous huge flowy clouds you'd expect from pure convection with this power, like sometimes shockingly so after a supersmooth low temp on demand hit, its just such a delight, a perfect vaping experience imo.
Another similar comparison for me is Firefly bc before Zion I was using ESV as I described above, and FF more chilling at home and when with others (Elevape did this too back when I first got it, a while before getting ff). Both are replaced by Zion easily, advancing on them quite a bit as well, yeah its bigger but it still almost completely covers off everything those two vapes did for me, in all the situations listed above pretty much (and true stealth will be where Jr comes in), its a tight portable package alltogether imo. I don't plan on selling ESV/FF bc i think they'd still be fun/useful every now and then, but I really don't need them at all anymore now and totally could sell both.
I began with Thermovape T1 for a while, before quiting combustion and finding VAS with the Solo (got kinda spoiled for session conduction by all the instant convection later on), Zion is exactly like T1 meets Solo for me, plenty portable in my experience so far and simple natural beauty and design of a log with the full power of an LSV, yet more easily tameable and versatile as well... Essentially my coverall vape
Does that paint a picture at least? lol
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Haha, now you've got one on me, totally unfamiliar with that one! Well, anyway, the important point is that you guys know your stuff and have the backgrounds and experience to prove it and it shows in your interaction with this community and all the progress you've made with the Zion and its siblings over a short period of time. Cheers!
Ok so here's a proper convection dab of some Master Jedi shatter courtesy of Loki, my Zion Beta unit (so focus on function not fit and finish). Loki runs hot and I have it turned up all the way for this video. This is from COLD to CLOUD. Warm up times are in real time. No music this time so you can hear the massive airflow this thing has. Two more healthy hits (though not like the first) followed that one on the same load.
ragnorokk
DERP
Yeeeeeeeah! That cloud looked fantastic. So jealous, but hopefully the FC-100 will be able to perform as heartily as Loki. Just about want to buy a second one...
Smoke1ForMe
Well-Known Member
I've had my Zion, part of the FC 10, for almost two weeks and I fucking love it! I have been slammed at work the last couple of weeks and was out of town last weekend, so I haven't had a chance to give my impressions on it.
First off this thing is a beast for a portable. I have to say it's the only portable I have used that didn't have me reaching for my EVO after using it to be fully satisfied. The taste I get from the different strains is amazing, I think it's one of its best qualities. The ABV is pretty even I usually stir it once during the session and the battery life is great a pair of batteries last me all day and then some.
I still need to buy an adapter to use it on all my glass, but I've been pleasantly surprised on how much I enjoy using it dry. I agree with Shit Snacks on how the Zion is not nearly as harsh as other portables I have used.
The Zion has definitely made its way into my vape family and I can't wait to see what else RBT comes up with.
First off this thing is a beast for a portable. I have to say it's the only portable I have used that didn't have me reaching for my EVO after using it to be fully satisfied. The taste I get from the different strains is amazing, I think it's one of its best qualities. The ABV is pretty even I usually stir it once during the session and the battery life is great a pair of batteries last me all day and then some.
I still need to buy an adapter to use it on all my glass, but I've been pleasantly surprised on how much I enjoy using it dry. I agree with Shit Snacks on how the Zion is not nearly as harsh as other portables I have used.
The Zion has definitely made its way into my vape family and I can't wait to see what else RBT comes up with.
stickstones
Vapor concierge
I was using the Zion daily until I combusted about two weeks ago and was too lazy to clean it up, so I went about a week without using the Zion. Once I got her cleaned up, though, she's all I've used for the last three or four days.
Part of the beta/review process for me is the grab test. After I've had the unit for a bit, do I reach for it during normal circumstances? Early on when my Zion was a rougher build I was not that impressed. I was reaching for the Air to go to the beach instead of the Zion because, at that point in time, the Zion was big and hard to use. But Sarah got upgraded and has been my reach for unit ever since. I don't even have the newer build as the current beta units and I am hooked. I'm gonna check out a production unit when all is said and done and I can't wait...I think the newer units get to temp quicker and work better at lower temps.
So...all of that was typed to make the point that the Zion is a fantastic daily driver for anyone no matter what vapes you already have. When I go up to my vape station and am choosing between the Evo, Herbie, two MV's and the VripTech, and grab the Zion instead...I know we have a winner! Buy direct from the manufacturer with confidence!
Part of the beta/review process for me is the grab test. After I've had the unit for a bit, do I reach for it during normal circumstances? Early on when my Zion was a rougher build I was not that impressed. I was reaching for the Air to go to the beach instead of the Zion because, at that point in time, the Zion was big and hard to use. But Sarah got upgraded and has been my reach for unit ever since. I don't even have the newer build as the current beta units and I am hooked. I'm gonna check out a production unit when all is said and done and I can't wait...I think the newer units get to temp quicker and work better at lower temps.
So...all of that was typed to make the point that the Zion is a fantastic daily driver for anyone no matter what vapes you already have. When I go up to my vape station and am choosing between the Evo, Herbie, two MV's and the VripTech, and grab the Zion instead...I know we have a winner! Buy direct from the manufacturer with confidence!
TheDudeNextDoor
Abiding
I've been hesitant to say this because comparing a portable to a plug-in unit is always problematic, but since you brought it up ... paired with a 18/14 adapter and a small water tower (the Pinnacle water tower is what I have), the Zion performs like a portable mini Cloud. That's the kind of power she gives, especially with fresh batteries.
Speaking of which, for those wondering about how many sessions you can get on a set of fully charged batteries, I use Samsung 25Rs, and with the water tower, I get 3-4 full-bowl sessions on one charge; with the stem, I get 4-6 sessions, depending on how far I push it.
So much to love about the Zion.
Special thanks to the Beta Team for posting reviews, pictures and video's. We thought the Zion might just be disruptive technology but we didn't anticipate the rave reviews from such an expert group. Maybe @stickstones is right and it really should retail for $250?
Only a few days left to secure the $169 price and lifetime warranty.
Only a few days left to secure the $169 price and lifetime warranty.
vapen00b
Many vapes & accessories. Always happy to help
Howdy pal,
man, thanks so much for your post. This make me even more looking forward to getting it.. and I felt like max. excitement already.
I had an ascent before (broke really soon, bad built quality imho) and could have sworn it wasn't as harsh as the Air.. But that was months before so you kinda lose contact with comparisons, rather thought it's a less cured and/or different strain. But over the last 6 months I was really feeling my throat got so sensitive... And obviously either not recovering to 100% or the harshness kills it rapidly causing new old trouble.
It would be a blessing if the Zion with its magical powers could give me the healthy tasty experience again that I loved so much - I guess it will outperform and blow my mind (my first convection vape!). Can't wait!
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MrPeanut
Zion, stealing faces since 2015
Figured I would pop in while all of the excitement builds for Zion as RBT approaches production with full concentration. I am still just a friend. I did get a free vape as I said before. Am I biased? I am sure. I do not know a damn thing about water tools, and I have only owned a few crappy conduction vapes. I do however medicate up to 5-8 times (22 years) a day for: ischemic heart disease, cardiomyopathy, congestive heart failure, stage 4 renal failure, epilepsy, insomnia, anxiety, cervical disc degeneration, diabetic neuropathy and general depression related to the aforementioned maladies. RBT has designed a device that is pure. It is an easy to use vaporizer. It is portable and pocketable (large cargo shorts). It has reduced my consumption drastically because it extracts the goodies so efficiently. Zion entices flavors and effect characteristics out of flowers that I never knew existed. IMHO any serious vape person that does not jump at this insanely low price and lifetime warranty is missing out on a huge opportunity. Viva el Zion!
ragnorokk
DERP
I'd also like to commend @RastaBuddhaTao for continuing the $169 sale price tag, even for those of us who happily bought it at $200. Thanks for offering to give us refund/store credit for the extra that we willingly paid, that's some great customer service, and won't be forgotten.
thekarmawhore
Well-Known Member
This.
I came to the project as a long time combuster who had tried vapes in the past but they just never quite cut it.
Then a few months ago we built me the 1st and only 3d printed "new style" prototype and I never really went back to combusting again. It wasn't even like I was trying to 'quit combusting', it's just that combusting no longer cut it anymore compared to the wallop that the Zion delivers to me.
I like to pretend I'm surfing after a big'un and ride out the knee wobble, COWABUNGAAAA!
stickstones
Vapor concierge
Guess what I just did. I just reached for the Zion again. I'm done beta testing it. It's an old build and the only reason I use it is because I want to. When a less than $200 vape consistently draws me away from the stable of big bucks vapes I have plugged in and ready to turn on...
Shit Snacks
Milaana. Lana. LANA. LANAAAA! (TM2/TP80/BAK/FW9)
Not only that, even coming from soms flavor champion vapes like Firefly, Elevape, Underdog, Lily, Thermovape, Air/Solo, the Zion still impressed me so deeply with its rich flavor profiles, it truly just felt so pure and tasty in a different mouthwatering way, with some of the same herbs on the low voltages in particular...
And yeah the effects, I mean it often feels like it with any new vape's honeymoon phase, but even over a month later now the Zion does feel like an even more powerful high, its like a new full bodied level sometimes when you hit it, especially when coming in first time in a day... Even combuster pothead ladyfriend saying its getting her too gone, and she's used it with me plenty now (she also has a volcano and did love my FF and UD too, its another level here)
Choughed
Well-Known Member
I got a super surprise this morning! So, my mother-in-law lives in the US, and we asked her if we could order and send the Zion to her address so she can forward it on.. and she sent an email this morning saying that she's ordered one for us and one for herself, and she'll send ours on - early Christmas present! OMG! 
Best MIL ever!! 
I can't wait!!
(emailing GHL for a refund today..
)
Best MIL ever!! I can't wait!!
(emailing GHL for a refund today..
)
Shit Snacks
Milaana. Lana. LANA. LANAAAA! (TM2/TP80/BAK/FW9)
I got a super surprise this morning! So, my mother-in-law lives in the US, and we asked her if we could order and send the Zion to her address so she can forward it on.. and she sent an email this morning saying that she's ordered one for us and one for herself, and she'll send ours on - early Christmas present! OMG!
I can't wait!!
(emailing GHL for a refund today..
Welcome welcome!
She certainly could give mothers in law a new reputation I think, incredible!
Wonderful how word is spreading
fluffhead
Recovering Idealist
After months of casually watching this thread, I started to read this thread more thoroughly recently. Once it started to get going, something else started up too, VAS. I think the tone of this thread has been a great collaboration well suited to FC. I feel lucky to have been able to order this vape for $169 with a lifetime warranty. I look forward to reading more about people's usage of this vape as more people get it.
Choughed
Well-Known Member
She's a medical user and involved in an org that advocates for MMJ use in her area. We think she's pretty cool.
I'm just hoping she likes the Zion enough to want to quit combustion! My husband has asthma and I'm looking forward to him quitting it too. Hail to the Zion! 
lol
Thanks @Choughed we emailed her to let her know that we will through in some extra stems and screens for being our first double order.
All, I have had a couple of people ask about international shipping and a few sneak them through lol.
It's pretty cool that we have units in England and France so until August 16th if an international order where to be entered and US shipping selected we can Paypal invoice the added shipping cost at time of shipment
However, on the 17th the price will go up, the warranty will be three years and shipping will be US only. Carpe Diem
All, I have had a couple of people ask about international shipping and a few sneak them through lol.
It's pretty cool that we have units in England and France so until August 16th if an international order where to be entered and US shipping selected we can Paypal invoice the added shipping cost at time of shipment
However, on the 17th the price will go up, the warranty will be three years and shipping will be US only. Carpe Diem