Vaporizers and Post Nasal Drip/Eustachian Tube Dysfunction

[Toastface_Killah]

Hey guys;

So for the past 4 years, I have developed and dealt with a chronic post nasal drip. It started 4 years ago and up until 8 months ago it did not really bother me that much. 8 months ago it started to cause Ear/Eustachian Tube troubles (plugged ears/goop and liquid is always up there now) which apparently is something that post nasal drip can lead to or cause.

Now, I do not want to have to give up my precious MMJ, but this really scares me. I stopped smoking completely within the first months of my ears getting problems, and picked up a very nice vaporizer (silver surfer). Heres where it gets confusing; when I smoked I would feel the mucus or w/e that is in my sinuses and ears kinda get more plugged up and stuffy, and then the next morning it would all be drained or draining. Now that I vape (usually multiple times a day, through a waterpipe), whenever I use it, I get this runny/mucusy feeling, and its most noticeable probably 45 min to an hour after consumption. To say the least, it isn't really pleasant. I can feel stuff sliding and moving through my Ear tubes and sinuses/throat. There is also the matter of ear clicking and popping, which I can manually cause by the fact I've gained control of the muscles that flex my eustachian tubes (theres some term for this) which can be annoying as all hell when I get into a nervous bout and just sit there popping and cracking my ears from stress or out of habit. This happens even when sober, but when I vape theres a few extra pops or clicks added on occasionally, which I attribute to the fact whatever is stuck up in my head is now more loose and liquidy with the introduction of cannabis into my system.

This may be me just being a crack-pot, but I have a theory for why I feel more liquid and mucus when I vape and why I feel so runny when i do. Weed is a known expectorant, and vapor is warm. I have looked the subject up of vapes and respiratory irritation on the net extensively and the only stuff I could find was people either saying vaping caused no problems (which i'm not sure is true) or that it caused very minor irritation; I'm still worried though that inhaling something hurts my cillia bad and prevents the proper expelling of this liquid. So, disregarding the minor irritation that may or may not be there, maybe this hot vapor is already loosening/dethickening the mucus in me from its heat, while at the same time the THC and its expectorants are causing the mucus to get really liquidy and runny. I have used mucinex before too and honestly, unless its my mind playing tricks, I have felt similar effects from that as what inhaling cannabis does. Even edibles cause the same effect, albeit with minor differences I can't really remember or notice that bad from the fact there is no inhaled matter.

While it can be uncomfortable, I really want to continue MMJ use and I am really unsure as to whether or not what I'm feeling is a good thing or not. Im under the assumption that if I can feel mucus running out my ears and sinuses and being loose, thats much better than it just sitting there thicker and dried. I have tried stopping cannabis use for a couple weeks with no improvement too, it just didn't feel as drainy/thick liquidy since I wasn't using my vape, however the plugged and cracklign ears remained like always and by the end of my tolerance break, was at a very annoying level.

So anyone have any thoughts, suggestions or ideas to throw in on this matter?

 

[Nycdeisel]

For starters, vapor doesnt paralyze the cilia like smoke does

I say look outside of your cannabis use. Look at the other things you put in and on your body, like what you eat and the body care products you use. There are TONS of other everyday things tht can cause health problems, [vaporizing. or eating] cannabis is probably one of the safer substances you use. I would recommend a small, but high quality waterpipe, as this may help with what you are feeling. I know I cant vape dry anymore, only with a bong or bubbler, and a doctor once said I had post nasal drip but im not sure because what I really experience is a lot of GERD and a feeling that theres always something in my throat and often I have to hack up mucus(though clear and thin mucus normally). Vaping doesnt make it worse, in fact it helps with the discomfort of a lot of ailments.
I suggest you try your best to focus on NOT popping/cracking your ears , if you can.

 

[Kief]

So anyone have any thoughts, suggestions or ideas to throw in on this matter?

I may have something to offer, but first I have questions...

-Have you seen a doctor about this?
-Do you have allergies?
-Are you taking any meds for congestion or allergies?
-Have you tried using your vaporizer with a water pipe for moisture conditioning? does it change anything?

No mater what info you find here or anywhere on the net, you should always consult a qualified physician when your health is in question.

 

[Toastface_Killah]

Thanks for the responses guys.

To answer your questions Kief, Yes, I have been to my physician twice now for this issue. Both times she told me that cannabis is not the problem, even when smoking. I saw her the other day for the second time and brought up this issue in detail and how I use vapes exclusively now and she said that while she can't say for sure its not causing any issues or helping the draining, it most likely wouldn't be any worse than breathing in normal particles and debris in the air like going into a perfume store or somewhere else. It is just annoying that when I vape I can feel the liquid more intense/more obvious and that my ears crackle more if I flex whatever muscle that is that controls the ear tubes (apparently you can gain control of that which is really annoying).

And she tells me I do have allergies too, its all clear fluid that is in me and my mother has a history of allergies; I feel that as I get older they are just hitting me stronger. I've taken numerous decongestants and antihistamines with no benefit; however, the other day when I saw my physician she prescribed me Singulair, so it has been 4 days of taking that.


And for the waterpipe question; yes, I exclusively use one with my SSV. However, recently as I have bene home I have been using my MFLB again, and in all honesty, I really do not notice a huge difference between no water or water.

 

[Nycdeisel]

Do not underestimate allergies. Get rid of all things that one would be allergic to in your home. Throw out the sprays, perfume, cologne, cleaning products(and replace with natural cleaning items that will disinfect, like vinegar, lemon juice, and hydrogen peroxide), soaps, etc. Filter your shower water fro chlorine so you dont inhale DBPs(disinfection by products, coming from chlorine and other chemicals added to the tap water systems). change your laundry detergent , get a GOOD air purifier, etc. Allergies to common household items cause a LOT of problems for me and its hell. But its easy to toss all of that and get natural alternatives.

I also dont advocate the use of pharmaceutical drugs, they will never cure anything anyway, they only try to cover up and mask symptoms, they will not be able to actually help you in any way. so dont expect much out of that and if you do feel improvement remember its only temporary before you start to have the drug build up in your body, causing other problems.

Best of luck, i know it can be tough but never give up, never stop trying to fix it.

edit: Cant forget food allergies! They can cause more then you would think!

 

[Hippie Dickie]

I also dont advocate the use of pharmaceutical drugs

This is my attitude also. i found my allergies have almost disappeared as i got older (64 now) but i attribute that to my daily 30 minutes of aerobics which i've done for the last 30 years. i never take allergy "medicine" anymore.

 

[Kief]

There is also the matter of ear clicking and popping, which I can manually cause by the fact I've gained control of the muscles that flex my eustachian tubes (theres some term for this) which can be annoying as all hell when I get into a nervous bout and just sit there popping and cracking my ears from stress or out of habit.

I completely understand the popping ears, I've lived with them for about 15 years. Unless your doctor is worried about it or it causes you pain, I wouldn't stress about it. You could try to replace it with something like chewing gum or even a stress ball for those nervous bouts. The control over the popping that you speak of does have a positive side... it can make high elevation descents painless, does for me anyway.

Do not underestimate allergies.

I agree, allergies can be a real problem and it sounds like it may be the culprit here. If you notice them getting worse as you age, the odds are that it will keep going that way.

The most effective way to find relief is to eliminate the allergens from your life. This is much easier said than done and often requires major life changes. Example: I'm allergic to dust, I would have to rip out my carpets and curtains, run an expensive air filter, make someone else do the weekly dusting, and never open my windows again... all just to eliminate exposure at home. You could try eliminating every possible allergen from your life, but why do that when there are only a few things that bother you? Seeing a specialist and getting tested is the best thing you can do if the simple fixes aren't working, I recommend it if you have the $$$ and/or insurance. You can also use a simple process of elimination, especially with food. Knowing what to eliminate can be a real game changer.

I also dont advocate the use of pharmaceutical drugs, they will never cure anything anyway, they only try to cover up and mask symptoms, they will not be able to actually help you in any way.

I agree that pharmaceutical drugs are not the best things and decline to take most of them, but when it comes to the misery that my allergies cause me, I will do whatever works. They don't cure anything, but they do help me by putting a stop to most of my symptoms... I like to breathe freely and couldn't live without them. Drugs can also be a much cheaper way to solve the problem. I do not have any experience with Singulair (that I recall), but I think it's one of those that needs to build up in your system... just make sure you take it for whatever the minimum recommended time is to see if it works.

I've taken numerous decongestants and antihistamines with no benefit

This could be an important piece to the puzzle, these drugs don't work very well for my food allergy reactions and there is one food that will give me the same fluid problems that you speak of. Just my experience, for whatever it’s worth.

I wish you luck in finding the root of your problem.

 

[hogleg]

buy raw local honey it will fix your allergies

 

[Toastface_Killah]

Thanks for the detailed reply Kief, I really appreciate it. I'm sure I could set up an allergist appointment in the coming months to see what it really is that is causing this response; my physician has basically told me that it is almost without a doubt allergies since my symptoms all match up, I have two tiny lymph nodes that have been slightly enlarged since around the time the post nasal drip started, and the fact all the mucus is completely clear.

If it matters, everyone has been telling me that in the past year the pollen and allergies in my area have been terrible. Although my issues started around late august of last year, apparently I am not the only one people I know know of that have had allergy problems they never had to deal with until recently.

and hogleg, thanks for the honey comment. I just looked it up and saw all the good things people had to say about local honey and allergies. I just made some tea with a tablespoon of some farmers market honey from the state bordering me, so I'm hoping this will provide some help.

 

[Nycdeisel]

Get it as local as possible but MAKE SURE IT IS RAW or else it wont contain the pollen, propolis, etc that is what is beneficial in honey. ALWAYS RAW HONEY. Manuka honey is also awesome for a lot of things, not sure exactly how it would work for allergies though. AT least use the local raw stuff.


There ARE natural, simple, and CHEAP remedies for pollen allergies. One great one is a Neti pot, which you must make sure to use with good clean water, as well as the right type of salt, for it to work properly. Use a good filtered water, and use pink Himalayan salt. The salt is awesome. You can also boil a pot of water, add the himalayan pink salt to it and then put a towel over your head so you can breathe in the salt steam. There are also dry salt inhalers that you can purchase online, for use with Himalayan salt of course. This salt is also much more preferable for eating, since it doesnt contain any garbage anticaking agents, and is not lacking minerals like refined, bleached, and processed table salt is. Even sea salt can have those problems. So pick up Himalayan salt. its not hard to find at all. And I promise you will love it. Drastically different then any commercial table salt.

Its more then just an allergy issue, its an overall health issue, removing toxic products from your home is a big deal. It has changed so much for me. The shower filter is a big one as well, because like I said there is Chlorine and disinfection byproducts(DBPs) among other things, in your tap water. In the shower it becomes easiest to take in, not just inhaling but is absorbed by your skin as well.

You do not NEED pharma drugs, they dont have to control you that way. there are many natural remedies available. and once you start using lots of different natural home remedies, instead of drugs(whether prescription or OTC) it will not only start to seem like common sense as to why they work, but you will notice the quality is real, it has value, its not like some synthetic pills. It gets to the root of the problem.

Allergy tests can be very expensive. And it cant telll you which household sources are effecting you, like the fumes in your shower water, or some other 'product' in your home, it could be a cleaning product, body spray, soap, there are just so many possibilities. Look for natural and organic products and ditch the junk, ditch processed foods, and all of those things, and see how you feel afterwards.

Good luck with the elimination process, toastface

 

[Albert Hofmann]

^^^^ Damn straight Deez. It's all about the neti pot! I've been using one for years, everyday. I'm going to have to check out about the pink himalayan salt, I've been using regular old pure sea salt. But yes, a daily neti pot rinse can do wonders for your nasal and sinus health, and I bet it would help out with your ear issue also. All that stuff is connected. Get a good size neti pot, the little 8 ounce one just isn't gonna cut it. I recommend the stainless steel one from healthandyoga.com. It holds a full pint, which is usually enough for a good rinse.

 

[Nycdeisel]

Its the best salt you will ever taste on food as well. Its the most pure salt youll find these days, it contains all of the natural trace minerals since it hasnt had any processing. Most salts are processed to hell and back, and then they add the anti-caking crap in.

You can find Himalayan pink salt in rock form, small crystals, or fine ground, and if you look online just about anywhere in between.

I too have noticed most neti pots are a little small to hold a full rinse for each nostril. i will check out that one you linked thanks man

 

[darkrom]

I also dont advocate the use of pharmaceutical drugs, they will never cure anything anyway, they only try to cover up and mask symptoms, they will not be able to actually help you in any way.

I respect you, I almost always agree with you, but this is a very ignorant statement to be making. There are plenty of people who find more relief in medication. There are many people who are only alive due to pharmaceutical drugs. I'm pro natural methods first, but to discount the benefits of pharmaceutical drugs completely is no better than the pill poppers thinking we are crazy burnt out hippies sipping soy teas and shit.

Both have their place. Personally I prefer natural, but to say pharmaceutical drugs will never cure anything really shocked me coming from someone I usually agree with.

 

[Greenscreen]

Have a very similar problem that started when i began vaping. I always blamed the vapes and the amounts i was using but just recently I did a two week break from everything and still experienced problems in these two weeks.

This thread has a lot of good info that i never even thought about before and has now given me the incentive to try and find out the root cause of the problem. I try everything when my sinus flare up.. Neti pots, steam, drinking hot cups of water and anything else i can think of, but this thread has definitely given me some different ideas and shown me its not necessarily the vape itself..Thanks for the info

 

[Toastface_Killah]

Crazy, sounds just like my situation. I'm assuming your ears affected by it? If so it makes me happy (not to sound mean) that I'm not the only one like this....I took a two week break at one point also and it didnt subside; if anything it got more annoying since I wasn't ever high. Interestingly enough, the entire problem arose at the very end of a two week tolerance break a year ago.

 

[Nycdeisel]

I respect you, I almost always agree with you, but this is a very ignorant statement to be making. There are plenty of people who find more relief in medication. There are many people who are only alive due to pharmaceutical drugs. I'm pro natural methods first, but to discount the benefits of pharmaceutical drugs completely is no better than the pill poppers thinking we are crazy burnt out hippies sipping soy teas and shit.

Both have their place. Personally I prefer natural, but to say pharmaceutical drugs will never cure anything really shocked me coming from someone I usually agree with.

Sorry , I guess that was kind of ignorant of me. All those things you just mentioned are totally true. Just know I am unusually biased in this area

 

[t-dub]

Pharmaceuticals are a double edged sword. Thats why you need a prescription to get them, they have "unintended consequences". Caveat Emptor! . . . I say as I go in for my next chemo shot on Wednesday

 

[darkrom]

Sorry , I guess that was kind of ignorant of me. All those things you just mentioned are totally true. Just know I am unusually biased in this area

Believe me I didn't even want to post that, but I can't let people act like pharms don't do amazingly good things, along with the amazingly bad things. I think the business side of pharms is the real problem IMO. I try to go with natural when possible, but sometimes there are things that can't be fixed or treated that way. Natural is definitely where its at, but lets not discount science completely!

 

[Tuck]

When I have congestion in my lungs, I find Mucinex, which has the active ingredient of Guaifenesin, to help me out tremendously. Mucinex is an expectorant.

For nasal and sinus congestion, I use generic 12 hour Sudafed which has the active ingredient of Psuedophedrine. It's OTC but you have to get it from the pharmacist, behind the counter, at least where I live. It's an antihistamine and it works like a champ.

 

[t-dub]

. . . Psuedophedrine. It's OTC but you have to get it from the pharmacist, behind the counter, at least where I live. It's an antihistamine and it works like a champ.

From Wikipedia:

Pseudoephedrine is a sympathomimetic drug of the phenethylamine and amphetamine chemical classes. It may be used as a nasal/sinus decongestant, as a stimulant[citation needed], or as a wakefulness-promoting agent. The salts pseudoephedrine hydrochloride and pseudoephedrine sulfate are found in many over-the-counter preparations, either as a single ingredient or (more commonly) in combination with antihistamines, guaifenesin, dextromethorphan, paracetamol (acetaminophen), or an NSAID (such as aspirin or ibuprofen).

So Pseudoephedrine is not an antihistamine, it can be used with one however

 

[Nycdeisel]

Psuedophedrine is the active ingredient in methamphetamine.

 

[t-dub]

Psuedophedrine is the active ingredient in methamphetamine.

Yes it is. Here in Oregon you have to ask the pharmacist for it since peeps were clearing the shelves

 

[Tuck]

My bad. You are right. Sudafed is a nasal decongestant. Antihistamines are things like Claritin, Zyrtec, or Benadryl. You can get Claritin and Zyrtec with Psuedophedrine packaged in. Again, you'll have to talk to the pharmacist, but you don't need a prescription. This is because, as nycdiesel pointed out, people were making meth with it.

I've had allergies since I was a child, so I was using sudafed before they invented Meth, whoever they is. It works great for me on my post nasal drip. Sudafed will also work wonders for a sinus infection. For the longest time, I thought pseudophedine had been banned, because you'd hear about someone's Grandma getting raided because she bought Sudafed. During that time, I had some of the worst sinus infections I've ever had. Since I started taking Sudafed again though, I never have problems with sinus infections.

If you want a natural source of pseudophedrine, look to the Ephedra plant.

I also deal with bouts of chronic bronchitis, and when I feel my chest tightening at the onset of one of those bouts, that's when I'll take the Mucinex. It really helps get the crap out of my lungs.

If you don't want to deal with a netipot, you can get saline nasal drops. Saline nasal drops are great.

Be careful with Afrin. This stuff is a wonder drug and will clear your sinuses better than eating a habenero. But if you use it too much, you can become addicted. My doctor said do not use it more than 3 days in a row. We keep some at the house but use it sparingly.

 

[Nycdeisel]

There is a nasal spray that uses the actice ingredient in hot pepper. My brother was having bad allergies and he tried it and cleared him right up.

Saline isnt exactly natural pure salt, either.

And FUCK all of those meth drugs and all of that. Use natural remedies instead

 

[t-dub]

There is a nasal spray that uses the actice ingredient in hot pepper. My brother was having bad allergies and he tried it and cleared him right up.

Saline isnt exactly natural pure salt, either.

And FUCK all of those meth drugs and all of that. Use natural remedies instead

I use that same ingredient, capsaicin (Sombra), for topical joint pain relief as well. When combined with DMSO it is an effective tool to have in the box for sure