VapeXhale heater mods

[olivianewtonjohn]

Only not induction. Inductive heat is cool stuff, though.

Here is a video on the heating tape:

http://www.briskheat.com/p-288-bwh-high-temperature-heavy-insulated-heating-tapes.aspx

Id imagine like 9" or so would be needed?

EDIT: Their thermocouple used in the video looks familiar
Video mentioned a few times to keep an eye on the tape and replace it if it gets damaged. Wonder about durability? Then again probably not running at even close to full power

EDIT#2: This can be bought in either .5ft or 1ft. Only trouble is its 17watt or 22watt; think original heater was 30w?

Says "Extreme flexibility allows for easy use on small tubes, vessels, or any place where space is limited", "Wrap around diameters as small as 1/8" (3mm)" but temp is too 900F

http://www.briskheat.com/p-328-htc-heating-cords.aspx

 

[JCat]

I measured ~16.15mm

 

[lazylathe]

So far the minimum diameter of the band heaters is 25mm, so not good.
Still researching...

 

[olivianewtonjohn]

Saw this today, wondering if its a "rope type heater" or if there is ceramic inside the fiberglass material:

http://fuckcombustion.com/threads/vapexhale-cloud.5247/page-503#post-371318

Its the presale version I guess? Wonder how that might compare to the other models.

EDIT:
I have no experience in this field, just thinking out loud. Could a wire be wrapped in material like this to essentially make our own heaters? Or would this braiding essentially insulate the wire and not get heat flow and all that jazz? Maybe a wire wrapped around the glass then covered with a sheet of this stuff for insulation.

Wire braiding:
http://www.extremeheatprotection.com/high-temperature-woven-fiberglass-fabric-plain-satin.html

Sheets:
http://www.firesleeveandtape.com/hi...eeve-tape-rope-fabric-insulation-tadpole.html

 

[Hippie Dickie]

Could a wire be wrapped in material like this to essentially make our own heaters?

Here's the thing about making your own heater ... you need to know what the electronics expects to see as the software must be tuned to the performance of the heater.

As an example: i use a 24" length of nichrome 80 wire wrapped around a glass tube - a short (1") version of the bamboo. my heater coil is 0.5 ohms and the electronic components are able to handle massive current flow (60 amps). my software is tuned to the fast heat-up and slow cool-down behavior of this heater.

i personally prefer an air gap for insulation. when i tried using a woven ceramic insulating material, it eventually heat saturated and got hot as fuck.

so you're kind of stuck trying to replicate their design.

 

[olivianewtonjohn]

Here's the thing about making your own heater ... you need to know what the electronics expects to see as the software must be tuned to the performance of the heater.

As an example: i use a 24" length of nichrome 80 wire wrapped around a glass tube - a short (1") version of the bamboo. my heater coil is 0.5 ohms and the electronic components are able to handle massive current flow (60 amps). my software is tuned to the fast heat-up and slow cool-down behavior of this heater.

i personally prefer an air gap for insulation. when i tried using a woven ceramic insulating material, it eventually heat saturated and got hot as fuck.

so you're kind of stuck trying to replicate their design.

Thanks for the valuable incite. I was actually wanting to message you this thread. So could we measure the resistance of a working OEM ceramic heater and then use a nichrome wire with the same resistance?

Dont think the insulating material would be too much of a problem since in the design the ceramic heater is in contact with insulating material already (also dont want the wire to short without insulation)

 

[Hippie Dickie]

So could we measure the resistance of a working OEM ceramic heater and then use a nichrome wire with the same resistance?

theoretically, yes. that's a starting point.

you can get insulated nichrome. i use bare wire and quite heavy gauge (16awg) so it is dimensionally stable and won't short out. i use nichrome 80 rather than nichrome 60, which i found to corrode after about a year of service. The 80 is medical grade and has not corroded after > 3 years of service in a humid climate.

 

[CentiZen]

theoretically, yes. that's a starting point.

you can get insulated nichrome. i use bare wire and quite heavy gauge (16awg) so it is dimensionally stable and won't short out. i use nichrome 80 rather than nichrome 60, which i found to corrode after about a year of service. The 80 is medical grade and has not corroded after > 3 years of service in a humid climate.

I think that this would be a bigger factor in vaporizers that are implementing the 'standard' PID algorithm in their control of heater power supply; and I am not so sure that the Cloud would fall in to this category. I don't have in depth knowledge of the control scheme they use (but by god once I finish figuring out MSP bytecode I will!); but I think that there is more happening behind the scenes with the Cloud than that - it almost seems to self-adjust it's tunings on the fly. I can't think of any logical explaination as to why lazylathe's silicone pad heater worked so well otherwise; unless that was just a coincidince and I am over thinking things.

@lazylathe do you still have the original pad heater you used by chance? Could you do a resistance measurement on it?

 

[lazylathe]

I think that this would be a bigger factor in vaporizers that are implementing the 'standard' PID algorithm in their control of heater power supply; and I am not so sure that the Cloud would fall in to this category. I don't have in depth knowledge of the control scheme they use (but by god once I finish figuring out MSP bytecode I will!); but I think that there is more happening behind the scenes with the Cloud than that - it almost seems to self-adjust it's tunings on the fly. I can't think of any logical explaination as to why lazylathe's silicone pad heater worked so well otherwise; unless that was just a coincidince and I am over thinking things.

@lazylathe do you still have the original pad heater you used by chance? Could you do a resistance measurement on it?

I do have a heater pad lying around the place...

If i set my multi meter to 20K i get a reading of 0,22.
Not quite sure what that translates too...

If i recall correctly they were made to be 55W and run off 110V.
So i guess that would make it 220 Ohms.

The issue with the silicone pad was that it got so hot the actual silicone covering started to deteriorate.
So it is not a viable fix...

 

[olivianewtonjohn]

I do have a heater pad lying around the place...

If i set my multi meter to 20K i get a reading of 0,22.
Not quite sure what that translates too...

If i recall correctly they were made to be 55W and run off 110V.
So i guess that would make it 220 Ohms.

The issue with the silicone pad was that it got so hot the actual silicone covering started to deteriorate.
So it is not a viable fix...

But good in proving a concept. @CentiZen thats what I was thinking, I dont know all the technical details, but it seems like the temp sensor and software has a good grasp on keeping consistent temps. If we used a more powerful heater it would probably just heat less.