The Herbalizer

[pakalolo]

I'm not sure what the first part does that just running a ballon at 445 won't do. You will get all of the 290 stuff in that run.

I don't want to derail this thread, but this isn't necessarily true. It depends on the particular compound (THC, CBN) and how long the cannabis is heated. Just reaching (or exceeding) a compound's boiling point does not immediately release all of it. Full release takes time, that's why ABV retains some of the active components. Most of us will stop vaporizing when the taste degrades, and that's usually not long enough to get everything. For example, every study I've read that examines the component percentages remaining after vapourizing has found some—including THCA, which is converted into THC at temperatures lower than we use for vapourizing. Full decarboxylation takes up to an hour at 115°C (240°F).

If anyone wants to discuss this then we need start another thread or find an existing one.

Edit: I've copied this post to the thread discussing the effects occurring during vaporization.

 

[nigel]

@pakalolo I misspoke when I said "all of the 290 stuff", and I believe that is what you are reacting to. I agree with what you have said, and the removal of the hyperbolic "all" I think puts our statements in line with one another. But as you said, that would be a discussion for a further thread.

My original point was about the use, care, and feeding of the Herbalizer, so it is relevant here.

As stated previously, I can see the benefit of separating two temp runs into different balloons (or the same one, just emptied between).

I'm not sure I see the difference between COMBINING two consecutive temp runs in the same balloon, vs just filling at the higher temp. Doesn't one *essentially* get the same result? Or perhaps there are subtleties and nuances that are more pronounced than I am presuming? The first thing I can think is one would give the lower temp run more time to cool and condense. I guess there should be a higher percentage of lower temp compounds, due to greater temporal exposure (to one of paka's points). Is that what the benefit is? What am I missing here?


On an unrelated note, took a high lumen light in a dark room to a few of my bags, filled expressly for the purpose of testing them. I noticed some minor wisps from the valve, depending on how I held it, but no leaks I've been able to see. I think the oldest bag is late December, but that's in rotational use, not continuos use.

 

[Medical Mark]

Ya I was the one that said my 14mm and 18mm glass stems didn't fit my herb chamber, I'm glad I didn't force it.
I did break a glass piece Turing to make air tight fit not a good idea lol.
Either way I have a nice set up and it works flawlessly. I have a 18mm female to make glass adaptor that fits right on top of the chamber and use a grommet from my cera to seal the adaptor on the chamber. I believe its the same set up as a other member here and its perfect.
It can allow me to set my water tool right on top of the herb chamber like a VXH cloud/evo and I able to draw directly from chamber or u attach my whip with a 18mm female and another male 14mm or 18mm adaptor to use with a variety of water tools.
It's very versatile and I can change pieces fast and without any interruption.
There's not much this herbalizer can't do so I'm very happy with this thing. I fill 2 bags at 445 and its dense thick vapor which makes me cough so it working lol and I feeling ok.
Very effective.

Cheers, medical mark

 

[SkrACHIN]

this device is awesome but the connection from the bag to the bowl is ridiculous. it's been out for a while and for a product designated by NASA scientists, i find the R&D that went into this part of the final product was completely ignored. all they had to do was have the whip adapter and the bag's mouthpiece screw on to the bowl so it wouldn't constantly pop out. for the $900 that i paid, i'd expect these obvious flaws to be addressed before the product is launched. i bought mine on the first day of release, and 3 of the 4 bags i got were useless after 3-4 fills. only 1 didn't leak. i emailed them pretty early on and they said that next batch of bags would be better. no offer to replace the cheap ones. so i just ordered 4 more after using the whip only for the last month. unfortunately when these bags came they were the same as the first batch. hopefully they hold.

this thing is so close to being perfect. but the connection from the bowl to whatever else is terrible. i should not have to stand there for 90 seconds and hold the mouthpiece down every single time. bush-league! until this is fixed i'm still going to recommend the volcano and two ounces instead of the herbie.

 

[grokit]

I don't have access to the entire length of the bowl's top cylinder where the opening is because of my grommet/o-ring setup, so what I have done to secure the connection is use a bit of 7th floor/ssv/dbv tubing in between the balloon's valve and the cylinder. It's much easier to employ this tubing than to remove the grommet, and it's a great fit so I've never had any issues filling a balloon since I employed this method.

 

[spincut]

Yep I am just holding it on there. Zero leakage while filling. Haven't used the Herbalizer valve all day. Its a solid valve kit I'm using.

There is a very slight downward pressure applied. Don't know its unhealthy for Herbie. Seems pretty solid.

Just bought a solid valve kit on eBay for $100 shipped. At first I wasn't sure I wanted to spend another $100 on my Herbalizer set up given the already big initial investment, but then some rationale made it an easy decision... a 4-pack of Herbalizer bags cost about $50 shipped and each bag lasts me about a week IME before the leaks become an issue. So in 2 months time I'll have spent $100 regardless, but at least with the solid valve every successive month will only cost a few dollars in turkey bags instead of another $50 in Herbie bags. Plus I like the idea of a 10 ft party bag

So, this process works for volcano's (solid valve only?) bags, but what I'd still like to know is, what about the bowl?

I am not overfilling my bowl I don't feel, but it is pretty tiny, and it would be nice to have a bigger one so I can hit it longer. Granted, the fan is the fan, and I dunno how that would affect it, but anyone know how to get a better more full bowl attached on there too?

 

[SkrACHIN]

I don't have access to the entire length of the bowl's top cylinder where the opening is because of my grommet/o-ring setup, so what I have done to secure the connection is use a bit of 7th floor/ssv/dbv tubing in between the balloon's valve and the cylinder. It's much easier to employ this tubing than to remove the grommet, and it's a great fit so I've never had any issues filling a balloon since I employed this method.

the ingenuity in this forum is incredible! i don't doubt it can be MacGyver'd in to a functional result. just annoyed that something as simple as a threaded end to prevent movement wasn't used. or something more NASA-y. Hopefully when this "Special Edition" run is over they'll develop some accessories that make it better. so far you can only get replacement parts...

 

[green2brown]

I just received my Volcano solid valve and it pairs up great with the Herbalizer. Yes, you have to hold it down onto the Herbalizer bowl, but you have to do that with the Herbalizer bags anyways. Otherwise, the solid valve is perfect. No leaks whatsoever, a very well-constructed valve/mouthpiece, and custom bag lengths. I'm glad to have the bag option back in my arsenal.

So, this process works for volcano's (solid valve only?) bags, but what I'd still like to know is, what about the bowl?

I am not overfilling my bowl I don't feel, but it is pretty tiny, and it would be nice to have a bigger one so I can hit it longer. Granted, the fan is the fan, and I dunno how that would affect it, but anyone know how to get a better more full bowl attached on there too?

How much material do you use in a typical session? I load about .3-.4g into the Herbalizer bowl and it vapes thoroughly. I just give it a single stir midway through the session. To fit that much you do have to pack it down, though. The Volcano bowl holds about .3-.5g IIRC, so you should be able to fit about the same amount. It's just a tighter fit in the Herbalizer.

 

[Been Vapin]

@green2brown Let me know if you think the vapor has a different taste, mouth feel, and coolness vs the stock Herbalizer valve.

 

[letter never sent]

@SkrACHIN I agree that the bag system could be significantly better, but there's nothing wrong with the whip connection as is. It fits great. They've actually improved on it since release too, with a new connector piece that prevents the whip from sliding down and obstructing the seal.

The good news is, if they do decide to improve the bag system, they won't have to modify the unit itself. Just the valve and/or bowl.

Give me a bag that sits securely on the bowl by itself, one that doesn't leak any vapor when not being sipped on, and this device is very close to perfect.

 

[SkrACHIN]

i kinda get the feeling that they got the smartest guys in the world to create the greatest vaporizing device in the world based on theory, but then didn't get a heavy user (maybe one with a lot of experience with other competitors) to put it through its paces. the bag system feels like an after thought. and i just got a new whip yesterday and it's the same one as the first day release. unless i remove the bowl top and FORCEFULLY insert the connector to the whip, it falls out every single time. just looking at it tells you it can't stay in place. it can extract and vaporize better than any other device i've ever tried, but the delivery from the machine to your face is not good enough, IMO.

But you're absolutely right @LetterNeverSent, the solution is pretty simple and (hopefully) relatively inexpensive. here's wishing the early adopters and supporters get a hook up on the updates.

 

[grokit]

FORCEFULLY

No need for force on mine, just a gentle twist and it's secured.

 

[green2brown]

@green2brown Let me know if you think the vapor has a different taste, mouth feel, and coolness vs the stock Herbalizer valve.

Some buddies and I have gone through a couple dozen bags now with the solid valve and have found the vapor to be much smoother and cooler than with the stock Herbalizer bags. The Herbalizer bags typically took me about 8-10 hits to finish because bigger, high-temp hits irritated my throat. With the solid valve I'm comfortably clearing a bag in 3 huge hits. The solid valve has much better airflow than the Herbalizer bags, which I think contributes to the coolness of the vapor.

The Volcano bags sure are loud though. After setting it down I can still here it crinkling for another minute or two. +1 for the Herbalizer bags here. But only here really, IMO.

 

[Been Vapin]

I think the metal and construction of the Volcano solid valve acts as heat sink resulting in cooler, smoother vapor. Still need to do a side by side comparison using clean valves and same size bags to see about flavor.

 

[Medical Mark]

Good morning, Been vaping / medicating through out the night can't seem to settle and be comfortable enough to get some sleep.
Loving the herbie its medicating me fast apnea effectively each and eye every time I use it.
Great device. I love it.
Had a shit storm when cleaning Some glass pieces and my double perc hoss bubbler broke its very clean but very broke
Life sucks and then its back to my herbie lol
Cheers medical mark

 

[Vitolo]

The whip and connector are not supposed to stay together securely.
The connector is MEANT to loosely sit there in the bowls top... and spin freely if you pass whip.
It is meant to come out freely with a gentle upward motion... not even a "pull".
I am confused as to why one would try to force it... unless one was just in the habit of the way that an older vape functioned... and has not yet become accustomed to this simpler concept:
Sit the connector in the bowl, and do not expect a click or any snugging... you're done.

 

[toros23]

The whip and connector are not supposed to stay together securely.
The connector is MEANT to loosely sit there in the bowls top... and spin freely if you pass whip.
It is meant to come out freely with a gentle upward motion... not even a "pull".

Maybe I misunderstood your post, but are you sure about that @Vitolo? As @grokit mentioned above, inserting the adapter/connector into the top of the bowl and then a simple twist "locks" the adapter and creates a sturdy connection that will not come loose unless you twist back the other way and lift. I have 1st and 2nd gen bowls and adapters and that is how both of mine work. I don't think I would be very happy with the functionality you are describing.

 

[nigel]

For those that don't like the coupling of the bowl to the squeeze valve, it is really only off by a small fraction. Until there are the new valves others have mentioned, a quick workaround is a bit of tape wrapped around a few times (experiment to see what works for you.. a few less than I did should be fine). I'd suggest kapton tape that has a high temp rating.

If you just want to test before ordering, so Scotch Tape at a low temp should be enough test.

That little extra thickness plus the texture will hold the Squeeze valve on tight.

 

[Chill Dude]

The whip and connector are not supposed to stay together securely.
The connector is MEANT to loosely sit there in the bowls top... and spin freely if you pass whip.
Sit the connector in the bowl, and do not expect a click or any snugging... you're done.

No need for force on mine, just a gentle twist and it's secured.

I think both of these statements are correct. The main point is that you don't need to "forcefully" attach the whip to the bowl. In fact, doing so can make it difficult to remove which is counterproductive. In my experience , if you gently place the whip onto the bowl it will seal just fine and most importantly it will be very easy to remove the whip at the end of your session..

Btw, I'm thinking hash sandwich later on today. What's the best way to do it without making a mess of the bowl? When I'm doing flowers I give the bowl a few shakes during the session, but I'm worried about doing that with a hash sandwich because I don't want to get the screens all covered with sticky hash resins. To shake or not to shake that is the question???

I must say, I'm still super happy with the concentrate pad when using top shelf concentrates. A little goes a long way, the taste is good, concentrate melts into the pad and disappears with no mess and I get highly medicated. Thumbs up for the concentrate pad!!!

 

[grokit]

I tried the concentrate pads for sublimate, it doesn't melt into the pad it just turns into hard black waste when it's done emitting vapor. I'm guessing that there's quite a bit of impurities in sublimate.

 

[Chill Dude]

I tried the concentrate pads for sublimate, it doesn't melt into the pad it just turns into hard black waste when it's done emitting vapor. I'm guessing that there's quite a bit of impurities in sublimate.

Yeah, I think the concentrate pad works best with high quality shatters. I've also used the pad with the highly refined, non BHO thin oils like "The Clear" or the Organa Labs C02 stuff with great results.

 

[Mister G]

I tried the concentrate pads for sublimate, it doesn't melt into the pad it just turns into hard black waste when it's done emitting vapor. I'm guessing that there's quite a bit of impurities in sublimate.

Yup, that describes my experience with sublimate as well, it leaves a black charlike residue behind.

 

[grokit]

Yup, that describes my experience with sublimate as well, it leaves a black charlike residue behind.

I would love to try shatter! The sublimate residue also seems to gunk up the adapt-a-bong vent holes which is supposedly the recommended method of consumption. I have found that the residue is the easiest to clean up afterwords with the dbv/ssv oil kit, so that's how I will consume sublimate from now on.

 

[Been Vapin]

How does one go about cleaning residue off an aromatherapy pad without SSV oil kit?

Also, the top KoolGrip on my older bowl will not stay in place anymore.

 

[lazylathe]

How does one go about cleaning residue off an aromatherapy pad without SSV oil kit?

Also, the top KoolGrip on my older bowl will not stay in place anymore.

I clean mine in 99% Iso