Discontinued The Firefly Vaporizer

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Mike M

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On one hand, I totally agree. OTOH, it's not nearly the most expensive portable suffering issues and failures...a number of much pricier units have the market since FF's debut, and they all experience failures and problems, some at 30-40% higher prices than the FF. Alas, such is the plight of the early adopter....no matter how much you spend. That's what the warranties are for!



I use the Arizer cyclone bowl screens for a top screen...sits right on the glass bowl edge.

Very important....keep in mind a top screen raises the heat in the FF. Helpful in aiding extraction, but proceed carefully till you see how it changes the operation of your FF. Good luck!
Mitchgo61, do you pull out the bottom screen when you use that?
Also, can you send a link to that product? When I google that I get this (http://azarius.net/vaporizers/vaporizer-accessories/arizer-glass-cyclone-bowl/), but don't think this is what you are referring to.

As for units breaking down, I have had mine since October with no issues. I would think the FF would break less, since there seems to be less parts to break, and really no temp control issues, since it's only a single button?
 
Mike M,

mitchgo61

I go where the thrills are
Mitchgo61, do you pull out the bottom screen when you use that?
Also, can you send a link to that product? When I google that I get this (http://azarius.net/vaporizers/vaporizer-accessories/arizer-glass-cyclone-bowl/), but don't think this is what you are referring to.

I leave the bottom screen in...you still wanna protect the steel plate in the bottom of the bowl from debris. (Even when I used to use the little Iolite Wispr screen discs, which won't fit my current FFs, I still left them in when using the top screen.)

I couldn't find them on the Arizer site, but here's an ebay link to a combo pack. I'm obviously talking about the flat screen, not the little screen baskets you use in the Arizer elbow joints.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/like/191307013916?lpid=82&chn=ps

As for units breaking down, I have had mine since October with no issues. I would think the FF would break less, since there seems to be less parts to break, and really no temp control issues, since it's only a single button?

Seems like most folks have had very few problems...you're not the only one who has used his for a year with no major issues. And then there's me on the other end of the scale...I've purchased two and owned 8, basically a catastrophic failure rate of 300%. I agree on paper, compared to much more complicated portables like the ESV or the S&B models, the FF is really simple. (This, I think, is one of the great strengths of the device...very little to deal with, no replaceable coils or cooling units or apps or extraneous bullshit to distract you from pure vaping pleasure.) However in real life it appears to have any number of things that can fail...I've lost two to complete heating coil death (light stays on, coil never heats up)...two to wild uncontrollable combustion (almost certainly mis-aligned heating coils)...one to a malfunctioning coil running too cold...and one had a weird battery issue where the unit would shut off after 8 seconds even on a full battery.

And there are lids with insufficient magnet strength, silicon seals that peel off, port gaskets that wiggle out of their own accord...in short, though the FF has few "moving parts", wherever there's a point of failure, someone has had an FF fail there. I don't think (despite my experiences) it is more prevalent with the FF than any other first gen portable, but obviously I don't really know. C'est la vaping....
 
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mitchgo61,
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hi_there

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When compared to the arizer products this seems very expensive to be having these types of issues. I am tempted but will probably wait for the next incarnation of the product. If they want to charge premium prices then they will have to up the quality control.
 
hi_there,

Stu

Maconheiro
Staff member
I've had mine for over a year and don't have any issues. I don't use it very often, though.

:peace:
 

HD Springer

Well-Known Member
Ive owned my FF unit for about a month or so and I'm very impressed with everything. If I had a complaint it would be the messiness of the whole process .For this reason alone I'm thinking about the top screen. Although that is just one more thing for me to loose.I've retired my ascent to only be used with groups because of the HUGE bowl. The fact that I can use this as a 1 hit and come back later for more is awsome.This unit is a great addition to anyones collection.
 

Mike M

Well-Known Member
I think the bottom screen is too small to use as a top screen. Standard "smoke shops" usually have 20mm screens that are very cheap and work fine.
Yeah, the one I have is slightly bigger, bought as a pack. I got several sizes and found one that is perfect. Cost me probably around a dollar.


HD SPRINGER: The screen really helps to keep it clean. Sometimes I don't put the screen in till I'm at the end of the bowl, when I'm pulling slightly harder, making sure I get every wisp of vapor out of it
 

hi_there

Well-Known Member
Yeah, the one I have is slightly bigger, bought as a pack. I got several sizes and found one that is perfect. Cost me probably around a dollar.


HD SPRINGER: The screen really helps to keep it clean. Sometimes I don't put the screen in till I'm at the end of the bowl, when I'm pulling slightly harder, making sure I get every wisp of vapor out of it

Can any draw a simple diagram to describe exactly where people are placing the two screens?
 
hi_there,

Mike M

Well-Known Member
Can any draw a simple diagram to describe exactly where people are placing the two screens?
The first screen comes in the FF, and sits and the bottom. All I did, it take a slightly larger screen, and lay it over the ground material, and then close the lid. That's all

Sorry, don't have a pic
 

mitchgo61

I go where the thrills are
Can any draw a simple diagram to describe exactly where people are placing the two screens?

Top pic: empty bowl with screen inserted on bottom.

Middle pic: top screen half-slid over the bowl (this is me in the middle of placing, just so you can see it).

Bottom pic: top screen in place, sitting on the edges of the glass bowl...on but not in the bowl.

qdsUpBp.jpg
 
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HD Springer

Well-Known Member
wow that screen looks like it was made for it.Im really thinking about adopting this method. When you open the lid to stir it can be a challenge to get the lid secured and all debri back in the bowl.I tend to get trigger happy though so id have to watch my temp.
 
HD Springer,

mitchgo61

I go where the thrills are
wow that screen looks like it was made for it.Im really thinking about adopting this method. When you open the lid to stir it can be a challenge to get the lid secured and all debri back in the bowl.I tend to get trigger happy though so id have to watch my temp.

If you look farther up the page you'll see a link for these screens on eBay. I agree with Mike...use the top screen later in the bowl, when it gets messy, and when a temp boost aids in extraction. I usually pop it on in the last few hits.
 
mitchgo61,

hi_there

Well-Known Member
Top pic: empty bowl with screen inserted on bottom.

Middle pic: top screen half-slid over the bowl (this is me in the middle of placing, just so you can see it).

Bottom pic: top screen in place, sitting on the edges of the glass bowl...on but not in the bowl.

Thanks, so bottom screen is to make it easy to clean and top screen stops bits of herb from going into your mouth?
 
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hi_there,

HD Springer

Well-Known Member
mitchgo61 have you had to replace a bottom screen.Im thinking this can go a long time with out needing it.
 
HD Springer,

mitchgo61

I go where the thrills are
Thanks, so bottom screen is to make it easy to clean and top screen stops bits of herb from going into your mouth?

Yes, and yes, mostly. The bottom screen keeps debris off the plate and potentially out of the device itself, though there's an O ring in there that also catches stuff. I think it's considered necessary to have some kind of bottom screen.

The top screen helps keep the lid clean and also can raise the heat level a bit...under normal circumstances you shouldn't get debris in your mouth, unless the grind is really fine like towards the end of a bowl. Hence the usefulness of the top screen late in the game....

mitchgo61 have you had to replace a bottom screen.Im thinking this can go a long time with out needing it.

Yes, I have, but you can make one last a very long time. I usually remove it and clean the plate every few bowls, but the more you remove the screen, the less effective it becomes...each time it's replaced it gets a little more degraded and provides a little less coverage. Leave a brand new one in as long as you can, but you will need to clean under there eventually.
 

RicoPishe

Member
Received my red Firefly from Vapefiend. It's even more lovely in the flesh...Got to say though that after 2 bowls it does get a bit messy. I stir and brush frequently and I don't think the ISO wipes will last long at this rate... have read loads and watched the vids but my technique definitely requires tweaking.. It's 10.00am ..too early to start?????
 

1_gr8_underdog

Trapped in the Astral Planes Back from the dead
@RicoPishe It is never to early to do some testing. Congratulations on your Firefly.

Happy new year everybody. Hope all has been well in my absence. Happy to be back here among my fellow FC friends. Firefly is still holding strong as my #1 daily driver. Had to replace both batteries, but that is expected after the amount of use I give it. :tup:
 

mitchgo61

I go where the thrills are
Only one thing could cheer me up after a week of massive snowfall: a phone chat with Firefly co-founder and CTO Sasha Robinson. Sasha contacted me in email a few days ago because he'd heard I had experienced a disproportionate amount of problems with my FFs and he wanted to get more details and some feedback. Like any respectable FF fan I quickly compiled a list of my own questions. He was kind enough to spend about 40 minutes talking with me yesterday and after I detailed my various FF failures we covered a variety of FF-related topics. Here's my random sequence brain dump...hopefully I've remembered everything...

Failure rate: despite my high rate of FF issues, he said the overall failure rate was 3%.

Batteries: The first batch of batteries were all fine, but due to an issue with the manufacturer, the last bunch were inferior, as some of us have discovered. The newer batteries (like the one EDA posted a pic of) are from a different manufacturer and supposedly have longer life and longer charges. I don't own one, so I can't confirm.

Screens: Funny that this topic just came up...Sasha mentioned that he doesn't even think of the screens as replaceable parts, and they debated even using a removable screen. They were designed to be left in as long as possible (but, he said "people really like getting extra screens"...because, I assume, they like to change them or think they need to). I did share with him my feeling that the screens are a bit too small and provide insufficient coverage when removed and reinstalled.

FF 2.0: They are indeed working on a Firefly 2.0. He said he couldn't give any dates or real details about it, but I gather they are well into the effort (my inference). Good news. (I said "can I give you my credit card number now and be first on the pre-order list??" :rofl:)

Retractable mouthpiece: This one's for EDA ("I have to ask you for a friend of mine..."). He said the FF would have to be larger...there's currently no room with the battery and electronics to retract the mouthpiece into the FF body. He mentioned the Pax as a device where a lot of thought went into the mouthpiece action but at FF they focused on keeping it simpler. (Given all the Pax issues surrounding the mouthpiece, good move.)

FC: They seem to read the thread here regularly, but it's unlikely that anyone from FF will be participating. I think he's worried about it becoming a huge time sink for someone, as they would be responding to all kinds of customer support issues, and they are a pretty small operation. I think he's also well aware of some of the less pleasant aspects, for a manufacturer, of being on the forum.

Changing over time: I noted that it seems like my FFs have changed over time, i.e. my current red FF seemed hotter two months ago than it does now. Sasha said it's possible subtle changes can occur as the resistor ages. I'm still not sure if it's real or my imagination but I wanted to ask about it.

Colors: it's unlikely new colors will be added due to the cost given the small unit runs per color...they wouldn't sell enough, say, metallic gold (my choice), to pay for manufacturing without the price being too high. But they will be adding some lid choices...(see below) ...

Challenges: Sasha talked a lot about the various challenges they face, in two categories...one, the challenges of the FF (Sasha is the designer of all the FF technical aspects), and two, the corporate challenges. The latter are typical of a small company...hard to achieve economies of scale with small product runs, difficult manufacturing relationships again related to company size, etc. The former are all the things we are aware of as users...the size of the FF (Sasha said they would like to get it smaller and lighter but given the heat generated it needs a certain mass), the battery life given how much power it needs, etc. Like any small company in this space it's a two-front battle.

QC/Testing: another big challenge, obviously one that affects us as users. They can't test every unit, and Sasha himself has stood at the end of the assembly line in China doing spot-testing of units, but since they cannot test them all themselves they rely on the manufacturer to do testing as well. (My feeling is if they've really gotten the failure rate down to 3% they are doing quite well in this space...I also suggested that if you take my 300% failure rate out of the equation, FF is probably more like 2% failure rate. :p He said they should send all their new products to me first so I can absorb the failures...I'm cool with that! :clap:)

Competition: I asked him about most of the current portables, and he's not only familiar with them but has taken most of them apart and gotten good looks at them. Like any good businessperson he had nothing negative to say about any of them, but obviously they've taken a different path from most of their competition. Emphasis has always been on flavor, convection, simplicity, and on-demand rather than session-based vaping. He said "taste is more important than some other aspects like stealth". But he also asserted that some vapes, like the Pax, may seem more stealthy, but thanks to their conduction/passive cooking, tend to throw more odor. "If you sit next to someone with a Firefly, and someone with a Pax, you're going to know what the Pax person is doing, but not what the Firefly user is doing." Anyway my takeaway is they are super-aware of their competitors and they think that building a quality device (no plastic, for example) that hews closely to certain key values and is supported by a great team is the way to win in the crowded portable space.

Upcoming goodies: concentrate pads; a mother-of-pearl lid; and a cherry-wood lid (Sasha has wanted a wood FF since that old prototype FF that used wood). Sounds like all of these are coming in the near future, but no dates yet. The future of cosmetic enhancements appears to be in the lid space.

Overall these guys have had a vision of the FF that focuses on several core priorities...flavor, on-demand vaping, simplicity of use and maintenance. They think of the FF as one of the few devices that stands apart from the plethora of portables that are both conduction and session-based (though he did express admiration for the MFLB's on-demand approach). They didn't make a device that's designed to pump out huge clouds (though it's easy to get 'em), but rather one that maximizes flavor and delivers, as Sasha put it, "the entire temperature range in every hit"...as opposed to a vape that sets a static temp and maintains it. (I thought this was really interesting...all this time with the FF and I had never really thought of it that way.)

Finally I told him to give the support folks a big virtual hug from me...their commitment to the customer is the thing that's kept me around when the devices fail. They understand our lifetime value...I wish I could say that about all manufacturers.

I'm sure I missed some obvious questions. Hopefully I'll get to pick his brain again in the near future so I'll try to keep a running list. In the meantime I'm psyched for that cherry lid. :D

 
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Mike M

Well-Known Member
Received my red Firefly from Vapefiend. It's even more lovely in the flesh...Got to say though that after 2 bowls it does get a bit messy. I stir and brush frequently and I don't think the ISO wipes will last long at this rate... have read loads and watched the vids but my technique definitely requires tweaking.. It's 10.00am ..too early to start?????
It's never too early in "Tralier Park Heaven". If you want to reduce mess, just through a screen on top of the material, and it will keep it real clean.

I buy ISO wipes from the drugstore, a box of a hundred for a couple of bucks.
 

TNT_error

Well-Known Member
How much are you packing? If it's too small, herbs can fly everywhere and vice versa. Stirring is required with bigger bowls imo. Try shaking and tapping the sides so the load turns itself, mess with load size also until you find something you like.

Simplest technique that I use is to just preheat the chamber until the light glows then take long slow draws until your lungs are full and/or the 30 sec shutoff happens. You'll figure your style after a few bowls then you can enjoy the FF to its fullest. Tastiest vape I've tried!
 
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mckeen

Tumrgrwer
Changing over time: I noted that it seems like my FFs have changed over time, i.e. my current red FF seemed hotter two months ago than it does now. Sasha said it's possible subtle changes can occur as the resistor ages. I'm still not sure if it's real or my imagination but I wanted to ask about it.
I think the batteries drop off over time, not the Firefly. At least I'm hoping this is the case. When I put in a good battery it works great but the weaker battery not so good. Never gets to the proper temp and after two bowls the red light glows.

Very Nice mitchgo61.
 

mitchgo61

I go where the thrills are
I'm still going to keep harping about that retractable / removable mouthpiece... :lol:

I found this amusing, because when I said "I have a feature request from a friend, it's not somethng I would have thought or cared about", he said people request it a lot. "Everyone always asks for a retractable mouthpiece, but what they don't realize is they are actually asking for a larger Firefly." I'm thinking "huh....guess EDA really does his finger on the pulse of discriminating vapists". Another one for the "what the hell do I know" file.

I think the batteries drop off over time, not the Firefly. At least I'm hoping this is the case. When I put in a good battery it works great but the weaker battery not so good. Never gets to the proper temp and after two bowls the red light glows.

I am still not sure about this. I feel like I've noticed it consistently with both of my current FF's, irrespective of whichever of my several batteries I'm using. Although maybe it's all the batteries. Or again, maybe it isn't even happening at all. :\
 
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