The 2016 Presidential Candidates Thread

[lwien]

Unless I missed something somewhere Hillary was not doing these speeches while under our employ. She was a private citizen at the time.

That's true which makes all this hoopla over this not mean very much. She has agents going around trying to get the best deal for her speaking engagements. That is how she generated income. She spoke for a lot of different companies and organizations. Personally, I don't see that she did anything wrong.

 

[Chill Dude]

That's true which makes all this hoopla over this not mean very much. She has agents going around trying to get the best deal for her speaking engagements. That is how she generated income. She spoke for a lot of different companies and organizations. Personally, I don't see that she did anything wrong.

No, I agree, she certainly didn't do anything illegal.. But for her to take huge campaign contributions and speaking fees from Goldoman Sachs one of the key players in the total collapse of the economy is just wrong and actually quite sickening in my view.

Bernie certainly doesn't cozy up with those corrupt fucking assholes!!!

 

[MinnBobber]

Hillary and high buck speeches:
she can talk the talk BUT not walk the walk. XXX is bad but I'll gladly take mega bucks from them.

And anyone who doesn't believe that Hillary's (and Bill's) high buck speeches were "attempts to buy influence" is IMO naive. Companies don't pay 100X the going rate for a speaker without hoping/expecting to get something back sometime, their "speech dividend".

Yes, other do it to but that doesn't mean it's ok.

 

[Gunky]

Hillary and high buck speeches:
she can talk the talk BUT not walk the walk. XXX is bad but I'll gladly take mega bucks from them.

And anyone who doesn't believe that Hillary's (and Bill's) high buck speeches were "attempts to buy influence" is IMO naive. Companies don't pay 100X the going rate for a speaker without hoping/expecting to get something back sometime, their "speech dividend".

Yes, other do it to but that doesn't mean it's ok.

How does this make sense when the same high bux were paid by colleges and non-wall street organizations? She made money by speaking. Everybody got charged similar fees. How does that make her beholden to one category of customer only?

 

[Gunky]

That's why I want to change the world and invite you to live in it, and that's why I'm voting for Bernie as he's the only one running who will make a major push for campaign finance reform.. We need to take back our government from the powerful and corrupt corporations and special interest groups. As you say " this sort of thing is quite ordinary", ...but should it be?

You say " it's not like in speaking to Wall Street players she caves to their influence " oh really? Then I guess in your view we don't need campaign finance reform because no one is influenced by the millions of dollars given by large corporations to corrupt the system...

Personally, I think the system is broke and it doesn't work for the people and it has gotten much worse over time.. Bernie will fix it

The problem with all this is Bernie can't fix it. He is promising to fix it but in fact he has zero chance of doing anything about it. This is something that is going to be fixed by congress if it can be fixed at all. Bernie has no constituency in congress and to date has sponsored 3 bills, two of them renaming post offices in Vermont.

 

[grokit]

Bernie will fix it

He'd give it his god-damnest best effort, and put his 30 years of public service experience into it. And it would be all for the public good, not on behalf of a private foundation/political dynasty. I think Bernie could be surprisingly good at building a consensus with progressives on both sides of the isle, because this country is ready for real change. Thinking of carter, he may need two terms to really accomplish anything.

 

[lwien]

Lots of political masturbation going on in this thread, eh?

The United States is going to vote in a 74 year old Jewish socialist for president? As much as I'd love to see that happen, it ain't gonna happen. He has as much of a chance of being our next president as Trump.

It's gonna be Rubio versus Hillary. I'd bet the farm on it, but I don't own a farm.

btw, anyone see Madoff on TV? Talk about a corrupt motherfucker.....

 

[Chill Dude]

He'd give it his god-damnest best effort, and put his 30 years of public service experience into it. And it would be all for the public good, not on behalf of a private foundation/political dynasty. I think Bernie could be surprisingly good at building a consensus with progressives on both sides of the isle, because this country is ready for real change. Thinking of carter, he may need two terms to really accomplish anything.

Agreed, of course it won't happen overnight, but Bernie has the courage to start the dialogue and empower the people to demand change and even out the playing field

 

[Chill Dude]

Lots of political masturbation going on in this thread, eh?

The United States is going to vote in a 74 year old Jewish socialist for president? As much as I'd love to see that happen, it ain't gonna happen. He has as much of a chance of being our next president as Trump.

It's gonna be Rubio versus Hillary. I'd bet the farm on it, but I don't own a farm.

btw, anyone see Madoff on TV? Talk about a corrupt motherfucker.....

I'm not trying to pick a winner.. I vote for the candidate that shares my values and if that candidate wins then that's great.

 

[Gunky]

Agreed, of course it won't happen overnight, but Bernie has the courage to start the dialogue and empower the people to demand change and even out the playing field

You guys have begun to drink the Kool-aid. Nice sounding words that mean exactly nothing. When you come down from this dream the country will still be the same one where nearly 50% have been voting for republicans these last decades. It's naive to think voting for Bernie is going to change all that, any more than voting for Obama did. With Bernie it's all magic asterisk 'political revolution'. Uh huh. And everybody gets a pony too.

 

[Gunky]

I'm not trying to pick a winner.. I vote for the candidate that shares my values and if that candidate wins then that's great.

In other words you are willing to vote for Nader even if it throws the election to Bush. But you are sticking by your values...

 

[CarolKing]

Who would have thought America would have voted for a black man for president a little over 7 years ago. Enough people have to believe in change. Barack Obama represented that change. It didn't turn out the way we thought. I think that's why Bernie appeals to so many.

I'm not even sure Hilary is the right choice for the Democrats but we don't have much of a choice.

I feel like people think Hillary is the automatic choice because she deserved the nomination since she was won out by Obama last time.

 

[Chill Dude]

You guys have begun to drink the Kool-aid. Nice sounding words that mean exactly nothing. When you come down from this dream the country will still be the same one where nearly 50% have been voting for republicans these last decades. It's naive to think voting for Bernie is going to change all that, any more than voting for Obama did. With Bernie it's all magic asterisk 'political revolution'. Uh huh. And everybody gets a pony too.

I respectfully disagree sir..

 

[Chill Dude]

In other words you are willing to vote for Nader even if it throws the election to Bush. But you are sticking by your values...

Naw... I never liked Nader

 

[lwien]

I'm not trying to pick a winner.. I vote for the candidate that shares my values and if that candidate wins then that's great.

So let me ask you a question. Candidate "A" shares ALL of your values but his/her chance of winning is about 20% and if they lose, you get a candidate that shares none of your values. Candidate "B" just shares some of your values but his/her chance of winning is 80%. Who do you vote for?

 

[Farid]

The United States is going to vote in a 74 year old Jewish socialist for president? As much as I'd love to see that happen, it ain't gonna happen.

We elected a black Muslim, so a Jewish socialist is hardly a stretch. And before people say Obama isn't Muslim, I know that, but in the eyes of many voters he is. Also, I first heard of him from Muslim friends who were excited about him back around 2005 because they identified with him, and he's certainly close to many in the Muslim community.

 

[lwien]

We elected a black Muslim, so a Jewish socialist is hardly a stretch. And before people say Obama isn't Muslim, I know that, but in the eyes of many voters he is. Also, I first heard of him from Muslim friends who were excited about him back around 2005 because they identified with him, and he's certainly close to many in the Muslim community.

If back before we ever knew who Obama was, you asked me, who has a better chance of winning the presidency, a young, good looking, Harvard educated, dynamic and very well spoken black man or a 74 year old white dynamic, well spoken Jewish socialist, I'd put my money on.........the first guy although I can also see why some would disagree with me.

I think it just comes down to this whole "outsider" mentality which encompasses both Bernie and Trump and while many desire this kind of radical change, I really think that when push comes to shove, that kind of change is just too scary for the general population to wrap their heads around especially when one asks, ok, how in the fuck are they going to accomplish what they say they want to do.

 

[CarolKing]

People are looking for change so they are gravitating towards Trump and the democrats Sanders. We are tired of big business and Wall Street paying off politicians for favors.

 

[lwien]

People are looking for change so they are gravitating towards Trump and the democrats Sanders. We are tired of big business and Wall Street paying off politicians for favors.

But it's been that way since the beginning of time with ALL governments. It's kinda how power works, eh? How do ya change that?

I'll do this for you if you do this for me. It's the definition of politics.

But I do think we can dial it back some with changes in the Supreme Court but that doesn't require a Trump or a Bernie to accomplish.

Guess I'm just a bit jaded.

 

[Joel W.]

Enough people have to believe in change. Barack Obama represented that change.

I say we got some well needed change that brought this country back from the edge of the cliff.

Top 50 accomplishments

lets not forget the stock market and the unemployment rate!

Edit: I also think most of the people that voted for Obama, will likely vote for Bernie now. Just my opinion though.

 

[howie105]

I say we got some well needed change that brought this country back from the edge of the cliff.

Top 50 accomplishments

lets not forget the stock market and the unemployment rate!

Look at the thirties and the resulting changes that occurred post depression. Very ugly and disruptive but it was necessary to arrive at where we are now. It may take another run off a cliff to cause more necessary changes, not saying it has to be or that the changes will all be good however turning a nation state isn't always nice or pretty.

 

[Chill Dude]

So let me ask you a question. Candidate "A" shares ALL of your values but his/her chance of winning is about 20% and if they lose, you get a candidate that shares none of your values. Candidate "B" just shares some of your values but his/her chance of winning is 80%. Who do you vote for?

Bernie, although he's defiantly the underdog for the Democratic nomination, according to the latest polls he does better than Hillary against Trump, Cruz and Rubio( source Real Clear Politics ). So, yes I will vote for Sanders who best represents my values, but if he doesn't win the nomination I will vote for Hillary who still represents most of my values, but not as appealing to me as Bernie.

I'm a progressive, so in general I vote for the most progressive candidate.. If you vote status quo, then you get little if any change. If you vote progressive and big ideas you get the chance for change.. Is it easy? No. Will it take time and rallying the people and congress? Yes. Is it possible that a lot of the policies can't be pushed through congress? Absolutely... But you start the dialogue and you push for change... THAT'S WHAT PROGRESSIVES DO!!

 

[HillaryClinton]

I can guarantee Bernie is going to win, I can almost guarantee he will be the last president before WW3 and the collapse of America by the Chinese and Russians....well if any of my dreams from the past 10 years live up to themselves, been preeettty accurate so far.

Puts on tin foil nightcap!
guarantee
guarantee

 

[His_Highness]

So let me ask you a question. Candidate "A" shares ALL of your values but his/her chance of winning is about 20% and if they lose, you get a candidate that shares none of your values. Candidate "B" just shares some of your values but his/her chance of winning is 80%. Who do you vote for?

I answered this same question a few pages back with:
"There may be a bunch of people voting for who they think can win instead of who they want. I wouldn't be one of them."

I still stand by the above but I would add that... the millions of people who may vote for who they think has a better chance of winning instead of the candidate who represents their ideals.... will not have their voices heard in the election or the polls.

When the MJ vote in Florida was held .... We didn't win but you can bet with the majority voting for it to pass our voice was heard.

 

[grokit]

Look at the thirties and the resulting changes that occurred post depression. Very ugly and disruptive but it was necessary to arrive at where we are now.

What's so great about where we are now?