The 2016 Presidential Candidates Thread

[Gunky]

[snip] It's much harder for congress to vote down legislation if the polls show that the majority of the people are in favor of it.[snip

Not so. For example big majorities favor immigration reform and gun control. It would be nice if it worked that way. Republican voters have been sending messages for years.

but you start the conversation of change and rally the people to get on board with it.

You do realize how little this sort of thing amounts to in the real world? Start the conversation of change? It's a fine-sounding sort of rhetoric but what would that actually consist of? Bernie proposing socialism from the White House? Some of you are perhaps a good deal younger and have had less of your idealism ground off by sharp realities than me.

 

[CarolKing]

I imagined Obama to continue his momentum that he had during his election. I was hoping that he would expose the republicans for the idiots that they are, a broken worn out policy. The bigots and the racists that are on the fringe of the party. That didn't happen to the degree I had hoped for. Plus he lost the house in 2010 which was a disaster in order to get his agenda pasted.

Bernie understands as president he will be in the position to educate the American people of his economic agenda. I expect him to rally the people then let them speak. It's not up to Bernie alone. People need to vote some of the republicans out of office.

 

[His_Highness]

@Gunky - I'm voting for the ideals and accomplishments I want to see happen for myself and this country. I want way more than just the message alone....BUT.... If the best my vote can cause is getting the message out in the strongest possible manner.... it'll have to do. That's not 'crude' that's democracy.

 

[Chill Dude]

Not so. For example big majorities favor immigration reform and gun control. It would be nice if it worked that way.

It depends on how big the majority is and who's at the helm driving the message. And I never said a strong majority would ensure passage of any legislation. What I said was "It's much harder for congress to vote down legislation if the polls show that The majority of people are in favor of it"..

I think the difference here is that you're looking for the best candidate To get things done in the short run whereas I'm looking for a candidate that can get a large portion of a bold progressive agenda accomplished over the long haul. And I don't think you or I are going to change each other's mind haha..we just have a difference of opinion..pure and simple...and that's fine with me..

 

[Gunky]

It depends on how big the majority is and who's at the helm driving the message. And I never said a strong majority would ensure passage of any legislation. What I said was "It's much harder for congress to vote down legislation if the polls show that The majority of people are in favor of it"..

I think the difference here is that you're looking for the best candidate To get things done in the short run whereas I'm looking for a candidate that can get a large portion of a bold progressive agenda accomplished over the long haul. And I don't think you or I are going to change each other's mind haha..we just have a difference of opinion..pure and simple...and that's fine with me..

Once again take a look at gun control. History shows that it is not difficult at all to thwart the will of the majority for many, many years.

When you say "I'm looking for a candidate that can get a large portion of a bold progressive agenda accomplished over the long haul", which parts of Bernie's agenda do you see moving forward during a four year term? I am talking about movement, action, not just talking, which he can do as a Senator or a private citizen. I see no one has taken the challenge of naming a single Bernie Sanders policy that could actually be enacted.

Free college tuition? Nope.

Single payer? Nope.

Big tax increases on the wealthy? Nope.

Campaign finance reform? Nope.

 

[CarolKing]

I have voted in 10 presidential elections. I registered to vote when I was 18 so I'm not all that young. I have always voted democrat. It's hard not to get jaded especially over the last 15 years. The Iraq War wasn't just a bump in the the road it helped to change the world as we know it today. The republicans were in office when that happened, George Bush owns it.

It is so important to get a democrat in office so who ever the Americans pick I will vote for. It might be Hilary or it might be Bernie.

Edit
@Gunky i don't have a crystal ball, you are talking hypothetically I'm not going down that rabbit hole. I believe in his reforms and I'm voting for my choice for president as well as you are. I respect that you are for Hilary Clinton. I may end up voting for her too. Like I said change is up to the American people not just up to the president.

 

[His_Highness]

I see no one has taken the challenge of naming a single Bernie Sanders policy that could actually be enacted.

Ok...I'll bite...every single one of his policies could actually be enacted. It's no different than civil rights, MJ legalization, etc. Each of these, and many others, had no shot out of the gate, according to folks who think just as you do about Bernie's policies. These other, never happen policies, didn't have a 4 to 8 year time limit either.

If you don't believe in the policies Bernie stands for then I have nothing to debate with you.

 

[grokit]

There's some progressive legislators on the gop side, they just need a catalyst (like bernie)

 

[Joel W.]

http://www.sanders.senate.gov/agenda/

With the house and senate full of dems, anything is possible!

 

[cybrguy]

I imagined Obama to continue his momentum that he had during his election. I was hoping that he would expose the republicans for the idiots that they are, a broken worn out policy.

He DID this. It didn't matter.

The bigots and the racists that are on the fringe of the party.

No, they are at the CENTER of the current republican party.

Plus he lost the house in 2010 which was a disaster in order to get his agenda pasted.

No. The DEMOCRATS lost the House, by not voting to keep it. Don't blame the President.

Bernie understands as president he will be in the position to educate the American people of his economic agenda.

Like Obama was able to do?

I expect him to rally the people then let them speak.

Because he has such soaring rhetoric and skillful speech-making? Do you really think if this would work that it wouldn't have worked for Obama?

Listen, I love Bernie, I really do. And I love what he is trying to do. And if I thought there was ANY way this country was ready for it I would be first in line to support his idealistic vision. But I am NOT blind and I know VERY WELL that America is NOT ready for this. WE CAN'T EVEN PASS A LAW TO KEEP ASSAULT WEAPONS FROM PEOPLE ON THE TERRORIST WATCH LIST, for Gods sake. Do you really think we are ready for utopian dreams?

 

[Gunky]

It depends on how big the majority is and who's at the helm driving the message. And I never said a strong majority would ensure passage of any legislation. What I said was "It's much harder for congress to vote down legislation if the polls show that The majority of people are in favor of it"..

I think the difference here is that you're looking for the best candidate To get things done in the short run whereas I'm looking for a candidate that can get a large portion of a bold progressive agenda accomplished over the long haul. And I don't think you or I are going to change each other's mind haha..we just have a difference of opinion..pure and simple...and that's fine with me..

Once again take a look at gun control. History shows that it is not difficult at all to thwart the will of the majority for many, many years.

Ok...I'll bite...every single one of his policies could actually be enacted. It's no different than civil rights, MJ legalization, etc. Each of these, and many others, had no shot out of the gate, according to folks who think just as you do about Bernie's policies. These other, never happen policies, didn't have a 4 to 8 year time limit either.

If you don't believe in the policies Bernie stands for then I have nothing to debate with you.

The problem is we are not electing a dreamer of long term dreams. We are electing the chief of our executive branch, commander of our military, etc. We are not picking somebody to go off and woodshed; they gotta get up on the stage and play now!

As for 'every single one of his policies could actually be enacted' the difficulty once again is when? You are already making shuffling motions and suggesting some day when Bernie is dead already. You simply can't come up with a policy of his that has a prayer in the next congress! This has a delusional aspect to it.

The repubs have been voting for extremists like Cruz for quite some time 'to send a message'. The thing is he can't deliver anything. So yeah they are sending a message but it's a futile one. Use your vote to elect someone who can actually do something, not to send a message.

 

[Joel W.]

We can't pass gun laws because our leaders are loyal to the gun manufacturers. We need new leaders!

 

[Chill Dude]

I see no one has taken the challenge of naming a single Bernie Sanders policy that could actually be enacted.

Free college tuition? Nope.

Single payer? Nope.

Big tax increases on the wealthy? Nope.

Campaign finance reform? Nope.

Probably not too much over the short term with a republican controlled congress. Most of it over time with a true progressive at the helm and a future democratic congress. I'm optimistic that there's a reasonable good chance for a democratic majority over the next 4 to 6 years.. Like I said in my previous post.... You're looking for someone to get some minimal legislation through right from the get go whereas I envision long term achievement of a lions share of a bold progressive agenda.. We think differently

 

[CarolKing]

Many of you make some valid points. I think a lot of us realize Bernie has some lofty ideas. I don't agree with free education or free daycare for everyone, it would be nice but not realistic. That doesn't mean that I don't like a lot of his other ideas.

The people will decide during the caucus and the primary election coming up some months down the road. To be honest I've never liked Hilary even when she was Fist Lady but I still will vote for her if I have to.

I liked Bill Clinton all the time he was president but I don't know if I like him so much now. It's like he owes her this after everything he has put her through.

 

[His_Highness]

Once again take a look at gun control. History shows that it is not difficult at all to thwart the will of the majority for many, many years.

The problem is we are not electing a dreamer of long term dreams. We are electing the chief of our executive branch, commander of our military, etc. We are not picking somebody to go off and woodshed; they gotta get up on the stage and play now!

So if it can't be done NOW it's not worth doing or not worth trying to make it happen. Let me know when we do have the time and inclination for the dreamers or even those who may take longer than 'now' and we can discuss it again.....if there's time.

 

[Chill Dude]

Many of you make some valid points. I think many of us realize Bernie has some lofty ideas. I don't agree with free education or free daycare for everyone, it would be nice but not realistic. That doesn't mean that I don't like a lot of his other ideas.

I agree with free education for all, but I think it should be only for the bottom 90% not the top 10%. So I guess I disagree with Bernie to a certain extent.. I mean I wouldn't want Trump's kids getting a free education at UC Berkley.. That would be ridiculous haha..

 

[MinnBobber]

When you say "I'm looking for a candidate that can get a large portion of a bold progressive agenda accomplished over the long haul", which parts of Bernie's agenda do you see moving forward during a four year term?

...................................................................

Four years does not a "long haul" make.................

Which candidate will potentially make a better US long term is absolutely a valid voting criteria and it might very well be a different candidate than who is more likely to get "something done" during their term.

 

[CarolKing]

It may take years for ideals and ideas to evolve. We will need more democrats in the house and the senate it will take the vote of the people to get the republicans ousted. Many younger people coming into the fold. Older folks dieing off along with outdated ideas such as no gay marriage.

 

[howie105]

I have voted in 10 presidential elections. I registered to vote when I was 18 so I'm not all that young. I have always voted democrat. It's hard not to get jaded especially over the last 15 years. The Iraq War wasn't just a bump in the the road it helped to change the world as we know it today. The republicans were in office when that happened, George Bush owns it.

It is so important to get a democrat in office so who ever the Americans pick I will vote for. It might be Hilary or it might be Bernie.

The war continues under the current administration so it owns the war too. If I get mugged by a gang I don't blame only the guy who threw the first punch, all the thugs involved in the beat down are guilty.

 

[Chill Dude]

Do you really think we are ready for utopian dreams?

Yes.. I'm readyjump in the water's fine!

 

[cybrguy]

Maybe its my age, or maybe its a lack of progeny, but until I can build some confidence that we will survive the next decade, I'm done worrying about some nebulous future America that we may never see. Sorry if I sound like Debbie Downer, but the political reality of America today scares the shit out of me. That someone like Donald Trump has a serious chance to actually become POTUS is astounding to me, and not in a good way. We need to worry about what is right in front of us, or our future planning may be nothing but a waste of effort.

 

[CarolKing]

Donald Trump got a lot of negative booing last night during the debate. He was getting so pissed and red faced, I thought he was going to blow. I kept waiting. The rest of the republicans just need to keep pushing his buttons during the next debate. We all can just sit back and laugh and load up a bowl to celebrate the fireworks.

 

[Joel W.]

Also, I am pretty sure Obama already put a plan in place for 2 years of free school for anyone in the right income bracket. It has already started in places and is growing..

"So far, in just the past six months, five communities have created free two-year college programs, including statewide programs in Oregon and Minnesota. Congressional Democrats have also proposed free community college legislation backing Obama's plan."

https://www.insidehighered.com/news/2015/01/09/white-house-plans-take-tennessee-promise-national

 

[grokit]

 

[Chill Dude]

Maybe its my age, or maybe its a lack of progeny, but until I can build some confidence that we will survive the next decade, I'm done worrying about some nebulous future America that we may never see. Sorry if I sound like Debbie Downer, but the political reality of America today scares the shit out of me. That someone like Donald Trump has a serious chance to actually become POTUS is astounding to me, and not in a good way. We need to worry about what is right in front of us, or our future planning may be nothing but a waste of effort.

Personally, I wouldn't be worried if either Clinton or Sander's became POTUS.. If Trump, Cruz or Rubio were elected, I would be absolutely terrified!